3rd grade bkb coaching help.

[Fatter than Joey]

Hey all -- Looking for some help from some good BKB minds...

 

I am coaching a 3rd grade BKB team, and I am getting frustrated with our offense, we play with 3G and 2F.

 

Our best player is a F who is a great rebounder, has great hands, and can turn and shoot -- and is probably the most coach-able, i.e he understands the flow of the offense the best.

 

We have another F who is a capable rebounder, can follow an offense scheme pretty well, is a good enough shooter.

 

Our guards are TO machines. I have one guard that is able to drive the ball a little -- however he takes bad shots and never looks inside -- the other guard is really fast but can't change directions or speeds he pretty much goes in a straight line and crashes into a wall -- the other guard pretty much dribbles into a corner and gets trapped.

 

In short -- I need some help with an offensive that is centered around weak guard play and strong forward play. -- Obviously the long term fix is work on ball-handling and passing with the guards but I could use some help for a tournament this weekend.

 

I tried to have one of my forwards set some high screens, but then we turned the ball over closer to half-court.

 

Any help appreciated.

[dadofandrew]

The only thing I can think of is to tell the guards they are not allowed to shoot until the ball goes inside once. Stress passing, not dribbling...though you are probably already doing that.http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[trwi7]

If the forwards can shoot just make sure they keep getting the ball early and often in the offense. Are you playing the best guards you have? Just find the best passer of the guards and get him the ball to pass it inside.

[And That]

Steroids.

[pitchleague]

I'm impressed that you are coaching an offense to a bunch of third graders. whenever I've seen 3rd grade age kids playing hoops (even in an organized league) it's ball-hog heaven with kids just running back and forth and kids going, basically, one-on-five because they just take it to the rim themselves, with varying levels of success.

[uecker9]

You need a point. Try dribbling goggles - they have them at Dicks for like $6. If your point can figure things out you can run pick n rolls til the rest of the team catches on.

[TooLiveBrew]

Steroids.

 

Hilarious

 

 

FtJ, try some high post stuff with your one capable offensive player. Get him the ball near the elbows, and run cutting off of that - I'm assuming he's a capable passer given the other descriptors you provided. This way, your corner-magnet guard has no reason to dribble to the corners, your PG has no reason to take the ball to the paint, and you can utilize the straight-line speed of the other guard moving toward the basket off screens set by your other post player.

 

Obviously there's more to it, but them's the basics.

[sbrylski]

When I played basketball up through out high school system, they started out teaching an extremely simple and structured offense. (Downscreen, pass and cut, screen across, pass and cut, downscreen...) Each year we would gradually get more freedom, and the area's middle school has/had some very good offensive teams running motion offenses.

 

But I agree with Uecker9, its going to be tough to do much of anything without a solid point. In the meantime, maybe a high post game, maybe an extremely high post game. Just get one of those guards to get the ball over halfcourt, then have the forward cut up from the block all the way to the top of the key, and have the forward get him the ball right away. If this foward is tall, it shouldn't be too difficult to hit him, and then you can just have some of the guys cut to the basket and see if he can turn and hit them.\

 

Good luck.

 

EDIT: Actually, my idea sounds very similar to TooLive's...

[Fatter than Joey]

The only thing I can think of is to tell the guards they are not allowed to shoot until the ball goes inside once.

 

Tried that -- then they don't shoot ever.

 

Are you playing the best guards you have?

 

I had to recruit a 2nd grader to find the best point.

 

I'm impressed that you are coaching an offense to a bunch of third graders.

 

Actually -- a lot of these teams have pretty good schemes, and execute them well.

 

You need a point. Try dribbling goggles - they have them at Dicks for like $6.

 

Great idea

 

But I agree with Uecker9, its going to be tough to do much of anything without a solid point.

 

Indeed.

 

In the meantime, maybe a high post game, maybe an extremely high post game. Just get one of those guards to get the ball over halfcourt, then have the forward cut up from the block all the way to the top of the key, and have the forward get him the ball right away.

 

I actually had the good forward at the elbow today, setting screens, and then rolling to the basket.

 

One time our straight line guard got an uncontested layup off of the screen, I almost wept. Badshot guard probably could have hit the forward rolling more, but chose not to, I can address that with line-sprints. Corner magnet guard still just turned the ball over.

 

Thanks for the ideas guys, I bought a program so I draw up animated plays.

[DHonks]

I never knew they offered basketball that young. My girlfriend's son is playing in kindergarten. Yet my district in Wisconsin (Elmbrook) didn't offer it to us until 5th grade, and the same was for the Catholic school I went to CCD at. The only sports for really young kids 20 years ago in Brookfield were soccer and baseball/t-ball.

[sbrylski]

I never knew they offered basketball that young. My girlfriend's son is playing in kindergarten. Yet my district in Wisconsin (Elmbrook) didn't offer it to us until 5th grade, and the same was for the Catholic school I went to CCD at. The only sports for really young kids 20 years ago in Brookfield were soccer and baseball/t-ball.

I read an article about a year ago that scouts/publications were ranking kids all the way down to 4th or 5th grade. That's just nuts.

[Crazyk1294]

Tell them to stop watching the NBA--now. Have them watch Hoosiers, The White Shadow, or Air Bud. I know was sure as hell wanted to be Michael Jordan when I was in 3rd grade-you've got a tough job.

 

One thing that worked for my team was running suicides when we did something stupid. I'm big on negative reinforcement....

[RockCoCougars]

Two words... point forward.

[Oldcity]

There is definitely merit to the point-forward idea. I coached parks and rec for a couple years (granted 7th and 8th grade so it's a bit different) and sometimes the best point guard happens to be one of the taller players. Although I'd think that when the kids are that young it's not a big deal to put a shorter player at forward and a taller player at guard. Might be worth a shot, at least a few times a game.

One time our straight line guard got an uncontested layup off of the screen, I almost wept.

Isn't that the best? Reminds me of the kids who would never want to shoot in a game and would just pass it right away. We finally got him to shoot and he nails a three. Good stuff.

 

[craigharmann]

I'm impressed that you are coaching an offense to a bunch of third graders. whenever I've seen 3rd grade age kids playing hoops (even in an organized league) it's ball-hog heaven with kids just running back and forth and kids going, basically, one-on-five because they just take it to the rim themselves, with varying levels of success.

 

You sure you weren't watching an NBA game? Sounds the same to me.

[Blindcheck]

This is how I did it when I was coaching a 3rd and 4th grade team....

 

We were undermanned to start the season, so we practiced defense/Defense/Defense and used our defense to set up fast breaks on offense...

 

The league that I coached in allowed Full Court Pressing unless you were up 10 points...We did that until the score was usually 10 to 0 and then put the press on if the opponent ever got within 10 points.

 

The benefit is that a full court press or a half court trap will lead to turnovers by the other team and lead to fast break opportunities for your team and also eliminate having to run your half court offense on many trips down the floor.

 

The year we did that we started out 0-2, but finished 8-2 and average over 50 points a game in 3rd and 4th grade league, when other teams sturggled to break 25 a game.

 

I also had another experience with a girls team that I coached on the same grade level and I had absolutely nobody on the team that could dribble the ball when the year started...The emphasis on defense in practice actually helps the offensive skills as the players get better when making the defensive players work in practice. But in the Girls league, no zones, no traps, no junk defenses, so we had to run half court offenses...so we had five basic plays that were run out of a the same set....(I had tried to run a motion offense, but had no luck, because of the lack of skills) By having the players know exactly where to go on each play, it helped keep the guards from dribbling themselves into trouble as the plays were designed to pass the ball and did not involve dribbling other than to get the ball up the court.

 

 

Overall, the best advice I can give is put in a full court press if allowed, half court trap if allowed...or if only man to man is allowed, use a Run and Jump defense that is a man to man defense where a man jumps the dribble and everyone rotates to a different man.....Getting easy offensive chances will help your team win games and get them confidence to run the offensive sets when you are in a half court set.

[bullox]

They need huge shorts and hip-hop.

[Roscoe Chill]

I coached 3rd and 4th graders when I was a Junior and Senior in High School. My philosophy was make sure everyone plays two quarters, and after that, the best players dominate the ball. Only certain players of mine were 'allowed' to shoot from outside a certain range, etc. It seems to work itself out as far as the weaker players getting their moments.

 

My biggest beef is that they stopped keeping score in my second year. I think that's one of the biggest mistakes in the new PC society we live in. Winning isn't everything, when I was in 7th grade I was on the same YMCA team as Robb Logtermann. We won every game by at least 30 points, and probably averaged 60 points a game. But Logtermann scored 55 of those points. I'm not exaggerating. Actually we lost one game to a team with Dave Jackson and Jim Jackson. Those twins played for Virginia Tech and Logtermann played for Marquette. My point is, it was probably the lamest season of organized sports I ever was associated with, finishing 14-1 or whatever it was. Not keeping official score actually makes lopsided games even worse. The last game I coached was an unofficial 62-6 victory http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif But there was no scoreboard, so who's running up the score? The kids know better. And if there was a scoreboard, I would have done things differently.

 

Back on point, stress team play in practice, and it seems to carry over in to the games. But I would say have your best players handle the ball regardless of their 'positions.' Quite frankly your best players should be your guards at that age.

[Fatter than Joey]

Thanks for the help --

 

I bought some goggles -- that was a great suggestion.

 

I am embracing the point forward concept -- I took him to open gym help with his ball-handling.

[nohopspanther]

Ever seen "Kicking and Screaming"? That's a pretty good path to follow.

[Jimbo]

Wow, this is way more advanced than what I had playing YMCA ball.

 

My dad was our coach for my 3rd-5th garde team one year and he taught us to play zone defense.

 

It wasn't until the middle of the third game until an opposing coach yelled "Hey, you're not allowed to play zone in this league!"

[Dmiles23]

Ok, this really doesn't have anything to do with the topic, but a couple of you were saying you never really had organized basketball until 4th-5th grade. I didn't until 4th grade, but I can across this video of a 5th grader. He us UNBELIEVABLE. If you are a basketball fan, I guarantee your jaw will drop when you watch it. This kid is unbelievable.

[Fatter than Joey]

UPDATE --

 

The kids went 2-1 in a tournament this weekend including handing out their first beatdown -- in which every kid scored.

 

The goggles, forward at the elbow, high-screens, etc. all helped...

 

Thanks to all!

[uecker9]

These little freaks finished the season 13-0, no help from me of course! Average score was 35-9 but needed a basket with 13 seconds left to win the tournament championship game 28-26. Next weekend we're going to a tournament in Lake Geneva with a lot tougher competition, we'll see what happens there. How's Team FTJ doing?

 

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x296/uecker9/IMG_0957.jpg

[Fatter than Joey]

Team's doing better -- I have installed the "point forward" philosophy, which has had its growing pains -- but we were playing someone last Friday and we were down 18-4 at halftime -- I switched to point forward and "won the second half" 6-4. We weren't turning the ball over near as much -- actually running an offense (burning clock) -- and not giving up fast breaks....

 

Where do you find out about tourneys? -- we aren't in a league, so tourneys are all we can go to, and we are looking for some more gyms to invade.