Haudricourt / BA Top 30 vs. Brewerfan Power 50

[Mass Haas]

Tom Haudricourt, in conjunction with his work at Baseball America, reveals and comments on the Brewers Top 30. For fun, in parentheses, I included each player's end-of-season 2007 ranking on our Power 50.

 

1. OF Matt LaPorta (2)

2. LHP Manny Parra (1)

3. SS Alcides Escobar (8)

4. RHP Jeremy Jeffress (3)

5. 3B Mat Gamel (4)

6. OF Cole Gillespie (7)

7. SS Brent Brewer (10)

8. C Angel Salome (5)

9. OF Lorenzo Cain (11)

10. OF Caleb Gindl (14)

11. RHP Rob Bryson (35)

12. RHP Mark Rogers (20)

13. LHP Zach Braddock (18)

14. RHP Luis Pena (unranked on a P50 technicality)

15. RHP R.J. Seidel (25)

16. C Jonathan Lucroy (13)

17. 3B Taylor Green (12)

18. RHP Cody Scarpetta (unranked)

19. RHP Nick Tyson (45)

20. RHP Alexandre Periard (33)

21. OF Darren Ford (6)

22. OF Lee Haydel (38)

23. 2B Eric Farris (43)

24. OF/1B Michael Brantley (9)

25. OF Stephen Chapman (16)

26. 2B/OF Hernan Iribarren (15)

27. LHP Steve Hammond (30)

28. OF Charlie Fermaint (29)

29. 1B Chris Errecart (21)

30. OF Brendan Katin (24)

[splitterpfj]

The gap in the two rankings for Michael Brantley caught my eye.

[twobrewers]

I like Tom's/BA significantly better, but then - the Power 50 hasn't been updated in awhile.

 

I guess my biggest agreement is that Bryson and Tyson, while young, are two of our better pitching prospects.

 

The Scarpetta bandwagon has been gathering a lot of steam lately as well. Looking at that list, we have a lot of players that need to show something this year. Lots of raw talent that needs to start performing to justify their rankings. (Brewer & Jeffress)

[DrWood]

one of the posters responding to that article said that gamel would be playing more CF than 3b this year. Hadn't heard anything like that before.

[colbyjack]

one of the posters responding to that article said that gamel would be playing more CF than 3b this year. Hadn't heard anything like that before.

 

Gamel playing CF? That's a first.

 

There was a story about a week ago that talked about Mat Gamel playing third base with Don Money as his head coach, and that roving infield instructor Garth Iorg, another fine defensive third baseman, would be spending a lot of time with Gamel. The story seemed to hint that if Gamel didn't show signs of improvement working with a couple of the better defensive third basemen, that the team would look to shift him to another position.

 

However, CF? That's a stretch.

[ILuvDaBush]

Well I still find it funny that we had a player who was drafted as a 1B playing center. As for the BA v. P50, I don't see how they can downgrade Darren Ford so easily. I thought they thought quite high of him last year.

[TooLiveBrew]

The gap in the two rankings for Michael Brantley caught my eye.

 

Ha! Ildb beat me to it. How about Darren Ford? Are the differences more a result of the P50 not being updated since last season?

[colbyjack]

I like Tom's/BA significantly better, but then - the Power 50 hasn't been updated in awhile.

 

BA has always placed a lot of value on potential (although they strayed from this in their league-by-league top prospect lists), so guys like Scarpetta, Bryson and Tyson are going to rank higher than they do on the P50 (although that doesn't explain Ford's ranking), while Brantley is going to rank lower than where we have him.

 

And keep in mind that the P50 is a collaborative effort between myself, Brad (pogokat) and Jim (Mass Haas), so a few differences in opinion can cause a pretty dramatic shift in where players end up.

 

I know for my rankings I typically need to see what a player can do at a higher level before I bump that player up. There are always exceptions, such as Gindl, who won the Pioneer League batting title as an 18-year old, and Jonathan Lucroy, who has a background of success in college and the scouting reports lead me to believe that his numbers were no fluke (as did his HWB performance). Bryson and Tyson saw substantial jumps towards the end of last year, and both could continue to rise if they enjoy success early during the 2008 season. Scarpetta needs to pitch professionally before I put him in the top 20, much less the top 50, and Haydel needs to show vast improvement with the bat for me to over-rank a player whose game is built around speed.

 

And of course these lists are subjective with no factual value to them, but they are fun to dissect.

[sheetskout]

Michael Brantley is WAY to low....

[Mass Haas]

Jim Callis of Baseball America answers the question below in his latest Ask BA:

The National League Central has quite a bit of talent behind the plate. How would you rank the five catchers who made BA's organization Top 10 Prospects lists: Bryan Anderson (Cardinals), Devin Mesoraco (Reds), Angel Salome (Brewers), Geovany Soto (Cubs) and J.R. Towles (Astros)? I know Soto and Towles are expected to start in the majors this season, but what is the ETA for the other three?

 

Andrew Haynes

Fresno

[TooLiveBrew]

Wow - just a side note, but 3 picks in the first 35 for the Crew (& 5 in the first 55). That's almost an insult to Jack Z's prowess! Almost.

 

 

"But was [soto's] improvement the result of losing 30 pounds and improving his bat speed and agility, or was it somewhat of a mirage created by spending a third straight season in Triple-A?"

How does Callis just gloss over Soto's freak BABIPs (both AAA & MLB)? That seems irresponsible for a sportswriter/analyst answering this particular question.

 

Also, not good to see Angel regarded as the weakest of the bunch. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/frown.gif

 

 

EDIT: Down at the bottom of the story MH linked, there's an interesting answer to this question:

 

What does it mean to be a crosschecker for a major league organization? How is it different than being a scout?

 

Ryan Hall

Havre de Grace, Md.

[colbyjack]

How does Callis just gloss over Soto's freak BABIPs (both AAA & MLB)? That seems irresponsible for a sportswriter/analyst answering this particular question.

 

Callis may very well be aware of BABIP, but that isn't that common of a term, at least not something most readers of Baseball America are going to be able to identify with. BA isn't in business to break down more complex statistical trends, although they do dabble with them from time to time, and have switched to the BA/OBP/SLG offensive line instead of the previously favored BA/HR/RBI.

 

I'm curious, why is the answer to how a scouting dep't. is broken down interesting? Is it just because you previously weren't familiar with how a scouting dep't. was organized? This map is a few years old, but it breaks down the Brewers scouting dep't. at the pro, amateur and international levels to give you a better understanding of how the Brewers specifically are organized:

 

http://www.brewerfan.net/ViewScoutingMap.action?draftId=6

[TooLiveBrew]

Callis may very well be aware of BABIP, but that isn't that common of a term, at least not something most readers of Baseball America are going to be able to identify with. BA isn't in business to break down more complex statistical trends, although they do dabble with them from time to time, and have switched to the BA/OBP/SLG offensive line instead of the previously favored BA/HR/RBI.

 

It's just that, in this specific case, the BABIP was so extreme, and played such an obvious role in his success, that I was surprised to not see it even get a whisper of a mention. But, if BA has only recently switched from counting stats to rate stats (generic, not meant as a broad-sweeping critique of BA), then I guess BABIP is way off on the horizon somewhere. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

 

 

I'm curious, why is the answer to how a scouting dep't. is broken down interesting?

 

I'd not seen anything on it before... you nailed it. Missed the chart, thanks for sharing. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif