Gallardo vs Inman

[lithium75]

One thing that has become clear as the posts about how to improve our Offense trickle in is that the majority of us think that Gallardo should be kept while Inman may be used to trade for a bat such as Crawford. I am in the camp that thinks that both should be untradable. One question that has not been raised is this: Which projects to the better pro?

 

Look at Gallardo; 6-3 record in 77.2 innings with an ERA of 2.10, K/Bb of 4.48, and a K/9 of 11.94 and a WHIP of 1.00 in A+ and a 5-2 record in 77.1 innings with a WHIP of 1.01, ERA of 1.63, 3.04 k/bb and a 9.89 K/9innings all as a 20 year old in A+ and AA respectively.

 

Inman was 10-2 over 110.2 innings with a 1.72 ERA, WHIP of 0.90, 5.58 k/bb, and 10.90 k/9 as a 19 year old in A ball.

 

Inman far outperformed Gallardo as a 19 year old. Gallardo throws 94ish with great control. Inman throws 93ish with great control. Inman appears to be the better strikeout pitcher. Both are very poised on the mound.

 

Gallardo is closer to the majors, and thus must be the safer bet. Inman may very well blow Gallardo's performance as a 20 year old in A+ and AA out of the water next year. I think that the race is closer than most think, and think Inman may have a very good shot of supplanting Gallardo as soon as next year.

 

I agree that Gallardo is the guy now, but I think that many are far too willing to part with Inman. Thoughts?

 

Edit: Gallardo's #'s as a 19 year old in A ball were 8-3 in 121.1 innings, ERA=2.75, WHIP=1.25, K'BB=2.16, and K/9=8.16. Inman was far superior as a 19 year old in A balla s Gallardo was. i have not factored in strength of offensive prospects, or other factors, so whomever can add these to the discussion are welcome.

[sbrylski]

He definatley has the potential to outpreform Gallardo. Those two are very exciting and I wish they were in the bigs now.

 

Inman appears to be the better strikeout pitcher. Both are very poised on the mound.

 

This is what I love about Gallardo. His "weaker" point is that he doesn't have great stuff. Yet he somehow led the entire minors in K's. Mmmm....nice.

[mothershipconnection]

Gallardo is closer to the majors, and thus must be the safer bet.

That's the issue. I think if people had to trade one of them, it'd be Inman simply because the further you are from the bigs, the more obstacles you may stumble over on your way there. Of course, we have guys who dominate AAA and can't make it work in the bigs, so nobody is a sure thing until they've done it at the mlb level.

Right now, I think the projections on the two are pretty equal, though the probability of a guy at a more advanced level meeting those projections is much greater. It's widely stated that the biggest adjustment a player has to make is the jump to AA, which Gallardo showed he could handle flawlessly. Inman hasn't had a chance to prove that yet, but let's all hope he progresses as well as Yo did this year and we may have more activity on the minor league forum than the major league forum.

[DHonks]

pretty simple, I would trade neither

[colbyjack]

First of all, I would trade Gallardo for Crawford if the deal became available. I just think Crawford is that good and is getting that much better as a 24-25 years old to make such a trade.

 

And while Inman has been incredibly impressive, and the numbers as you point out prove that, you just can't stack him up against Gallardo IMO given Yo's success this year at two higher levels.

 

I personally have Ryan Braun as the team's 1A prospect with Gallardo as 1B, with Inman as a legitimate #3, and have wondered out loud what team out there has a better 1-2-3 prospect tandem at the top of their minor league system. The only one I can/could think of is the D-Backs. BA is all over the D-Rays system right now, and they also seem to like Rogers better than Inman at this point in time, but again, I think Inman is a better prospect than Rogers and I also don't think the D-Rays have a better top 3 prospects than the Brewers do.

 

Back to the Gallardo-Inman breakdown, Inman needs to prove his worth next year at BC, and if he enjoys a similar jump as Yo did this past year, then we can have the discussion as to which prospect is better (that is, if Gallardo isn't already contributing at the big-league level).

[tigerbrew]

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pretty simple, I would trade neither

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Me too, I would like to see them pitch for the Brewers.

[pogokat]

I would love to see both pitch for the brewers...but if i can go back in time to 2000 and trade nick neugebaur for carlos beltran, i'd do it in a heart beat...

[endaround]

I'd be willing to trade either in the right deal. The Brewers have a three year window with actual pitching, you know the hard part to get. They need good hitters.

[tigerbrew]

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I would love to see both pitch for the brewers...but if i can go back in time to 2000 and trade nick neugebaur for carlos beltran, i'd do it in a heart beat...

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I think both Gallardo and Inman are better pitchers than Neugebauer, and I don't think Crawford is as good as Beltran.

 

To me, trading Gallardo for Crawford is a very difficult decision, which I will probably decline the trade. Gallardo's potential is higher than Neugebauer, and he has no injury history/problem. What if he turns out to be a Francisco Liriano?

 

Edit: change the word better to as good as

[pitchleague]

I would keep both, also. Isn't Crawford up for arbitration soon (this year?) and free-agency in a year or two? Why trade a potential Verlander (minus the 100mph stuff) for a guy we might have for only a year or two?

[pogokat]

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Gallardo's potential is higher than Neugebauer, and he has no injury history/problem. What if he turns out to be a Francisco Liriano?

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that's a bad example...who cares how good his half season was if he'll never be healthy again...

 

I would definitely move one of these guys for a perenial all-star at another position...pitching prospects will eventually drive you into utter despair..

[tigerbrew]

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that's a bad example...who cares how good his half season was if he'll never be healthy again...

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yeah, you're probably right that it's a bad example, what about Johan Santana as an example instead http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[colbyjack]

I think both Gallardo and Inman are better pitchers than Neugebauer, and I don't think Crawford is better than Beltran.

 

To me, trading Gallardo for Crawford is a very difficult decision, which I will probably decline the trade. Gallardo's potential is higher than Neugebauer, and he has no injury history/problem. What if he turns out to be a Francisco Liriano?

 

It's really easy to say that any prospect is better than Neugebauer now, but I think you're forgeting just how good of a pitching prospect Neugie was. The dude threw 100 mph with an absolutely wicked slider, and when his results started to catch up with his stuff, his name soared up BA's overall prospect lists, not just the Brewers'. His potential as a pitcher was higher probably than any other arm at the time, and while I really like Gallardo (and Inman), it is really hard to say right now that he/they is a better pitching prospect with a higher potential than what Neugebauer was four to five years ago.

[tigerbrew]

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His potential as a pitcher was higher probably than any other arm at the time, and while I really like Gallardo (and Inman), it is really hard to say right now that he/they is a better pitching prospect with a higher potential than what Neugebauer was four to five years ago.

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The reason I find that Gallardo (and Inman) to be better pitchers than Neugebauer is based on their stats compared with Neugebauer at the same level.

 

Neugebauer's control/accuracy wasn't good, resulting in high BBs.

[UWRyan428]

If Neugie wasn't throwing strikes with his fastball, then he was less than ordinary. Gallardo has 4 MLB quality pitches.

[BillScottCanRake]

The reason I find that Gallardo (and Inman) to be better pitchers than Neugebauer is based on their stats compared with Neugebauer at the same level.

 

Neugebauer's control/accuracy wasn't good, resulting in high BBs.

 

They might well be better pitchers now, but with Neubebauer we are talking about a guy who had a Randy Johnson-like ceiling.

 

I think the real point that is being made is when you are dealing with pitching prospects, the unknowns are so great that if you can flip one for an established star, you have to atleast strongly consider it.

 

Guys get hurt or they flame out for other reasons all the time and fail to live up to their astronomical potentional. If you can trade potential for production, you at least limit the number of unknowns you are dealing with.

 

Personally, I like Gallardo a lot and would be inclined to hold on to him. But I can also see why people wouldn't be opposed to trading him, and I could probably be swayed if the right deal came along.

[sbrylski]

Isn't Crawford up for arbitration soon (this year?) and free-agency in a year or two?

 

No, he signed a contract.

 

2007 - $4 million

2008 - $5.25 million

2009 - $8.25 million (club option)

2010 - $10 million (club option)

 

So we would have him for four years at a very reasonable price.

[colbyjack]

Like I said before, it's easy to call Gallardo a better pitching prospect than Neugebauer was now.

 

However, I am talking in context of how highly regarded Neugebauer was when he was one of the top pitching prospects in the game. It's easy to go back now and break down his stats and think "yeah, he wasn't as good as Gallardo is." As Chris mentioned, Neugie had a Randy Johnson-esque upside (he drew a lot of comparisons to Kerry Wood, and remember, we're talking about Wood comparisons from around the year 2000 when he was considered arguably the best young power pitcher in the game, not the Kerry Wood of today), and was talked about as a legitimate staff ace. Heck, one year (2000) he was even rated higher than Ben Sheets was.

 

Again, when talking about Gallardo now versus Neugebauer then, it's hard to say that Gallardo is a better prospect and has a higher upside.

[tigerbrew]

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However, I am talking in context of how highly regarded Neugebauer was when he was one of the top pitching prospects in the game.

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Isn't Gallardo currently considered one of the top pitching prospects in the game?

 

I think most young power pitchers have Randy Johnson-esque upside, but whether he has another good pitch and good command of his pitches are also vital. Neugie had struggled with his command much of his career.

[BillScottCanRake]

Isn't Gallardo currently considered one of the top pitching prospects in the game?

 

Yes- and while it's entriely probably he'll have a better major league career than Nick's two year run, he doesn't have the same upside as Neugebauer.

 

The problem is we KNOW Neugebauer never reached his potential because of injuries, so that tends to skew our view as to just how high his ceiling was. If both players reached their maximum potential, Neugy would have turned out to be the better pitcher.

[thefutureishere2006]

i wouldnt trade either of them until one prooves to be far greater then the other in the majors. even then, you might want to hold on to them both because pitching depth is really important.

[Yount19]

Maybe Rogers will fufill the potential the Nuegie had.

 

Rogers

Gallardo

Inman

Sheets

Cappy/Villianeuva/??

 

Maybe...

[SoCalBrewfan]

For some perspective, some Brewers pitchers and their peak position in the BA Top 100...warning as it's a sobering list in some ways:

 

Narciso Elvira, #23 (1991)

Angel Miranda, #81 (1991)

Cal Eldred, #85 (1992)

Tyrone Hill, #10 (1993)

Jeff D'Amico, #25 (1996)

Valerio DelosSantos, #52 (1997)

Ben Sheets, #5 (2001)

Nick Neugebauer, #17 in 2002

Mike Jones, #56 in 2003

Ben Hendrickson, #90 in 2003

Manny Parra, #69 in 2004

Jose Capellan, #25 in 2005

Mark Rogers, #44 in 2006

 

While Neugie was a high-ceiling guy, and led the minors in K/9, his control was always something to wonder about, and even BA who values ceiling above all else had some questions about him. (In 2002 he was the sixth-ranked pitching prospect on the list behind Beckett, Prior, Juan Cruz, Ryan Anderson, and Dennis Tankersley.)

 

Ben Sheets and Tyrone HIll were considered better prospects in their respective days, and Elvira, D'Amico and Capellan could be considered to be similarly ranked to Neugie, though for different reasons. I think Yo will be in the same range this spring. Gallardo is almost universally regarded as a notch below the best pitching prospects in the minors, and he won't unseat Sheets as the top-rated guy ever, or even beat Tyrone Hill in all likelihood. I'd be very surprised if Yo is not in the top 25, but at the same time I predict Brewerfan will be unhappy with his spot on the BA top 100.

 

(See the BA link below for one person's ranking of prospects by position...Yo is listed as the fifth-best RHP, behind Hughes, Bailey, Hochevar, and Lincecum. Mark Rogers is 20th on that list and Inman is not mentioned.)

 

www.baseballamerica.com/o...62606.html