Starting Lineup as of now? (Designated lineup thread)

[brewcrewkid14]

Considering that it is getting pretty late into the offseason, and as it does not appear that the Brewers are going to try to do much more (I know they could, but still), what is the projected starting lineup going to be for 2008? I am not really talking about the batting order in particular, but just who is most likely to start where, and what the bench might look like...

 

Here's what I got:

 

C: Kendall

1B: Fielder

2B: Weeks

SS: Hardy

3B: Braun

LF: Gross? (this is an area that I might be wrong)

CF: Hall

RF: Hart

 

SP: Sheets

SP: Gallardo

SP: Suppan

SP: Villanueva

SP: Capuano/Bush/Vargas

 

I am not going to even attempt the bullpen, but is this what it might look like for us this year? Will it be Kapler instead of Gross? What do you guys think?

[Team Canada]

I'll quibble a little bit and say that we're just a bit more than midway through the offseason, and there's still plenty of time for deals to be done. Not that there will be, but it's not panic mode yet.

 

I don't think there's much debate about the basics of the lineup as it stands right now, other than who will play LF (or 3B), but it would be a little disappointing if no other movement is made, and it wouldn't make me feel very confident about a division title in 2008. Not that it couldn't happen, mind you, but I sure wouldn't feel like we were the prohibitive favorite.

[logan82]

I would say you are right, but Gross will be paltooned with either Dillon or Kapler.

[monty57]

I'd say the likelihood of another move is still pretty high. If we don't make a move, do we start Yo and Villy in AAA or do we DFA two of Capuano / Vargas / Bush? I don't see either of those two scenarios happening, so we pretty much have to trade some of our excess starting pitching. The problem seems to be that every other GM knows this, so they aren't offering much for our pitchers.

[patrickgpe]

it defiantly seems we have entered the quiet part of the offseason, so we traditionally get alot of these threads. I don't think its fair or fruitfull to do it until at least after February 15nd. All the big free agent signings have been made and a few big trades have gone down. You remember though that we got Koskie right before spring training 2 season ago and i could see teams looking for a starter once the Bedard and Santana situations are resolved one way or another. Right now we have more pitchers than we can carry with a 12 or 13 man staff. Something has to give. Truth is Doug can't be happy if he has to use a Gross/Dillon/Kapler platoon on opening day. I think something will go down. Besides that there is little or no controversy with your lineup.

[logan82]

I don't see where we need to trade starting pitching. We have 2 more starters than we need, but they can both go to the pen. I see no scenario where Villy and Yo do anything other than start.

[patrickgpe]

well heres the problem with that

 

we have guaranteed contracts with

 

1. Gagne

2. Turnbow

3. Shouse (arby eligible)

4. Riske

5 Torres

6. Mota

 

Also Parra has yet to be discussed, who certainly would deserve a shot at a major league roster. Through in the 2 starters who do not get a spot and you have a 13 man staff. The brewers traditionally open with a 12 man staff due to number of off days to start the year. There just isn't room for these pitchers. If we want another position player we have to give up something and starting pitching would be a position of strength.

[sbrylski]

I don't see where we need to trade starting pitching. We have 2 more starters than we need, but they can both go to the pen. I see no scenario where Villy and Yo do anything other than start.

Three more:

Sheets - Gallardo - Suppan - Villanueva - Capuano

Bush - Parra

Vargas, ~$5M

 

I think if Capuano or Bush aren't used to net a better player, then Vargas will almost surely leave for something smaller.

[Invader3K]

I'm really not digging the thought of a Gross and/or Dillon situation in LF. I don't think Kapler will make the team, but who knows for sure? I also think one of Bush/Cappy/Vargas will get traded before Opening Day. Some other team that needs a starting pitcher will pony up something of enough value for Melvin to bite on. These things tend to sort themselves out in spring training.

 

I really wish the Brewers would consider moving Hall to a corner spot and putting a better defensive player in CF. Don't get me wrong, I think Hall is good, but he just didn't ever look that comfortable playing in center. I think Hart would be a better option there than him.

 

I also wonder who the backup catcher will be.

[Ennder]

They are small samples but for what it is worth Hall statistically was better than Hart in CF last year. Hall was pretty miserable in the first half and was above average in the 2nd half. I'm ok with another year with him in CF myself since we knew there would be an adjustment period.
I'm ok with Gross in LF but I'd like to have some more solid options if it doesn't work out, Dillon every day scares me and I'm worried we will end up with Gwynn out there a lot.

To take it another step here is the lineup I'd like

vs RH

Weeks
Gross
Braun
Fielder
Hart
Hall
Hardy
Kendall

vs LH

Weeks
Hart
Braun
Fielder
Hall
Hardy
Dillon
Kendall

I wish we had a good option for the 5 spot vs RH so Hart could bat 2nd but Gross worries me batting behind Fielder and Hall and Hardy are bleh against RH.

[Gopher74]

 

 

Sheets - Gallardo - Suppan - Villanueva - Capuano

Bush - Parra

Vargas, ~$5M

 

I think if Capuano or Bush aren't used to net a better player, then Vargas will almost surely leave for something smaller.

I keep seeing everyone saying Vargas will make about 5 million. I'd be surprised if he gets more than 4.2 million. I'm not sure why everyone thinks he's going to go from 2.5 to around 5. I doubt a guy with an ERA over 5.00 is going to get double what he got last year in arbitration.

 

Then again, I remember having this debate with people over Mench as well.

 

 

[twobrewers]

"We're set at a lot of places," said Melvin. "A lot of these other clubs are trying to fill holes." That was taken from Haudricourt's December 21st Blog - Melvin Likes Team Even With No More Moves.

 

If we were to open spring training today, I believe Gross would be penciled in as the starting LF. (Possibly as a platoon partner to Dillon)

 

Am I the only one against Gross as a starting OF? In my opinion, if Gross is going to start and be platooned with Dillon - why not just start Dillon at 3B and move Braun to the OF. I think Dillon and Gross are likely to put up similar numbers. Starting Gross keeps Braun at 3B and potentially wrecks our defense. Starting Dillon improves our defense without hurting our offense.

[rluzinski]

Considering that it is getting pretty late into the offseason, and as it does not appear that the Brewers are going to try to do much more

 

Even if only for a few more hours, it's still 2007, man! Plenty of time to make some moves. I think we'll see one more interesting move before it's all over. melvin will get his 3B, one way or another.

[Ennder]

Considering that it is getting pretty late into the offseason, and as it does not appear that the Brewers are going to try to do much more

 

Even if only for a few more hours, it's still 2007, man! Plenty of time to make some moves. I think we'll see one more interesting move before it's all over. melvin will get his 3B, one way or another.

 

I agree and even if he fails to get the 3b I bet he brings in another OF, even if it isn't a very solid OF like a Shannon Stewart or Brad Wilkerson type.

[logan82]

Three more:

Sheets - Gallardo - Suppan - Villanueva - Capuano

Bush - Parra

Vargas, ~$5M

 

I think if Capuano or Bush aren't used to net a better player, then Vargas will almost surely leave for something smaller.

I forgot about Torres so one more. Parra goes back to AAA to stretch out for 2009 when Sheets leaves and we need another starter.

[brewtank34]

#11...

I just don't think that they would move Braun to the OF so that Dillon can play 3B. If they're going to move Braun to the OF, it's going to be only to play someone of above average to star quality at 3B. They can't risk the mental breakdown of Braun for a chance that Dillon will be better than average. As gutt renching as it is waiting for Melvin to do something here, I will continue to wait patiently for it to happen. We have waaaaaay to many pitchers as well as young prospects such as Gwynn, Gamel, Hall, Gross as trade bait. Something's gotta give...

[yoshii8]

I don't know why Parra would begin the season in AAA, I would prefer for him to be our 5th starter, but at the very least he has proved to be one of our 12 best pitchers. I think there is plenty of time for the Brewers to work out the extra glut of pitchers. I still think that Capuano and Vargas will be traded.

 

I would like to see Sheets, Gallardo, Suppan, Villanueva and Parra as starters, and Bush, Torres, Shouse, Mota, Riske, Turnbow and Gagne as the relievers.

[brewcrewkid14]

You guys are right they basically have to make a move, and it very well could just end up being Vargas if they can't get something decent for Bush or Capuano. I wonder if they are waiting with Capuano in case the Cardinals come back calling for Rolen. I don't really want to get into that here, but just what I can assess.

 

Also, I have a feeling the lineup might look something more like this:

 

Weeks

Kendall

Braun

Fielder

Hart

Gross

Hall

Hardy

 

I just think that they plan on batting Kendall second because of his on base abilities. This is what I expect, it isn't exactly what I want.

[logan82]

I don't know why Parra would begin the season in AAA, I would prefer for him to be our 5th starter, but at the very least he has proved to be one of our 12 best pitchers. I think there is plenty of time for the Brewers to work out the extra glut of pitchers. I still think that Capuano and Vargas will be traded.

He only pitched approx 133 innings last year. Other than that he hasn't goe over 100 innings since 2003. I would guess mostly because of injury. He might be one of our 12 best pitchers, but if we want him starting, sending him to the minors and getting his innigs up in 2008 is the best way for him to be starting in 2009. It might work for him if he was our 5th starter, but I doubt he would make the starting rotation. It looked like Villy had a starting spot locked up at the end of 2006 and then we aquired Vargas. Management and our manager have shown they prefer the guy with more experience in the rotation. With Bush, Vargas and Capuano all in line ahead of himI doubt he makes it. I think one will be gone by spring training. Hopefully Vargas as I think the other 2 are better. We may not like Vargas, but he does have quite a bit of value.

[yoshii8]

Logan, I still think that he would have the biggest upside as the #5 starter, and if healthy he would probably be able to pitch 150-160 innings, which would be plenty. I don't see any reason to waste his healthy innings in AAA, escpecially when we are in a win now mode.

 

He proved to me that he belongs, and looks to be a guy that could potentially give you a quality start every time if healthy. Also Melvin said that Parra will be given every chance to be the 5th man in the rotation. And I think another thing that makes me think that he will be in the rotation is that during the pennant race last year he was put in our rotation.

[MNBrew]

The '07 plan for Villanueva was to send him to AAA to start if he didn't make the rotation. But he just pitched way too well to get sent down, so they put him in the bullpen. After some injuries & slumps, he finally got his crack in the rotation and did very well. I think Villanueva would have to prove he doesn't belong in the rotation to be anything other than an '08 starter for the Crew.

[Baldkin]

"During the pennant race last year he was put in our rotation."

 

Yes, after 1 starter was hurt, another was given up on a third was down in the minors stretching out his arm and a 4th was having his innings limited as best as possible.

 

They want Parra to start this year, if he wins the job by a big margin he'll be the 5th starter.

 

If he doesn't he'll be in AAA as he still has an option left and he needs more innings in his arm to prove (get him ready for) a full season starting.

[yoshii8]

Well, they still thought enough of him to put him in our rotation during a pennant race, thats gotta mean something. He looked very MLB ready, I think if we wanted to win in 2 years we leave him in AAA, but its a win now situation.

[And That]

I think if we wanted to win in 2 years we leave him in AAA, but its a win now situation.

I think the Brewers would prefer to win both this coming year and the year after. If Parra doesn't completely out-perform every other possibility for the rotation in spring, and the scouting staff truly believes he has nothing left to learn in AAA, then he'll stick. Otherwise he goes back to AAA.

 

[logan82]

I think we have more and more experienced arms this year for our pen than we did last year. That's why I don't think Parra makes the pen. I honestly can see a lesser arm kept in the pen especially when that last arm in the pen usually gets very sporadic work, not something you want for a young developing arm. I think a lot of it comes down to the fact he still has an option left. It doesn't hurt to have him in AAA stretched out so he can step in for the inevitable injury to one of our starters. Nobody specific, just when is the last time any MLB team went the whole year without changing one of their starters at some point because of injury or performance?