Catalanotto now in play?

[JohnBriggs12]

Hmmm. Texas now has Hamilton and Bradley in the OF and Ben Broussard at 1B and Blalock at 3B. That's a lot of lefthanded bats. I cannot imagine why they'd need Frank Catalanotto now. And they surely could use a starting pitcher. Is it possible that Melvin will re-unite Catalanotto and Kapler as his LF platoon?

[sbrylski]

Catalanotto = Gross, IMO. Good for deepening the team, but I'd hope we could find an everyday player out there somewhere, if not at 3B.

[JohnBriggs12]

Catalanotto = Gross, IMO. Good for deepening the team, but I'd hope we could find an everyday player out there somewhere, if not at 3B.

 

Catalanotto is a far, far more accomplished hitter than Gross and far closer to the description that Melvin says he wants. He's been a regular platoon guy his entire career. Gross has been a bench guy. As a number 2 hitter in his career, Catalanotto has posted .299/.359/.451 in over 1500 AB's. He fits Brewer needs to a tee. He's lefthanded. He plays LF. He's tough to strike out (as opposed to Gross). He gets on base (.359 career).

[And That]

Catalanotto is a far, far more accomplished hitter than Gross and far closer to the description that Melvin says he wants.

Can he play 3B regularly? No?

 

[JohnBriggs12]

Catalanotto is a far, far more accomplished hitter than Gross and far closer to the description that Melvin says he wants.

Can he play 3B regularly? No?

 

And that,

 

Melvin has said he's looking either for a LF or a 3B. In fact he was looking for a LF before he even considered 3B but none were available at his price that fit his description. It was only then he started looking at 3B. Well now Catalanotto might be available. Nobody on the Brewers has ever said Braun is definitely moving off 3B.

[And That]

And that,

 

Melvin has said he's looking either for a LF or a 3B. In fact he was looking for a LF before he even considered 3B but none were available at his price that fit his description. It was only then he started looking at 3B. Well now Catalanotto might be available. Nobody on the Brewers has ever said Braun is definitely moving off 3B.

Ryan Braun is a terrible third baseman. If he's not replaced, we're in trouble.

 

[colbyjack]

Sure, no one has said that Braun is moving to the OF yet, but I think it's pretty clear that Melvin would much rather prefer to get a 3B. However, if the team is mulling Lofton, Catalonotto certainly is possible, and there are obviously ties with Melvin.

 

That reminds me of the ongoing Cat vs. Kapler argument we had way back when...

[And That]

However, if the team is mulling Lofton, Catalonotto certainly is possible, and there are obviously ties with Melvin.

That doesn't mean it's a good, or even palatable, idea.

[JohnBriggs12]

Colbyjack,

 

I've been following this very closely and I don't recall one quote where Melvin said anything about "preferring" a 3B. I did read where he was somewhat frustrated that he couldn't find the OF bat he was looking for so he expanded his search to include the "possibility" of adding a 3B, and moving Braun to LF.

 

It was posters here that jumped on the Rolen rumor to conclude that Braun to LF was set in stone.

[sbrylski]

Catalanotto = Gross, IMO. Good for deepening the team, but I'd hope we could find an everyday player out there somewhere, if not at 3B.

Catalanotto is a far, far more accomplished hitter than Gross and far closer to the description that Melvin says he wants. He's been a regular platoon guy his entire career. Gross has been a bench guy. As a number 2 hitter in his career, Catalanotto has posted .299/.359/.451 in over 1500 AB's. He fits Brewer needs to a tee. He's lefthanded. He plays LF. He's tough to strike out (as opposed to Gross). He gets on base (.359 career).

Over the last three seasons, verse RHP:

 

Gross - .270 / .361 / .464 / .825 - 440 AB

Catalanotto - .291 / .362 / .450 / .812 - 1105 AB

 

Gross is under contract for 400k.

Catalanotto would cost a prospect/pitcher to get, and is under contract for 2 years / $8M total, with a $5M team option and $2M buyout.

 

Gross is also likely better defensively, based on BP's Rate, 100 is average (LF/CF/RF):

 

Gross - 110 / 103 / 106

Catalanotto - 91 / 93 / 101

 

The only argument you can make for Catalanotto over Gross is he has a larger sample. I think we should set our sights a little higher or stick with what we have.

 

[JohnBriggs12]

sbrylski,

 

Did you read my initial post on this thread? Texas just traded the guy listed as their 5th starter on the team's website. They now need another starter (ala Vargas or Capuano) to fill that slot. Texas could not trade Catalanotto prior to today because they had no adequate replacement for him so any inquiry would have been rebuffed. Now not only do they have another left handed hitting outfielder in Hamilton, they are short one more starting pitcher.

 

Catalanotto's contract is modest for a veteran. It's far below what Jenkins just signed for yet he provides the better contact and on base skills that is needed in this lineup. Any salary he has would be offset by their taking Capuano or Vargas in return.

[And That]

Catalanotto's contract is modest for a veteran. It's far below what Jenkins just signed for yet he provides the better contact and on base skills that is needed in this lineup. Any salary he has would be offset by their taking Capuano or Vargas in return.

We need a third baseman, not a left fielder.

 

[JohnBriggs12]

Catalanotto's contract is modest for a veteran. It's far below what Jenkins just signed for yet he provides the better contact and on base skills that is needed in this lineup. Any salary he has would be offset by their taking Capuano or Vargas in return.

We need a third baseman, not a left fielder.

 

 

We have a third baseman who was just Rookie of the Year.

[And That]

Catalanotto's contract is modest for a veteran. It's far below what Jenkins just signed for yet he provides the better contact and on base skills that is needed in this lineup. Any salary he has would be offset by their taking Capuano or Vargas in return.

We need a third baseman, not a left fielder.

 

We have a third baseman who was just Rookie of the Year.

Who can't field.

 

Even in Georgia they know this.

[derflotr]

What do you mean he can't field? He can't throw.

 

The career .360 OBP is attractive, and if he's our best return for Capuano/Vargas I guess I'd be satisfied.

 

Signed a 3-year 13.5 mil contract last November...get him for 2 years for around 9 mil? Definitely an option.

[And That]

What do you mean he can't field? He can't throw.

I believe that's part of fielding. Doesn't do much for a guy to catch the ball and stick it in his mouth, yah?

[derflotr]

Thank you. I seriously did not know that.

 

Yeah, I'm with you on this one. Ryan's defense is absolutely beyond repair, especially considering his age. I mean, there is really no fix to those kinds of struggles and it has never been done before.

 

We can only hope that Doug Melvin reads this thread and reacts exclusively to your advice of complete abandonment of one of our best prospects that we've had in years.

[And That]

Thank you. I seriously did not know that.

 

Yeah, I'm with you on this one. Ryan's defense is absolutely beyond repair, especially considering his age. I mean, there is really no fix to those kinds of struggles and it has never been done before.

 

We can only hope that Doug Melvin reads this thread and reacts exclusively to your advice of complete abandonment of one of our best prospects that we've had in years.

The fact that Ryan Braun can hit does not negate the fact that he can not currently field well at third base. It also does not negate the fact we can not currently afford an abominable third baseman given our present defensive structure. I'm sure Ryan will hit equally as well as a LF or RF, even though his ego may be hurt that he's not playing a position he can't handle.

 

[derflotr]

Thank you. I seriously did not know that.

 

Yeah, I'm with you on this one. Ryan's defense is absolutely beyond repair, especially considering his age. I mean, there is really no fix to those kinds of struggles and it has never been done before.

 

We can only hope that Doug Melvin reads this thread and reacts exclusively to your advice of complete abandonment of one of our best prospects that we've had in years.

The fact that Ryan Braun can hit does not negate the fact that he can not currently field well at third base. It also does not negate the fact we can not currently afford an abominable third baseman given our present defensive structure. I'm sure Ryan will hit equally as well as a LF or RF, even though his ego may be hurt that he's not playing a position he can't handle.

 

See: Bill Hall.

Can we agree that Hall's massive dropoff heavily contributed to 2nd place last year?

We don't need Braun to fall off the face of the earth offensively either. And yes, I realize CF is not LF or RF, but it's still a change of scenery and obviously can having damaging effects. I can't understand why someone would move Braun so quickly after seeing Hall do some serious regressing last year.

 

[And That]

I can't understand why someone would move Braun so quickly after seeing Hall do some serious regressing last year.

Ryan Braun was the worst defensive third baseman in 100 years?

Edit: Excuse me... ~100 years.

[Fatter than Joey]

Ryan's defense is absolutely beyond repair, especially considering his age. I mean, there is really no fix to those kinds of struggles and it has never been done before.

 

This would be correct.

 

We can only hope that Doug Melvin reads this thread and reacts exclusively to your advice of complete abandonment of one of our best prospects that we've had in years.

 

If by "complete abandonment" you mean -- "move to left field" -- DM is obviously considering making this move.

[brosto1]

Moving Pujols off third base during his rookie year didn't hurt his offense much.

[Fatter than Joey]

I can't understand why someone would move Braun so quickly after seeing Hall do some serious regressing last year.

 

First -- Braun can't get through a whole game at 3b --Yost isn't going to trot Counsell out to play LF

 

Second -- I think it is just as probable that Braun could struggle offensively if he continues to botch 1 out of 10 plays at 3b, and he starts getting booed.

[And That]

First -- Braun can't get through a whole game at 3b --Yost isn't going to trot Counsell out to play LF

I would argue Ryan can't get through a whole inning at third without some luck.

 

[sbrylski]

sbrylski,

Did you read my initial post on this thread? Texas just traded the guy listed as their 5th starter on the team's website. They now need another starter (ala Vargas or Capuano) to fill that slot. Texas could not trade Catalanotto prior to today because they had no adequate replacement for him so any inquiry would have been rebuffed. Now not only do they have another left handed hitting outfielder in Hamilton, they are short one more starting pitcher.

 

Yes, I read it, and Gross>Catalanotto was my response. I don't care about who Texas traded or what they need, that's irrelevant to my argument.

 

Can we agree that Hall's massive dropoff heavily contributed to 2nd place last year?

 

Have we agreed it was completely due to a position change? He also played through an injury. There's also just natural fluctuation. Not saying it didn't hurt, but there's other guys who've made the transistion and hit fine. Even if he hits a bit worse and is below average defensively in a corner, he'll be more valuable than he was at 3B.