Why has boxing died?

[jaybird2001wi]

About 15 years ago, Heavyweight boxing was actually decent. We had Mike Tyson, pre-jail, and Evander Holyfield and George Foreman at the tail end of his career.

I always remember watching ESPN the night of the big heavyweight fights to see Al Bernstein's round-by-round scoring since I couldn't afford to pay the 49.95 fee for "Pay-Per-View" at the time, unless I had a friend who had the "chip" at the time.

Now Holyfield could die if he gets knocked out again, Tyson is getting crazier, Lennox Lewis is old and the only good heavyweight fighter is a Russian named Vitaly Klitschko.

The fighters back in 1992 who could actually show some interest from the public were:

1) Foreman (sometimes, depending on who he fought)

2) Michael Moorer (he had his moments, but lost a lot of respect when he got knocked out by an aging Foreman)

3) Buster Douglas (gained some respect after knocking down Tyson)

4) Mike Tyson

5) Holyfield

6) Larry Holmes (just for the comical sense of when he fought Foreman)

7) Lennox Lewis

8) Razor Ruddock

9) Ray Mercer

10) Riddick Bowe

 

Now it is like the heavyweight division is run by no-name Russian fighters with no character and heavyweight boxing has bowed down in favor of the UFC.

[GAME05]

i always shudder when i realize that Klitschko is maybe the best heavyweight out there.

 

i think it's not only the names that don't attract people, it's been exposure. Boxing isn't on network TV anymore, so it's just not as accessible. I guess we've got Friday Night Fights or an HBO bout, but I'm usually not anxious to watch those names fight.

 

the big name people also fight about half as often as 30 years ago.

[brettac1]

I would put Tommy Morrison in your list, too, jaybird. White American guys are always a drawing card in boxing.

 

I LOVE boxing. I watch pretty much all the big fights on PPV/HBO/Showtime. I think the sport is great, but just in the lower divisions. Obviously, heavyweights sell, however, the PBF/DLH PPV this year set a record for the number of buys for any fight. Heck, the Mayweather/Hatton fight is going to have a lot of buys, and Mayweather's just going to make a fool of him - so, HBO is obviously doing a great job marketing the sport.

 

The lack of the network TV presence is really it, though. I remember when I was a kid being able to watch a lot of fights on CBS, NBC, and ABC on Saturday afternoons with my grandpa.

 

I guess another problem is that most of the really good fighters of the past decade plus aren't action fighters, either. Floyd, Wright, Hopkins, Jones, etc. There are some (the Cotto/Mosley fight was great), but just not a lot.

[jwill535]

the biggest problem is the 100 sanctioning bodies and the fact that there are a 100 champions per weight class. It akin to everyone gets a trophy. Corruption is another major problem, as long as people like Don King rule the sport, that isnt going to change. Plus MMA has taken alot of the fans, with its quicker fights and generally more entertaining fights. I watched a Jermaine Taylor fight(pre Pavlik) and he threw about a 100 punches the whole fight.

[brettac1]

Oh, man, Jermain Taylor was the worst. Praise be to Kelly Pavlik. I'd bet the fight you watched was the Corey Spinks fight. Awful. Taylor fought guys when he was champion that were just jokes, in Ouma and Spinks. Then he finally had to fight Pavlik.

 

I was going to add the same thing re:the alphabet soup belts, jwill. The fact that there isn't a universally recognized world champion at each weight class hurts (so does the fact that there are a million weight classes today, as well).

 

I sort of agree with the corruption thing (and people like Arum and King are terrible), but that's been in boxing for ages. Jack Johnson taking a dive, Liston counting the lights against Clay, etc.

[danzig6767]

brettac1 wrote:

The lack of the network TV presence is really it, though. I remember when I was a kid being able to watch a lot of fights on CBS, NBC, and ABC on Saturday afternoons with my grandpa.

I think that has alot to do with it. I'm not sure how old you are, but as a kid i grew up watching all the great fights involving Sugar Ray Leonard, Duran, Hagler, and Hearns. As for heavyweights, i watched Ali fight Spinks, all the Holmes fights against guys like Norton, and other big name fights all on free TV.

 

As i got older, the bigger fights went to pay per view, but i had a descrambler for about 8-10 years and got all the big fights for free. There are fights now that sorta interest me, but in most cases, i'm not going to pay 35-55 bucks to watch it.

 

The mess of sleazy promoters has helped drag down boxing also along with the huge rise of mixed martial arts sucking away younger guys who don't follow boxing.

[brettac1]

I'm actually only 23, but I remember watching De la Hoya in his younger days, as well as guys like Sweet Pea Whittaker, Chavez, etc. on network TV. Thanks to the wonders of YouTube, though, I have watched a ton of amazing fights that I wasn't alive to see (my favorite ones in the past few weeks being Meldrick Taylor vs. Julio Caesar Chavez, what an amazing fight and Roberto Duran vs. Iran Barkley).

[jaybird2001wi]

[mothershipconnection]

I don't follow boxing at all anymore. It's just not accessible for me. Back in the day you maybe had to have HBO or Showtime to get the fights - and I could deal with paying $20 for the fights in addition to the other programming they offer. I'm not willing to spend $50 a fight, though. It has simply gotten ridiculous. And I think there's a "chicken and egg" issue going on with exposure and great fighters. Perhaps the lack of interest and glorification of the sport has not attracted the athletes that once went toward boxing. Watching fights as a kid was what attracted me to being a boxer.

[Boy Jeenius]

When Cus D'Amato died and Don King took over managing Mike Tyson, it turned into all sizzle and no steak. It was all about the hype and the substance was just gone. It did not take people long to figure out that we were watching an event no different than WWE. D'Amato kept Tyson focused on boxing. King kept Tyson on being on TV and in tabloids. What junk.

[GAME05]

i absolutely love boxing (don't much care for MMA). but $50 or whatever for PPV just isn't feasible. and a Mayweather/Hatton fight? am i supposed to get excited about that? really?

 

although i disagree about corruption ruining the sport, at least recently vs. past. that's definitely one thing that's always been there.

 

but now to a good extent, no even fights are really put together. sure, every couple of years you get something, but you just don't see 1 vs. 2 much anymore. all the top fighters seem to pick opponents that they know they can beat, get their huge purse and go away happy. everyone's too afraid to lose.

[Fatter than Joey]

I would never consider myself a huge boxing fan -- but I certainly grew up in an era where boxing was as big as anything else in sports.

 

I would say that the biggest downfalls to boxing are --

 

1.) Lack of "Tuesday Night Fights" --

2.) Rise in popularity of UFC type stuff.

 

The other aspect that hasn't been discussed but I think may be a factor, is the wane of interest in the Olympics -- some of my earliest childhood sports memories are from the 1976 Olympics -- the Spinks bros. Sugar Ray -- Big John Tate getting decapitated by Teofilo Stevenson.. It was pretty easy to embrace the career of Sugar Ray and the Spinks after defeating the Russians to win gold medals.

[GAME05]

everyone keeps saying MMA has taken away from boxing, but i guess i don't see it that way. i think the rise of MMA has only sprung out of the lack of interest in boxing. plus i don't see the sports as being mutually exclusive and that fans could easily suport the two.

[Invader3K]

Really though, boxing needs to take a cue from UFC. UFC is all over cable (SpikeTV), and I think they even have a syndicated show. Their PPVs outdraw boxing and even WWE events now (just as an aside). I get mailers regularly for UFC events...I can't remember getting a postcard or anything for the last big boxing match. Plus, you have all the "knock off" groups on Versus, HDNet, etc. Once in a while there is a fight on ESPN, HBO, or Showtime...that's about it. Boxing just doesn't have the presence that UFC has achieved. I mean, ESPN even covers UFC regularly now. You see guys like Chuck Liddel and Tito Ortiz all over TV in commercials, doing interviews, etc. How often do you see, uh...Vitali Klitschko in a TV commercial, for example?

 

I don't really follow either sport too much, but just a casual observation.

[DuWayne Steurer]

everyone keeps saying MMA has taken away from boxing, but i guess i don't see it that way. i think the rise of MMA has only sprung out of the lack of interest in boxing. plus i don't see the sports as being mutually exclusive and that fans could easily suport the two.

I don't think that's necessarily true, I think a lot of fans see MMA as much more exciting. In boxing you punch, in MMA you can do just about anything besides choke with your fingers or kick a man's head while he's on the ground. The fights are much quicker, and with going bare knuckle, any half ass fighter can land a lucky shot and score a knockout. The first 5 or 6 PPV's of the year in UFC had the underdog winning the main event, often in stunning fashion.

Also, as others have pointed out, UFC (and Pride, beforehand) have done a fantastic job of marketing themselves, getting on tv, and making people aware of the product. Just a few months ago, UFC aired a live light heavyweight title fight with a full undercard on Spike for free. They're having another major card in February I believe on cable. They plan on continuing that trend at least 2-3 times per year. You're never going to see a major boxing title (or even a big draw fight) on network or cable tv.

[brettac1]

There's only one MAY-WEATHER.

 

Awesome performance by Floyd tonight. Hatton's a C Class chump and Floyd disposed of him as such. I thought it'd something like a 119-109 decision for Floyd, but it was nice to see him just knock him out. He's the best I have ever seen or probably ever will, I just hope his "vacation" isn't too long.

 

Box that midget, champ. Box that midget.

[bthurley19]

Classy move by the English fans booing our national anthem. Loved Floyd coming out to Springsteen's Born in the USA too. Good fight and awesome performance from the best pound for pound boxer out there right now. That left hook coming out of the corner to knock down Hatton was amazing.

[GAME05]

before the fight a friend of mine actually thought Hatten could stay with Marweather--i tried to tell him, but he's figured it out now. Round 8 hit and just got too tired, he lost all his speed, he started leaning in to rest instead of leaning in to punch. and he just stopped pushing Mayweather into the ropes and actually tried to fight him in the middle of the ring. but you could see Mayweather was still strong, so you could just tell a KO was coming, no surprise.

 

it's possible i dozed off for a second watching the undercard bouts, all just totally lifeless.

[igor67]

I remember back in the early 90's when every once in awhile you could still catch a boxing match on ABC. The problem even then was that the only interesting fights to watch were the light weight fighters because they actually moved. Most heavyweights devolved into hugging matches and rounds of boring action. Mid 90's I caught a kickboxing fight on ESPN and I couldn't believe how exciting those 3 rounds were! At first I wanted more rounds since there was no KO, but then it occurred to me that you get better action with a shorter fight because your not trying to stay standing an hour later. And a few years later I saw some early UFC stuff which was so unpredictable and tons of actual knockouts compared to boxing. Modern MMA still has superficially less appealing grappling, but they are so good and fast that it's still action.

[TURBO]

any of you guys from the espn boards remember a cat named ANTIBOXER?

 

every time I see a boxing thread, I am reminded of him...

 

he would show up and tell of his past glorys, usually involving tugging the manhood of his wrestling partners...funny stuff, I wonder what ever happened to the guy?

[brettac1]

it's possible i dozed off for a second watching the undercard bouts, all just totally lifeless.

 

Yeah, that was definitely the worst undercard in a while. The Cherry/Ferguson fight was OK, but even Ponce De Leon was boring. Lacy was overhyped three years ago, and yet he's fighting in the fight prior to the main event... against a guy from the freaking Contender. Just a bad card. But, I was happy with the main event. The one thing Golden Boy Promotions does is sell a PPV and make the rubes think it's going to be a good fight. There were people who actually thought Hatton had a chance, and there were people a couple months ago who thought Barrera had a chance against Manny Pacquiao.

 

The Mayweather/DLH card had Katsidis (who is just awesome) vs. Amonsot though, which was great. The Cotto/Mosley card was decent. Trying to remember back, I think there were some OK fights on the Wright/Hopkins undercard, too.

 

Next HBO PPV is Jones/Trinidad, that's going to be a terrible fight. I can't imagine how blown up and slow Tito's going to look at 170. But, Pavlik/Taylor 2 is in February, and that should be a good fight again. Hopefully Pavlik can win again, he's good for the sport - he's an action fighter, but he's good, plus he'll fight anyone. Good thing is that it's not a title fight, so he can stay in the limelight as middleweight champ, even if he loses.

[brewcrewreview]

I got Mayweather at -180 and it was one of the biggest steals ever! Almost as good as when I took Mayweather over De La Hoya.

[brettac1]

Well, anyone else braving the sure-fire dud that's coming up tonight with Jones/Trinidad?

 

At least the undercard has Andrew Golota.

[burniebrewer]

Jones wins a unanimous decision while scoring two knockdowns along the way.

 

From the stories I've read, it sounds like Jones was toying with Trinidad and won the fight rather easily.

[brettac1]

Yeah, Jones just owned him after the first 3-4 rounds. It was a far better fight than I was expecting, though, considering there was no doubt who would win from the moment the fight was signed. Trinidad's got no business at 170.

 

What was shocking was that a Don King Promotions show put on the best HBO PPV undercard in ages. Alexander/Clottey was one-sided but entertaining, Karmazin/Bunema was really good, and the Andrew Golota express rolled on in a really nice fight. In all not a terrible card.

 

Next one is sure to be great - Taylor/Pavlik II.