Joe Crede

[MoneyballMan]

Joe Crede's name coming up again. Interesting. (mlbrumors.com)

[trwi7]

Hopefully not for the Brewers. I don't want his weak bat anywhere near Milwaukee, plus he's a free agent after this season and is represented by Boras. He has almost no value.

[PeaveyFury]

What Melvin left out was that their discussions about Crede was probably:

 

'Whatever we do about third base or left field, it will not involve Joe Crede.'

[Brian the Automator]

Crede's an interesting case. Every few years, his numbers take a real nice spike. He'll be 30 though in April, so I'd pass this one up. If he could play SS/2B, he wouldn't be a bad bench player.

[splitterpfj]

Please don't do this.

[TCSM]

everyone can calm down...theres no rumors, no speculation...just an idea someone on that site made up (which are usually garbage)

[colbyjack]

Crede just isn't very good. I'm not going to waste my time posting numbers, he's a better option than Pedro Feliz, but he still is living off of the reputation he made after the White Sox won the World Series.

 

However, I did point out very early in the Rolen thread in mid-November that Crede would make for an interesting target of a three-way trade with the Cardinals to help them replace, even if it is temporarily, Scott Rolen. I have to believe that the White Sox would take just about anything for Crede these days, as he's not good to begin with, is a free agent after next season and is represented by Scott Boras. He does have power and is good defensively and could be one good year away from a ludicrous contract players like Crede should never sniff.

 

Of course that is assuming the Cardinals might think he's a decent player. If they're even considering Pedro Feliz, they might.

[PeaveyFury]

everyone can calm down...theres no rumors, no speculation...just an idea someone on that site made up (which are usually garbage)

 

Actually, it comes from Adam McCalvey at Brewers.com:

 

Were the Brewers to acquire a player like Rolen or White Sox third baseman Joe Crede, whom they discussed briefly at last month's General Manager's Meetings

 

http://milwaukee.brewers.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20071203&content_id=2316320&vkey=news_mil&fext=.jsp&c_id=mil

[TCSM]

looks like i should have been more specific....as of now *insert last statement here*

[JohnBriggs12]

I'd take Crede over Rolen. Ignore his stats from 07. His back was killing him before he finally opted for surgery. Everything I hear is that he'll be 100% for this season. He's as good as they get with the glove, is still fairly young (turns 30 in 08), and assuming health, his power will surpass that of Rolen. Plus he's in a contract year where he has to prove himself.

[dadofandrew]

Crede would be a stopgap if nothing else happens. Short-term, you could do worse, but I'm sure he's not ideal.

[tigerbrew]

I'm guessing the asking price for Crede is Mench, anything more might be overpaying considering Crede could be due close to $5M in arby.

[trwi7]

I'd take Crede over Rolen. Ignore his stats from 07. His back was killing him before he finally opted for surgery. Everything I hear is that he'll be 100% for this season. He's as good as they get with the glove, is still fairly young (turns 30 in 08), and assuming health, his power will surpass that of Rolen. Plus he's in a contract year where he has to prove himself.

 

So both are coming off injuries. One is due 3/36 while the other is a one year rental with Boras as his agent, both are expected to be ready come opening day and Crede has a career .751 OPS with a .305 OBP while Rolen has a career .879 OPS and .372 OBP.

 

Crede doesn't exactly fit the description of a "professional hitter" that Doug Melvin is looking for.

[logan82]

Crede would be a stopgap if nothing else happens. Short-term, you could do worse, but I'm sure he's not ideal.

 

If we are going to go with a stopgap solution I would rather go with a stopgap in LF where we have a prostect in the minors we are grooming for the postion rather than moving Braun off of 3B. I am sure we would be better defensivley with Crede at 3B.

[JohnBriggs12]

"Rolen has a career .879 OPS and .372 OBP"

 

There's no question Rolen has been a better hitter than Crede, but the key phrase is "has been". His OPS since his shoulder became an issue in 2005: .706, .887, .729. So 2 of his last 3 years, his OPS is under .730.

 

His OBP last year was .331.

 

As has been pointed out Crede's numbers improved year to year prior to his back issue. The really big issue is cost. Crede isn't a long term financial risk. Rolen is.

 

"Crede doesn't exactly fit the description of a "professional hitter" that Doug Melvin is looking for."

 

Frankly, I wouldn't go after any 3rd baseman. They need a lefthanded bat OF for the 2 spot in the order more than they need anther 5-6 hitter who bats righthanded. Rolen doesn't fit that profile either. To me Melvin is panicking looking for a big name after losing Cordero. He's going after damaged goods and not even following his criterea that he himself set right after the season.

[yoshii8]

I know that most at Brewerfan, including myself, have not been very excited about the possibility of Crede being our 3rd baseman next year but I have been reading some White Sox fan sites, and talking to a few friends that are huge Sox fans, and I hear a lot of really good things about him.

 

I even see a lot of people hoping that they keep him over Josh Fields at 3rd. Why do you think this is? Could it be mostly because of the 05' World Series run? Or could it be that he is a very good player when healthy?

 

I know his OBP is garbage, but his 06' was very nice, and I think that the improvement he showed since he's been in the league makes me kind of want to take a chance on him. Anybody else?

 

Seeing that we might be interested in Luis Gonzales might also have something to do with this.

[trwi7]

White Sox fans love him because he was "so clutch" during the 2005 World Series run. His career best OBP is .323 which is still below average. Yes, he plays great defense but from an offensive standpoint he's just not what we need. Morgan Ensberg on the other hand...

[yoshii8]

Morgan Ensberg seems like a perfect fit, but I'm not sure why nobody is giving him a chance. You'd think its because the GM's know something that we don't know. I'm not sure.

 

I don't think thats the only reason they love Crede, he had one hell of a season in 06', and looked like he was going to break out into something special before the season. I think that his defense, and power numbers make him an attractive enough option compared to most. Even w/ his OBP, I'd still take him over Lofton, Gonzo, Feliz, and probably Ensberg.

[TooLiveBrew]

I have to believe that the White Sox would take just about anything for Crede these days, as he's not good to begin with, is a free agent after next season and is represented by Scott Boras.

 

Also, Josh Fields. Probably shouldn't leave out the biggest reason to make a change. I'd bet if the Cards had a 3B ready like the Sox have Fields, Rolen'd be long gone by now.

[Gopher74]

White Sox fans love him because he was "so clutch" during the 2005 World Series run. His career best OBP is .323 which is still below average. Yes, he plays great defense but from an offensive standpoint he's just not what we need. Morgan Ensberg on the other hand...

Is a player that nobody wants, and has some huge question marks. I was on the Ensberg bandwagon as much as the next guy, but it's really a head scratcher to see no teams even interested in this guy at this point. That's not the type I want to pencil in for 145+ games and pin our hopes on.

 

I guess I look at Crede like this. What's going to improve our team more, a better OBP, or a possible GG at 3rd base? That's assuming we can't get both.

 

He's certainly not a perfect player, however, he's got his benfits over Rolen.

-He's a one year investment. You're not potentially locking 30+ million dollars into him like you are Rolen, and Rolen hasn't been "Scott Rolen" the last year and a half.

-Again, he's a great defensive 3rd basemen.

-He was a guy who was definitely coming into his own. 30 and 90 with a .283 BA and a .323 OBP would look like beautiful at 3rd when you factor in his glove right now. Put him in a position in which he doesn't have a lot of pressure like the 7th hole and the power is just a plus. The defensive upgrade is SOOO huge that I really would be willing to live with the poor OBP.

 

I think that that he probably produces more power than Rolen, which I understand isn't what we're looking for, but it also doesn't hurt, and he's a safer bet to stay healthy IMO. And even if both end up being busts, with Crede, we can wash our hands of him next year. With Rolen, we're handcuffed, and in trouble because at that point, nobody will take a fliar on a guy like him.

 

I guess I don't think that

Weeks

Hart

Braun

Prince

Hall(let's hope he bounces back in a big way)

Hardy

Crede

Kendall

.......is really that bad of a lineup. Not when you factor in just how much better our D will look.

 

Of course compensation is a big issue as I think the White Sox value him more than those of us on this board do, but if it were just Vargas, they'd almost be doing us a favor. And it's not like it'd preclude you from making another move it one came up, but I think I'd feel a lot better going into next season with that for a lineup, rather than signing a guy like Lofton, but neglecting our defense.

[trwi7]

I agree if worst comes to worst I'd take Crede I'd just rather explore Ensberg first or a trade for Chavez or Rolen again before I go back to him. The main things we should be looking for is moving Braun off 3rd and improving OBP. Ensberg, Rolen and Chavez provide both, Crede only provides one.

[logan82]

Gopher74 wrote:

-He's a one year investment.

Also a negative though if we have to trade a player to get him. Plus if we are going to move Braun off of 3B it would be better to get somebody who will be there for a while or we are looking at the same problem next year with Braun being off of 3B for a year and posibly worse than he was last year.

[Gopher74]

Gopher74 wrote:

-He's a one year investment.

Also a negative though if we have to trade a player to get him. Plus if we are going to move Braun off of 3B it would be better to get somebody who will be there for a while or we are looking at the sam problem next year with Braun being off of 3B for a year and posibly worse than he was last year.

Well that's true. I guess my thinking though with the big names out there is that it'd almost be better if it WAS just a year. I can't feel good about giving 30 million dollars to Chavez or Rolen right now given their injury history, and it wouldn't take a lot to get Crede would be my thought. Yea, if you're talking about having to give up Cappy, then I think it's a negative, but if you're talking about having to give up Vargas, and then a lower level prospect, then it's really not a big deal to me.

 

Plus, and this may be a faulty way of looking at it, but I think that next year we'd be in a more advantageous place in terms of leverage. I'm banking on Capuano having a comeback season, and if he does, then you've got a very tradable chip there, that people would feel confident about getting, not a guy you're taking and "hoping" he bounces back.

 

Or, as has been my stance all along, you make a move during the season. Crede's just a kinda "tide you over" type of guy. Melvin's said that pitching will get you more in return during the season, and position players in the off-season. Well, get Crede right now, then you can always look for that upgrade in June or July when people start going down.

 

Of course, the question then becomes, if Cappy's having a great year, let's say it's 2006 all over again, and he's 10-4 at the break with a 3.20 ERA do you trade him? To further that scenario, Parra's down in AAA, and blowing people away, say with about a 2.50 ERA, 10.5 K's per 9, and there's a player like a Beltre out there that's having a solid season. Do the Brewers trade Cappy knowing his history of pitching a little worse in the second half, and hope that Parra can step into that 5th spot without missing a beat, or do they try and ride Cappy out, only to be stuck in the same situation next year.

 

Anyway, I'm getting WAY off topic here. Just thinking out load.

[TooLiveBrew]

I think it'd be great to get a guy for just a one-year plan. The current crop isn't anything fantastic, so why lock yourself into money beyond 2008? If it's the right deal - like if Barry Bonds can miraculously handle 3B for 145 games - then you do it. Otherwise, roll the dice on Ensberg and/or Crede/Feliz/Rolen.

[logan82]

The current crop isn't anything fantastic, so why lock yourself into money beyond 2008?

That's true and a big reason I am not to big on getting Rolen. I would rather stand pat at this point.