Sheets? Latest: Dodgers, Mariners

[billyhallfan]

just because broxton is overweight, doesn't mean that he is lazy, I can't stand it when people say things like that.

 

it is something that is wrong with our society, and quite frankly, I am getting sick of hearing that Estrada is lazy, and so on and so forth.

[Chio151]

just because broxton is overweight, doesn't mean that he is lazy, I can't stand it when people say things like that.

 

it is something that is wrong with our society, and quite frankly, I am getting sick of hearing that Estrada is lazy, and so on and so forth.

 

Well, I think the Estrada stuff is more about his effort on the basepaths than anything...

[Patrick425]

I am getting sick of hearing that Estrada is lazy, and so on and so forth.

Yeah, it's probably unfair to say that about someone based solely on there physical appearance. However, did you see Estrada play last year?...he's not exactly "Charlie Hustle". Injury or no injury, the guy has been on 4 different teams in 4 years and I have heard that the Mets are not really interested in keeping him. To me, the evidence points in the direction that he has somewhat of an attitude issue.

 

Anyways. I know this is not an Estrada thread. Either? He doesn't thrill me at all, especially as a main piece in a trade involving Sheets. He's young and has a decent OB percentage, but has limited power and not a whole lot of speed. I'd much rather have Kemp.

[splitterpfj]

Still - Broxton was just about as good and is 23 years old. If I were a GM and had my choice it would be Broxton all day.

Me too, I'd much rather add Broxton, and if I were the Dodgers, I would be offering Saito. He's been awesome for them, but why hold onto the old guy, when both are so talented?

[fondybrewfan]

My perfect storm of awesomeness is:

 

Sheets to the Dodgers for Kemp and Broxton

 

Cappy, TGJ, and Mench to the Cards for Rolen & Franklin

 

Claudio Vargas & Derrick Turnbow, and a prospect to the Rockies for Brian Fuentes

 

and since we have an extra OF now and Doug isnt going to want to pay Bill Hall to be a 4th outfielder

 

Bill Hall to the Yankees for Kei Igawa and Kyle Farnsworth (Assuming the send Cabrera to the Twins in the Santana deal)

 

Weeks - 2b

Hardy - SS

Braun - LF

Fielder - 1B

Hart - CF

Rolen - 3B

Kemp - RF

Kendall - C

 

Gallardo

Villenueva

Suppan

Bush

Parra

 

Long Man - Igawa

Riske

Farnsworth

Ryan Franklin

Brian Fuentes

Jonathan Broxton

 

That might quite possibly be the greatest collection of young talent in the history of baseball. Obviously it will never happen but I can dream

[Patrick425]

Gallardo

Villenueva

Suppan

Bush

Parra

I know I'll have many disagree with me, but IMHO that's a scary rotation (I mean for the Brewers, not the opposition). However, I guess if the bullpen were to be dramatically improved, they would not have to put as much weight on the starters.

[Fear The Chorizo]

If the Brewers can trade Sheets for Broxton and Kemp, or Broxton and LaRoche, I'd hope Melvin makes either deal. It's probably wishful thinking to include Kershaw in the deal, unless the Brewers include another high-ceiling trading chip. Kemp put up very solid numbers for a rookie last year, and he played his home games in one of the toughest hitters parks in the majors. LaRoche would be solid enough defensively to supplant Braun at 3rd and has big upside offensively - acquiring either player would give the Brewers a ridiculously young and talented lineup.

 

Weeks

Hardy

Braun

Fielder

Hart

Hall

Kemp/LaRoche

Kendall

 

That's also very right hand hitter-heavy, but that collection of everyday players could absolutely mash - if I were an opposing manager, I'd leave any left-handed starters I had at the hotel any time I'd have to play those Brewers, because they would get shelled.

 

Injuries may lower Sheets' trade value, but the dearth of quality free agent starting pitchers probably brings it right back up. If the Twins decide to keep Santana, and the Orioles decide to keep Bedard, suddenly Sheets' trade value drastically increases, as he may start drawing legit interest by the Yankees and Red Sox along with the Dodgers.

 

I'd love to resign Sheets if I knew he'd be Mr. Reliable every 5th day for the next 5 years, but recent history strongly suggests otherwise - and there's definitely a scenario this offseason that would allow the Brewers to pull of a Sexson-esque trade (not as many players, but quality young players who improve their roster NOW and prospects) in dealing big Ben. If such a trade can be made, it makes the most sense for the long-term success of the Brewers.

[fondybrewfan]

The SP in my scenario would obviously be the weak link, but with the lineup I proposed on most nights it probably wouldnt even matter. I would have confidence in that rotation but by no means are they world beaters. If Gallardo develops into a Sheets like talent this year that rotation does look a whole lot better

[twobrewers]

just because broxton is overweight, doesn't mean that he is lazy

In general society, I agree with you.

 

However, when your job requires you to be at peak physical performance to full utilize your tools - it certainly raises a red flag. I don't care if my teacher is overweight. He doesn't need to be at a set weight. But I do care about my ball players. Plenty of players have eaten themselves out of the league.

 

And I personally think an overweight athlete is often an indication of poor work ethic. (If I was going to pay you a couple million dollars to play baseball - wouldnt' you make it your goal to be in the best possible shape?)

[aracko]

Its possible that being overweight is a contributing factor to his amazing stuff, isnt it?

[Patrick425]

Would guys like Weathers, D. Wells, and R. King be better if they were lighter?

[Dogger192003]

(Gallardo, Suppan, Bush, Villanueva, Parra ) I've seen many people propose this rotation on this site. I obviously love all the youth and upside, but there is no way all three young guys can be part of the rotation all year. Villanueva only threw 120+ innings last year and asking every fifth day out of him is unrealistic. I'd hope they limit hime to around 180 innings for the year. Gallardo will be pitching his first complete year in the bigs and hopefully will be limited to under 200 innings. Manny Parra certainly needs to be babied along given his injury history and youth as well. I would love to see all three of these guys be a part of the rotation in some capacity but on a limited basis. There are other solutions such as piggy-backing the young guys with the long men in the bullpen that may work.

[Oldcity]

If they trade Sheets, they really can't be sending off Capuano or Bush. Depth becomes even more important when your best one is gone (i.e. the bullpen with Cordero).

[brewswinga2]

If they trade Sheets, they really can't be sending off Capuano or Bush. Depth becomes even more important when your best one is gone (i.e. the bullpen with Cordero).

I agree, and if they were to get Kemp from LA then there would be no need to trade for Rolen. If Sheets is traded I say keep the 7 remaining starters and let the best 5 emerge.

[Fatter than Joey]

just because broxton is overweight, doesn't mean that he is lazy, I can't stand it when people say things like that.

it is something that is wrong with our society, and quite frankly, I am getting sick of hearing that Estrada is lazy, and so on and so forth.

 

No one says Prince is lazy and he is huge. I think the Estrada/lazy talk came primarily from scouts who used "lazy" to describe Estrada's effort behind the plate. I don't think it was meant as a slam - rather an evaluation.

[gregmag]

I think Dogger makes a really good point, and I'll add that -- in that scenario -- we would be betting a lot on the health of the three young guys, even if Ned did take good care of them. We talk a lot about the unreliability of Sheets' health, but young pitchers are NEVER good health risks. Parra, Gallardo, and Villy scare me a lot more as health risks than Sheets does. Don't get me wrong -- I love all three, and I think they're good enough to lead a rotation. I just hate betting a lot on young pitchers' shoulders and elbows.

 

If we trade Capuano, I don't think we can trade Sheets unless we get an immediate rotation piece back. Capuano may have sucked last year, but he isn't Vargas -- if he's on the team, he's going to be counted on to give serious innings.

 

Greg.

[wiscsportnut]

Interesting tidbit from rotoworld about Marniers interest in Sheets.

 

"According to the Seattle Times, the Mariners talked to the Brewers about Ben Sheets.

Seattle is clearly looking for rotation help and have been linked to Sheets, Erik Bedard, and Johan Santana, along with lesser starters like Cliff Lee, Edwin Jackson and Mark Prior. The newspaper speculates that the Brewers could be interested in the Mariners' "young catching and relief pitching," which likely means Jeff Clement.According to the Seattle Times, the Mariners talked to the Brewers about Ben Sheets.

Seattle is clearly looking for rotation help and have been linked to Sheets, Erik Bedard, and Johan Santana, along with lesser starters like Cliff Lee, Edwin Jackson and Mark Prior. The newspaper speculates that the Brewers could be interested in the Mariners' "young catching and relief pitching," which likely means Jeff Clement."

 

Gotta love Clement as part of any trade with Seattle.

[aracko]

Jeff Clement and Brandon Morrow? Id take it. Morrow how is currently beign raised as a starter would be the Closer of the future. He would be simply lights out with his hard stuff and semi - willdness.

[fondybrewfan]

Since it appears the Yanks will not be getting Santana what would they offer for Sheets. Would they offer Hughes?

[Invader3K]

just because broxton is overweight, doesn't mean that he is lazy, I can't stand it when people say things like that.

it is something that is wrong with our society, and quite frankly, I am getting sick of hearing that Estrada is lazy, and so on and so forth.

 

No one says Prince is lazy and he is huge. I think the Estrada/lazy talk came primarily from scouts who used "lazy" to describe Estrada's effort behind the plate. I don't think it was meant as a slam - rather an evaluation.

Is it just me, or has at least half the talent the Brewers have been rumored to be interested in acquiring been derided as being "lazy" or having "a bad attitude" on this site?

[tigerbrew]

Gotta love Clement as part of any trade with Seattle.

As I had mentioned yesterday in this thread...

If Seattle is the club asking about Sheets, I would probably ask for catcher Jeff Clement and Aussie lefty Ryan Rowland-Smith in return. I wouldn't mind giving them Mench too if they want.

I still want both these young players for Sheets please.

[tigerbrew]

Since it appears the Yanks will not be getting Santana what would they offer for Sheets. Would they offer Hughes?

I really hope so. If by any chance the Yankees do ask for Sheets, I would like to get Philip Hughes and Ross Ohlendorf from them.

[Robideaux]

If the 2007 season taught me anything it's that when Sheets was not in the rotation, the Brewers did not have enough pitching to win consistently. Trading Sheets doesn't shore up what I consider that glaring weakness.

 

To me, Sheets is like the original nintendo after a few years. It only half-worked and you had to blow in it every so often in just the right way to make it work, but when it did, it was awesome. Trading Sheets is like throwing that NES against the wall in frustration. Sure, you don't have to deal with those frustrating moments when the video game system malfunctions and all you get is a blue screen, but now all you have left to play with is tidily-winks.

 

I don't want tidily-winks. I want Sheets in a Brewers uniform in 2008.

[Brian the Automator]

I actually think Hughes would out-perform Sheets in '08. So, if it was Hughes for Sheets straight-up, I'd be stoked.

[TooLiveBrew]

To me, Sheets is like the original nintendo after a few years. It only half-worked and you had to blow in it every so often in just the right way to make it work, but when it did, it was awesome.

Classic!