Rolen Trade, Latest: Glaus/Rolen swap (reply #795)

[LUKE232323]

Who is more likely for us to obtain with Rolen if we land him, Franklin or Flores? Franklin did have a great year last year, but he will be 35 at the start of next season.

If we can get Rolen and a solid BP arm and not give up any of our big time prospects or current position players, IMO DM has to pull the trigger on that.

Obviously how much of Rolen's contract St. Louis is willing to pay is a big issue here.

[trwi7]

Would anybody be willing to take on Rolen's entire contract if we could get him for less? Say Vargas and a decent prospect?

[brewers255]

Melvin confuses me. NDOG you are 100% correct, if nothing's imminent than he has spoken with him. Expect a deal done by the end of the meetings.

 

Also here is my winter meetings plan

 

Sign David Riske 3/12

Trade Capuano, TGJ, Mench for Franklin and Rolen, Cards take on 1/3 of Rolen's contract.

Trade Hall, Bush, and Zach Jackson for Joe Nathan.

Trade Vargas for Luke Scott.

 

C: Kendall, Rivera

1B: Fielder, Dillion

2B: Weeks, Counsell

3B: Rolen, Dillon

SS: Hardy, Counsell

LF: Braun, Gross

CF: Hart, Nix

RF: Scott, Gross

 

Lineup

 

1. Weeks 2B

2. Rolen 3B

3. Braun LF

4. Fielder 1B

5. Hart CF

6. Scott RF

7. Hardy SS

8. Kendall C

 

Rotation

 

1. Sheets, 2. Gallarado, 3.Villy, 4. Suppan, 5. Parra

 

Bullpen

 

CL: Nathan, SU: Riske, Turnbow, Mota, Shouse, Chote.

[RockCoCougars]

Except Counsell is a very good reserve IF, and the only backup SS the Crew has.

I wouldn't go that far. He's decent with the glove, but is basically an automatic out at the plate. Not worth 3 million for sure. If Rolen is acquired, the infield defense should be shored up big time. Hardy is solid defensively as well. I just don't see the need for Counsell. If they want an old good glove no hit shortstop, Rey Ordonez is trying to make a comeback and would probably play for the league minimum. If they want a backup IF who can actually hit a little, Mark Loretta is still out there and probably could be had for what Counsell will get next year.

[brewers255]

Also if Rolen were to get hurt, Dillion could fill in at 3B and would do a pretty good job in my opinion. This is worth the risk.

[dpapo]

Let's not start getting too ahead of ourselves with the Rolen rumors. I still haven't seen anything written by ken Rosenthal on it which would seem odd if he mentioned it on the radio. And it seems like the trades that tend to get made are the ones we don't hear much about. With all that said, if there is something to these rumors, I think Rolen and Capuano will be the main pieces, but who knows what the rest of it will look like. When I read the St. Louis Cardinals Web site, they had the following,

 

"Dealing strengths: The Cards have a slew of outfielders, and their most appealing chip is likely either Chris Duncan or Rick Ankiel. With top prospect Colby Rasmus on the way, and Skip Schumaker already squeezed for playing time, St. Louis can definitely part with a flycatcher in the right deal. Bullpen depth is also a strength."

 

So, I don't know if Mench and Gwynn Jr. would make sense. For all we know maybe there ends up being some sort of trade involving Cappy for Duncan.

 

[brewers255]

I can guarantee that the Cards will not trade Duncan. His father is the Cards Pitching Coach and they wont take the risk.

[JohnBriggs12]

"Counsell is a very good reserve IF and the only backup SS the Brewers have"

 

Al, he put up a .631 OPS last year. Only 2 players, Adam Kennedy and one other who's name escapes me had worse OPS with at least 250 ABs.

 

They could go out and sign Alex Cintron (recently released by White Sox) or do any number of minor deals to get a backup SS that can handle the glove and give similar offensive production for a lot less.

[whizkid]

The Brewers can't trade all their SP depth 255. At most 2 of Cappy, Bush and Vargas and preferably not Cappy and Bush. With Ben's history and Manny being a rookie that depth is important. Any one or more of the top 5 can get hurt for that matter.

[gregmag]

Yeah, just because a guy brings defense doesn't mean his offense stops counting. A tradeoff is one thing; a black hole is quite another. It's all one game -- you stop the other team from scoring, you score -- and every player has to contribute to (and/or hurt) both sides of the equation. Plus, Counsell is enormously expensive for what he brings. Al, I'm surprised you like him that much; you're usually the first guy to point out -- quite correctly, IMHO -- how many role-players could easily be replaced by dozens of cheaper guys who are kicking around AAA waiting for a shot. Counsell, to me, is exhibit A for that argument, and it isn't like reserve IF is a high-risk place to take a minor gamble.

 

Greg.

[DuWayne Steurer]

Trade Hall, Bush, and Zach Jackson for Joe Nathan.

 

Not to go off on a tangent here.......I can't believe Melvin would trade that package for a guy he'll control for only one year. After this season, Nathan is going to cost as much, if not more than Cordero. Hall is Brewers property for 3 more years, and Bush at least 4. They might not be the caliber of players that Nathan is, but their cost and length of control makes that far too much to give up.

 

As far as the Rolen thing goes, I'm more on board with this move the more I think about it. The 3 years/38 million is a problem, but I hope it doesn't end up being the deal breaker. If Rolen manages to play 130 games and put up an .830 OPS, he's worth that much for 3 years.

[brettac1]

I like Luke Scott and all, but I'd rather have Bill Hall. I don't see that Nathan trade happening, anyhow, since I don't think those are the kind of players the Twins are looking for in exchance.

[Paulus88]

As far as the StL outfield depth I can imagine an effective platoon of Mench and Duncan or they may use it to get someone else, maybe like Tejada or more pitching

 

But a Duncan/Mench, Rasmus, Ankiel outfield post Edmonds may not be too bad for them

[Ennder]

"Counsell is a very good reserve IF and the only backup SS the Brewers have"

 

Al, he put up a .631 OPS last year. Only 2 players, Adam Kennedy and one other who's name escapes me had worse OPS with at least 250 ABs.

 

They could go out and sign Alex Cintron (recently released by White Sox) or do any number of minor deals to get a backup SS that can handle the glove and give similar offensive production for a lot less.

Counsell had an EQA of .227 last year. That is just slightly lower than Ryan Theriot, Felipe Lopez, Stephen Drew,

 

It was better than Julio Lugo, Royce Clayton, Tony Pena, John McDonald, Cesar Izturis, Adam Everett, Bobby Crosby, Omar Vizquel, Juan Uribe.

 

He also came out +12 runs in fielding between the 3 positions he played (though I don't have as much confidence in defensive stats, he was certainly above average though) which is very strong for a partial season. I don't know of a good stat to combine fielding and hitting (and no WARP is not a good one) but he was probably better than 1/3 of the starting SS's in baseball last year. He makes a fine backup SS.

[Klements Bratwurst]

To add a little information to the discussion on Scott Rolen's injuries here are some links from the Cardinals MLB page and the Wikipedia page.

 

The main information that comes out of this is that Scott should be completely healthy for the start of spring training, with a lot to prove I am sure, especially to Tony LaRussa.

 

Go get him Dougie!!!

[brewcrewkid14]

The Brewers can't trade all their SP depth 255. At most 2 of Cappy, Bush and Vargas and preferably not Cappy and Bush. With Ben's history and Manny being a rookie that depth is important. Any one or more of the top 5 can get hurt for that matter.

 

I agree with you there. They are definitely going to keep one of those three if not two, and I expect it to be Bush. SP depth is never bad. I also think Parra will be this year's Villanueva, and he might become a part of the rotation at the end of the year if need be. That'd be just fine with me too. This is exciting stuff though about Rolen. The more I hear about it the more excited I get.

[BREWCREW5]

I need some help here guys...as I am arguing with one of my best friends, who is a BIG cubs fan.

 

He is saying that Rolen is always injured and that he basically sucks now. His shoulder is junk and he is terrible now. How can I argue against that?

 

The guy has had 3 shoulder surgeries in the last 2 years. Is his shoulder ruined?

[Klements Bratwurst]

Check out my post from a few posts higher on this page. The official press release says he will be ready in Spring Training. His 2006 stats were good enough for consideration for comeback player of the year.

[jjfanec]

I mean he is a year removed from batting .296 with an OBP of .369 and 22 HR's all while winning the gold glove at 3B.

[Roscoe Chill]

For all we know maybe there ends up being some sort of trade involving Cappy for Duncan.

 

Even better.

 

EDIT: But that's not happening.

[clancyphile]

I really am not happy about the thought of moving Capuano. I'd rather just deal Vargas and Mench for Rolen even up. Let Cappy be the 5th starter, and move Bush to the bullpen.

[And That]

Would the Cards have any interest in Joe Dillon? He's not really a SS, but he plays the other IF positions decently. Could also be they want them some Mike Rivera... who knows? Capuano, Mench, Dillon and mid-level pitching prospect like Dave Welch could make some sense for Rolen and Franklin.

[And That]

Any chance someone could photoshop a Brewers hat on Rolen's head shot for an avatar for me?

I'm going to second this request. I get all wiggly thinking about Scott Rolen in a Brewer uniform.

 

[clancyphile]

Any chance someone could photoshop a Brewers hat on Rolen's head shot for an avatar for me?

I'm going to second this request. I get all wiggly thinking about Scott Rolen in a Brewer uniform.

 

15 NL pitching staffs that might as well be baby seals? I like that thought... but I still cringe at the thought of losing Capuano.

 

[twobrewers]

Would the Cards have any interest in Joe Dillon? He's not really a SS, but he plays the other IF positions decently.

Gasp. Blasphemy!

 

Even with Rolen, Dillon would likely be the top back-up (not for late-inning defensive purposes) at 3B, 2B and 1B. He also has a chance to put up an OPS of .800 if he hits anywhere near last year.

 

Not to mention he is still cheap. I think Dillon is going to play a big role this year for the Brewers. I would hate to lose him.