Rolen Trade, Latest: Glaus/Rolen swap (reply #795)

[brains and braun]

No thanks on Blaylock. I'd rather keep Cappy than have his offensive boost over Counsell

[splitterpfj]

I wouldn't be surprised if it's Gwynn and Cappy for Rolen, which I would do. It sounds as though the Cards are prepared to pay a decent chunk of the money, too.

 

I don't believe this is dead, but I also never believed St Louis felt rushed to do this at the meetings. I'm sure they'd like to see what happens with Cabrera, just in case it lifts Rolen's value.

 

The no-trade is a great thing for those who want to see Rolen in Milwaukee. How many teams have a starting pitcher to trade, and are already cleared by Rolen?

 

I believe the answer is one.

 

I guess we'll find out.

[TheCouga23]

I wouldn't be surprised if it's Gwynn and Cappy for Rolen, which I would do. It sounds as though the Cards are prepared to pay a decent chunk of the money, too.

I'd be surprised if it was Gwynn. I don't think anyone considers him a top prospect, and I think he projects as a career backup right now. I don't think the Cardinals would bite on that. I'm guessing the prospect might be Escobar.

 

[patrickgpe]

looks like talks have cooled off, due to there desire to keep rolen out of the central.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3141330

[I Heart Brewers]

Any thoughts that Rolen may waive the no trade clause (to teams outside the midwest) because he hates playing for Tony that much?

[dpapo]

Since St. Louis has a new GM, it's hard to know what to think of him. With this being his first big deal, maybe he got cold feet at the thought of Rolen coming back and hurting St. Louis. We'll probably find out by tonight it there is any truth to the story.

[Invader3K]

I think there has to be more to this than "The Cards don't want Rolen in the Central Division." He'd be an upgrade for the Brewers, but it's not like he'd guarantee them a division title or anything.

[patrickgpe]

well its not like we are getting him for nothing, and if they want a sp, they are getting an all star one back in return.

[dpapo]

I'm starting to feel like Tom Haudricourt's agent or something, but I guess we'll find out in a couple hours whether the story is true or not.

 

Have Rolen talks cooled?

By Tom Haudricourt

Tuesday, Dec 4 2007, 04:06 PM

Nashville - We don't get our daily briefing wth general manager Doug Melvin for another couple of hours but ESPN is reporting that talks between the Brewers and Cardinals regarding veteran third baseman Scott Rolen have cooled.

Supposedly, the Cardinals have decided they don't want to trade Rolen within their division. I listed that among the obstacles to a possible trade in my story in the JS this morning so it's not a surprising development, if true.

A member of the Brewers' delegation here told me they were worried that Cardinals ownership would back off for fears that Rolen would come back and haunt them over the remaining three years of the contract.

ESPN said the Cards now will turn to San Francisco and the Los Angeles Dodgers in talks for Rolen. He has a no-trade clause and would have to agree to go to one of those teams. He supposedly was receptive to a trade to Milwaukee.

The Cardinals had shown interest in Brewers left Chris Capuano. The Giants supposedly have some pitching to trade and the Dodgers probably do, too.

Of course, things like this change from day to day. If the Cardinals can't strike a deal for Rolen elsewhere, they could get over the within-the-division concerns and come back to the Brewers.

That's assuming the ESPN report is true to begin with, of course.

http://blogs.jsonline.com/brewers/archive/2007/12/04/have-rolen-talks-cooled.aspx

[colbyjack]

I don't believe this is dead, but I also never believed St Louis felt rushed to do this at the meetings. I'm sure they'd like to see what happens with Cabrera, just in case it lifts Rolen's value.

 

This is a good point, as there are a lot of big deals being rumored out there and the Cardinals may start to generate more interest in Rolen once guys like Cabrera and possibly even Tejada are off the market. The good thing for the Brewers is that Rolen already knows about their interest, and may have more of a say in this situation than most players would. That no-trade clause could work to the Brewers advantage.

 

I'm sure Rolen may waive his no-trade clause for other teams out there, but we can only hope (if you're in the pro-Rolen camp that is) that he may use it as a negotiating ploy to be traded to where he wants to go. The Cardinals can only call his bluff so much, as they're stuck with an unhappy player with a big contract if they choose not to trade him to the Brewers because they play in the same division (assuming that is the best deal they can strike while also receiving Rolen's blessing).

 

Fortunately one team that is reportedly interested in upgrading their third base situation, the Phillies, will have nothing to do with Rolen.

[CportBadger]

MLBTR is saying the Indians are discussing sending Cliff Lee to the Cards for Reyes and C Brian Anderson. Not sure if this has any effect, but wouldn't that probably decrease their interest in Cappy if they got Lee?

[brewers19]

The latest from JSOnline:

 

Nashville - I just talked with Brewers general manager Doug Melvin and he told me talks with St. Louis regarding third baseman Scott Rolen broke off with little chance of being resumed, but not for the reason reported by ESPN earlier.

 

ESPN reported the talks "cooled" because the Cardinals decided not to trade Rolen within their division.

 

"They never told me that," said Melvin. "That (report) didn't come from us."

 

Melvin said the talks broke off because of other undisclosed issues, probably the money remaining on Rolen's contract -- $36 million over three years and $14 million in deferred payments -- or what the Cardinals were asking in return. St. Louis reportedly had interest in lefty Chris Capuano but also might have asked for one of the Brewers' top young players.

 

"It just seemed like we were getting farther apart," said Melvin. "We disagreed on some issues. We didn't completely close the door but I don't anticipate (further negotiations).

 

"We're going to look at other things. Right now, we don't have anything serious going but we'll continue to look around.'

 

Melvin indicated he had little interest in free agent third baseman Pedro Feliz.

 

I'll get to talk to Melvin at length in a couple of hours and will report further details but it looks like Rolen will not be coming to Milwaukee. Supposedly, the Dodgers and Giants might jump in on him.

 

Poop.

[chinabob99]

Supposedly, the Dodgers and Giants might jump in on him.

They might try, but if Rolen doesn't want to go to LA or San Francisco, it doesn't matter. If the Cards were bluffing, it certainly looks like Melvin is calling it. Good for him.

[TooLiveBrew]

Melvin indicated he had little interest in free agent third baseman Pedro Feliz.

Phew!

 

I wonder if the Birds asked for Gamel. That'd bring discussions to a skidding halt (at least temporarily) pretty quickly. It'd be plausible that they may have asked - plays the same position, looks to be blocked in our organization, etc.

[brettac1]

They might try, but if Rolen doesn't want to go to LA or San Francisco, it doesn't matter. If the Cards were bluffing, it certainly looks like Melvin is calling it. Good for him.

 

Rolen's going to waive the no-trade no matter what, he just wants to get the hell away from LaRussa.

[aracko]

Blalock had a .358 OBP Last season. Last year he hit Lefties at a .298 clip with a .370 OBP. I wouldnt platoon him. .309 hitter with RISP. .371 OBP with 2 outs.

 

I agree he was injured but he is about to hit magic # 27.

And in 2005 he had a .318 OBP and in 2006 he had a .325 OBP. His 3 year splits vs LHP are platoon worthy. .216/.267/.347/.614 that's Counsell'esque.

 

But if Weeks made those same improvements its because he is playing up to his potential. Maybe he found something - maybe he worked hard, maybe he made a change in his approach, maybe he matured. But no - these things only happen with Brewers players. (please note I am not pointing at any one person)

[TerraceReserved]

. I like guys like Rolen and Andrew Jones not because of their stats, but because they were the centerpiece of winning organizations. I would like Chipper Jones, Jeter and Bernie Williams for the same reason. I think the real reason for the Yankees' success was Bernie Williams. I like players who have tasted victory / success. That's why I'm high on White Sox, marlins, Red Sox, and yankees players. They know how to win.

 

That's why I want Rolen. Forget his stats. forget his injuries. Forget his fielding ability. forget his age. forget his salary. i like him because he knows how to win.

 

I apologize for getting this thread a bit off topic, but this really irks me. Saying you like players from winning teams becuase they "know how to win" is completely ridiculous. Fact is, they don't know how to win, they're team does. What about the players who are significantly better that are on bad teams? Do they not know how to win? No, of course not, they know how to play very well but simply are not on a good team. And you say that you like Rolen becuase he "knows how to win" If he was on a bad team would you not like him becuase he doesn't know how to win? The whole concept of knowing how to win is entirely dependent on the successes of your team, which means it is entirely useless in evaluating players.

[PlayerHader]

I think to totally disregard the idea that some guys are just winners while others aren't is wrong.

 

That said, no player in baseball is going to lead a team of scrubs to the playoffs. That isn't the claim being made, though.

[brettac1]

Alright, 20fry, I'm going to need an Andruw Jones photoshopped headshot, now.

[trwi7]

But if Weeks made those same improvements its because he is playing up to his potential. Maybe he found something - maybe he worked hard, maybe he made a change in his approach, maybe he matured. But no - these things only happen with Brewers players. (please note I am not pointing at any one person)

 

What improvements? He was good in 2004 then sucked in 2005 and 2006 and was doing fine in 2007 until he got hurt he's just really on and off and the risk of him posting a .318 OBP again is not something I want.

[twobrewers]

"It just seemed like we were getting farther apart," said Melvin. "We disagreed on some issues. We didn't completely close the door but I don't anticipate (further negotiations).

Good for Melvin to back off. The fan base was pretty excited about this potential trade - but if the value isn't there, you have to draw the line.

 

I was willing to part with Chris Capuano and pay Rolen's next three years salary. (none of his deferred money) If St. Louis isn't happy with that offer, we can look elsewhere.

 

Seems like the general agreement might have been in place - We wanted Rolen/They wanted Capuano. But St. Louis kept pushing for more and more. At some point, this trade stops making any sense.

[bjkrautk]

Just to be the one to point it out, on the ESPN (Insider) Winter Meetings blog, there's a note from Jerry Crasnik (7:12 pm yesterday) indicating that the Brewers were wary to make the deal based on Rolen's medical reports (and the money they would have to take on in the deal).

 

"Trading within the division" is probably a factor, but it wasn't the first reason listed for why the deal is stalling.

[TwinsBrewersWorldSeries]

This day has gone from very promising to a disaster

[CportBadger]

I'm guessing Melvin was fine with giving up Cappy as long as he got a little salary relief. The Cards didn't want to give any $$ and felt they needed a prospect in the deal as well. There was just too much middle ground to come to a solid compromise.

[Team Canada]

I would love to get Rolen and Wayne Franklin or Reyes...I think both really could help our BP out alot

Pretty sure you mean Ryan Franklin. Wayne Franklin helps no bullpen.

 

Wayne Franklin just wins, baby. Don't you know the Brewers are over .500 in his games??