Wisconsin Badgers Basketball

[pitchleague]

Then UCLA's game-winning shot was illegal because the ball cannot be shot over the back of the backboard.

since when is this illegal? Was this rule changed? I don't seem to recall this from my basketball coaching days.

[homer]

I'd love to see Wisconsin play Memphis. I'd love to see them play Tennessee. Any team that doesn't know what defense is and then...BAM...frustration that a team would actually have the gall to actually defend. Watching the Memphis-Tennessee game was like watching a McDonalds All American game at times. I'm with homer, a team that is similar would be a tougher game for this team.

Memphis actually has a good defense according to Ken Pomeroy. He has them ranked as the 2nd most efficient D in the nation (UW is 3rd) meaning they give up relatively few points per opponent possession. Their offense is surprisingly about the same level of adjusted efficiency as UW's - only Memphis plays at a break neck pace so they get more possessions per game (and hence, more total points).

 

http://kenpom.com/stats.php

[trwi7]

since when is this illegal? Was this rule changed? I don't seem to recall this from my basketball coaching days.

It's in the NCAA rule book. They were showing the rule on ESPNEWS a couple nights ago and said the basket shouldn't have counted due to that rule.

[LouisEly]

Personally, I would be OK with a 3 as long as they don't get hosed by having a ridiculously tough second round match becuase they gave some other team a bad seed.

 

Yep, and I have a sick feeling in my stomach that their 2nd round opponent will be Kentucky, and that Marquette will be in the same region. Anyone want to give me odds on that?

[pitchleague]

trwi7, thanks. Was unaware that was a rule change. I don't remember that one from my rulebook tests back in the day.

[Oldcity]

If Wisconsin lined up with Kentucky, EVERYONE would be picking Kentucky.

[Glennron]

Is Kentucky going to get a 6 or 7 seed anyway? Obviously 12 SEC wins is impressive, but the teams they beat OOC are : Central Arkansas, Liberty, Texas Southern, Stony Brook, Tennessee Tech, and Florida International. I wouldn't be surprised I guess but still.

Even if Wisconsin would be lined up with them, I'd prefer them over other potential 6-7 seeds, especially without Patrick Patterson. It won't matter if Marquette's in the same region anyway, if they win their first game they'll lose to a 1 or 2 seed in the next.

[Fatter than Joey]

I would bet internal organs that WSU will be our 2nd rd foe.

[Dmiles23]

trwi7, thanks. Was unaware that was a rule change. I don't remember that one from my rulebook tests back in the day.

I'm pretty sure that has been a rule for a long time. I think it started when they began putting the shot clock above the basket. The rule in the NBA is the ball has to be shot directly over the board for it to be whipped out. But the college rule is more broad that it can't be shot from the vicinity behind the basket and can not go over any part of the backboard at all.

So I don't know what the refs were watching in the UCLA game, but Shipp clearly shot the ball from the vicinity behind the basket, and the ball clearly went over the corner of the board. All I can say is UCLA home cooking 2 games in a row handed them the Pac-10 title, and a number 1 seed.

 

[Glennron]

I would bet internal organs that WSU will be our 2nd rd foe.

I'll take that bet.

[Fatter than Joey]

Which one do you want -- I'd advise against the liver or kidneys. Lungs are probably in good enough shape.

 

(and I mean that WSU will be our 2nd rd foe in the bracket, they of course may lose their 1st rd game...)

[TooLiveBrew]

So I don't know what the refs were watching in the UCLA game, but Shipp clearly shot the ball from the vicinity behind the basket, and the ball clearly went over the corner of the board. All I can say is UCLA home cooking 2 games in a row handed them the Pac-10 title, and a number 1 seed.

Given that UCLA got completely barnyard-screwed in their "loss" at Stanford (one of the worst calls I've seen all year), I'd say things have evened out. Their performance in this season's Pac-10 is nothing short of staggeringly impressive. They were handed nothing.

[Glennron]

Which one do you want -- I'd advise against the liver or kidneys. Lungs are probably in good enough shape.

 

(and I mean that WSU will be our 2nd rd foe in the bracket, they of course may lose their 1st rd game...)

I thought you said organS, as in plural? I'm pretty healthy, so I was just planning on putting them on ice in case I needed something, or sell them on the black market.

 

Given that UCLA got completely barnyard-screwed in their "loss" at Stanford (one of the worst calls I've seen all year), I'd say things have evened out. Their performance in this season's Pac-10 is nothing short of staggeringly impressive. They were handed nothing.

 

Didn't UCLA win pretty easily at Stanford? I think they won by like 10, but I didn't see the game so I don't know what call you're talking about. I would disagree they were handed nothing. They were handed a win against Cal, I don't care what anyone says. The no call on Ryan Anderson was an absolute joke. On top of that it looked like the ball went off the UCLA player anyway. Sure they had the Pac 10 wrapped up beforehand, but it now might protect a 1 seed for them even if they slip up early in the Pac 10 tournament.

[Fatter than Joey]

I thought you said organS, as in plural?

 

Your organ + my organ = multiple organs

[fondybrewfan]

There have been a number of questionable late game calls this year in basketball. Obviously the 2 recent UCLA games and the other one that immediately comes to mind was the Big East game where the guy was supposedly fouled about 90 feet away from the basket with .1 seconds left. There was also a simlar womens game with Rutgers I believe where they got completely hosed.

[bjkrautk]

Which one do you want -- I'd advise against the liver or kidneys. Lungs are probably in good enough shape.

 

(and I mean that WSU will be our 2nd rd foe in the bracket, they of course may lose their 1st rd game...)

Not ready to commit to the bet just yet, but I am in the market for a spare epiglottis...

[brwrsfan]

There have been a number of questionable late game calls this year in basketball. Obviously the 2 recent UCLA games and the other one that immediately comes to mind was the Big East game where the guy was supposedly fouled about 90 feet away from the basket with .1 seconds left. There was also a simlar womens game with Rutgers I believe where they got completely hosed.

It was the Tenn/Rutgers women's game about a month ago. And amazingly, I actually saw it. I could care less about women's basketball, but I literally flipped the TV on, saw that it was a 1 point game with like 15 seconds left with 2 top 5 teams at the time, and decided to watch the end. The game was at Tennessee, not to imply anything, but it was on their home floor. There was an apparent clock "malfunction" during the last few second of the game, where essentially the clock was intermittently stopped for very short periods of time. Tennessee scored with less than a second left to win the game....that should have ended a couple of seconds before that. I can't recall if they reviewed it or not, or if they didn't realize it until after the game, but either way Tennessee got the win.

 

Anyone know how many games these officials are working during the course of a year? Are they wearing down? Are there just so many games now that the quality of officials has dropped that significantly. Sure, it's only human to make mistakes, but there have been some just terrible, terrible calls in the last couple months (both Georgetown and UCLA have benefitted multiple times) that quite frankly, shouldn't have been missed.

[fondybrewfan]

Rivals is projecting the Badgers as the 2nd 3rd seed along with Louisville, Stanford, and Xavier. They have the 14th seeds (1st round opponent) as Siena, UC - Santa Barbara, Cornell, and New Mexico State. The 2nd round game (6th or 11th seed) would be the 6 (Clemson, Marquette, Butler, Pitt) or the 11 (Illinois State, Texas A & M, Oregon, South Alabama)

 

Ill be honest I wouldn't really like to play any of those #6 seeds. But I would put them in this order in terms of odds of UW winning

 

1. Clemson (Like all ACC teams, all O no D, except there O isnt that goodm they aint Duke thats for sure)

2. Marquette (Think UW has gotten better while Marquette has kinda stagnated

3. Butler (dangerous team IMO)

4. Pitt (Wouldnt not want to play this team at all costs)

[TooLiveBrew]

Didn't UCLA win pretty easily at Stanford? I think they won by like 10, but I didn't see the game so I don't know what call you're talking about.

 

Whoops - you're totally correct... I wonder what game I was remembering/what the hell I was thinking? Sorry about that one. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/embarassed.gif

 

EDIT: I think I was thinking of the Arizona @ Stan. game from 1/17/08, fwiw. Sorry.

 

I would disagree they were handed nothing.

I'll just disagree with you, then. Calls go both ways all year long, so I'm sure UCLA fans could find some to complain that went against them, too. Getting to 16-2 in this year's Pac-10 is phenomenal... heck, 14-4 is damn impressive. UCLA is a legit #1 seed, and arguably as deep in terms of talent as any of the power/#1 teams.

[brwrsfan]

Didn't UCLA win pretty easily at Stanford? I think they won by like 10, but I didn't see the game so I don't know what call you're talking about.

 

Whoops - you're totally correct... I wonder what game I was remembering/what the hell I was thinking? Sorry about that one. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/embarassed.gif

 

EDIT: I think I was thinking of the Arizona @ Stan. game from 1/17/08, fwiw. Sorry.

 

I would disagree they were handed nothing.

I'll just disagree with you, then. Calls go both ways all year long, so I'm sure UCLA fans could find some to complain that went against them, too. Getting to 16-2 in this year's Pac-10 is phenomenal... heck, 14-4 is damn impressive. UCLA is a legit #1 seed, and arguably as deep in terms of talent as any of the power/#1 teams.

Certainly there are calls that are missed or were tremendously bad all year, but when it occurs in the last 5 seconds of a game, it tends to get magnified a great deal, especially in the last 1-2 weeks of a season. Another reason that it's been such a huge deal this year is the fact that it's been UCLA and Georgetown involved, while on national television for all to see...not Iona and Belmont...had these happened in a smaller league, it probably wouldn't even have made the sports news at all (one that comes to mind is the end of the Akron game last year in the tournament final where the clock was messed up and the officials botched it so badly that they somehow added .02 seconds back onto the clock, when the issue was the fact that the clock didn't START on time and a shot went in at the buzzer).

[Glennron]

I'll just disagree with you, then. Calls go both ways all year long, so I'm sure UCLA fans could find some to complain that went against them, too. Getting to 16-2 in this year's Pac-10 is phenomenal... heck, 14-4 is damn impressive. UCLA is a legit #1 seed, and arguably as deep in terms of talent as any of the power/#1 teams.

I agree UCLA is a legit #1 seed, and they more than likely deserve it unless they lose right away and other teams win out in their tourneys. But with that being said, I won't change my mind about the Cal game. I'll admit I didn't see a lot of the game (only the last few minutes) so I can't really talk about the officiating as a whole, but how a foul wasn't called at the end is beyond me. His left arm was draped (drapped? Hah I don't even know) around Anderson and he slapped him with his other arm, he was trying to foul him. That's the thing I dont' get. UCLA was trying to foul there. If I was Ben Braun I would've probably freaked, but fortunately I'm not good enough to be a college basketball coach http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

As far as those 6 seeds mentioned, I would prefer Pittsburgh over Marquette and Butler. They're 6-6 in their last 12, with one win coming against a (Joe Lunardi) "lock", West Virgina-who by the way is bad on the road- on a last second three.

 

Edit: I just rememberd I don't even think you're allowed to play a team you've already played until at least the Sweet 16, so it's probably unlikely they'd be matched up with Marquette that quickly.

[TooLiveBrew]

Hehehe - it's "draped." http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

 

Certainly there are calls that are missed or were tremendously bad all year, but when it occurs in the last 5 seconds of a game, it tends to get magnified a great deal, especially in the last 1-2 weeks of a season.

 

Which makes it all the easier to forget &/or overlook calls made in the middle of a game, which have an equal impact with those called with .0000000547 seconds to play.

 

 

Another reason that it's been such a huge deal this year is the fact that it's been UCLA and Georgetown involved, while on national television for all to see...not Iona and Belmont...had these happened in a smaller league, it probably wouldn't even have made the sports news at all

Exactly - so why are the UCLA & G-town games any more or less positive/negative? When a call goes against a big power like UCLA or G-town, fans hardly even blink, yet when a call goes in the 'power' team's favor, it's time to re-evaluate the entire officiating process (I generalize, sorry http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif ). UW has had calls go for & against them this year, as every team does every year. I just can't find the blatant wrong if it happens for UCLA, as opposed to at their expense... or whether it happens to a 'power' team or not.

[Oldcity]

I'd be pretty happy with Clemson in the second round. Not so much Butler.

[LouisEly]

Ill be honest I wouldn't really like to play any of those #6 seeds. But I would put them in this order in terms of odds of UW winning

1. Clemson (Like all ACC teams, all O no D, except there O isnt that goodm they aint Duke thats for sure)
2. Marquette (Think UW has gotten better while Marquette has kinda stagnated
3. Butler (dangerous team IMO)
4. Pitt (Wouldnt not want to play this team at all costs)

 

Actually I'd put them in almost the reverse order. Pitt is overrated, very inconsistent, and got blown out by Marquette (amongst many other Big East teams); if I had to pick one, I'd pick them. I watched most of the Butler game tonight and based on this small sample they hardly came across as "dominant" or at least performing of a top-10 team. I think Flowers and Hughes can contain their guards on the defensive ends, and Butch, Landry, and Krabby would dominate their big guys. The only significant team Butler beat was an Ohio State team early in the season that was adjusting to four new starters. I think the ACC is overrated but Clemson is kind of an unknown. Marquette just matches up really well with UW in the front court and back court, and I think Marquette's guards can penetrate on Wisconsin's defense which is the key to Marquette winning; Marquette just has too much speed and talent at guard (James, McNeal, Matthews, Cubillan, Acker), they have Hayward who can flat out dominate inside and outside when he is on, and Fitzgerald can step out and hit the three also. Marquette was able to force UW to play Marquette's up-tempo style, something not many teams have been able to do. If Marquette can hit their shots they can beat anybody, but their shooting is inconsistent and their guards sometimes think they are better shooters than they really are and throw up too many long jumpers instead of penetrating like they need to.

 

Plus, if UW plays Marquette one of them has to lose. I really hope they are in separate regions so that they each have a chance to make a run without running into each other.

[Glennron]

Another bad call at the end of a Pac 10 game. ASU was down 2 in the closing seconds against USC, and a guy on ASU got a put back dunk. He was called for over the back without touching the guy who was in front of him. Pac 10 officials aren't really having a good week in close game situations.

 

Edit, to show this awesome pic (or painful, if you're an ASU fan) http://images.yuku.com/image/pjpeg/ade15e968f713d73ec7af055d9be8c0a10d60c8.pjpg