Bucks beat Cavs in dramatic fashion

[dadofandrew]

Don't forget, the Bucks were over .500 late last December when injuries hit and I think they have less depth this year. I did not see tonight's game, but any win over DAL is a good one. The Lakers aren't that good, but a win over CLE on the road was impressive.

 

If they keep winning at home, they'll be a playoff team. If Redd or another main guy get hurt, I think 28-30 wins is also possible. I'll hope for the former.

[trwi7]

Don't forget, the Bucks were over .500 late last December when injuries hit and I think they have less depth this year. I did not see tonight's game, but any win over DAL is a good one. The Lakers aren't that good, but a win over CLE on the road was impressive.

 

If they keep winning at home, they'll be a playoff team. If Redd or another main guy get hurt, I think 28-30 wins is also possible. I'll hope for the former.

 

They're not as deep as last year?

 

Our depth chart last year was.

 

Williams-Blake-Bell-Greer

Redd-Bell

Patterson-Ilyasova-Noel

Villanueva-Skinner

Bogut-Skinner-Gadzuric

Compare that to this years team

 

Williams-Bell-Ivey

 

Redd-Bell-Mason-Ivey

 

Mason-Simmons-Noel

Yi-Villanueva

Bogut-Gadzuric

That's much more depth than last year and much better players than last year. And they still won 28 games last year with Simmons missing the whole year, Blake sucking, Williams missing a few weeks, Bogut missing a few weeks and Villanueva being healthy for about 8 games.

[Oldcity]

Don't forget about Skinner, who was in the mix before he got injured. Not that he'll make a big difference, but he'll get minutes when he gets back.

 

I think this team is deeper than last year. Also better coached.

[trwi7]

Don't forget about Skinner, who was in the mix before he got injured. Not that he'll make a big difference, but he'll get minutes when he gets back.

 

I think this team is deeper than last year. Also better coached.

 

Skinner plays for the Suns now.

[Oldcity]

Oops. Nice call; I totally meant Michael Ruffin.

[danzig6767]

All along i felt the main thing Mo needed was experience, a better team around him, and a head coach that leaned on Mo to play more controlled. He's got those things and is finally starting to shine. Thankfully the Bucks weren't as impatient as you are don and understood there were things that slowed his development, not all guys come into the NBA with special gifts like Paul or Williams. Some need time and coaching, with some shaky play mixed in while developing.

Unfortunately, Mo got his "experience" running teams that could have probably competed a lot better had they had frankly better point guards. That's the source of the frustration; in the NBA can a team that claims to be "competitive" really run a PG out there that's "shaky" and try to let him work out his issues? Absolutely not. Am I impatient? We all are to an extent - look at the firestorm on the Cordero thread, if you want proof of that. Mo's development would have been most likely more consistent had the Bucks not hired Stotts and went with someone who wouldn't be afraid of benching Mo if he was making the consistently-bad decisions that he was making.

 

It's not so much that I am impatient as I was unhappy with Mo's wretchedly inconsistent play and decision-making. I've said before that the keys to the Bucks having a successful season do start at the PG spot because of how much Mo handles the ball; I'm going to stick with that story here. If Mo continues to play well, the Bucks will win a bit more than the critics have said they will.

 

 

What Bucks teams would have been so much better if Mo had played better?

04-05-- Ford gets hurt and in what was nearly a rookie year for Mo, he has to start at PG. The roster was crap, it would have taken a stellar season by Jason Kidd running the point instead of Mo to possibly finish around .500. Mo certainly wasn't holding back some very talented roster. Averaging 10/6 in only 28mpg was alot better than i expected from a second round pick that barely played his rookie year o another team.

05-06--Can't blame Mo for him killing the team at PG given he spent alot of his minutes playing SG since TJ was back.

06-07--Mo prevented last years Bucks from having a good year? They were 17-16 and had won 7 of their last 8 games. Then mass amounts of injuries hit an already fairly thin team overall talent wise. The lineups being thrown on the court were garbage after injuries, Steve Nash couldn't have got that team to .500. On top of that, the offense still managed to somehow stay fairly efficient, but the defense and rebounding were deplorable. If you want to blame Mo for anything last year, it should have been for him contributing to that deplorable defense with his sad defense.

As for Mo's play at PG being the key to the season before it started, all i can say is i think that was nowhere near as important in my mind to the defense and rebounding. The Bucks in the first 33 games pre-injuries last year were in the top 5 in ppg and field goal percentage, for Mo being so terrible, defenses sure had a tough time slowing our offense at that time. Their offense easily was productive enough to be in the playoffs with a good seed. The reasons though that they were only 17-16 with such an efficient offense was they were nearly dead last in defense and rebounding.

Go search history, find me all the teams who did well while finishing 29th in FG% allowed and 29th in rebounding, regardless if they had a good offense. I do think Mo is playing better than last year, unlike you though, i'm not really surprised by it. With that said, if you think his better play has been a bigger key than the vastly better defense/rebounding, then i gotta wonder if you follow basketball much. If the Bucks were playing defense like last year and rebounding like last year, Mo's improved play would have barely mattered. The Bucks record would be more in the 4-7 range instead of 7-4.

Props to Coach K, he has Mo/Redd/Bogut all trying harder on defense. Of the three, Bogut's defensive improvement has been stunning, beautiful to see.

 

[danzig6767]

One more thing on Mo. They showed an interview with him and he was asked what brought on all the higher assist totals and less shots. He said this was the first time in two year he's been asked to be more of just a distributor. He said the team is healthy, has plenty of scorers now, and the head coach isn't asking him to be a scorer.

 

His play this year is just like i expected if we were healthy and the new coach not only didn't asked for Mo to be a scorer, that the coach was demanding that Mo distributes the ball because the skills were there to do so.

[greeg35]

Don't underestimate the power of a contract year. Mo was playing for himself last year. This year he is free to play for the team.

 

I was a Mo fan before last year, a huge critic of him last year, skeptical early this year, and I am already a total convert now. He is doing a great job of getting others involved, especially Bogut. When the offense bogs down this year so far it has been when the second unit outstays their welcome, or when Redd or Bell decides to do more dribbling than passing. Redd has been very good in many areas, and his one man scoring ability has been valuable at times; but overall the team is better when he's taking his open shots and passing when they're not there. It seems like the Team USA experience has helped him become more complete; but has also created a little "I have to be the go to scoring guy" monster in his head. The reality is he would be the go to scoring guy whether or not he dribbles the ball too much and doesn't pass.

[dadofandrew]

That's a mighty thin frontline. Bogut goes down, and it's a defense only group. Patterson played PF for much of last year, and Ersan had plenty of good games as well. Both had warts, but could score. Mason is a nice role player, and Simmons is a decent complementary player. That said, Redd goes down, the club will struggle to score 85.

[bball123h2]

That said, Redd goes down, the club will struggle to score 85.

If you removed the best player from any team in the NBA, methinks they would struggle too.

[lcbj68c]

Bucks forum?

[And That]

Bucks forum?

Bucks thread.

 

[PlayerHader]

Please don't give any ideas. I already hate that Packer talk isn't allowed around here.

[Brian the Automator]

Either passive-aggressive complaints like lcbj's or overt ones like fortheloveofweek's belong in the I don't want to post at LambeauLeap.net thread. I can assure you that even though we've made our decision and are sticking to it, you can vent your frustration there.

[tigerbrew]

Away for a week vacationing with my wife in south China and I return home to learn that the Bucks won 3 straight (including a road game) against tough opponents. Well done Bucks, please keep it up.

One of the cities I visited was Yi's hometown Shenzhen, bet his hometown fans are liking his move to the Bucks, it has turn out well.

[bobbledude25]

How about Yi's D on Nowitzki at the end of the game? wow

[Oldcity]

Four things I've been stunned to see this year:

 

1. Mo's distribution-- I too am pretty much already completely converted from skeptic to believer

2. Yi's defense-- Thought he'd be raw there, but he's already one of their top defenders

3. Boguts's aggressiveness and defensive improvment

4. Redd looking like a complete player

[davego]

Brian keeping the troops in line. Very Admiral Kane of you. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

 

 

[don1481]

With that said, if you think his better play has been a bigger key than the vastly better defense/rebounding, then i gotta wonder if you follow basketball much.

Props to Coach K, he has Mo/Redd/Bogut all trying harder on defense. Of the three, Bogut's defensive improvement has been stunning, beautiful to see.

 

1. I go to most home games and have gone to most home games for the past few years (season ticket holder). I actually watch the Bucks more than I do the Brewers (percentage of games-wise). The TV shots don't always show the guy wide open that Mo would ignore last year that he's not ignoring nearly as much this year.

2. I agree that Coach K is the right guy for the job in terms of getting the team to believe in, well, a team concept.

3. I think Mo's decision-making has been a BIG difference from a year ago, especially since there are now fewer wasted offensive sets being run. Is it the biggest difference between the team? Maybe, maybe not - but it's still a big factor.

[JJHardy7]

Michael Redd's improvement has a ton to do with playing with Team USA from everything I read. He covered Kobe day in and day out. I give Redd a ton of credit for not settling for anything and the want to improve. I also think Bogut falls in the same regard. He's not going to just settle for things. This Bucks team looks like they may prove all the "experts" wrong. If I recall, I believe one ESPN guy had them making the playoffs. Even on brewerfan they didn't have a lot of love for making the playoffs...

[Weirdos19]

They are deep. Injuries didn't help them last year.

[danzig6767]

Four things I've been stunned to see this year:

 

1. Mo's distribution-- I too am pretty much already completely converted from skeptic to believer

2. Yi's defense-- Thought he'd be raw there, but he's already one of their top defenders

3. Boguts's aggressiveness and defensive improvment

4. Redd looking like a complete player

The vast improvement in Bogut's defense has been the biggest shock to me by far. Andrew only averaged .5 blocks per game last year, this year he's not only blocking shots left and right, he's altering many others. It drove me crazy last year how few times Bogut even bothered to try and block shots, our interior defense was pathetic. I never thought Bogut had it in him to be a force defensively. The other night vs Atlanta when Bogut took a very hard foul on Josh Smith who had been killing the Bucks, i was so damn proud of him. No longer are guards and forwards allowed to waltz into the paint and perform layup drills on the Bucks. Between Bogut and Yi this year, the interior defense is light years better than last season.

 

It's hard to win alot of games with a marshmellow interior defense and weak rebounding.

[danzig6767]

With that said, if you think his better play has been a bigger key than the vastly better defense/rebounding, then i gotta wonder if you follow basketball much.

Props to Coach K, he has Mo/Redd/Bogut all trying harder on defense. Of the three, Bogut's defensive improvement has been stunning, beautiful to see.

 

1. I go to most home games and have gone to most home games for the past few years (season ticket holder). I actually watch the Bucks more than I do the Brewers (percentage of games-wise). The TV shots don't always show the guy wide open that Mo would ignore last year that he's not ignoring nearly as much this year.

2. I agree that Coach K is the right guy for the job in terms of getting the team to believe in, well, a team concept.

3. I think Mo's decision-making has been a BIG difference from a year ago, especially since there are now fewer wasted offensive sets being run. Is it the biggest difference between the team? Maybe, maybe not - but it's still a big factor.

Well don, we'll just have to agree to disagree on Mo. I post on the Bucks forum on RealGM and Mo was quite the polarizing figure on there also. I was in the pro-Mo camp that all he needed was a healthy team and new coach, but about half the posters there felt like you did, feeling he was a SG in a PG body that would never change. Both Mo and TJ Ford seemed to be the most polarizing players in awhile, lots of debating went down about both with very few minds changed. Mo's play this year is starting to change this somewhat, but i suspect all it will take is a 4-17 FG/ three assist game to bring back out his detractors. I'm more concerned his very poor defense of the past will rear it's ugly head as the season drags on.

 

I'm with you though that Stotts hitting the road was the best thing to happen this offseason. IMO coaches often get more credit or blame than they deserve, but it is somewhat common for teams to take on the personality of their coach. Under Stotts the team was soft as butter and while i don't think that was all his fault, i do feel he was at least partly to blame for it. I wasn't a fan of him being hired and nothing i saw under him changed my mind.

[danzig6767]

That's a mighty thin frontline. Bogut goes down, and it's a defense only group. Patterson played PF for much of last year, and Ersan had plenty of good games as well. Both had warts, but could score. Mason is a nice role player, and Simmons is a decent complementary player. That said, Redd goes down, the club will struggle to score 85.

Quality centers in the NBA are like No.1 starters in pro baseball, not a bunch of them out there and teams don't have multiple of them. If he gets hurt, you're pretty much out of luck because one won't be sitting on your bench or be available in a trade.

Same goes for the best player on a team. Remove Duncan from the Spurs, Dirk from the Mavs, or Kobe from the Lakers via injury and their teams will be in big trouble. Maybe not quite as bad as the Bucks, but they'll still struggle to win consistently.

 

[olliegjw]

Whatever happened to Ilyasova this year? I haven't seen his name anywhere. He seemed like he had a lot of potential.