Does Boston = NY in hateability?

[lithium75]

Boston had the feel good 2004 season where they overcame an 0-3 deficit over the Yankees to finally escape the "Curse of the Bambino." This year's team has nice stories like the Jon Lester comeback from cancer, and they are buildoing their dynasty the right way, with young home grown players. Boston's payroll is lower than the Yankees, so yes, the "Evil Empire" still deserves it's seat at the throne of most hated team.

 

But Boston is catching up. They spent an obscene ammount of money to sign Dice-K (more than twice what Ben Sheets got in his 4 year extension) and he had never pitched a major league inning before. They got Josh Beckett from the Marlins when they were in the slash payroll mode. They have been throwing money around to free agents, and that trend will only continue.

 

Will Steinbrenner decide that the reason the Yankees haven't won it all in 7 years is that they aren't spending enough money? Or will Boston sail past them into the $200 million payroll land? I'm not sure any team can ever match the hateablity of the Evil Empire, but I had a really good feeling about the 2004 Red Sox team. The 2007 team had an evil empire type vibe from the moment Dice-K signed, giving tme the "Keep an eye on them, they're dangerous," feeling.

[don1481]

Seeing as the Yankees are firmly - and permanently - entrenched as the Evil Empire in my mind, any team that can topple them will always be one of my favorites.

 

I'd love to see the Yankees never win another World Series title again; granted, the odds of that happening are between slim and none, and slim just left town.

[pretendastronaut]

I don't know about hateability. I think plenty of people hate them, but the race between the two teams is still a mile apart. I think the biggest thing though is that Boston has certainly lost its underdog status to the Yankees. It was a great story in 04 no doubt, but now that mantra is lost, they've become to elite now to be the team that's kept down by the Yankees. So their image has most definetly changed, but I don't think its anywhere near a tight race in terms of which team I despise more yet.

[homer]

Boston complained for years about Steinbrenner's spending sprees and now they are doing the exact same thing. I'm sick of 'em.

[mark brouhard is number on]

i think it has a lot to do with the players too. new york just seems to always have a lot of jerks and attention getters, like Clemens, randy johnson (when he was there), a-rod, etc. not a fan of jeter either, he's a good player, but not god like new yorkers think. whereas boston has big papi, manny, and a bunch of players i just think seem like good fun guys, who keep a fun atmosphere in the clubhouse and on the field. not like the stuffy, always business yankees. that is why i've always hated the yankees. baseball is supposed to be fun, and they never look like they're having any, while the red sox always seem to be.

[biedergb]

i think it has a lot to do with the players too. new york just seems to always have a lot of jerks and attention getters, like Clemens, randy johnson (when he was there), a-rod, etc.

I would qualify Schilling, JD Drew as attention getters and/or jerks. So NY does not have a monopoly on that.

 

The two payrolls are going to be closer if Boston keeps its players, and the Yanks are set to pare off quite a bit of salary (Abreu, ?Giambi?, Clemens, Mussina, possibly A-Rod)

 

And a side note, does this now make the Yankees the long suffering franchise, I mean the Sox have won 2 titles since the Yankees last won one? (That should be in blue, but the fact is ESPN and Yankee fans will think this is the truth)

[TooLiveBrew]

Did it really take as cosmetic an act as Boston winning another WS title for people to recognize that they operate almost identically to NYY? Or NYM, CHC/S, etc.? Sheesh.

[joepepsi]

I respect the way the Red Sox build their teams. It's not all superstar free agents. This past offseason they signed Lugo, Drew, DiceK, and Okajima. Hardly the Yankee approach of outbidding for all the top free agents.

 

I wish my favorite teams had the front office smarts and available revenue the Red Sox have. I'm not going to fault them for building good teams and smart player acquisition. They took Mike Lowell as part of the Beckett trade when no one wanted Lowell. They picked up Ortiz after the Twins declined to offer him arbitration. Loretta was signed for a year, while Pedroia developed in the minors. They let Damon walk, taking a flyer on Crisp, while Ellsbury developed. Unlike the Yankees or Mets, the Red Sox try and build a team, not just gather superstars.

[kgbaseball]

No way.

[colbyjack]

Boston complained for years about Steinbrenner's spending sprees and now they are doing the exact same thing. I'm sick of 'em.

 

This bugs me too. Boston is almost trying to make themselves look like every other team in MLB, but they're not that far off from being the Yankees. Yes, I apreicate the way they have been built, but I also appreciate the way the Yankees have been built, with quite a few homegrown stars that helped them through their string of World Series in the late 90s. I was sick of Boston already in 2004, and like the Cubs, they seem to be one of those teams in which it is "cool" to follow them.

 

I respect the way the Red Sox build their teams. It's not all superstar free agents. This past offseason they signed Lugo, Drew, DiceK, and Okajima. Hardly the Yankee approach of outbidding for all the top free agents.

 

No offense, but I think this should have been in blue. The didn't outbid anyone for these guys? Drew opted out of his big contract with the Dodgers (5 years, $55 million) to sign a 5 year $70M deal. DiceK? They dropped over $50 million just to have the opportunity to negoatiate with him only to drop another $50M+ on his 4-year deal. Lugo? 4 years $36M for a light hitting, slick fielding SS.

 

I think the perception of the Red Sox vs. Yankees is a little skewed simply based on the above comment alone. It's the Yankees, Red Sox and then everyone else. If you're after a free agent, you better hope both of those teams aren't, as there's no way you have a chance at signing them if they do.

[homer]

Not to mention the deals they proferred to Schilling and ManRam.

[billyhallfan]

joepepsi--DiceK wasn't a top free agent?

 

also, if I tallied, and used my baseballcube information correctly. Boston used a total of five "homegown" players on their 25 man roster, while New York(A) had 8. I have a problem with that, 4 players that they developed, that is pathetic. Say what you want about the Yankees, Mets, or Cubs. But if out of 25 players, only 5 of them are your own, that went through your farm system, that in my opinion makes them worse than the Yankees. And I think that has to be the worst in the majors. I don't know and I haven't done all the research, but that has to be the worst...

[valpocrewsader]

I would qualify Schilling, JD Drew as attention getters and/or jerks. So NY does not have a monopoly on that.

And I, personally, find Papelbon and Pedroia to be two of the most odious youngsters in the game. Boston = NY to me, although I might even hate New England more than I hate New York. Sick of them ... sick of their accents, sick of their arrogant attitudes, sick of the major sports media outlets revolving around them.

[bklynbrewcrew]

The yankees will always be the most hated team in baseball and I for one will never hate any sports team as much as I hate them. The Red Sox are in that same payroll stratsosphere so they arent exactly likeable either.

[BrewCityUnit]

I think the Red Sox are worst then the Yankees. The Red Sox are the only team in MLB that I hate. I hate their fans, I hate that they complain about the Yankees when ANY team would spend like the Yankees if they had the chance. I can't stand Manny, Ortiz, Schilling, Youk, Pedroia, Drew....the list goes on and on. The only ones I like are Papelbon, Lester and Beckett.

[chadomac]

Boston complained for years about Steinbrenner's spending sprees and now they are doing the exact same thing. I'm sick of 'em.

agreed. The Red Sox have become exactly who they despise. I'm completely sick of them and I have a hard time rooting for any of those "big money" teams.

 

 

 

 

[Bring Back the Stein]

I hate the Cubs more than either of them.

[joepepsi]

The Red Sox salary is 75% of the Yankees' salary. $143 million vs. $190 million. The Sox may be 2nd in highest in payroll, but that's a huge difference. To put it in perspective, these teams are approximately within 75% of the Red Sox payroll: Withe Sox, Angels, Dodgers, Cubs, Mariners, Mets.

[Tbadder]

I love anyone who beats the Yankees, especially at their own game. But objectively Boston and NY (throw in Detroit with their drafting exploits) are doing all they can to destroy the foundation of the game. Eventually what happened to the housing market will happen to the baseball market. It's overvalued because of reckless spending.

[logan82]

You are mean the Yankees north. That is how I think about Boston. The only thing that seperates them from the Yankees is a lunatic meddling owner.

[jjgott]

I have been ragging one of my Red Sox buddies about this all through the playoff run. Any sort of "underdog" quality about the Red Sox definitely evaporated with this World Series Win. Looking at payrolls, $143 million vs. $190 million difference, would be like comparing a Maserati with a Ferrari. But even in the Yankees heyday, they had guys like Jim Leyritz, Shane Spencer, Scott Brosius, etc. so they didn't have "super stars", but quality players that could win. Meanwhile, the Red Sox are starting to shell out ridiculously out-of-market salaries for guys like J.D. Drew or Julio Lugo. Finally, and I find this just as valid as any of the payroll issues, the Red Sox fans, much like Scrub fans, are finding it is simply trendy to slap on that hat and shell out $100 to go to the game. While there are dedicated and informed fans of both the Sox and the Scrubs, most fans are there simply because it is the hot thing to do to be seen and show status. In the end, the Red Sox have now solidified their standing amongst my hated teams of the Yankees and Cubs, and I hope the Sox's spending ways end up blowing up in their face like the Yankees.

[joepepsi]

I suspect you'd all be fine with Milwaukee spending $143 a year if they could afford it.

[BrewCityUnit]

I would be fine with the Brewers spend that kind of money. What makes me mad is that Boston complains about the Yankees yet they do the same thing. I don't complain about the Red Sox and Yankees spending habits...I complain about the Red Sox complaining.

 

You will never hear me complain about the Cubs ability to spend more than the Brewers. I will use that as an excuse to why they should be better than us, but I don't hate the Cubs because they can spend more money than us. It just makes it better when their season ends in dissapointment year after year.

[dadofandrew]

Theo has singlehandedly built that franchise up from being mediocre every year. Hopefully, Doug will accomplish the same thing.

[SoCalBrewfan]

Theo has singlehandedly built that franchise up from being mediocre every year.

 

He was hired November 2002. That 2002 season the team had won 93 games. With Theo (years 2003-2007) they've averaged 94 wins per year...and of course won it all twice. So they've improved a bit, but at the same time they've also ramped up the payroll significantly. And 'singlehandedly?' I don't know how one could make that claim. Theo's a smart guy, and a good GM in my opinion, but he also has tremendous structural advantages...and there's a lot more to that organization than just Theo and a spreadsheet.

 

(If you want to get into a bit more detail, the team won 89.5 games/year for the five years before Theo, 94/ year since then. Average finish in the division was 2nd for each five year period.)

 

And, by the way, I do hate the Red Sox now. For all that they cry about how they're the underdogs against the Evil Empire, to the rest of the league it's Evil Empire Ia and Ib, with the Red Sox' advantage over the rest of the league just as big as the Yankees' advantage over the Red Sox.