Turnbow yea or nay

[Jay Zahn]

Opinions. Should Turnbow be brought back next year? Traded for whatever we can get for him? Released?

I don't want him on the team next year. He's a manager killer. He hurts the team, but he's got stuff, and will have some good outings, but hurts us in the end with his meltdowns. A Spurling will just give up hits and the manager will react appropriately when he's pitching poorly. Turnbow's too much of a temptation.

Anyone else?

[Weirdos19]

I don't know. Considering we may lose Cordero and Linebrink, Turnbow may be the best right handed reliever coming back. Gulp.

[PKBadger]

Nay, nay, nay.....a thousand times nay.

Hopefully we can get something for him via trade. But as long as he's not in our bullpen next year, I'm happy. Timid pitchers aren't going to win us ballgames.

[trwi7]

I don't know. Considering we may lose Cordero and Linebrink, Turnbow may be the best right handed reliever coming back. Gulp.

 

Thanks for the final blow on an already depressing night.

[valpocrewsader]

This sorta seems like a reactionary thread (although you ask insightful questions) without a lot of staying power, but what the heck. I've been anti-Turnbow since the 2005-2006 offseason, hoping for a favorabke trade opportunity since his surprising 2005 season. (If the search went back that far, I could prove it.) Frankly, I hate Turnbow. I like smart people and smart ballplayers ... he is neither. (See my rants on Weeks and Hall.) I like reliable people ... he is not. I like guys with good track records who have had consistent success elsewhere ... again, nope. He's a castoff that Melvin is trying to pin playoff hopes on. A turd we keep hoping to polish into something worthy of big-market success.

[PKBadger]

[mothershipconnection]

Really, we don't have great options, so you pretty much have to keep anyone capable of not sucking. His value is rock-bottom, so Doug will be offered a pile of dog vomit for him at this point. He'll be back, but I pray we have better options and can put him in mop up situations before trading him near the deadline if he improves.

Edit: We could possibly get more than a worthless player if we take on someone's pricey contract, though. I've long thought that the best possibility for the Crew this winter will be another trade like they made to get Lee. It's possible that such a salary-dumping team would also have a ton of holes and be willing to give Turnbow a shot as long as they're still getting a salary dump overall.

[RobertR]

I see no point in outright cutting him. He's not the worst pitcher in the bullpen even now.

But, I do think his time as a high leverage reliever is at an end. His control is simply too inconsistent for that role. I'd have no problem with him taking over Matt Wise's role or simply being the 7th inning reliever. After the last two years I just don't see how any team can expect to win a World Series with Turnbow being a major part of the bullpen. Just too many meltdowns.

Robert

[iluvlamp]

Turnbow can be possibly useful... ahh crap..that's all I got. He could do some things.

[wOOgiE22]

TURNBOW IMPLODING
Date	Team	IP	ER	BB	DEC
5/14	Philadelphia	2/3	4	1	L
5/15	Philadelphia	1	1	0	L
5/30	Atlanta	1/3	3	2	L
6/24	Kansas City	1/3	2	1	BS
7/24	Cincinnati	0	2	0
7/29	St. Louis	1/3	4	0	L
8/16	St. Louis	1/3	4	3
9/3	Houston	1/3	3	2
9/12	Pittsburgh	2/3	3	2	L
9/26	St. Louis	1/3	3	2
----	-----------	4 1/3	29	13	-------

I think these statistics pretty much sum up Turnbow when he is not on.

[trwi7]

Doug will be offered a pile of dog vomit for him at this point.

Honestly I can think of more uses for dog vomit right now. Throwing it on opposing players, spreading over the outfield for slipping, our catcher taking a little bit when he goes out to catch and then showing it to the batter hoping he gets sick from it or at least grossed out enough that he can't concentrate on the at bat.

[Fatter than Joey]

I've been anti-Turnbow since the 2005-2006 offseason

 

me too.. I wanted him gone a LONG time ago.

[jlau20]

TURNBOW IMPLODING
Date	Team	IP	ER	BB	DEC
5/14	Philadelphia	2/3	4	1	L
5/15	Philadelphia	1	1	0	L
5/30	Atlanta	1/3	3	2	L
6/24	Kansas City	1/3	2	1	BS
7/24	Cincinnati	0	2	0
7/29	St. Louis	1/3	4	0	L
8/16	St. Louis	1/3	4	3
9/3	Houston	1/3	3	2
9/12	Pittsburgh	2/3	3	2	L
9/26	St. Louis	1/3	3	2
----	-----------	4 1/3	29	13	-------

I think these statistics pretty much sum up Turnbow when he is not on.

Thanks for the chart. Either he's on, or he's completely off. It doesn't seem like there's a whole lot of middle ground with him. I'm glad Pipine somewhat brought that to Ned's attention after the game...but Turnbow was on three days rest so it shouldn't matter. What? So in spite of the fact that when he loses it, he loses it, it's all ok so long as he's had a few days rest? What a jawdropper.

 

[DannoMac21]

I want him gone.

[thablingster]

TURNBOW IMPLODING
Date	Team	IP	ER	BB	DEC
5/14	Philadelphia	2/3	4	1	L
5/15	Philadelphia	1	1	0	L
5/30	Atlanta	1/3	3	2	L
6/24	Kansas City	1/3	2	1	BS
7/24	Cincinnati	0	2	0
7/29	St. Louis	1/3	4	0	L
8/16	St. Louis	1/3	4	3
9/3	Houston	1/3	3	2
9/12	Pittsburgh	2/3	3	2	L
9/26	St. Louis	1/3	3	2
----	-----------	4 1/3	29	13	-------

I think these statistics pretty much sum up Turnbow when he is not on.

Ugh. lol

That line is so ugly it is sad. Overall I think Turnbow is a decent pitcher, but I wouldn't miss him if we could get someone reasonably dependable to replace him. If we are bringing back the same guys next year, we almost have to keep him because when he is good he is better than Aquino, Spurling, etc. and is just about as bad as they can be on any night they are bad.

[alwz4gbp]

Its hard to believe that he may be our best option next year. I don't think I've ever seen n "established" major league pitcher who is so hit or miss. He is either unhittable or so bad that any of us could take him deep al in the matter of 24 hours. Don't know what to do with him. Doug is gonna have to earn his money this off season to get us a bullpen. Especially if Linebrink and Cordero walk and all we're left with is Turnbow and a bunch of AAAA pitchers.

[number59]

NO.

 

closers can be found. That chart is all you need to see.

 

We will be too good next year to put up with such nonsense.

[TooLiveBrew]

Look, I think the answer is pretty obvious. But let's not forget the human side of this story - it's not like Turnbow doesn't want to do well, and he's supplied the Brewers and their fans many memorable happy memories, too. This may be the saddest picture I've seen from this season - I honestly just want to give him a hug.

 

http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphics/sports/brew/img/sep07/turnbow0926.jpg

[jlau20]

All that chart tells us is that when he's not on, he's not on. Ned should know this by now and should always have a guy getting loose in the pen with Turnbow. If Turnbow shows up like he did tonight, he should be out of there right away.

 

However, when he is on, he's got some pretty nasty stuff. Given the fact he seems to let that negative vibe from the crowd really get to him, I don't see why the boo's need to be rained down so heavily upon him. Is it boo-able that he walked in a run on four straight pitches? Yes. Should he have still been in there? Probably not. Was he the man in '05? Yes. Do people seem to have forgotten that? Yes.

[True CryM]

If his problem was mechanical, I'd be more inclined to keep him. But as Jlau eluded, he's a complete head case. How can you depend on a set-up guy who crumbles when ANYONE gets on?

[TooLiveBrew]

I just hope to gawd that next year, instead of a "set-up guy," and "a 6th-inning guy," and a "closer," and a "7th-inning guy," we just get some freaking solid relievers - ones that don't need to come with a read.me file including player label so our manager doesn't have to think. Find me a couple rubber-armed guys that can pitch with runners on or no runners on, day off, 18 days off, or the second game of a double-header. I'm tired of the specialization of bullpen roles. Just pitch, dang it!

 

(vent over)

[danzig6767]

Look, I think the answer is pretty obvious. But let's not forget the human side of this story - it's not like Turnbow doesn't want to do well, and he's supplied the Brewers and their fans many memorable happy memories, too. This may be the saddest picture I've seen from this season - I honestly just want to give him a hug.

 

http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphics/sports/brew/img/sep07/turnbow0926.jpg

 

 

I'm with you

I know few will agree with me,but i hated seeing that big crowd boo him off the field with such a fierce level of anger.Turnbow seems like a very nice guy,he just might be to emotional in some pressure situations when things start going bad,he can't keep his composure enough to allow for his mechanics to stay consistent.

Whoever was making the call should have seen Turnbow was in trouble once he walked the last guy to load the bases.So he was left out there somewhat to fail by people who should have had the knowledge to see danger was lurking.It was bad enough that Turnbow was left out their to face Stinnett from the start,but after the first two balls missed so bad,he should have been pulled after the count hit 2-0.It was painfully obvious there was almost no shot by that point to avoid the walk,Turnbow looked rattled as hell.

His manager at that point left Turnbow out there to hang himself and we should all know he was trying his hardest not to walk Stinnett,he must have felt miserable after that walk.No way i'd have piled on to his pain by booing and jeering him as he walked off the field,that would have been saved by me for whoever was the guy who decided to leave him in when the obvious call was the make a change.

 

[Nearsighted Views]

I've always liked Turnbow and he falls into that "he is what he is" category. When he's on, he's lights out but when he's not, he's awful.

 

He's been mismanaged and continually put into situations that don't favor success for him. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

 

So to answer the question, I think Turnbow would be a fine option in the bullpen if he's used correctly. That being said, it's hard to have such speical circumstances around a MLB pitcher. You would basically need to enforce these rules:

 

Nobody on.

If he allows more than 1 baserunner, pull him.

 

Like I said, I like Turnbow and watching him melt down hurts me. Seeing him booed last night hurt me. That picture says it all. I just hope we don't turn it into a situation where he needs a "change of scenery" to start over.

[bklynbrewcrew]

We have no choice but to keep him. He has no trade value right now so Melvin will have to hope Turnbow turns things around. Other than Cordero and possibly Linebrink who in this bullpen can you actually have any confidence in? Turnbow looks lost as does Wise, Shouse, and every other bum they have out there. Its a shame that this team hasnt developed any reliable relief pitchers over the last few years because we are going to be forced to spend a lot of money on this area if we are going to contend next season.

[mark brouhard is number on]

he's my least favorite brewer and although i know he's trying, he's just too much of a head case to pitch for a winning team, which i hope the brewers will be next year. i don't care if we cut him or trade him, i never want to see him pitch for us again. even when he is pitching good you just always feel his next pitch could be the start of his next implosion.