When is it time to pull the plug on the Gamel at 3B project?

[bullox]

Nothing more to say than he has a whopping 20 E's so far this season, including a recent 4 E game and 2 today.

[pogokat]

no reason to move a guy in the low minors...they won't move him to another position until he hits AA or higher, i would assume...

 

like braun, i think they intend to fix him

[PrimeTime955]

Braun was never this bad.

[pogokat]

Quote:

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Braun was never this bad.

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i'm well aware of that...

 

but i dont think the brewers see a pressing need to move Gamel, so i doubt they will for another year or two...unlike when everyone in the system was a first baseman, there's just no motivation to shift him somewhere else...

[bullox]

I don't think Hart was given as long a leash at 3B (performance-wise), but I see what you are saying about Gamel only being in Low A. Hart had his struggles at 3B while playing for Huntsville, IIRC.

 

I guess what I feel is that if this continues, there has to be some point where the powers that be realize that he is just not cut out for the position. His bat has the potential to play elsewhere.

[SoCalBrewfan]

It should also be noted that there are plenty of other outfielders around, and having Gamel at 3b ensures that he'll get at bats. Since development is more important than winning in the low minors, it could well be that they've decided to punt 3b defense to get all these guys in the lineup. As it is the oufielders are struggling to get their share of playing time...

[lexi881]

Im not trying to be rude or anything but I was just wondering if any of you have actually been to watch a Manatees game (or games) or are your comments based solely on the audio and game reports, as sometimes the audio does not paint a very accurate picture of what is really going on. Certainly not all, but more than a few of Mat's errors can be chalked up to very questionable (i.e. bad) calls.

[pogokat]

I havent been to one this year...

 

I've seen Mat play about 10 times. he's certainly got the potential to play passable 3b defense, and i think the Brewers agree with me on this. I know he's got to think about that error total alot and i could see how it would cause pressure on a player to change his game...

[lexi881]

We get to see a lot this year because he is so close to home (Jax, FL). Its really nice!

[DHonks]

I tend to like keeping players at their natural positions as long as can be. The only reason to move him to the corner outfield or 1b would be the dearth of power prospects at those spots in our farm system.

 

I hope they keep him at 3rd, and I hope his offense and defense picks up.

 

To be fair, most minor league fields are awful. If there are 10 bad hops, how many go as hits (which punish the pitcher with higher ERA) and how many are errors? It's somewhat subjective. Are all the BC players generally showing higher error totals?

[Mass Haas]

Heading into last night's game, only one Florida State League player besides Gamel had as many as 12 errors. The St. Lucie third baseman had 11, and the player with 12 and the few with 10 were middle infielders, not third baseman. Kudos to Sarasota, the Reds' squad, with no player with more than four.

 

Of course, we're all rooting for Mat to excel, but there's really no one to compare to on an error-per-chance basis in the FSL.

 

Mat won't be 22 until July, he's getting on base at a decent clip, and his K rate isn't bad for a corner player. The Manatees only have 15 HR's as a team in the power-tough FSL, but it'd be nice to see Mat with one and slugging more than .308. It's early, let's revisit this in another month.

[Boy Jeenius]

No way do you give up on a player that young so soon. Slow down with the expectations will ya? If the Brewers listened to this site, we'd have a whole team of DH's right now. This site has had this exact same thread for Rickie Weeks, Prince Fielder, Corey Hart, Kevin Mench. Heck even J.J. Hardy had one. Now it's Ryan Braun and Mat Gamel. They are in the minors to develop into major league players, nothing more. The only way to do it is with lots of innings and learninmg by making lots of mistakes.

[SoCalBrewfan]

Of course, errors only tell a small part of the story for defense, particularly in the low minors...for those who have seen Gamel, how are his range / quickness and arm? My sense from what I've read is that most of the errors are throws, and that he's got a strong arm but needs work on accuracy, and thus maybe footwork?

 

Players can improve defensively, so it's worthwhile to invest a few hundred games before shifting them...moves to less difficult positions tend to be irreversible.

[pogokat]

the errors i saw Mat make last year were fielding the ball, not throwing it..

[bullox]

Certainly not all, but more than a few of Mat's errors can be chalked up to very questionable (i.e. bad) calls.

 

I'd be more apt to agree with your point of view if Gamel's error total wasn't such an outlier not only on his team, but throughout the league as well. If it was a problem with bad calls, wouldn't other players have the same sort of bad luck?

 

 

This site has had this exact same thread for Rickie Weeks, Prince Fielder, Corey Hart, Kevin Mench. Heck even J.J. Hardy had one.

 

J.J. Hardy has been a slick fielder his entire professional career. Never once was his glove questioned. Kevin Mench never played in the Brewers' minor league system. Corey Hart

was moved from 3B, so I don't see how that comparison works here.

 

I'm all for Gamel getting playing time at 3B to help his bat mature due to the glut of OFs in the low ranks of the system. I just hope his struggles in the field don't start to mess with his confidence and throw his whole game off.

 

As far as whether or not I've seen the games: I'm allowed to say that his bat has potential based on game reports, but the minute I question his defensive ability, my credibility is suspect. It's got to be a two-way street.

[RyDogg66]

It doesnt seem to make a lot of sense to say Braun is the 3b of the future and move Bill Hall to prove that point and at the same time keep Gamel at thirdbase if he is a butcher.

 

So the Brewers fix his defense to make him passable at third base. His bat develops nicely and he is called up to Milwaukee sometime in 2009, where Braun is the everyday thirdbaseman. So the Brewers move him to a different position then.

[lexi881]

As far as whether or not I've seen the games: I'm allowed to say that his bat has potential based on game reports, but the minute I question his defensive ability, my credibility is suspect. It's got to be a two-way street.

 

You are certainly entitled to your opinion and are allowed to say whatever you want. I was not questioning your credibility and please accept my apologies if it came across that way. My question was simply that, a question wondering if your opinions were based on personal observations or the observations and reports of others. I have been fortunate enough to see several games this season and sometimes the balls take really bad hops, and sometimes he dives for balls that would have otherwise been a hit, but if the ball touches the glove it is an error whether it is really playable or not. Sometimes the first baseman pulls his foot off of the bag in an attempt not get hit by the runner, and that gets charged as an errant throw. This all has also been confirmed by his scout, who we speak to on a regular basis, and who also gets to see several games, as he is based out of Florida as well. Don't get me wrong - he has had some errors, but sometimes they don't always look quite like what they sound like on the radio. I meant no offense, I was just trying to say that sometimes the broadcast isnt a completely clear picture of what happened.