Melvins job performance

[Diskono]

Counsell is here instead of Loretta or Cirillo because we need someone who can play SS. If we didn't sign him, it might be Ozzie Chavez or Chris Barnwell with 233 ABs this year. Mark Loretta probably isn't as good as Graffanino anymore. It sucks that Graffy got hurt, but that's not Melvin's fault.

 

The Vargas/Estrada trade wasn't too bad. Vargas and Davis is a wash. I was pretty high on Eveland, but he hasn't even pitched since May 8. Krynzel is retired now. I'm not a fan of Estrada, but considering that we got him for two guys who aren't even playing, you really can't complain too much.

 

I do think we gave up too much for Linebrink, but we should get a draft pick for him next year, which will help. Never did like the Suppan deal. Just because other mediocre free agent pitchers were getting paid too much didn't mean that we had to do the same. If we needed a signing to show that we could compete for free agents, I'd prefer we sign an actual good player next time. Showing the world we mean business won't help a whole lot in a couple years when we can't afford anybody else thanks to our 5th starter's contract.

 

Some say that Suppan was more of an Attanasio signing than a Melvin signing (kind of like A-Rod in Texas) - if that's the case, Melvin gets a mulligan. Overall, I still think he's done a great job.

[hauser42]

So, because Suppan has 8 wins and Sheets has 10, that means that Sheets isn't that much better than Suppan is? If one were to play along and overlook the fact that win-loss record is essentially meaningless, then what about the fact that Suppan has 10 losses and Sheets only 4? Secondary stats nothing. Sheets has a 3.39 ERA and a 1.16 WHIP; Suppan has a 4.89 ERA and a 1.55 WHIP. It's not even close. Sheets is the best starter on this team.

Well you cant be the best starter sitting on the sidelines when you team needs you the most.

[brewers19]

Fine then, we'll revisit this next week after Sheets is activated from the DL.

[logan82]

I would like to point out that Fielder, Weeks, Hall, Hardy, Sheets, Jenkins, and Hart(I think) all predate the Melvin take over. I agree that he has made quite a few good moves, but we already had pretty good talent on the way before he took over. Bottom line is that I am glad he is here.

[Ennder]

Melvin brought us Mench, Estrada, Bush, Capuano, Suppan, Counsell, Graffanino, Turnbow, Cordero, Linebrink. That part of the team isn't looking quite as good right now, heh.

[RU Rah Rah]

I am sort of undecided about Suppan; I can see validity in both the pro and con arguments. One way of thinking about it might be to consider how the possible alternatives might have panned out. So . . .

 

1.) At the time, was there a better and comparable FA pitcher that Melvin could/should have signed?

2.) Could the team have just eaten his 156 IP with farmhands, scrubs, etc.?

 

Obviously, the answer to #2 is "no." Even with him on pace to eat 200 IP, the staff is stretched to the breaking point. So I guess the argument really boils down to Soup's relative position within last year's crop of FA pitchers. (My mind is sort of a blur here, beyond Zito, who clearly wasn't an option.)

[hauser42]

Fine then, we'll revisit this next week after Sheets is activated from the DL.

 

A little blister on the finger might have more to say about this. I hope Britlle Ben returns soon, but not holding my breath.

[homer]

I guess you've never tried to pitch with a blister. Ask Josh Beckett how well that works.

[Fatter than Joey]

2.) Could the team have just eaten his 156 IP with farmhands, scrubs, etc.?

 

This killed us in 2006 -- I certainly do not blame DM for trying to get us some rotational help.

[hauser42]

Melvin brought us Mench, Estrada, Bush, Capuano, Suppan, Counsell, Graffanino, Turnbow, Cordero, Linebrink. That part of the team isn't looking quite as good right now, heh.

 

You are correct but we are not looking at a roster with Jack Voight, Bad Chad, and Royce Clayton on the roster anymore.

 

He also looked great last night, by getting rid of Doug Davis. How bad did he look last night.

[endaround]

Almost as bad as Estrada did.

[Trowekamp]

The way I see it:

 

Estrada > Miller

Miller > Moeller

Suppan > Davis

Vargas > Z. Jackson

 

I am probably over simplifying things but the moves Melvin has made have not doomed the team this year. If anything they have been improvements (most slight improvements only but we aren't the Yankees). The issue with this team has been:

 

- Capuano

- Sheets Injury

- Weeks / Hall underperforming expectations

[JohnBriggs12]

In retrospect, the money spent on Suppan might have been better spent on bolstering a thin bullpen, allowing Villanueva to assume what for him is a better role as a starter.

 

I don't buy the notion that they had to sign Counsell because he could play shortstop. They're weren't other just as good or cheaper options out there? Counsell can still play defense but he's been teetering on useless offensively for some time and is clearly near the end of his career. They could have had a backup plan at short (last year's starter, Bill Hall) or if they just needed an adequate defensive guy for a few games here and there, I would not be embarrassed to put Ozzie Chavez out there a few games. Heck he'd probably give you close to what Counsell does with the bat and he's a fine defensive shortstop.

[MarquesJohnson2000]

I am sort of undecided about Suppan; I can see validity in both the pro and con arguments. One way of thinking about it might be to consider how the possible alternatives might have panned out. So . . .

 

1.) At the time, was there a better and comparable FA pitcher that Melvin could/should have signed?

2.) Could the team have just eaten his 156 IP with farmhands, scrubs, etc.?

 

Obviously, the answer to #2 is "no." Even with him on pace to eat 200 IP, the staff is stretched to the breaking point. So I guess the argument really boils down to Soup's relative position within last year's crop of FA pitchers. (My mind is sort of a blur here, beyond Zito, who clearly wasn't an option.)

It would have seemed foolish at the time, but Lilly or even Marquis might have been a better signing than Suppan (for this season, anyway).

 

Cubs fans certainly weren't excited about either of those signings at the time.

 

http://www.cubbiepalooza.com/cubbiepalooza/2006/12/cubs_sign_jason.html

[GenoSeligPrieb]

Ome at a time here after another in-law wedding dragged me out of town, and out of pocket, for half a week or so...

"He was our #1 prospect and was dominating this year until a few early struggles in Huntsville. After those struggles though, he seems to have adjusted pretty well."

Have to disagree, Paul.

Inman became our #1 prospect by default. The parent club was already employing quite a few 2007 minor leaguers to great effect, such as YoGa, Brauntosaurus, McClung, Dillon (although a 32-year-old can hardly be called a "prospect") and Charlie Newhouse, before hitters adjusted to him. If Inman's not promoted, then perhaps he qualifies for the title of "Best Nugget We Had Left", after Doug raided the farm system so often this season. But the issue with that is, by default, EVERY franchise has a B.N.W.H.L. after all the better nuggets already earned promotions ahead and instead of him. Sometimes an organization's best nugget is perhaps only the 5th-best on a deeper farm system. This year, the Cubs and Cardinals are around the .500 mark, the Astros lost all their quality aging pitchers, the Reds still play in the Great American SmallPark, and the Pirates are still run by McClatchey. The door's still wide open, and our 5th-best nugget, plus 2 others, was still worth the price, to acquire a quality reliever like Linebrink.

"Isn't it said that the jump from A ball to AA ball is the toughest jump"

Or how about the jump from AAA to the majors? Since our last playoff appearance, we've used literally hundreds of AAAA clowns who couldn't step up to the majors. From A ball to the next level? Compared to reaching the big leagues, that's a piece-o-cake. I mean, look at how McClung and Balfour dominated AAA this year. In the majors? Embarrassing.

"I know he was a great quote, but I still don't quite understand why Inman was Picklered by what seems like the majority of the board. He's a high school pitcher, with an injury history, and his ceiling isn't impressively high"

I'd say, Kat, that he was Picklered because he was a nugget arm, and we were trading minor leaguers for *gasp!* an outsider, a veteran, a guy who didn't make the league minimum, and worse of all, a pending free agent! That automatically made Linebrink less than desirable, and in turn helped bolster Wil Inman's case for sainthood. In fact, I could swear, the last time they closed the outfield panels at The Keg, that the one above the RoadRunner High Speed Cable sign had a stained-glass etching of St. Wil of Inman.

"Suppan: This is the one area that I might be able to see the argument. Suppan hasn't been that stabalizing arm many thought he would be."

I'm right there with ya, Tim.

When he was signed, I immediately posted that they overpaid for a hack with good postseason stats. Then, in May or so, I will grudgingly admit that I began to wonder whether SoupCan had indeed turned the corner. Maybe he wasn't that same rummy who was released by talent-starved KC and the Pirates anymore. But nowadays, when Sheets goes down for his annual injury, we really needed a vet SP like him to step up and show some professionalism, a winning mindset, all that intangible silly crap. But he hasn't, and that makes me question his signing. If he steps up in September and (fingers-crossed) in the playoffs, then he'll be much closer to earning that bloated salary of his. But right now? Meh.

[twobrewers]

I think Melvin deserves some blame - as many of his additions haven't panned out perfectly. But then whose does?

 

Suppan has been exactly what we expected. He is pitching very near his career average with a significantly worse defense behind him. He is leading the team in IP - and has protected us from overusing the young arms. There is absolutely nothing sexy about him. But if you are disappointed with him so far - you better have been disappointed when we signed him. .Because frankly, I believe he has lived up to his expectations.

 

Counsell might have cost too much - but Barnwell was AWFUL last year. Graffy was just a back fire that actually worked out pretty well. I miss Rillo and would love to see him back next year as a coach. (Move over Dale!) But Graffy is a better player.

 

I can't believe anyone is calling the Estrada/Vargas for Davis trade bad. Vargas and Davis is pretty much a wash. And while I HATE Estrada - he is a starting catcher. There are many worse starting for other teams in the league. Krynzel and Eveland were nobodies.

 

Brian Shouse was a stroke of genius.

 

Linebrink can't be evaluated until we see what becomes of Inman and the draft picks we receive for Linebrink. (If we resign him I don't like the trade)

 

I think one of Doug's worse moves might have actually been trading Overbay. Overbay was a fan favorite who was a doubles machine. If we could have found a position for him, he would look great batting 2nd for us. We got Bush (A solid starter - but nothing too special), Gross (At best a career platoon player) and Zach Jackson (I doubt he will ever make an MLB impact). I think that trade is pretty balanced for both teams.

[TooLiveBrew]

Honestly the only pitcher I'd have rather signed over Soup would be Gil Meche, who only got a tad more moola, but a 5th year on his deal. I suppose Lilly wouldn't be bad, either, but hindsight is always 20/20. Nearly every stat-head felt Lilly was a very, very risky signing at the money he'd get. Suppan is doing exactly what we signed him to do - pitch at appx. league average, and eat innings. Without him, given the injuries, I shudder to think what our other options would have done to this point.

 

Heading into the post-season (& 2008), we have available: Sheets, YoGa, Bush, Villy, Vargas, Cappy, Parra and Suppan as SP options (please, not intended to start a debate of who are the best choices). That's a wonderfully deep pool from which to choose, no matter how you slice it.

 

We're lucky to have a GM of Melvin's caliber, and although you can pick at his decisions, I think overall he's been a godsend to this organization.

[brettac1]

I think one of Doug's worse moves might have actually been trading Overbay. Overbay was a fan favorite who was a doubles machine. If we could have found a position for him, he would look great batting 2nd for us. We got Bush (A solid starter - but nothing too special), Gross (At best a career platoon player) and Zach Jackson (I doubt he will ever make an MLB impact). I think that trade is pretty balanced for both teams.

 

I would say that the value of an average starter like Bush is much higher than the value of an average 1B like Overbay. Guys like him are a dime a dozen, solid, pre-arby starters like Bush aren't. As an example - Suppan has a career ERA of 4.63, Bush is at 4.46. Suppan is making $6 million this season (according to his THT profile) and Bush is at $450,000. While it may seem that pitchers like Bush are everywhere, that isn't exactly the case. Who's the last Brewers pitcher developed by the Brewers to throw 200 IP in a season other than Sheets?

 

Just because they got him with his contract situation, that makes that a great trade for the Brewers. Add in that they got a solid player in Gross, and they won that trade by a wide margin. Overbay had a career year last year, and has been hurt this year on the way to his current .759 OPS. The fact that he was a fan favorite should have had zero bearing on whether Melvin traded him - especiallyt when doing so created an opening for the current fan favorite.

[pogokat]

linebrink sucks...i'm not gonna fire melvin forr this season, but he no longer gets a free pass from me...

 

even if you hate will inman, you gotta think he could be putting up the numbers linebrink has in the majors..

 

such a waste

[MoneyballMan]

I think sometimes some people here would rather just see the Brewers hold onto all their chips and never make any moves. It feels safer that way, I guess.

 

Not every move will pan out for a GM, but overall, Doug Melvin has a great track record with the Brewers. I think we're lucky to have him.

 

And on the other side (see the trade rumors forum), there are plenty in the "make a move, any move" crowd! But then complain when the move doesn't work out perfectly.

[MoneyballMan]

I think one of Doug's worse moves might have actually been trading Overbay. Overbay was a fan favorite who was a doubles machine. If we could have found a position for him, he would look great batting 2nd for us. We got Bush (A solid starter - but nothing too special), Gross (At best a career platoon player) and Zach Jackson (I doubt he will ever make an MLB impact). I think that trade is pretty balanced for both teams.

 

I would say that the value of an average starter like Bush is much higher than the value of an average 1B like Overbay. Guys like him are a dime a dozen, solid, pre-arby starters like Bush aren't. As an example - Suppan has a career ERA of 4.63, Bush is at 4.46. Suppan is making $6 million this season (according to his THT profile) and Bush is at $450,000. While it may seem that pitchers like Bush are everywhere, that isn't exactly the case. Who's the last Brewers pitcher developed by the Brewers to throw 200 IP in a season other than Sheets?

 

Just because they got him with his contract situation, that makes that a great trade for the Brewers. Add in that they got a solid player in Gross, and they won that trade by a wide margin. Overbay had a career year last year, and has been hurt this year on the way to his current .759 OPS. The fact that he was a fan favorite should have had zero bearing on whether Melvin traded him - especiallyt when doing so created an opening for the current fan favorite.

 

And in addition, where would we have gone with Prince had we not traded Overbay? I applaud DM for getting what he did for Overbay when teams knew he had to deal him to make room for Prince. My opinion is the deal has been outstanding and we haven't even benefited from Zack Jack yet (and may never, but there's still potentially more to gain from the deal).