Our rotation sucks right now

[dvoiss]

Since June 1st our starters ERA:

 

Suppan 6.13 (13 starts)

Sheets 2.82 (8)

Vargas 6.00 (10)

Cappy 6.03 (9)

Bush 4.35 (10)

Gallardo 5.05 (7)

 

As a staff the starters have a combined ERA of 5.18 and 3 of our 5 current starters (not counting Sheets) have ERAs over 6 for the last 2 1/2 months. Granted Yo was pitching well until today so his ERA is a little deceptive but this is ridiculous. That had better and change and soon. This was supposed to be one of the strong parts of this ream and now they have completely collapsed. The bullpen is starting to feel the effects of this and that is why we are seeing all those late comebacks. Even when the starters do piytch well the bullpen is so exhausted from overwork that they can't hold a lead. The starters need to pull it together and fast.

[trwi7]

Yeesh I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

[razzzorsharp]

Great------------------------>Good---------------------------->Average----------------------------------->Bad-------------------------->Brewers

 

Who is going to step up? I thought it would be Cappy, I really did, but it looks like I was wrong. Bush is inconsistent at best and Vargas and Soup are 5-6 innings 3-4 runs at best. I really don't see too muc hope for this rotation, and although people think Sheets is the light at the end of the tunnel, I would hate to get my hopes up and get them broken again.

[thablingster]

Yeesh I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

I'll take "things that make us cry" for 500.

 

[bullox]

I'm glad they are having this slump now, and not later on in the season. It's all about peaking late.

[razzzorsharp]

Maybe the peak was a ways back and now we are sledding down on the long slide towards .500

[packfan79]

And the games that the starters do pitch well the bullpen tanks. Hopefully this team wakes up sooner rather then later.

[TerraceReserved]

Gallardo 5.05 (7)

???
What I found is a 4.20 ERA, including todays start. I'm geussing you just used his ERA for starts, but that doesn't sound right to me either. It'd be unfair to say he's sucked becuase he's been stellar before his shellacking today. (2.55 ERA, 47K in 53IP)

Soup has been bad, but lately in his last 2 starts hes been very good. (12 IP 3 ER for a 2.25 ERA) Granted, thats an extremely small sample but it is a good sign.

Vargas: Yup he's sucked.

Bush: Since June 1 he does have a 4.35 ERA, which is alright, but add one more start on there and its 4.04, which is pretty good. So he's been solid for 2 months now.

Cappy: Well, he hasn't pitched too well

And Sheets has been great, and we can only hope for him to continue his success when he returns. But overall, I agree with you that the rotation as a whole needs to improve, but it's performed a little better than you made it out to be.

[TerraceReserved]

razzzorsharp wrote:

 

Bush is inconsistent at best and Vargas and Soup are 5-6 innings 3-4 runs at best.

3 of Soups last 5 starts were better than 5-6 innings 3-4 runs at best.

Those 3 starts:

 

6 IP 2 ER

6.1 IP 2 ER

5.2 IP 1 ER

 

His last 5 starts he has and ERA of 4.18. To just say at their best that's all the can do is pretty far off.

 

 

[logan82]

For the season...

 Innings Suppan Bush Sheets Vargas Capuano Gallardo
>6 7 (30%) 7 (35%) 8(42%) 2(10%) 5(26%) 4(25%)
6 7(30%) 6(30%) 7(37%) 8(40%) 3(16%) 2(25%)
<6 9(40%) 7(35%) 4(21%) 10(50%) 11(58%) 2(25%)
Total Starts 23 20 19 20 19 8 

Given the relativley low number of starts for Gallardo his percentages will fluctuate greatly. I didn't have time to look at 7+ innings starts which is where, in my opinion you seperate solid starters and aces. We have 3 starters who don't finish the 6th at least 40% of the time. Given that I guess it isn't surprising our bulpen is worn out. I guess I don't know how this compares to other pitching staffs. I would be kind of interested to know.

 

EDIT: I had everything all seperated and nice so it was readable. Somehow my spaces disappeared and now it is just a big mess of numbers.

 

 

(note: I pasted sgtcluels' cool work into this post. Thanks sarge! http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif --1992)

[brewcrew00]

I didn't know where to tuck this random stat, and I didn't want to start a new thread, but I was watching the Braves/Mets game on my lunch today and they were talking about Tim Hudson. The stat I'm about to list simply blew my mind...

 

When given a 3 run lead, Tim Hudson's record: 92-1. Yes, I know, I thought the same thing but it's true, 92-1

[sgtcluels]

 Innings Suppan Bush Sheets Vargas Capuano Gallardo
>6 7 (30%) 7 (35%) 8(42%) 2(10%) 5(26%) 4(25%)
6 7(30%) 6(30%) 7(37%) 8(40%) 3(16%) 2(25%)
<6 9(40%) 7(35%) 4(21%) 10(50%) 11(58%) 2(25%)
Total Starts 23 20 19 20 19 8

[HebrewHammer]

Yeah, our pitching has been surprisingly bad. No team in MLB pitches this bad. You have to figure it's a small trend that will regress towards the mean favorably for us. That is they've all been mostly bad lately so theoretically they should all come around and be pretty good sooner than later.

[JohnBriggs12]

And some still think Mike Maddux is a genius.

[brewcrew00]

Just as shocking is that some still think Capuano belongs.

[adambr2]

Just as shocking is that some still think Capuano belongs.

 

So why does Capuano not belong, but Suppan does? They have almost identical ERA's and WHIP's.

 

Capuano had more quality starts than almost almost any other pitcher in 2005 and 2006. It's not like Suppan has a better track record than Capuano, despite his age.

[brewcrew00]

My fault, I assumed it was determined that Soup had underperformed. I would have gladly listed him too http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[brewcrewkid14]

I know people are saying that Sheets is key to saving our bullpen, but I think Soup is just as key. When we were on the 24-10 stretch he was consistently going 7+ innings even if he did give up four or so runs in the process. If that Soup came back, we'd be in O.K. shape too.

 

Will he? I hope so.

[logan82]

4 of Suppan's 6+ inning starts were in April. Doesn't look to pronising. 200 innings spread out over 34 starts is under 6 innings a start.

[moofnelson]

When given a 3 run lead, Tim Hudson's record: 92-1. Yes, I know, I thought the same thing but it's true, 92-1

It's incredible when you think of how many three run leads we've lost in the last month and a half.

[MessiahRp]

I didn't know where to tuck this random stat, and I didn't want to start a new thread, but I was watching the Braves/Mets game on my lunch today and they were talking about Tim Hudson. The stat I'm about to list simply blew my mind...

 

When given a 3 run lead, Tim Hudson's record: 92-1. Yes, I know, I thought the same thing but it's true, 92-1

We need THAT guy. We're seriously going to have to address our rotation next year. I think Sheets and Yo are locks and Cappy probably has earned a second chance but we could use another front end starter for this rotation. I'd be willing to pay half of Soup's salary to dump him to the Pirates at this point if it freed up $5 million towards a good pitcher.

 

Rp

[TracyThom]

It's also important to remember that minus Yo, this is the same rotation we had in April and May too. Cappy has shown some signs that he is starting to come around. We need to hope that the rest of the rotation can return to their April/May form.

[JohnBriggs12]

"Cappy has shown some signs that he is starting to come around"

 

I must have missed those. He's okay for 4-5 innings (that's why he might be better off in the pen) then he gets hit and I mean hit hard. I was at his last home start against the Mets and there was nothing cheap about the rockets he was giving up, nor was anything the Rockies hit in the 6th inning cheap.

 

I got blasted before for suggesting Parra take his rotation spot, because his arm has to be babied. Well fine, start Parra 3-4 times in Capuano's spot then have Sheets take his spot in September. Capuano is getting far too much rope.

 

As for Suppan, at least you don't have to go back to mid-July to find one of his quality starts. And oh yeah, he's got about 35 more million to collect from the Brewers compared to around $1-2 million obligated to Capuano.

[Brian the Automator]

"Cappy has shown some signs that he is starting to come around"

 

I must have missed those. He's okay for 4-5 innings (that's why he might be better off in the pen) then he gets hit and I mean hit hard. I was at his last home start against the Mets and there was nothing cheap about the rockets he was giving up, nor was anything the Rockies hit in the 6th inning cheap.

To me, a good 4-5 innings are signs that he's starting to come around. 6-7 good innings would mean that he's came around.

 

[JohnBriggs12]

"he's starting to come around".

 

In mid-August? No Brian, he's turned into Glendon Rusch. If we're lucky, maybe he'll end up a Cub someday too.

 

His ability to go 4-5 means the thrid time through the order, the hitters have him figured out.