Prince's "It's poor for the fans to boo us" comment (merged with "Prince blasts fans")

[1992casey]

When Prince "runs his mouth", I never sense anger or whining or mean-spiritedness. His comments seem to be calm, collected, stated objectively, and are often the result of a reporter's question.

 

Had Prince been particularly upset about the fans, I don't think he'd have been handing out his bats yesterday. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[HOF4canrake]

Whether one thinks booing is good or bad, right or wrong...can someone explain to me how booing would be considered classless?

[pretendastronaut]

Running his mouth seems a bit harsh. That's pretty much reserved for trash talking players that you normally see more in the NFL and NBA. I can't believe people would actually get mad at the players because they don't like 40,000 people booing them. Fans sure are turning into a selfish lot.

[Paul77]

Most of the arguments in this thread have been about the act of booing - should you or shouldn't you, is it helpful / hurtful etc... I'm still waiting for someone to defend (or explain) his comments about Brewers fans not having the same "rights" as Yankee & Red Sox fans.

 

Put aside the (non) issue about fans having the right to boo. I would like to understand his thought process when he said that.

[lukevan]

Put aside the (non) issue about fans having the right to boo. I would like to understand his thought process when he said that.

 

The way I interpreted this was that you "expect" Yankee and Red Sox fans to boo since they always have, whereas Brewer fans haven't been known as a "booing" crowd. I don't think Prince really meant that he thinks Yankee fans "can" boo and Brewers fans "can't", just that the players expect it going in.

[1992casey]

Whether one thinks booing is good or bad, right or wrong...can someone explain to me how booing would be considered classless?

I think the general act of booing is more childish than classless. However, if people weren't allowed to get a bit juvenile once in a while, life wouldn't be much fun. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

 

Specifically, I believe booing becomes classless when it's done too often, when it's directed toward the wrong target, or when it occurs in the wrong situation.

[Paul77]

Put aside the (non) issue about fans having the right to boo. I would like to understand his thought process when he said that.

 

The way I interpreted this was that you "expect" Yankee and Red Sox fans to boo since they always have, whereas Brewer fans haven't been known as a "booing" crowd. I don't think Prince really meant that he thinks Yankee fans "can" boo and Brewers fans "can't", just that the players expect it going in.

I can't make that same interpretation. He's saying that Brewer fans can't tell the difference between good and bad baseball because we haven't seen enough of the former. Therefore we are unqualified to express displeasure with what we perceive to be poor play. He's also saying we should be content with simple being better than we used to be.

 

''They can do what they want because they paid for the tickets, but in my opinion, fans have to earn the right to boo,'' Fielder said. ''[With] the Yankees and Red Sox, they've had winning teams, so they sat through the bad times and the good times. Here (Milwaukee), they've never had too many good teams to earn the right to boo. We're the best team they've had in a while.'' - Prince Fielder

 

I'm not stating an opinion for or against booing, but if enduring 15 years of winless baseball isn't enough to "earn" the right to boo, what is?

[sweepscc]

Just a dumb thing to say. Kid needs to take some media classes if he's going to be the face of the Brewers as they try to EARN our respect and money in the upcoming years.

[1992casey]

I can't make that same interpretation. He's saying that Brewer fans can't tell the difference between good and bad baseball because we haven't seen enough of the former. Therefore we are unqualified to express displeasure with what we perceive to be poor play. He's also saying we should be content with simple being better than we used to be.

I can agree that Prince might be saying that we should be happy that we're seeing the best baseball we've had in a long time, but I don't think he's implying that Milwaukee fans don't know the difference between good and bad baseball.

However, I think there's a decent argument that Milwaukee fans are booing too often and booing at too many things.

[pretendastronaut]

I think it's a bit silly to be looking for someone to defend Prince's comment about the right to boo, the crux of the issue is the booing itself, not that quote. Is it a strange quote, yes, do I think its possible he probably he didn't choose the best way to illustrate a point, yes. The question isn't about a right or not anyway, of course you have the right to boo, but I have a lot of rights I don't choose to exercise just because I can.

I think the heart of Prince's comments was that we're very easy to lay into these guys when we've not had an opportunity like this in a long time and its not part of our historic makeup. You look at a fanbase like the Yankees and its an all or nothing approach, either we're the very best team out there every year, or its a waste. And before someone points it out, yes I realize every team's goal is to win a championship every year, but there's also a bit of reality in knowing your chances any given year. Its different with the Yanks, they have a legitimate chance at winning the series every single year, something most teams can not do for one reason or another. As such this culture has been instilled in their sometimes rabid fanbase, you know you're going into a hostile environment when you sign there. Losing is not an option there, yet here, we had our first taste in a long time, and instead of being excited that we're on the cusp, we demoralize our team for not coming through. I think its about appreciating what we have.

That's probably kind of mangled. I should have just agreed with 1992casey maybe, because I think in general this year we booed to often, to easily. For crying out loud I heard people booing Coco yesterday after he gave up 2 homers. We were still up 11-6 in the final inning of the year, and people are booing? Really?

I would just hate it if booing became such a part of our fan culture. It would be a real shame.

[homer]

One strange phenomena I've noticed this year is pre-emptive booing. People start booing before something really bad happens or when they think something really bad is about to happen. Like the time Linebrink walked a guy and gave up a hit or something, got booed, then got out of the inning. Kind of puzzling.

[adambr2]

I challenge Derrick Turnbow to find a stadium next season where he can go and, when he cannot throw a strike, and is walking hitter after hitter, in a crucial situation in a pennant race, and still not get booed. I imagine he'll be looking long and hard. I would like to see how Yankee and Red Sox fans react if Turnbow had done the exact same thing in the exact same situation there.

 

No, I am not saying booing does any good. It is a fact of sports, however. You fill a stadium with 40,000 people, some of them are going to react in that way to those situations. It is what it is. We may not like booing, but we can't control what 40,000 paid seatholders do. It's just not possible.

 

I am not trying to justify booing, but I am really tiring of the players harping on the booing at Miller Park as if we've just been atrocious fans. We've sold out many, many games this season. We showed up to the park in drones. We got into the games, cheered, and helped lead our team to the best home record in the NL.

 

All these comments make me not even want to make the effort to go the games anymore. Is it not enough that multiple times a year, I drive three hours, fight traffic, pay for overpriced parking and concessions, and a ticket, to help pay your salary by watching you play a game for 3 hours?

 

Get over yourselves, players. This whole feeling of superiority because "I'm a major league ballplayer" needs to end. You knew what came with the territory when you signed that contract.

 

Again, I'm not trying to justify booing, no, it does not do any good. But the constant complaining about it is getting ridiculous. Have heard from Turnbow now, heard from Prince a couple times, heard from Yost, guess what guys? It's not going to change, like it or not, and please stop pretending that the solution is to ask for a trade. If that's what you want, perhaps we should ship you off to Kansas City, Washington, or Florida, where no one will care if you are failing at your job.

[DougJones43]

Good post, adambr2. I agree with pretty much everything you said.

[Fatter than Joey]

Again, I'm not trying to justify booing, no, it does not do any good. But the constant complaining about it is getting ridiculous.

 

I agree -- The thing I have noticed is that there really seems to be an adversarial relationship nurturing between the Brewers and their fans.

 

It really bothers me that anytime Ned does anything that doesn't work, he comes back with some sort of comment about "armchair managers". It's going to be

very unpleasant in 2008 if the Brewers do not win a lot of ballgames out of the gate. Fans are going to assume that there will be a "second half collapse", and

if the Brewers don't head out of the gate sprinting, there will be a lot more booing.

 

The fans don't want to see Turnbow anywhere near a close game.

 

Anytime a fanbase grows substantially in a short amount of time, you are going to get more booing/fickle fans, but if you want their money, you have to deal with their reactions.

 

That said, I wish the fans didn't boo and diminish any sort of home field advantage we may have.

[Time for a Miller]

Fatter than Joey, that is an interesting point you made about a fan base growing a lot in a short amount of time. I think it's even more true with baseball since casual fans have better access to tickets and the team.

[biedergb]

I agree with all these points. Basically unless you are wining a lot, then the choices are have a lot fans at the games and some booing will ensue, or not have fans at the games. As adambr2 pointed out, ask the KC, DC, Pit or TB players. They'd probably love an occasional booing, becuase it means that fans are in the seats, and that they actually care about the outcome.

[TooLiveBrew]

Dear Prince Fielder & anyone else who asserts that our fans are horrible boo-birds:

 

I'm watching the now 8-3 NLDS game 2 in Philadelphia (Phillies trailing), and Brewers fans are nowhere near being poor fans. Trust me. These boos are borderline deafening, and make our fans' boos sound like whispers. Please be more realistic in assessing your fanbase - you've got a darn good one.

 

Sincerely,

 

TLB

[homer]

this thread has really run its course....several times over.

[TooLiveBrew]

it has?

[iluvlamp]

We showed up to the park in drones.

 

I call mine Herschel.

[jazzytrav]

I caught myself booing once this year. It was a Friday night late in the season against the Reds. Braun fielded a grounder, and since the shift was on, Dillon (2b) was out of position. Braun's throw didn't even come close, and the ball traveled into RF...where Gross picked it up and decided he would throw it, well, somewhere. When it's stupid play like that, players should almost understand that they're going to get booed. They're salary is at least 10 times more than mine, and I'm using part of that salary to see them. I don't think that players realize that dealing with the media and fans in a respectful manner is part of the reason they're paid as much as they are.

 

As far as booing individual players, I think fans need to understand something. Let's use Turnbow as an example:

Derrick Turnbow is a mentally fragile pitcher with a high 90's fastball and a nasty slider. WHY WOULD YOU BOO HIM?! To me it's just common sense that this is the kind of guy that, if he goes out and blows a game, he should have 40,000 people patting him on the back saying "tough game, get 'em next time". I would do anything to help Turnbow get his confidence back up to what it was in '05. I doubt if booing will do the job.

 

Does he deserve to be booed? That's anyone's call. You paid for your ticket, you make the choice. But if the Brewers are your team and you want them to win, wouldn't it make more sense to support him instead?

[logan82]

Would you boo your kid if s/he wet their bed? I believe that is how we have to treat Turnbow. Like an insecure child who wet his bed.

[adambr2]

Would you boo your kid if s/he wet their bed? I believe that is how we have to treat Turnbow. Like an insecure child who wet his bed.

 

I would hope that we can be assured that Turnbow is a little more of a man than a 5 year old bedwetting child, although he may not have a stronger mental psyche than one.

[logan82]

I would hope that we can be assured that Turnbow is a little more of a man than a 5 year old bedwetting child, although he may not have a stronger mental psyche than one.

I am sure he is, but some people need to be treated with a little more sensitivty than others. That was an extreme I was pointing out. A little to extreme I guess.

[jazzytrav]

I think the point is that the embarrassment of a 5 year old wetting the bed and having a brother or sister make fun of you for it would be roughly (and i mean VERY roughly) equivalent to a grown man failing in front of 40,000 people. You may even pick up a nickname from the sibling to remind you, much the same way that many people have starting using the name Turn"blow" to remind him of his failures.

 

All I'm trying to say is that all players are at a different level when it comes to how much grief the can take from fans/coaches/other players. Turnbow, while being an extremely gifted player, has a weak mental psyche. Based on that, maybe being a closer or setup man isn't what's best for him. Theoretically, we as fans can contribute to our players mental state by knowing what will drive a player forward and what will drive him backward. If a player thrives on proving the media and fans wrong, get under his skin and watch him thrive. But if it's Derrick Turnbow and we all know that he'll crash and burn if his confidence level drops, then maybe it would be best to support him more than rip him apart.

 

No matter how little our contribution is, it could only be the difference in 1 or 2 wins...which would have meant quite a lot this year.

Keep in mind I'm speaking theoretically. I'm not saying this is what I do or what I think all of you should do. It's more of a common sense managerial thing where you work to the employee's strengths and away from their weaknesses. Sooner or later those weaknesses become less of a weakness.