Mark Rogers' Surgery

[DHonks]

JSONLINE link

[colbyjack]

I'm sure the negative responses will pile up on this one, but I just wanted to point out that arthoscopic surgery is about as minor as it gets. Going into a young man's arm no matter where or how is never a good thing, but relatively speaking it's a lot better than what it could be.

 

I sure don't like this quote though:

 

As for whether attempts to change Rogers' delivery led to his shoulder problems, Ash said, "I think some of it is related to that. I don't think he's capable of completely changing his mechanics."

 

These are exactly the types of things you see as a scout, write them down in red, and move on.

[DHonks]

Colby, I was interpreting that as perhaps the injury was the fault of the changes. Kind of like when I speculated that perhaps Peterson's injury was because they changed his mechanics rather than letting him go with what worked. Speaking of Peterson, he should be our new play by play guy

[lovehate]

'lube job' huh, what a cute way of looking at it... so lame

[Nader Raider Tim]

Correct me if I am wrong, because I am not positive that I am correct. When Rogers was drafted though wasn't one of the positives about him was people thought that he wouldn't have arm troubles. I seem to remeber reading an article that refered to his arm as indestructable.

[bucksman4]

Yeah, just like they said Prior's smooth delivery would prevent injury concerns....http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[pogokat]

yup...rogers and jones were both known for smooth deliveries...

 

this definitely sets mark back, but he's a great guy and a huge talent, so i'll be rooting for him...

 

manny parra's come back more than once now, and chris capuano survived tommoy john before he broke, so never say never..

[bjkrautk]

Hooray for drafting high school pitching in the first round!

 

For the record, as much as I harp on what I feel to be bad a bad investment (the injury rates make the ROI for high school pitchers low with a first round pick and the guaranteed upfront money), once the pick was made...he's our guy and I'm rooting for him to recover.

[deeswan]

Obviously this is not good news, hopefully it's as minor as Ash makes it out to be, but I'm not optimistic that way.

 

Anyway, I'm trying to come up with some names of pitchers the Brewers drafted and turned out to be pretty good. There just doesn't seem to be many. Sheets recently, of course. Anybody want to come up with a list?

[bork]

Anyway, I'm trying to come up with some names of pitchers the Brewers drafted and turned out to be pretty good.

 

I don't know about being pretty good, but guys who at least pitched a while for the Brewers: Wegman, Plesac, Henry, Eldred, Karl, D'Amico, Woodard, Sheets.

 

Will Jefress make it to AA before needing surgery or will it happen before than?

[deeswan]

Bork, of that list I guess Wegman, Eldred, and Plesac are the only ones that would qualify as being good. The others either were not any good or could not stay healthy. So, as it stands right now. I'm seeing 4 good or better pitchers they've developed for their own team in the last 15 years. Man, is that terrible.

[colbyjack]

Colby, I was interpreting that as perhaps the injury was the fault of the changes. Kind of like when I speculated that perhaps Peterson's injury was because they changed his mechanics rather than letting him go with what worked.

 

Thanks DHonks, but I still don't like the fact that they knew Rogers threw across his body somewhat and still took him knowing the incredible investment they would be putting into him.

 

yup...rogers and jones were both known for smooth deliveries...

 

Just so you know, there is a difference between a smooth delivery and throwing across your body (improper mechanics). Jones delivery and mechanics were believed to be picture perfect, but after a while we heard reports that he had difficulty maintaining/repeating his delivery.

 

There were reports of Rogers throwing across his body before the Brewers selected him, and you could see that from his scouting video on MLB.com and from his performance at the Aflac All-American Classic the previous summer (he fell off the mound to the first base side pretty drastically).

 

However, his arm action still worked well, evidenced by his easy upper-90s velocity.

 

For the record, as much as I harp on what I feel to be bad a bad investment (the injury rates make the ROI for high school pitchers low with a first round pick and the guaranteed upfront money), once the pick was made...he's our guy and I'm rooting for him to recover.

 

Agreed. As much as I have criticized the pick, from when it was made to today, I definitely wish Mark the best on his way back. As I noted earlier in this thread, at least it is only arthoscopic surgery, so hopefully it won't take as long for him to work his way back.

 

Anyway, I'm trying to come up with some names of pitchers the Brewers drafted and turned out to be pretty good. There just doesn't seem to be many. Sheets recently, of course. Anybody want to come up with a list?

 

bork already came up with a good list of names, but recently the Brewers have had a hard time developing pitchers. Dana Eveland has already been shipped out, while Ben Hendrickson and Dennis Sarfate are probably the closest to contributing at the big-league level, although I don't think many are counting on Hendrickson for much of anything.

 

Parra, Gallardo, Hammond, Dillard and a few others hopefully aren't that far away. Of the 40-man roster, only 5 of the 17 pitchers were originally drafted by the Brewers. I don't know how that stands vs. other teams in baseball, but only one of those pitchers, Sheets, has been counted on in recent years.

 

Regardless, I think the Brewers really need to look at this and learn from their mistakes. Jones could be mistake #1, and Rogers could be mistake #2. Hopefully they both bounce back, but it's difficult to count on that. And hopefully Jeffress avoids injury altogether.

 

In the meantime, I'm still in the corner for more polished, college pitchers.

[bork]

Bork, of that list I guess Wegman, Eldred, and Plesac are the only ones that would qualify as being good.

 

Eldred and Wegman also had some injury issues as well.

 

I forgot about Bosio and Navarro.

 

That 1992 starting rotation was 80% home grown with Bosio, Navarro, Wegman, and Eldred.

[RyDogg66]

Say hello to Nick Neugebauer's career Mark.

[AJ Love]

/hindsight of course being 20/20, we sure shoulda picked Homer Bailey!

 

I'm not thrilled with the statement that changing Rogers' mechanics might have contributed to his injury... here's hoping for a strong recovery

[deeswan]

So, over the last 15+ years we have Bosio (pretty good until hurting his knee after leaving Milwaukee), Wegman (average to slightly above), Plesac (awesome closer for a short stretch, after which he became a solid set-up guy), Eldred (incredible rookie season, followed by not ever living up to hype), Navarro (couple pretty good season followed by being terrible), Sheets (awesome if he can get over the injury bug of the last couple of years). That's pretty much it other than one terrific year by D'Amico. No idea how that stacks up against other teams, but Milwaukee has to be close to the bottom at bringing successful pitchers up through their system since 1990.

[Katuluu]

I'm fairly certain the Twins have only brought up Radke in the past 15 years who would be considered average or above as a starting pitcher. For all the acclaim they get for their pitching, nearly all of it comes from other organizations.

[thumperden]

Don't forget J.M. Gold too.

[Mass Haas]

Link while active, text follows:

 

sports.mainetoday.com/pro...ogers.html

 

Stiff shoulder, so Rogers thinks about surgery

By PAUL BETIT, MaineToday.com Staff Writer

 

Mark Rogers, who was the Milwaukee Brewers' first-round draft pick out of Mt. Ararat High two years ago, is contemplating undergoing arthroscopic surgery to see if anything can be done to relieve the stiffness in his throwing shoulder.

 

"It's not major surgery," Rogers said Wednesday night.

 

A 20-year-old right-hander from Orr's Island who recently completed his third pro season, Rogers is scheduled to see a specialist in Texas next week to seek a second opinion on whether his condition warrants the arthroscopic surgery.

 

"At this point I can't really make a comment beyond that," Rogers said.

 

Last July, Rogers returned to the Brewers' training complex in Maryvale, Ariz., after his throwing shoulder stiffened while he was pitching for the Brevard County Manatees in the Class A Florida State League.

 

"I'm in a situation now where I have discomfort when I throw," said Rogers, who now lives in Tempe, Ariz., during the offseason.

 

"I think it's due to all the changes in my mechanics."

 

In 2004, Rogers signed for $2.2 million after the Brewers made him the fifth pick in the draft following his senior year at Mt. Ararat High in Topsham.

 

Last March, Rogers was ranked 44th on Baseball America's list of top prospects.

 

"In my book he's had a minor setback," said Jim Rooney, Milwaukee's coordinator of minor-league pitching.

 

"He had a little stiffness in Florida and we brought him (to Arizona) so he could get one-on-one treatment from his physical therapist."

 

Rooney said Rogers has been participating in the Brewers' winter throwing program.

 

"He threw on Monday and he said he didn't feel as good as he did last week," Rooney said.

 

Rooney said Rogers has "hypermobility" in his right shoulder.

 

"Because of his size and the violence of his delivery, he has loose shoulders," Rooney said.

 

"Things move around in there."

 

According to Rooney, at least two other pitchers in the Milwaukee organization suffered similar conditions this past season.

 

"Some guys pitch their entire careers with a loose shoulder, and other guys want to do something about it," Rooney said. "If there is surgery in Mark's future, it is up to Mark and his doctors."

[deeswan]

Because of his size and the violence of his delivery, he has loose shoulders," Rooney said.

 

The words "capsular shift" come to mind. I know D'Amico had one, anyone know of any other Brewer pitchers who did?

[DHonks]

I think Ben McDonald did about 2 years after he was out of the organization. And did Neugy?

 

capsular shift, or capsular tightening is the term, I think. If I remember correctly, Orel Hershiser and D'Amico were the first two to ever return from the surgery.

[aracko]

Why are they first noticing this now......?

[deeswan]

Why are they first noticing this now......?

 

It's not likely they are. The standard operating procedure is to use a pitcher's shoulder/arm workouts to try to tighten things up. I would guess this generally works, as there are not many capsular shifts that are performed.

[DHonks]

aracko, this is an example where us fans don't fully understand things. Remember, this is a player whose arm is his ticket to big things. He trusts his arm, and trusts it'll get better with rest and rehab. The last option is to have surgery on that golden arm, as some guys just never come back from them. We always wonder why guys "just don't get it taken care of." well, it's because we're not the ones needing the surgery.

[pogokat]

rogers had some trouble with blisters in 2005...its possible he tweaked his delivery to overcome the hand stuff as well...theres a million different ways to screw up a shoulder....im willing to be that 90% of pitchers experience regular discomfort, but it only hinders some guys performance..

 

rogers, apparently is having a hard time throwing strikes..