Corbin Burnes Contract Talks (or lack thereof)

[Axman59]

On 9/17/2022 at 11:09 PM, Jopal78 said:

Playoffs six times in the last ten years;   11 times in the last 22 seasons while never spending more than 90 million in payroll.

Come on, don’t be obtuse. 

Zero World Series wins.

 

The goal is to assemble a World Series winning team.

[Grabkoj]

Burnes would demand a $30 million a year contract 

I would see Brewers extending Woodruff for 3-4 years before Corbin.

Burnes would get a great return for a power hitting infielder, another pitcher, and prospects.

I would try to trade him to teams like the Mariners or Yankees. 
 

Seattle has the depth to part with guys like Ty France and has the young pitching depth and farm system. 
 

To me, they’d be the perfect trade partner. 

[Samurai Bucky]

On 9/21/2022 at 10:05 AM, clancyphile said:

Given the present realities of baseball's economic system, the Brewers will have to take risks to keep elite-level talent of one sort or another.

However when they take a risk on a player who wins an MVP and was close to winning another one before getting injured, then the Brewers will get ridiculed for how stupid it was to give that player a long-termed contract.

We can't rip management for a poor decision on Yelich and in the same breath say that we have to take risks with Burnes.  The memories of Matt Garza and Jeff Suppan still resonate in the bowels of Mill... I mean American Family Field.

[Hopper]

6 hours ago, Samurai Bucky said:

However when they take a risk on a player who wins an MVP and was close to winning another one before getting injured, then the Brewers will get ridiculed for how stupid it was to give that player a long-termed contract.

We can't rip management for a poor decision on Yelich and in the same breath say that we have to take risks with Burnes.  The memories of Matt Garza and Jeff Suppan still resonate in the bowels of Mill... I mean American Family Field.

The difference is, Yelich was given his BIG DEAL after a knee injury ended his season.  That contract was given before anyone knew if he would be the same player.  In his case, he hasn't been the same player, which is why that contract SHOULD be ridiculed.  Why didn't they just wait until he had some games under his belt the following season to make that call?

[Brock Beauchamp]

5 hours ago, Hopper said:

The difference is, Yelich was given his BIG DEAL after a knee injury ended his season.  That contract was given before anyone knew if he would be the same player.  In his case, he hasn't been the same player, which is why that contract SHOULD be ridiculed.  Why didn't they just wait until he had some games under his belt the following season to make that call?

Because he would have priced himself out of Milwaukee otherwise. They rolled the dice and lost. It happens. 

[UpandIn]

On 9/30/2022 at 10:03 AM, Samurai Bucky said:

However when they take a risk on a player who wins an MVP and was close to winning another one before getting injured, then the Brewers will get ridiculed for how stupid it was to give that player a long-termed contract.

We can't rip management for a poor decision on Yelich and in the same breath say that we have to take risks with Burnes.  The memories of Matt Garza and Jeff Suppan still resonate in the bowels of Mill... I mean American Family Field.

Well...in the context of this thread, you'd be talking about buying out his 3 arbitration years and then hopefully 2 FA years. That's a fraction of the commitment you made to Yelich. You're committing 2 more years to Burnes, you're committing 9 more years to Yelich. 

I also wouldn't personally ridicule the contract to Yelich(in fact, you got a very team friendly deal at the time). It was the right decision at the time...it's hard to foresee a guy going from THAT level to the level he's since played at. 

Quote

Because he would have priced himself out of Milwaukee otherwise. They rolled the dice and lost. It happens. 

Right, it was a calculated risk. And I still don't believe the kneecap is the cause for his decline for a litany of reasons I've mentioned in the past based on his exit velocity, FB ratio...etc...

I think it was the back problems starting up again in 2021 after a bit of a fluke 2020 covid season. Moot point now,

[Robocaller]

On 9/23/2022 at 12:00 AM, Axman59 said:

Zero World Series wins.

 

The goal is to assemble a World Series winning team.

Bites of the apple.

 

[Robocaller]

7 hours ago, Hopper said:

The difference is, Yelich was given his BIG DEAL after a knee injury ended his season.  That contract was given before anyone knew if he would be the same player.  In his case, he hasn't been the same player, which is why that contract SHOULD be ridiculed.  Why didn't they just wait until he had some games under his belt the following season to make that call?

Except that it's not that injury that seems to be limiting him. 

[Hopper]

10 hours ago, Robocaller said:

Except that it's not that injury that seems to be limiting him. 

Maybe not, but coincidentally, he has not been the same player since.

His knee may or may not have been an issue in 2020.  You'd think by this time, that should not be a concern.

[MrTPlush]

On 9/23/2022 at 12:00 AM, Axman59 said:

Zero World Series wins.

 

The goal is to assemble a World Series winning team.

Maybe to fans…to the owners, I mean…kinda debatable. I don’t think being consistently competitive has everything to do with winning a World Series. Being a fringe WC team is probably more valuable to the Brewers even if it means no WS appearance ever. 
 

World Series are great, but high payrolls, expensive contracts usually go with that..,and World Series hangover excitement/interest dies fast…especially if you tank into a crap team.

[rickh150]

4 hours ago, MrTPlush said:

Maybe to fans…to the owners, I mean…kinda debatable. I don’t think being consistently competitive has everything to do with winning a World Series. Being a fringe WC team is probably more valuable to the Brewers even if it means no WS appearance ever. 
 

World Series are great, but high payrolls, expensive contracts usually go with that..,and World Series hangover excitement/interest dies fast…especially if you tank into a crap team.

What the Brewers are doing (4 or five straight playoffs, 2 division championships) with less payroll is an outlier in baseball. It’s rare and should be celebrated, even without a WS appearance.
 

That being said, I don’t think we can continue this much longer. I would be fine with the team saying our window is through 2024 and add on, knowing 2025 and 2026 are going to be a full blown rebuild. Having two aces AND pretty good secondary pitching pieces makes it tough to take steps back the next two years, just trade for prospects, and hope we can get back to what we are now with pitching. 

[MrTPlush]

50 minutes ago, rickh150 said:

What the Brewers are doing (4 or five straight playoffs, 2 division championships) with less payroll is an outlier in baseball. It’s rare and should be celebrated, even without a WS appearance.
 

That being said, I don’t think we can continue this much longer. I would be fine with the team saying our window is through 2024 and add on, knowing 2025 and 2026 are going to be a full blown rebuild. Having two aces AND pretty good secondary pitching pieces makes it tough to take steps back the next two years, just trade for prospects, and hope we can get back to what we are now with pitching. 

I am not insulting it by any means. But to say teams are trying to win a World Series is somewhat generous in a lot of cases. They want to, but I don’t know if it really is priority one or even two. If it was Hader would still be here and Burnes/Woodruff etc. would stay and we would sell off most of the blue chip prospects. Profits are important and I think being a borderline contender is the best things as long as you make the playoffs many of those years. Casual fan likes that.

I don’t think they will see much of a rebuild if they do it strategically. But it is hard to predict how these prospects will do and how much we try to win in 23 or (likely not) 24.

[BigWoo53]

If the Brewers do things right it won't be that much of a rebuild. Burnes/Woodruff dealt and should get back a huge return for Burnes with prospects who should be close to timeline of 2024 with Chourio and these young prospects. The Brewers have power guys and the guys coming up Turang/Frelick are nice hit-tool average guys projected. Sign a FA or two. If you can get a couple young arms and a 3B prospect and elite top prospect in Burnes deal and many solid pieces the Brewers could quickly contend again. 

One case can be made for the Brewers to go for it next year. NL Central will be down and if you have Burnes/Woodruff the Brewers should be able to be in the race for sure again if healthy. Sign a Jose Abreu to DH and be in the middle of the lineup on a short deal and deal Burnes after the year or even if you trade him for a solid 3B prospect and young arms. The Rangers have a good young 3B Jung and good pitching prospects. Could be a match. 

[Brock Beauchamp]

1 hour ago, BigWoo53 said:

If the Brewers do things right it won't be that much of a rebuild. Burnes/Woodruff dealt and should get back a huge return for Burnes with prospects who should be close to timeline of 2024 with Chourio and these young prospects. The Brewers have power guys and the guys coming up Turang/Frelick are nice hit-tool average guys projected. Sign a FA or two. If you can get a couple young arms and a 3B prospect and elite top prospect in Burnes deal and many solid pieces the Brewers could quickly contend again. 

One case can be made for the Brewers to go for it next year. NL Central will be down and if you have Burnes/Woodruff the Brewers should be able to be in the race for sure again if healthy. Sign a Jose Abreu to DH and be in the middle of the lineup on a short deal and deal Burnes after the year or even if you trade him for a solid 3B prospect and young arms. The Rangers have a good young 3B Jung and good pitching prospects. Could be a match. 

Welcome to the site!

[Robocaller]

On 9/23/2022 at 12:00 AM, Axman59 said:

Zero World Series wins.

 

The goal is to assemble a World Series winning team.

You mean like the Dodgers did this year?

Having the best team is no guarantee. Considering our budgetary limitations, the "bite of the apple" approach seems wise.

 

[MrTPlush]

20 hours ago, Robocaller said:

You mean like the Dodgers did this year?

Having the best team is no guarantee. Considering our budgetary limitations, the "bite of the apple" approach seems wise.

 

Helps if Stearns doesn’t throw away the apple at the deadline though.

[UpandIn]

10 hours ago, BigWoo53 said:

If the Brewers do things right it won't be that much of a rebuild. Burnes/Woodruff dealt and should get back a huge return for Burnes with prospects who should be close to timeline of 2024 with Chourio and these young prospects. The Brewers have power guys and the guys coming up Turang/Frelick are nice hit-tool average guys projected. Sign a FA or two. If you can get a couple young arms and a 3B prospect and elite top prospect in Burnes deal and many solid pieces the Brewers could quickly contend again. 

One case can be made for the Brewers to go for it next year. NL Central will be down and if you have Burnes/Woodruff the Brewers should be able to be in the race for sure again if healthy. Sign a Jose Abreu to DH and be in the middle of the lineup on a short deal and deal Burnes after the year or even if you trade him for a solid 3B prospect and young arms. The Rangers have a good young 3B Jung and good pitching prospects. Could be a match. 

Yeah, that's fair. Wait to trade Burnes and the prospects you get are likely going to be diminished, but you should still be looking at a couple of top 100. 
Same for Willy and Woody. 

I still believe they'll push hard to re-sign one of the arms, but as long as they can keep their pitching development group around...even if Stearns leaves, they should be set up just fine. 

We may look at the prospect lists by the end of next year and see two top 50 pitching prospects(Gasser and Misiorowski wouldn't shock me if he moved up quickly) or if Ashby has established himself as a 3-4 WAR starting pitcher. The talent is certainly there. Or we may need to find them, but we've got the core in place in both the farm system and very valuable assets on the big league club. 

We should not go through any prolonged rebuild, but we've also been spoiled with Burnes and Woodruff.

 

 

 

That said, Burnes

[MadThinker88]

The situation of Burnes with MKE is very similar to the situation with Beiber in CLE.

It will be interesting to watch what happens with either situation as it could influence the outcome of how the other situation..

[brewmann04]

I have said in the past that the Brewers will need to decide on either one and must trade the other however not trusting Stearns at adding the best prospects in return