Sal Frelick.......

[folly412]

I don't see it as unreasonable to think that Frelick could come up and exceed the .274 OBP Taylor is giving, or provide a threat to reach second base that Davis doesn't bring.  He has hit immediately (or close enough to it) at every level.  The downside risk is minimal, given the output there is limited to Taylor running into one once every couple of weeks.  

Contrast with Turang, who has taken some time to get going at every level.  Understandable, given he's been young for every level.  They may be preparing him for a call-up (given the starts at 2B and 3B), but expecting offense is a mistake.  He's best suited to be on the opening day roster next year with patience through any early struggles.  Unless Peterson is lost for the season, I'd wait on Turang.

[YelichPosse]

I’ve seen enough of Taylor, #FreeFrelick and let’s go this team needs a spark 

[wibadgers23]

My guess is Frelick makes his debut a week from tonight against the Cubs.

[Jim French Stepstool]

Just an FYI......Frelick must be cooling off. After the 4-hit game, it took him a full two games in Fridays' doubleheader to collect 4 hits. Four-for-seven day leaves him at a slowpitch softball-like .456.

[edfunderburk]

12 hours ago, Jim French Stepstool said:

Just an FYI......Frelick must be cooling off. After the 4-hit game, it took him a full two games in Fridays' doubleheader to collect 4 hits. Four-for-seven day leaves him at a slowpitch softball-like .456.

I guess Brewers management will wait for him to come back to earth before they consider promoting him to the big league roster … let him cool off to be more similar to the current Brewers hitters

[Austin Tatious]

Garrett Mitchell and Brice Turang are also doing really well.  If it weren’t for Frelick we’d be clamoring for Mitch in center.   I saw in the box score that they had Brice at 3B.  He doesn’t really fit that profile but it’s a major weakness so I get why they are sensitizing him to the position.   I wonder if they’re calculating service time ramifications.  I don’t know what makes sense in that regard but we may get an influx of these guys.  The rosters go to 28 soon.

Mejia seems to be doing well in the pen as he’s apparently sporting a 0.66 ERA.

[markedman5]

24 minutes ago, Austin Tatious said:

Garrett Mitchell and Brice Turang are also doing really well.  If it weren’t for Frelick we’d be clamoring for Mitch in center.   I saw in the box score that they had Brice at 3B.  He doesn’t really fit that profile but it’s a major weakness so I get why they are sensitizing him to the position.   I wonder if they’re calculating service time ramifications.  I don’t know what makes sense in that regard but we may get an influx of these guys.  The rosters go to 28 soon.

Mejia seems to be doing well in the pen as he’s apparently sporting a 0.66 ERA.

 

[wibadgers23]

54 minutes ago, Austin Tatious said:

Garrett Mitchell and Brice Turang are also doing really well.  If it weren’t for Frelick we’d be clamoring for Mitch in center.   I saw in the box score that they had Brice at 3B.  He doesn’t really fit that profile but it’s a major weakness so I get why they are sensitizing him to the position.   I wonder if they’re calculating service time ramifications.  I don’t know what makes sense in that regard but we may get an influx of these guys.  The rosters go to 28 soon.

Mejia seems to be doing well in the pen as he’s apparently sporting a 0.66 ERA.

I agree on Mitchell. Frelick gets all the hype (and rightfully so) but Mitchell is also putting up some very nice numbers in Nashville. It’s all about staying healthy for him.

[Jim French Stepstool]

1 hour ago, edfunderburk said:

I guess Brewers management will wait for him to come back to earth before they consider promoting him to the big league roster … let him cool off to be more similar to the current Brewers hitters

It was explained why they're (supposedly) waiting until the 23rd. I think it's a dumb rule, tying something like that into a draft pick, but under the circumstances I get it.

[Oxy]

On 8/19/2022 at 8:43 AM, monty57 said:

RE: the "service time" conversation going on.

Every day in the majors counts as a day of service time, but at this point it doesn't really matter because there aren't enough days left to count as a full year of service time for Frelick. The Brewers will still have him for six seasons of "team control" whether they bring him up today or next week.

For every day he spends in the majors this year, The Brewers will have to keep him in the minors NEXT year an equal amount of days PLUS an additional 2 weeks in order to "gain" another year of service time. 172 days on the active roster is one "year" of service time, and there are about 186 or so calendar days in a baseball season.  If he comes up September 1st, he will get something like 35 days of service time.  So if he has 136 days of service time NEXT year (basically keeping him in the minors for the first 50 days of the season (186-136)) his total service time at the end of next year would equal 171 days, just less than 1 year of service time, thus The Brewers would STILL control him for SIX additional full years.

So yes, every day the Brewers wait to bring him up make it easier to "gain" another year of control.

[Jim French Stepstool]

1 hour ago, Austin Tatious said:

Garrett Mitchell and Brice Turang are also doing really well.  If it weren’t for Frelick we’d be clamoring for Mitch in center.   I saw in the box score that they had Brice at 3B.  He doesn’t really fit that profile but it’s a major weakness so I get why they are sensitizing him to the position.   I wonder if they’re calculating service time ramifications.  I don’t know what makes sense in that regard but we may get an influx of these guys.  The rosters go to 28 soon.

Mejia seems to be doing well in the pen as he’s apparently sporting a 0.66 ERA.

I agree Turang doesn't fit the profile of a 3B, but that bothers me less & less as the seasons go by. We have a guy who's on a pace to hit maybe 30 HR, hitting around .220 w/a ton of K's & struggling to get his OBP anywhere near .300--and he's playing SS. They value versatility so I'm a little surprised Turang hasn't played 3B or 2B this year before now.

Mitchell definitely deserves props. To be dormant much of the season then take off like he has in his 1st taste of AAA is fantastic.

[yourout]

It's time to give someone else a look. I like Taylor but he is nothing more than a fourth outfielder.

[RedStickBrew]

1 hour ago, Jim French Stepstool said:

I agree Turang doesn't fit the profile of a 3B, but that bothers me less & less as the seasons go by. We have a guy who's on a pace to hit maybe 30 HR, hitting around .220 w/a ton of K's & struggling to get his OBP anywhere near .300--and he's playing SS. They value versatility so I'm a little surprised Turang hasn't played 3B or 2B this year before now.

Mitchell definitely deserves props. To be dormant much of the season then take off like he has in his 1st taste of AAA is fantastic.

Turang has really turned the power on of late. He's slugging .550 with a handful of HRs and his OPS is in the .950s over the last month.

Mitchell was dealing with some injuries earlier this year which may have accounted for some of that dormancy. Really nice to see his productivity take off in Nashville- he is the best defender of the 4 AAA outfielders too IMO.

[Jim French Stepstool]

5 hours ago, RedStickBrew said:

Turang has really turned the power on of late. He's slugging .550 with a handful of HRs and his OPS is in the .950s over the last month.

Mitchell was dealing with some injuries earlier this year which may have accounted for some of that dormancy. Really nice to see his productivity take off in Nashville- he is the best defender of the 4 AAA outfielders too IMO.

I should've been more specific. I was actually referring to the injury issues when I said dormant. If he can keep those behind him He'll surprise a lot of people. Wiemer is flying under the radar now too, just recovering from sort of (I think) hand issue. The thing about both those guys, they don't physically profile as base stealers but steal they do, and at a very high success rate. Just solid all-around. Hard not to get intrigued.

[RedStickBrew]

38 minutes ago, Jim French Stepstool said:

I should've been more specific. I was actually referring to the injury issues when I said dormant. If he can keep those behind him He'll surprise a lot of people. Wiemer is flying under the radar now too, just recovering from sort of (I think) hand issue. The thing about both those guys, they don't physically profile as base stealers but steal they do, and at a very high success rate. Just solid all-around. Hard not to get intrigued.

Wiemer's OPS is around .640 over the last month.  He shows some flashes here and there at the plate but just hasn't got going yet at AAA. He has had a nagging hand injury that I suspect is hampering him.  Hopefully he can play through it this season and get healthy in the offseason. Both he and Mitchell are superb athletes who all out hustle on the field and are both a joy to watch play. Can't wait to see them in MKE.

[brewcrewdue80]

On 8/19/2022 at 12:34 AM, Brock Beauchamp said:

Honestly, just lulz.

Buxton was literally the number one prospect in baseball.

And he failed. Miserably.

And if you want a more recent example, let me introduce you to this man.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=torkel000spe

Cool cool. Orlando Arcia was top 10 in prospect rankings hows that worked for him?

Maybe you don't really understand prospect rankings and that ladder hierarchy. Why would Arcia ever be top 10 prospect with the bat he brought?  Oh yeah his skilled defense carried him there. If that offense production improved at his age at the time you're staring at 9-12years of producing good numbers with defense.  Buxton drafted #2 already was slotted top 25 prospect before he'd played 1month professionally. Same can be said on your Torkelson. Its not what these players do in their first 100games, but what they could be over the next 6+years.

Randy Arozarena is the possibility at the plate as is your examples.  I understand both directions. If Frelick was the Arozarena type at CF though, he could boost the teammates around him. Team needs a hot batter vs the dull weekly outputs were 1 or 2 batters swap having good days followed with disappearing for 4-6days.  People talk about just getting in to post-seasonand if you're hott then maybe you run the tables.

As it stands we're on the outside looking in for playoffs.  Trotting out the same cast of batters with this season's sample size isn't likely to suddenly be a sparkplug to a better team batting performance. Frelick or Ruiz are the unknown that can flip a switch should they succeed. If they didn't, what did you lose? Adames had this team batting better after he joined, and that is who I'd think could benefit from a that potential. Urias-Narvaez too. 

[Robocaller]

On 8/18/2022 at 10:18 PM, Brock Beauchamp said:

I mean, maybe. But how often does a hitter have a wildly exposed weakness that is only exploited at the major league level?

Answer: often.

I can't even rattle off the list of players who were "can't miss" top five prospects who just bombed out for an extended time in MLB.

Here's a great example and he plays CF at an other-wordly level, much better than Frelick: Byron Buxton, who was literally the #1 consensus prospect at the time.

AAA OPS as a 21-year-old: .986

MLB OPS that season after the call-up: .576

Some player performance translates directly to MLB. Some take time. Some never perform. As I said, our data is limited and we should always keep that in mind when casting 100% judgment over a decision.

There is literally no significant downside of giving him a chance. If he's lost in the majors, the brewers can send him back to Nashville and still have 3 or more reasonable alternatives.

[Robocaller]

12 hours ago, yourout said:

It's time to give someone else a look. I like Taylor but he is nothing more than a fourth outfielder.

fifth OF at best.

[UpandIn]

On 8/19/2022 at 12:34 AM, Brock Beauchamp said:

Honestly, just lulz.

Buxton was literally the number one prospect in baseball.

And he failed. Miserably.

And if you want a more recent example, let me introduce you to this man.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=torkel000spe

Actually...he was the #2 prospect. 

The #1 prospect that year;

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/seageco01.shtml

I don't get the lulz. Isn't the argument merely that he's got nothing more to prove at AAA and that his contract rate and his BP skills and his speed SHOULD help to protect him from being completely overmatched?

Trea Turner, Dansby Swanson, Devers, obviously Seager...I'd say there's a fairly wide chasm between Seager and Buxton and it hardly seems like a stretch that Frelick could fall in the middle.

 

Prospects rankings are also less about production than they are tools, so not a shock to see Torkelson stumble out of the gate as he just wasn't real productive at AAA. But I don't see a whole lot to lose. Frelick should be a better defender(at least as good of one) and really the mark we should be aiming for is the .221/.273/.413 line that the guy currently manning CF is sporting. 

And should he catch lightening in a bottle...which is certainly plausible given just how absurdly hot he is in AAA, he could literally help save our season. 

I also reject the claim that we only know 10 pct of what goes into promoting a guy. We know about service time manipulation. When a guy is hitting .450, how much left is their to learn? Less than 90%!

[homer]

Frelick has 31 hits in August four of which have gone for extra bases. He's had a lot of luck recently (that 4/4 day was a mix of grounders and schtoinkers).

[JohnBriggs12]

On 8/19/2022 at 12:34 AM, Brock Beauchamp said:

Honestly, just lulz.

Buxton was literally the number one prospect in baseball.

And he failed. Miserably.

And if you want a more recent example, let me introduce you to this man.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=torkel000spe

Aren't you confusing Buxton with Brinson?  Brinson was in the range of the 15th best prospect.  Buxton was consensus number one.  Buxton's had a lot of injuries but he was an All Star this year.  Brinson's clearly been a disappointment in the majors but at 28 and with a AAA OPS hovering around .900 this year, he yet might emerge as a useful major league player.

[Fear The Chorizo]

50 minutes ago, JohnBriggs12 said:

Aren't you confusing Buxton with Brinson?  Brinson was in the range of the 15th best prospect.  Buxton was consensus number one.  Buxton's had a lot of injuries but he was an All Star this year.  Brinson's clearly been a disappointment in the majors but at 28 and with a AAA OPS hovering around .900 this year, he yet might emerge as a useful major league player.

I think it's more to do with the initial few years of Buxton's MLB career, which were pretty darn bad offensively - he took awhile to develop as a good MLB offensive player, always had GG caliber defense roaming center field.  He's also been injured - alot - and missed large chunks of seasons where it looked like he would have finally put it all together.

[Brock Beauchamp]

15 hours ago, JohnBriggs12 said:

Aren't you confusing Buxton with Brinson?  Brinson was in the range of the 15th best prospect.  Buxton was consensus number one.  Buxton's had a lot of injuries but he was an All Star this year.  Brinson's clearly been a disappointment in the majors but at 28 and with a AAA OPS hovering around .900 this year, he yet might emerge as a useful major league player.

Buxton obviously became a great player but he was abysmal for 2+ seasons in MLB.

I’m not even saying don’t call up Frelick, I probably would… but scouting a stat line is very problematic. There could be significant issues the coaches see that we do not.

But if this is a service time issue, BLECH. 

[markedman5]

https://twitter.com/BrewersPD/status/1561755860765777920?s=20&t=nDuLOCyTBHPYi2WlVqSQww

[Jopal78]

43 minutes ago, markedman5 said:

https://twitter.com/BrewersPD/status/1561755860765777920?s=20&t=nDuLOCyTBHPYi2WlVqSQww

Looking at that video clip, it looks like some line drives and balls the other way