Should Milwaukee pursue a trade for CF Ramon Laureano?

[damuelle]

I say "Go big or go home!" Byron Buxton for a package centered on one of our lefty starters (Eric Lauer, Aaron Ashby, Ethan Small)...

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

19 minutes ago, damuelle said:

I say "Go big or go home!" Byron Buxton for a package centered on one of our lefty starters (Eric Lauer, Aaron Ashby, Ethan Small)...

Wouldn't the Twins signing of Correa indicate that they are also in "go for it" mode though?

[brewers888]

I am far more interested in a difference making bat than a player like Laureano. The Red Sox are out of it and JD Martinez is a free agent at seasons end. With Boston probably being interested in saving money in a non competitive season we may get Martinez at a low cost prospect wise.

This is the time to go for it and JD would be the big time hitter this team lacks especially when matching up against lefty starters which we continue to struggle against. This is the type of acquistion that can help us win that all elusive World Series.

[damuelle]

10 minutes ago, Ron Robinsons Beard said:

Wouldn't the Twins signing of Correa indicate that they are also in "go for it" mode though?

Yeah, I just figured they'd need to add a proven lefty starter like Lauer.

Otherwise, we're probably back to looking at the likes of Bryan Reynolds. Does Aaron Hicks have anything left in the tank (though I'm not sure the 27-9 Yankees need any help)?

My main point is that I hope we seek out an Adames-level impact, even if it costs us pitching, prospects and/or material expense.

[wntrtxn21]

Some big questions that need to be answered ver, very soon... How much will MA allow Stearns to spend to help the anemic offense? Martinez has a $19.5M contract. Bogaerts has a $20M contract, if he opts out of his $100M deal.  Stearns already has a team record payroll, so will MA open the checkbook even more?  Can the Brewers wait until the deadline to aquire somebody to bring the cost down? To defer some of the cost, does DS trade a big arby guy for offensive help? Is it time to DFA Cain and look elsewhere? 

[Brewcrew82]

8 hours ago, damuelle said:

I say "Go big or go home!" Byron Buxton for a package centered on one of our lefty starters (Eric Lauer, Aaron Ashby, Ethan Small)...

We're just lucky Byron Buxton wouldn't cost us Burnes because of the injury history. When healthy, he's right up there with Trout. Regardless, I don't see it happening when the Twins are probably about even with the White Sox for winning the division. 

[SRB]

The Twins signed Buxton to a long, team-friendly extension during the offseason. (And now he's putting up MVP numbers again.) Has to be one of the most unavailable players in baseball.

[Robocaller]

16 hours ago, wntrtxn21 said:

Some big questions that need to be answered ver, very soon... How much will MA allow Stearns to spend to help the anemic offense? Martinez has a $19.5M contract. Bogaerts has a $20M contract, if he opts out of his $100M deal.  Stearns already has a team record payroll, so will MA open the checkbook even more?  Can the Brewers wait until the deadline to aquire somebody to bring the cost down? To defer some of the cost, does DS trade a big arby guy for offensive help? Is it time to DFA Cain and look elsewhere? 

relative to other teams, the brewers offense is doing blood doping instead of being anemic. It's an off year for hitting.

[Robocaller]

Looking at the stats, I can't find any CF who is hitting OK on a bad team, and who might be available. 

But while we're dreaming, lets send our #1-10 prospects and Lauer for Mike Trout.

[timpep]

13 hours ago, Brewcrew82 said:

We're just lucky Byron Buxton wouldn't cost us Burnes because of the injury history. When healthy, he's right up there with Trout. . 

Byron Buxton's career year of 250 plate appearances was 172 ops+, Trout's career average is 177. Buxton at his best is almost as good as Trouts career average. Let's not pretend he's anywhere close to the same level of player.

[Brewcrew82]

6 hours ago, timpep said:

Byron Buxton's career year of 250 plate appearances was 172 ops+, Trout's career average is 177. Buxton at his best is almost as good as Trouts career average. Let's not pretend he's anywhere close to the same level of player.

Okay. You're right in that it was a little hyperbole. What Trout has done over the last decade is unrivaled. But, Buxton at his healthy peak is probably as close as it gets. Particularly when you factor in what he provides with the glove. Why, if he was consistently healthy, we would almost certainly have to start the bidding with Burnes. But the Twins aren't going to trade him, so the discussion is moot. 

[LouisEly]

On 5/14/2022 at 4:00 AM, Robocaller said:

The guy never played more than 123 games, and has been mediocre since 2019, and is coming off a ped suspension. I get the potential he offers, but his actual accomplishments aren't great.

I'm not sure why this is not as obvious to some others here as it is to you and I.  Especially the "coming off of a PED suspension" part - there is a lot of risk as to what his actual performance is and will be post-PED suspension.

And I'm not sure what an "elite" prospect is.  We have a 22-year-old LHH SS at AAA who is 4.5 years younger than league average and has a ~.750 OPS.  We also have 25-year-old LHSP who is striking out almost 13/9ip in AAA.  Lots of guys on these top-100 prospect lists haven't made the jump to AA yet, and thus their value has to be discounted for development risk.  Not so with the two aforementioned prospects, and on top of that they play perhaps the two most valuable positions on the diamond.

[jay87shot]

I'd rather give Weimer or Frelich a chance than get a guy like Laureano, I know both are pretty far away but I think that giving up a couple of prospects for a potentially slight improvement doesn't get us anywhere.

The further on the season goes the more I am leaning towards JD Martinez as our trade target, I bet the Red Sox would eat most of his salary if we made up for it in prospect value. 

[Jopal78]

1 hour ago, jay87shot said:

I'd rather give Weimer or Frelich a chance than get a guy like Laureano, I know both are pretty far away but I think that giving up a couple of prospects for a potentially slight improvement doesn't get us anywhere.

The further on the season goes the more I am leaning towards JD Martinez as our trade target, I bet the Red Sox would eat most of his salary if we made up for it in prospect value. 

It is highly improbably Boston will be "sellers" come the end of July. The Red Sox are currently hovering near .500 (19-22)  (Pythagorean 21-20) at the quarter mark of the season. There is a ton of baseball left and Boston should get both Chris Sale and James Paxton back at some point this summer which would be a significant infusion of talent to their pitching staff. 

Now, with six teams making the playoffs from each league, any team around .500 is going to be in the hunt. In fact, Boston is currently the 8th best team in the AL, two games behind the #7 team Chicago, and 3 games behind #6 Toronto. If anything they will likely be buyers trying to put together one more run with their current group of stars. 

[nate82]

2 hours ago, Jopal78 said:

It is highly improbably Boston will be "sellers" come the end of July. The Red Sox are currently hovering near .500 (19-22)  (Pythagorean 21-20) at the quarter mark of the season. There is a ton of baseball left and Boston should get both Chris Sale and James Paxton back at some point this summer which would be a significant infusion of talent to their pitching staff. 

Now, with six teams making the playoffs from each league, any team around .500 is going to be in the hunt. In fact, Boston is currently the 8th best team in the AL, two games behind the #7 team Chicago, and 3 games behind #6 Toronto. If anything they will likely be buyers trying to put together one more run with their current group of stars. 

I don't see Boston beating out the Rays, Blue Jays, White Sox and the Angels.   Even with 6 teams making the playoffs I just don't see the Red Sox beating out those teams along with the Twins and Mariners being wild cards in the playoff hunt.  The Red Sox are in one of the toughest divisions in baseball and will only have one easy opponent in their division in the Orioles.  While the White Sox get to beat up on the Royals and Tigers.  I just don't see the Red Sox getting that final wild card spot and I think they will do what the Cubs did last year and sell off some of their expiring contracts.  

[Jopal78]

20 minutes ago, nate82 said:

I don't see Boston beating out the Rays, Blue Jays, White Sox and the Angels.   Even with 6 teams making the playoffs I just don't see the Red Sox beating out those teams along with the Twins and Mariners being wild cards in the playoff hunt.  The Red Sox are in one of the toughest divisions in baseball and will only have one easy opponent in their division in the Orioles.  While the White Sox get to beat up on the Royals and Tigers.  I just don't see the Red Sox getting that final wild card spot and I think they will do what the Cubs did last year and sell off some of their expiring contracts.  

I don't see why not? With how well the Yankees have started a Division Championship is probably a long shot. BUT, the expanded playoffs were created exactly for a team like Boston. They've had a little bad luck so far as they're 3 games under .500 but have outscored their opponents in the aggregate. If Sale comes back healthy, that's essentially adding a #1 Ace pitcher. 

I'll grant you the Yankees, Astros, Twins and Angels have all played better than .600 baseball which gives them a nice head start, but it's highly un-probable that all four teams will continue to play at that clip. 

Conversely, Seattle is already 8 games under .500 and trending the wrong way coming off being swept in a four gamer. They have the same record as Baltimore and are only one loss better than Oakland two teams who are rebuilding. With Kansas City and Detroit already being 12 games under .500 they're likely close to playing for next year as well. 

Even assuming those top four don't falter that still would leave two playoff spots in the AL. Tampa looks to have an inside track on one of those spots, The sixth spot however is wide open. Both Toronto and Chicago have negative run differentials (-10 and -22 respectively) which suggests some luck has played a part in their winning records. Likewise, Cleveland and Boston have positive run differentials (+5 and +1 respectively). Cleveland and Boston are both 3 games under .500.  And who knows about the Rangers they've kept their head above water but lost 100 games last year. If they only lost 80 this year it would be nothing short of a huge turnaround for that team. 

I really do think with the expanded playoffs any team hanging around .500 at the end of July is going to either stand pat or make moves to get better, especially the big market clubs. It will be the Tigers, Royals, Mariners etc. who are the sellers. 

 

 

 

[Brewcrew82]

3 hours ago, Jopal78 said:

It is highly improbably Boston will be "sellers" come the end of July. The Red Sox are currently hovering near .500 (19-22)  (Pythagorean 21-20) at the quarter mark of the season. There is a ton of baseball left and Boston should get both Chris Sale and James Paxton back at some point this summer which would be a significant infusion of talent to their pitching staff. 

Now, with six teams making the playoffs from each league, any team around .500 is going to be in the hunt. In fact, Boston is currently the 8th best team in the AL, two games behind the #7 team Chicago, and 3 games behind #6 Toronto. If anything they will likely be buyers trying to put together one more run with their current group of stars. 

Xander Bogaerts is almost certainly going to walk in the offseason, raising the possibility that the Red Sox will come away with nothing for him except a draft pick. Unless they go on a major run and surpass the teams you listed above, I think they will definitely be listening on their impending free agents like Bogaerts and JD Martinez. 

[nate82]

21 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Xander Bogaerts is almost certainly going to walk in the offseason, raising the possibility that the Red Sox will come away with nothing for him except a draft pick. Unless they go on a major run and surpass the teams you listed above, I think they will definitely be listening on their impending free agents like Bogaerts and JD Martinez. 

Since the Red Sox are a CBT team the best they can get in terms of comp for losing Bogaerts is a comp b pick and that is if Bogaerts gets a contract that pays him 40m aav or $150m total.  This will be Bogaerts first time as a FA so he will be eligible.  

 

Free Agent Compensation

Former club status	35M TG/ 18M AAV	55M TG/23M AAV	100M TG/ 30M AAV	150M TG/ 40M AAV
Revenue Payee	3rd round	Comp B	Comp A	Comp A+ 3rd round
Revenue Payor	---	3rd Round	Comp B	Comp A
CBT Payor	---	---	3rd Round	Comp B

The Associated Press

Compensation tiers are based on:

• the total guarantee (TG) OR the average annual value (AAV) of the player’s new contract, whichever is higher, and
• The Revenue paying and CBT status of the former club
• The player must be a first time free agent, and have been with the former team for at least one full season.
• There is no qualifying offer of salary or arbitration required for compensation.

 

29 minutes ago, Jopal78 said:

I don't see why not? With how well the Yankees have started a Division Championship is probably a long shot. BUT, the expanded playoffs were created exactly for a team like Boston. They've had a little bad luck so far as they're 3 games under .500 but have outscored their opponents in the aggregate. If Sale comes back healthy, that's essentially adding a #1 Ace pitcher. 

I'll grant you the Yankees, Astros, Twins and Angels have all played better than .600 baseball which gives them a nice head start, but it's highly un-probable that all four teams will continue to play at that clip. 

Conversely, Seattle is already 8 games under .500 and trending the wrong way coming off being swept in a four gamer. They have the same record as Baltimore and are only one loss better than Oakland two teams who are rebuilding. With Kansas City and Detroit already being 12 games under .500 they're likely close to playing for next year as well. 

Even assuming those top four don't falter that still would leave two playoff spots in the AL. Tampa looks to have an inside track on one of those spots, The sixth spot however is wide open. Both Toronto and Chicago have negative run differentials (-10 and -22 respectively) which suggests some luck has played a part in their winning records. Likewise, Cleveland and Boston have positive run differentials (+5 and +1 respectively). Cleveland and Boston are both 3 games under .500.  And who knows about the Rangers they've kept their head above water but lost 100 games last year. If they only lost 80 this year it would be nothing short of a huge turnaround for that team. 

I really do think with the expanded playoffs any team hanging around .500 at the end of July is going to either stand pat or make moves to get better, especially the big market clubs. It will be the Tigers, Royals, Mariners etc. who are the sellers. 

 

 

 

I don't see the Tigers or Mariners being sellers at least not traditionally.  The Tigers spent this off season so I don't think they will sell all that much maybe a pending FA or two but I wouldn't expect them to trade anyone that will still have team control.  

The Royals will probably be big sellers but that helps the White Sox out more so than the Red Sox.  The Red Sox have to go through the Yankees, Rays and the Blue Jays.  All three are good teams the White Sox and the Twins are going to improve with their records while the Red Sox will have to compete against two good teams and one team on par with them.  I just don't see the Red Sox if they are hovering around .500 making the playoffs that is a tough road.

Like I said I believe the Red Sox go the Cubs route but try and get players that will help them next year and this year.  So something like trading Martinez for someone who is blocked in AAA that can help the Red Sox now and in the future.  If it works out great if not there is always next year for them.  I don't think they will trade Bogaerts but someone like Martinez who they could possibly get something back that will help them now and in the future I could see the Red Sox doing.  

[Jopal78]

1 hour ago, nate82 said:

Since the Red Sox are a CBT team the best they can get in terms of comp for losing Bogaerts is a comp b pick and that is if Bogaerts gets a contract that pays him 40m aav or $150m total.  This will be Bogaerts first time as a FA so he will be eligible.  

 

Free Agent Compensation

Former club status	35M TG/ 18M AAV	55M TG/23M AAV	100M TG/ 30M AAV	150M TG/ 40M AAV
Revenue Payee	3rd round	Comp B	Comp A	Comp A+ 3rd round
Revenue Payor	---	3rd Round	Comp B	Comp A
CBT Payor	---	---	3rd Round	Comp B

The Associated Press

Compensation tiers are based on:

• the total guarantee (TG) OR the average annual value (AAV) of the player’s new contract, whichever is higher, and
• The Revenue paying and CBT status of the former club
• The player must be a first time free agent, and have been with the former team for at least one full season.
• There is no qualifying offer of salary or arbitration required for compensation.

 

I don't see the Tigers or Mariners being sellers at least not traditionally.  The Tigers spent this off season so I don't think they will sell all that much maybe a pending FA or two but I wouldn't expect them to trade anyone that will still have team control.  

The Royals will probably be big sellers but that helps the White Sox out more so than the Red Sox.  The Red Sox have to go through the Yankees, Rays and the Blue Jays.  All three are good teams the White Sox and the Twins are going to improve with their records while the Red Sox will have to compete against two good teams and one team on par with them.  I just don't see the Red Sox if they are hovering around .500 making the playoffs that is a tough road.

Like I said I believe the Red Sox go the Cubs route but try and get players that will help them next year and this year.  So something like trading Martinez for someone who is blocked in AAA that can help the Red Sox now and in the future.  If it works out great if not there is always next year for them.  I don't think they will trade Bogaerts but someone like Martinez who they could possibly get something back that will help them now and in the future I could see the Red Sox doing.  

No, more probably true than not Seattle and Detroit will sell off whatever veterans they have coming out of contract. They won't break up their teams and start over because they never were serious contenders to begin with.  Nonetheless, the Mariners have some high pro-file rentals they could/will trade: Mitch Haniger, Adam Frazier, Jesse Winker, Sergio Romo etc.  Likewise, Detroit has Michael Fulmer, Michael Pineda, and Wily Peralta (!!) 

As pointed out earlier, Toronto and the White Sox have been outscored by opponents on the year, the fact they ahead of Boston in line for the 6th wild card spot is a testament to lucky breaks, but their deviation should regress as the season continues. 

I don't know if you watch the same Cubs teams that I see, when they broke up their team they didn't get players who could "help them this year and next year" they got Nick Madrigal- former #4 overall pick, diminutive slap hitter with no power to speak of, 29 year old rookie Frank Schwindel, and Codi Heuer. Everyone else they acquired in the sell off was in A or AA years away from the majors. 

To the point about JD Martinez, Boston isn't the kind of franchise that sells when they're around .500, they add. If they implode between now and July (which I personally doubt) they might move some impending free agents, but they certainly aren't going to pay cash to do it (or without getting premium blue chip talent in return) which would rule out Martinez or any other high pay veteran coming to Milwaukee

[nate82]

6 minutes ago, Jopal78 said:

I don't know if you watch the same Cubs teams that I see, when they broke up their team they didn't get players who could "help them this year and next year" they got Nick Madrigal- former #4 overall pick, diminutive slap hitter with no power to speak of, 29 year old rookie Frank Schwindel, and Codi Heuer. Everyone else they acquired in the sell off was in A or AA years away from the majors. 

I swear you never read any of the posts before commenting on them fully.  You need to reread what I wrote about the Cubs comparison there is a but in the sentence which makes what you commented here completely confusing.  

Here let me highlight exactly what you missed:

Like I said I believe the Red Sox go the Cubs route but try and get players that will help them next year and this year.  I can't believe I have to explain this but the but try and get players that will help them next year and this year means they wouldn't be following the Cubs trades from last year.  The comparison with the Cubs was with the selling off of soon to be free agents but instead of getting what the Cubs got the Red Sox would go after more immediate return players.  

Also the Brewers have enough in the budget to add Martinez they have done it in the past and Stearns has said previously in the past that if they need to spend more they will during the deadline.  I don't see a veteran salary being a blocker for the Brewers during the deadline. 

[Jopal78]

17 hours ago, nate82 said:

I swear you never read any of the posts before commenting on them fully.  You need to reread what I wrote about the Cubs comparison there is a but in the sentence which makes what you commented here completely confusing.  

Here let me highlight exactly what you missed:

Like I said I believe the Red Sox go the Cubs route but try and get players that will help them next year and this year.  I can't believe I have to explain this but the but try and get players that will help them next year and this year means they wouldn't be following the Cubs trades from last year.  The comparison with the Cubs was with the selling off of soon to be free agents but instead of getting what the Cubs got the Red Sox would go after more immediate return players.  

Also the Brewers have enough in the budget to add Martinez they have done it in the past and Stearns has said previously in the past that if they need to spend more they will during the deadline.  I don't see a veteran salary being a blocker for the Brewers during the deadline. 

Maybe I did misread it because what you actually wrote is illogical. No MLB team is going to trade major league players to acquire an impending free agent like Martinez or anyone else. Further, it’s not 2008 anymore and teams very rarely trade major league ready talent for rentals.

What is more, the Red Sox and the Cubs are nothing alike. The Red Sox are viable in the playoff chase (the Cubs we’re not) and with a 200 million dollar payroll are not afraid to lose players to free agency. (Moreover, they actually sort of have a history of keeping the free agents they determine are essential, but whatever). The Cubs alternatively began cutting payroll (Darvish) before the big sell off even occurred. 
 

Finally, there is a huge difference between what cliches a GM feeds the media pool and what decisions they actually make. As far as I can recall in the last 20 years the Brewers haven’t traded for a player at the deadline with a high seven figure salary let alone eight figures like Martinez. I doubt that changes anytime soon. 

[RWeeksFan23]

Miami is apparently really interested in Laureano, which leads me to thinking how badly we could use him too. 

Fangraphs grades his CF defense as really good over the course of his career, and he's a far better hitter than Cain as well. 

I think he'd be a good target for us.

[markedman5]

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/07/brewers-trade-rumors-ramon-laureano-athletics.html
 

I assume his PED suspension would make him ineligible for this years playoffs? 
 

 

[nate82]

23 minutes ago, markedman5 said:

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/07/brewers-trade-rumors-ramon-laureano-athletics.html
 

I assume his PED suspension would make him ineligible for this years playoffs? 
 

 

No it is the year of the suspension.

[wibadgers23]

Somebody please tell me what the fuss is all about with this guy? He hasn’t put up good numbers since 2019.