NCAA Basketball Thread 2021-2022

[bjkrautk]

We don't have a miscellaneous CBK thread, so I'll put this here for anyone interested:

 

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/32820497/kobe-king-returns-college-basketball-valpo-nearly-two-years-leaving-wisconsin-badgers

[CheezWizHed]

FYI, there is no harm in starting a thread if you want one.

[nodakfan17]

After a close loss to Alabama, a Houston staffer trashed the visitor’s tunnel on their way back to the locker room. After most of the team walked by the mess, one player stayed behind to pick up the overturned trash can (and the trash). Both the staffer and the player were caught on video:

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/houston-trashed-coleman-coliseum-loss-174510825.html

[PeaveyFury]

My goodness. Raise your kids to be like the player in that situation, not that fragile staffer.

[Oxy]

Purdue losing to NC St. First #1 ranking in school history and they may promptly lose to two mediocre teams back to back.

[nodakfan17]

UWGB’s Keifer Sykes is reportedly signing with the Indiana Pacers. He’s been playing overseas and in the G-League for 6 years. I’m so happy for this guy.

 

https://www.wbay.com/2021/12/27/sykes-join-indiana-pacers/

[nodakfan17]

UWGB played UWM today for the second time this year and it caused me to wonder if this has ever happened before (probably not):

 

Will Ryan is the HC at UWGB, but he played at UWM.

His father, Bo Ryan, was also the HC at UWM.

 

Pat Baldwin Sr is the HC at UWM.

His son, Pat Baldwin Jr., plays at UWM.

Pat Baldwin Jr. was born in Green Bay when his father was an assistant at UWGB.

 

That’s an unparalleled amount of cross-pollination.

[SomewhereInTime]

UWGB played UWM today for the second time this year and it caused me to wonder if this has ever happened before (probably not):

 

Will Ryan is the HC at UWGB, but he played at UWM.

His father, Bo Ryan, was also the HC at UWM.

 

Pat Baldwin Sr is the HC at UWM.

His son, Pat Baldwin Jr., plays at UWM.

Pat Baldwin Jr. was born in Green Bay when his father was an assistant at UWGB.

 

That’s an unparalleled amount of cross-pollination.

 

On a related note for UWM, I wonder if there's another team that's ever dropped as far in the KenPom rankings as they have over the course of the year since their initial ranking somewhere in the #120 range. Currently sitting #326. But still higher than Green Bay which entered today #341st.

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

Yeah, a bad year for the Horizon League all around. Conference realignment really did a number on what used to be a very, very strong league.

[nodakfan17]

In 2 years at UWGB, Will Ryan is:

 

2020-21: 8-17

2021-22: 4-20

 

I’m willing to give him a mulligan on the COVID year, but you might have to go back 40 years (pre-Dick Bennett) to find a team with a worse record. It’s not all Ryan’s fault. They lost their best player to free agency. He’s now at Missouri and didn’t have to sit out a year.

 

Ryan’s predecessor, Linc Darner, was 92-80 in 5 seasons. He had a winning record in 4 out of 5 seasons and made the tournament in 2016. Darner was fired after going 17-16 in his final season. The AD who made that switch already status hopped his way to another school and won’t have to pay the price.

[Joseph Zarr]

If you care to hear a deeper perspective on the sham of the Federal case a few years back on the recruiting and pay-outs at high level programs (here's looking at you Bill Self), here is Merle Code (my brother-in-law actually went to school with him: he's a good guy - tho the Feds would want us to think otherwise). This pod really really exposes a lot of things. Tough listen but very worth it for a deepened perspective and understanding:

 

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/cbb-black-market-merl-code-on-the-state-of-the-ncaa/id1423417914?i=1000551095229

[MrTPlush]

I always thought punishing programs for this kind of thing was a slippery slope. Sooooo much is slipping through the cracks it seems questionable to really drop hammers on some few programs. I mean a big part of Kansas' probe is Zion Williamson...a player who never even ended up on the team. So it seems pretty obvious that Duke paid Williamson, there just isn't any proof. So Kansas, the team that didn't even end up paying him, is going to take the fall for that situation?

 

At some point someone should go punish the leaders of college basketball. They are the ones that let this run beyond wild and have caused it to be totally out of control.

[Joseph Zarr]

I always thought punishing programs for this kind of thing was a slippery slope. Sooooo much is slipping through the cracks it seems questionable to really drop hammers on some few programs. I mean a big part of Kansas' probe is Zion Williamson...a player who never even ended up on the team. So it seems pretty obvious that Duke paid Williamson, there just isn't any proof. So Kansas, the team that didn't even end up paying him, is going to take the fall for that situation?

 

At some point someone should go punish the leaders of college basketball. They are the ones that let this run beyond wild and have caused it to be totally out of control.

 

If you are willing to let the programs off the hook (and, frankly, I don't care about the optics of this entire topic one bit. It's ridiculous that the Feds suddenly pretend policed this to begin with and made it such an ordeal. This stuff has been going on for decadesssss). And, absolutely, the NCCA establishment at large is a machine that enables institutions to profit off student athletes. Just very very recently they have allowed student athletes the ability to make monies off their own image and talents - tho, as Merl points out they still must be granted permission. The issue in this case, is really Merl and the retinue of convicted individuals were made to fall on the sword of 'justice' for essentially just doing their jobs...and, then there is the reality what they were convicted of and found guilty of is now legal and, really, wasn't some type of terrible offense in the first place. The coaches and the institutions themselves were once again left completely unscathed. It's just a gross commentary on the reality of power dynamics.

 

I'm looking forward to reading his book when it comes out in March. I think he has a very compelling story to tell.

[PinaMadness]

Down goes Auburn.

[CheezWizHed]

The way refs allow flying elbows in the league is ridiculous. I was watching ILL vs MI-ST Saturday. Cockburn makes his move and clocks the defender with his elbow. The ref calls a foul (on the defender) and Cockburn goes to the line. Meanwhile, the announcer says, "seems like has a bloody lip" as if it was a mystery how it happened.

 

Both ILL and Purdue have flying elbow squads. When those boys hit the NBA, someone is going to teach them a lesson because they won't be outsized there.

[LouisEly]

Down goes Auburn.

And Gonzaga, and Arizona, and Kansas, and Kentucky. Seven of the top 10 lost yesterday.

[stoutdude04]

I have seen some places that have Wisconsin as a 2 seed. Who would have thought? I imagine they will be a popular upset pick no matter the seed - they are like 14-1 or something in games decided by 6 points. That is wild.

[PinaMadness]

Auburn's second loss in a week. An early exit in the SE tournament will knock them down to a two seed for sure, not that it makes much of a difference.

 

Gonzaga and Arizona remain ranked 1-2 despite the losses.

[patrickgpe]

Pat Baldwin Sr fired at UWM. Bringing in his son has to be classified a disaster. I thought there was a chance he could get UWM back into the tournament and they ended up winning only 10 games. I think along with the basketball coach their AD needs to go too. She fired Jeter and they haven't been relevant since. Now Jr will sure go to the pro's and be a mid 1st round pick, even though he was projected to go much earlier last fall and UWM is in shambles.

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

Pat Baldwin Sr fired at UWM. Bringing in his son has to be classified a disaster. I thought there was a chance he could get UWM back into the tournament and they ended up winning only 10 games. I think along with the basketball coach their AD needs to go too. She fired Jeter and they haven't been relevant since. Now Jr will sure go to the pro's and be a mid 1st round pick, even though he was projected to go much earlier last fall and UWM is in shambles.

 

Watching GB and Milwaukee struggle so much has been weird the last few years. That league is there for the taking. Both those places need some sort of reevaluation.

[nodakfan17]

Pat Baldwin Jr only played in 11 of 32 games due to injury. Maybe their fortunes would have been different had he stayed healthy, but credit dad for not running his son into the ground to save his job.

 

Jeter is now HC at Western Illinois and is off to a good start

 

19-20: 5-21 *before Jeter

20-21: 7-15 Year 1 (weird COVID year)

21-22: 16-14 Year 2

 

I don’t know what’s up with UWGB. They fired Linc Darner who was 92-80 during his 5-year tenure that included 4 winning seasons and a tournament appearance. I think the new AD (who left for Akron) wanted to make a splash with Will Ryan.

[OldHeidelberg]

The Horizon has lost a lot of teams over the years notably Xavier, Butler, Loyola and Valpo since GB and MILW joined. I see UIC is leaving for the MVC now as well. I had to look to see who is in now and without looking I could have probably only named Wright St, Cleveland St, and Detroit. So it's tough to build in a declining conference when they also have the problem of having 2 popular in state power 6 programs to further drive them into irrelevance. I am not sure what the answer is for them, get some good JC and other transfers and hope to have some good seasons to get in line for the next round of conference expansions I guess. The Jeter firing was stupid.

[nodakfan17]

UIC has been a Horizon League bottom feeder for 20 years, but they got the MVC invite because of their market. It begs the question if Milwaukee would have been a better candidate had they had more recent success.

[patrickgpe]

 

Watching GB and Milwaukee struggle so much has been weird the last few years. That league is there for the taking. Both those places need some sort of reevaluation.

 

I agree on GB, they are really the only game in town once conference season starts. UWM is in a tight spot. They play in a off-site arena. Gets no support from Alumni and Students at the games. Is clearly 2nd fiddle to MU and plays across the street from a NBA team as well. Also there are fans who think UWM can bring back the glory days of Bruce Pearl and that is simply not realistic. I do think its not unreasonable every few years to be an AQ for the tournament.

 

Looking at the Horizon, they have lost teams like Butler, Loyola, and Valpo and replaced them with Robert Morris, Oakland, UIPUI, and Purdue - Fort Wayne. I agree, on that with the conference in its current state, they should be in the upper echelon. All of the teams that have been over the last decade or so have bolted.

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

Yeah, Oakland is a good program (though have struggled to win lately--Kampe is just an institution who schedules big noncon games in a good market) and Northern Kentucky seems like they've dumped lots of resources into hoops.

 

I just don't think any team in that league has the history UWM and GB do. Maybe Cleveland St. But who else in that league has won a tourney game recently? Youngstown is horrible (and is FCS football-first). IUPUI whatever. IPFW beat Indiana in regular play once.

 

In GB's case, flirting with football just seems like a bad move. You're never going to win as big as you will in men's basketball if you're an NCAA tourney regular. That's the lesson Creighton, Xavier, Dayton, etc. learned. Heck, Valpo is still dining out on Bryce Drew. Dumping athletic resources into hoops just seems like the smart move.

 

The good news is it just takes the right coach. You're one Steve Proehm or TJ Otzelberger or Chris Beard or Niko Medved away. Hard to predict who will be the one to replicate that success, but with the basketball quality across Wisconsin (look at the WIAC), gotta think there's someone there.