Brewers trade for Hunter Renfroe in exchange for Jackie Bradley Jr., David Hamilton and Alex Binelas

[sveumrules]

I really think that we all just need to accept the fact that Corey Ray is a big, giant, huge BUST.

 

Every time I see his name brought up with any kind of hope attached, I cringe.

 

Sure, Ray is a bust. That is a common theme for 2016 first rounders...

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/draft/?year_ID=2016&draft_round=1&draft_type=junreg&query_type=year_round

 

...with only 9 of 41 cracking even 1.0 WAR five years on, that would be something like a 78% bust rate to this point.

 

Brewers OF is already five deep with Yelich, Cain, Renfroe, Taylor & Jace. By virtue of being on the 40 man that makes Ray something like the 6th OF at the moment.

 

No hope, just bleak reality.

[StearnsFTW]

Well at least we got Lauer out of that first round.

 

I remember being devastated that we took Ray over Puk. Still am.

 

On topic, I would be completely shocked if Ray ever contributed in any meaningful way, but I'll continue to hope for it.

[monty57]

I would be completely shocked if Ray ever contributed in any meaningful way, but I'll continue to hope for it.

 

That's why I think it may be time to see what he can do as a cheap 5th OF. He has some assets that could help at the MLB level as long as he's playing for league minimum. Heck, he might even "prove himself" enough to stick around for an arby year or two.

 

He's been surpassed by a number of guys on the prospect depth chart, so he's probably never going to get the starting role in Milwaukee. He's nearing the stage where we either get something out of him as a bench player or let him go and see what he can do elsewhere.

[wntrtxn21]

I would be completely shocked if Ray ever contributed in any meaningful way, but I'll continue to hope for it.

 

That's why I think it may be time to see what he can do as a cheap 5th OF. He has some assets that could help at the MLB level as long as he's playing for league minimum. Heck, he might even "prove himself" enough to stick around for an arby year or two.

 

He's been surpassed by a number of guys on the prospect depth chart, so he's probably never going to get the starting role in Milwaukee. He's nearing the stage where we either get something out of him as a bench player or let him go and see what he can do elsewhere.

 

I don't believe if the DH comes to the NL (assuming they get a DH and not use Yelich as the DH) the Brewers will carry a 5th outfielder. Taylor can play all three OF positions, and Peterson can play the corner OF spots as well as the infield.

[umphrey]

If they adopt the DH would they postpone it a year or so anyway? I can imagine teams being unhappy about needing to fill the last minute roster spot.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

If they adopt the DH would they postpone it a year or so anyway? I can imagine teams being unhappy about needing to fill the last minute roster spot.

 

They played the abbreviated 2020 season with a DH. I don't see why they'd wait a year to throw it in if part of the new CBA.

[tmwiese55]

I agree, especially since all moves are halted and won't happen until it's decided. It's not like teams are going to fill out everything now and then all of a sudden a rule change happens in spring training.

[Roderick]

If they adopt the DH would they postpone it a year or so anyway? I can imagine teams being unhappy about needing to fill the last minute roster spot.

 

They played the abbreviated 2020 season with a DH. I don't see why they'd wait a year to throw it in if part of the new CBA.

 

Nelson Cruz is crossing his fingers. Many more teams will be an option and bump up his pay pretty good.

 

Edit: I should have said, unless Sal Bando is advising about DH spending ....

Edited January 7, 2022 by Roderick

[monty57]

If they adopt the DH would they postpone it a year or so anyway? I can imagine teams being unhappy about needing to fill the last minute roster spot.

 

They played the abbreviated 2020 season with a DH. I don't see why they'd wait a year to throw it in if part of the new CBA.

 

Nelson Cruz is crossing his fingers. Many more teams will be an option and bump up his pay pretty good.

 

That's why the union should really want the DH. That's 15 more potential landing spots for aging vets who can still hit but can't play defense. Those guys can be pretty expensive compared to the utility guy that would normally take that roster spot. Guys like Nelson Cruz can make a lot of money as a DH, but without the DH, they're out of baseball.

 

The owners should want the DH because it limits the chance of their pitchers getting hurt, and the W-L record after years of interleague play seems to show that the AL (with the DH) has the advantage over the NL. The AL has won 52.3% (3,482 W / 3,180 L) of the games since inception. It may not seem like a lot, but if I think I have a competitive disadvantage, I'd like to try to fix that.

 

I know some people are really opposed to the DH, but I'm surprised that it's taken this long for it to (probably) get implemented in the NL.

[StearnsFTW]

I hate the DH, but I recognize that it's inevitable and let's just go with it.

[wallus]

I'm fine with the DH now because pitchers are so good and you need 9 guys that have a legitimate chance of hitting.

[TURBO]

I don't know if you NEED 9 guys who can hit...lol

[bjkrautk]

The owners should want the DH because it limits the chance of their pitchers getting hurt, and the W-L record after years of interleague play seems to show that the AL (with the DH) has the advantage over the NL. The AL has won 52.3% (3,482 W / 3,180 L) of the games since inception. It may not seem like a lot, but if I think I have a competitive disadvantage, I'd like to try to fix that.

 

I'd be really curious to see the splits for AL (with DH) vs. NL (without) home games....mainly to see if the AL has an absolute advantage for inter-league play, or the advantages of the DH in home games outweighs the home advantage of playing without the DH in the NL.

 

Honestly, I prefer the strategic aspects of having the pitchers hit. If that were taken out of the game, I'd almost rather see an 8-man batting order than putting the DH in the National League....but I'm guessing that's a non-starter for collective bargaining.

[wntrtxn21]

The owners should want the DH because it limits the chance of their pitchers getting hurt, and the W-L record after years of interleague play seems to show that the AL (with the DH) has the advantage over the NL. The AL has won 52.3% (3,482 W / 3,180 L) of the games since inception. It may not seem like a lot, but if I think I have a competitive disadvantage, I'd like to try to fix that.

 

I'd be really curious to see the splits for AL (with DH) vs. NL (without) home games....mainly to see if the AL has an absolute advantage for inter-league play, or the advantages of the DH in home games outweighs the home advantage of playing without the DH in the NL.

 

Honestly, I prefer the strategic aspects of having the pitchers hit. If that were taken out of the game, I'd almost rather see an 8-man batting order than putting the DH in the National League....but I'm guessing that's a non-starter for collective bargaining.

 

As a traditionalist I'm not a big DH fan, but I think it's inevitable. I saw an interesting concept on a N.Y. web site. Keeping the DH through 5 innings and starting in the 6th inning, once the pitcher is removed, the DH is gone. That keeps the DH and still allows some strategy of the NL. I'm sure that's just one of many conceivable concepts of the DH rule.

[DHonks]

 

That's why the union should really want the DH. That's 15 more potential landing spots for aging vets who can still hit but can't play defense. Those guys can be pretty expensive compared to the utility guy that would normally take that roster spot. Guys like Nelson Cruz can make a lot of money as a DH, but without the DH, they're out of baseball..

 

We don’t know that’s how it’ll work. Nelson Cruz is the rarity. Most teams are using the DH for load management rather than signing a solid aging bat. Teams just aren’t looking to fill these spots with a Harold Baines or Edgar Martinez—guys that can’t play the field.

[umphrey]

 

That's why the union should really want the DH. That's 15 more potential landing spots for aging vets who can still hit but can't play defense. Those guys can be pretty expensive compared to the utility guy that would normally take that roster spot. Guys like Nelson Cruz can make a lot of money as a DH, but without the DH, they're out of baseball..

 

We don’t know that’s how it’ll work. Nelson Cruz is the rarity. Most teams are using the DH for load management rather than signing a solid aging bat. Teams just aren’t looking to fill these spots with a Harold Baines or Edgar Martinez—guys that can’t play the field.

When I was looking through NL rosters last year it looked more likely to solve roster logjams than anything. Like the Reds who had 7 3Bs on their roster or the Mets who kept benching their best hitter (JD Davis).

[Warning Track Power]

My solution to the DH, which the Union would never agree to, is to go to 8 man lineups. You no longer have the pitcher hitting and you do away with the DH entirely.

 

I know it’s unrealistic but there is just something wrong about sitting the bench all game other than to hit 3-4x. This isn’t adult league softball.

[monty57]

 

That's why the union should really want the DH. That's 15 more potential landing spots for aging vets who can still hit but can't play defense. Those guys can be pretty expensive compared to the utility guy that would normally take that roster spot. Guys like Nelson Cruz can make a lot of money as a DH, but without the DH, they're out of baseball..

 

We don’t know that’s how it’ll work. Nelson Cruz is the rarity. Most teams are using the DH for load management rather than signing a solid aging bat. Teams just aren’t looking to fill these spots with a Harold Baines or Edgar Martinez—guys that can’t play the field.

 

I agree that many teams will use it that way. That's why I said "potential landing spots."

 

Take Prince Fielder's situation years ago. It seemed pretty obvious that he was going to an AL team, so half of the teams in baseball were out of the bidding before it began. If the NL had a DH, it would theoretically push the price of "DH only" guys higher due to the extra demand. These guys may be uncommon, but they are paid a lot of money. The union gets a percentage of everyone's paycheck, so if the 26th roster spot is used for a guy making league minimum, they make a lot less than if it is used to pay a DH an eight figure salary.

 

The union knows that smaller revenue teams will often use it in the way you suggest, which is why they're against anything that helps smaller revenue teams. Bigger market teams are more likely to pay a lot of money to have a big bat at DH.

[Mass Haas]

David Hamilton talks Boston Red Sox trade ‘shocker,’ regaining speed after slicing Achilles in scooter accident

By Christopher Smith, masslive.com

[markedman5]

https://www.mlb.com/news/jackie-bradley-jr-back-with-red-sox

[NBBrewFan]

I saw that article on mlb.com and it was pretty educational.  I learnt that lackluster is now a new adjective for worst season by a major league hitter.    I hope Jackie the best and hope he rebounds offensively and keeps a high level of defense, but I can't wait to see what Renfroe can do in a Brewers uni.  Lackluster?! Too funny.

[stalton]

Say what you want about JBJ's offense, he is still a great OFer.  2 assists already this spring so far.

[Adam Rygg]

2 hours ago, stalton said:

Say what you want about JBJ's offense, he is still a great OFer.  2 assists already this spring so far.

Amazing defender. Just needs to play more to have a puncher's chance at the plate.

[DR28]

Interesting, Renfroe is starting at 1B today... Has he ever played there before?

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

4 minutes ago, DR28 said:

Interesting, Renfroe is starting at 1B today... Has he ever played there before?

He played 9 innings there for the Rays in 2020.