Wisconsin Basketball Thread 2021-2022

[stoutdude04]

If Howard felt threatened there then he is softer than a baby's number 2.

 

10 ply if you will.

Edited February 21, 2022 by stoutdude04

[Cool Hand Lucroy]

 

We mostly agree. I just do think Gard's screw up is minor compared to Howard's. Is it minor in a vacuum? I think probably? The biggest thing I think Gard did wrong was just rising to the bait a bit too much--he got a bit too vehement in talking to Howard, I think because he was more upset than he let on in the post game interviews about the full-court press. He didn't want Howard to get the last word. Maybe I just have the same problem.

 

I started off by saying I agreed with all of what you said so I'll go with we mostly agree as well. You were saying maybe 25% on Gard and I was saying maybe 3% but same idea. Gard should have let it go until the presser when as you note he was better able to control himself. I'm sure he'd handle it differently if he had to do it again. And again, none of this justifies what Howard did.

 

Sorry, I misread your second post as putting more blame on Gard than I thought. My fault.

 

We'll see how the B1G sorts it. I am guessing Neath, and the two Michigan players each get 1-2 games. Howard gets at least 4. Gard issues some sort of contrite public statement.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Juwan Howard is a 6'9" former NBA power forward and enforcer. Greg Gard looks like the guy selling insurance in the office around the corner. The idea that Howard is claiming self defense is an absolute joke.

[LouisEly]

Watching it again this morning, and Gard's hand was on Howard's elbow for literally a half of a second. Timed it three times - exactly a half of a second.

 

The narrative that he "grabbed" or physically restrained Howard in any way needs to stop.

[MrTPlush]

He grabbed Howard's arm and then stepped in front of him...thus not allowing Howard to walk away. That is essentially restraining Howard. Grabbing someone and then using your body to prevent them from going where they want is physically restraining them by definition, in my opinion.

 

I mean...I am not blaming Gard for doing it, as I can't imagine many just letting someone walk away after that. But thus, he did it.

[nodakfan17]

I’m not a big UW fan (nor do I cheer for Michigan), so I think I can objectively say this incident is 100% on Howard unless Gard and staff used improper language that allowed the situation to escalate as quickly as it did. The act of touching someone’s forearm during a crucial conversation, while odd, shouldn’t trigger violence.

 

Very interesting to see how this plays out.

[homer]

He grabbed Howard's arm and then stepped in front of him...thus not allowing Howard to walk away. That is essentially restraining Howard. Grabbing someone and then using your body to prevent them from going where they want is physically restraining them by definition, in my opinion.

 

I mean...I am not blaming Gard for doing it, as I can't imagine many just letting someone walk away after that. But thus, he did it.

 

Howard could have turned around and gone back the way he came....towards the locker room. The end of the floor from which he came is where the teams both go. I doubt his plan was to continue down the line and shake hands.

 

And not allowing him to walk away is stretch. That makes it sound like Gard had established position and was waiting to draw a charge. He stepped in front of Howard for a split second and then moved.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Gard responded reasonably to unprovoked taunting, i.e. the entire reason Howard decided to go through the line in the first place. Surprised by Howard scolding him, he gently holds up the line probably to try and say "You hadn't stopped playing, so we didn't stop playing." The nonsense about "putting your hands on a man" and "Gard starting it" is just that, nonsense.

 

Howard went looking for a fight, wanted a much worse reaction than the one he actually got, and then still threw the first slap/punch.

 

What makes it even funnier is that he has no ground to be upset in the first place. If Bucky had been out there launching threes and playing full-court press with their starters, the whining tantrum is still pathetic but at least maybe understandable.

 

I do nothing but laugh at guys like Howard, big and tough and you can't mess with them, but you're supposed to go easy on them during competition at this high of a level. He is a Man Baby, pure and simple. An adult that can't control their emotions like that has no business being employed in the position he is. Again, I'll say this: imagine where his temper goes when he's not on national TV.

[PeaveyFury]

I think Potrykus hit the nail on the head this morning: "If Howard wanted to leave the building w/out speaking to anyone he could have. Why did he choose to go through the line, take his mask down and bark that he would remember this? Answer: He was dying to do what he did."

 

[OldSchoolSnapper]

https://i.redd.it/tkt74mifm6j81.jpg

[homer]

Someone may have touched on this but I didn't know until this morning that UW only had 4 seconds to get the ball across halfcourt because the ball was knocked out of bounds.

[PeaveyFury]

Yes, Gard immediately cited that as his reasoning in his on-court postgame interview. Taking the timeout gave them 10 seconds vs. the 4.

[jerichoholicninja]

I'm far from a basketball expert but can someone explain why taking a timeout is such an offensive thing to do in this situation?

[wallus]

I'm far from a basketball expert but can someone explain why taking a timeout is such an offensive thing to do in this situation?

 

It's not a big deal in college or lower honestly. In the NBA it would be but they also don't press once the game is over.

[PeaveyFury]

I'm far from a basketball expert but can someone explain why taking a timeout is such an offensive thing to do in this situation?

 

In the most St Louis Cardinals- like way, Howard apparently believes that one team can continue to try to win, while if the other does, it’s rubbing it in. Never mind of course that he literally did the same exact thing on the other side of a blowout two weeks ago….

[LouisEly]

For some reason, Howard didn't have an issue with the last time that Gard touched him on the arm...

 

[homer]

https://i.redd.it/tkt74mifm6j81.jpg

 

I don't think that's really apples to apples. He substituted his bench at that point.

[SeaBass]

For some reason, Howard didn't have an issue with the last time that Gard touched him on the arm...

 

Yeah, the whole pearl clutching "He touched me" thing in the handshake line doesn't really hold much water with me either. I get it, we live in a society where personal space is respected to a high degree but in sports especially a touch on the arm is hardly something to get upset about. Mike Maddux wouldn't know what to do with himself if that was the case, he's the poster boy for a touchy feely coach to the point where it was always something I noticed.

[stoutdude04]

To me - the entire arm grab thing was Gard trying to explain himself. Anyone who thinks it was trying to detain him or that he escalated it seems to be off base. Now, I wasn't there to hear it, but it surely is not hard to infer this.

[MrTPlush]

To me - the entire arm grab thing was Gard trying to explain himself. Anyone who thinks it was trying to detain him or that he escalated it seems to be off base. Now, I wasn't there to hear it, but it surely is not hard to infer this.

 

Well he was trying to explain himself…but he was also kinda detaining Howard so he could speak his mind. He grabbed Howard and then stepped in front of him. Howard was looking for an argument/fight though and Gard unfortunately gave Howard a (poor) excuse to escalate that.

 

Was calling the timeout kinda silly? Yah…most coaches are just going to not care that much about the turnovers at that point. 99% of the time coaches will brush off and let stuff at the end go. Clearly Howard is not one of those guys. I don’t know that it was wrong to call the timeout though…and the response towards it was kinda ridiculous. I think it’s a learning moment for Gard to avoid anything that is going to incite some negative response like that in the future. For the most part a coach at that point should just go into cruise control and not care what happens good or bad.

[sveumrules]

Looked to me like Gard was trying to coach up Howard on how to behave like an adult, Juwan clearly needs it.

[PeaveyFury]

I think it’s a learning moment for Gard to avoid anything that is going to incite some negative response like that in the future.

 

I’m not a fan of the ‘you just need to figure out how not to make him mad’ narrative as that’s been used since the dawn of time to enable bad behavior in people who can’t control their emotions.

[PeaveyFury]

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Was calling the timeout kinda silly? Yah…most coaches are just going to not care that much about the turnovers at that point. 99% of the time coaches will brush off and let stuff at the end go. Clearly Howard is not one of those guys. I don’t know that it was wrong to call the timeout though…and the response towards it was kinda ridiculous. I think it’s a learning moment for Gard to avoid anything that is going to incite some negative response like that in the future. For the most part a coach at that point should just go into cruise control and not care what happens good or bad.

 

I guarantee that timeout wasn't silly to those deep reserves who were getting their opportunity to play against a Big Ten power. Bravo to Gard for caring enough at that point to put his players in the position to not be embarrassed in the few seconds of game action they were going to see.

[homer]

I think it’s a learning moment for Gard to avoid anything that is going to incite some negative response like that in the future.

 

I’m not a fan of the ‘you just need to figure out how not to make him mad’ narrative as that’s been used since the dawn of time to enable bad behavior in people who can’t control their emotions.

 

Guarantee if Gard had just walked away people would have crowed about him "backing down" or some nonsense like that.