The struggles of Yelich and Hiura - Let the numbers talk!

[pacopete4]

At this point, I’ll take a slap hitting, high OBP Yelich in our lineup. He can worry about power heading to next season. We just consistency from him. Something like .280/.370/.420 is just fine with me.

[KeithStone53151]

One thing I'd like to see him work on in drills before games to prepare for postseason is bunting. He's getting a pretty heavy shift currently, some relatively free singles could be super useful in the playoffs if the power stroke still hasn't been found.

[BruisedCrew]

One thing I'd like to see him work on in drills before games to prepare for postseason is bunting. He's getting a pretty heavy shift currently, some relatively free singles could be super useful in the playoffs if the power stroke still hasn't been found.

 

Then he should also work on making sure not to look at, think about, or flinch in the direction of second base after a fielder throws his perfectly placed bunt past first.

[KeithStone53151]

I have been thinking about just how much better this team could be if yelich was even 80% of his MVP form. I think I saw 52-24 since we acquired Adames and one of the most productive offenses. Turn that 700 OPS LF into an 850 OPS LF. Would be huge.

 

Assuming that doesn't happen, is there any chance Yelich doesn't start some playoff games? Specifically against lefties would CC go to Taylor and have Yelich come off the bench? Numbers indicate he SHOULD, but would he is a completely different question.

[jonescm128]

I have been thinking about just how much better this team could be if yelich was even 80% of his MVP form. I think I saw 52-24 since we acquired Adames and one of the most productive offenses. Turn that 700 OPS LF into an 850 OPS LF. Would be huge.

 

Assuming that doesn't happen, is there any chance Yelich doesn't start some playoff games? Specifically against lefties would CC go to Taylor and have Yelich come off the bench? Numbers indicate he SHOULD, but would he is a completely different question.

 

I doubt it. He is still getting on base at an extremely high clip - although, not as much in the 2nd half compared to the first (.297 vs .399) - so he still has value even if he is not hitting.

[jonescm128]

Yelich 1st Half vs 2nd Half Tracker (games through 8/22)

 

ABs: 187 / 88

AVG: .241 / .261

OBP: .399 / .309

SLG: .369 / .420

OPS: .768 / .729

ISO: .128 / .159

BB%: 19.7 / 6.4

K%: 27.7 / 23.4

2B: 7 / 5

HR: 5 / 3

 

Last 7 games: .379/.379/.690/1.069

Last 15 games: .296/.333/.463/.796

 

Great to see some vintage Yelich come through this weekend!

[jonescm128]

Since this thread is about Yelich and Hiura and its been a while since Hiura was discussed...just checked in on him and his first action at AAA was August 17th. He is 3/14 since then with 3 singles, 3 BBs and 3 Ks. I wonder if they will be taking a new approach with him during this stint.

[KeithStone53151]

Since this thread is about Yelich and Hiura and its been a while since Hiura was discussed...just checked in on him and his first action at AAA was August 17th. He is 3/14 since then with 3 singles, 3 BBs and 3 Ks. I wonder if they will be taking a new approach with him during this stint.

 

Possibly, more than anything I think Hiura has work to do in the offseason to get his mechanics where they need to be.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Keston needs an offseason and some time to sort out his approach at the plate for sure, but I'm hoping this extra time allows for his personal life situation with his mother battling cancer to hopefully sort itself out for the better, too and allows his mind to shift much more towards improving results from the batter's box.

 

As a Brewers fan, the other thing that I think would benefit both Hiura and the organization greatly this offseason would be for the NL to adopt the DH. As of right now, there's no way the Brewers trade Hiura because he's a talented mess as a hitter, but not having the DH in the NL for 2022 would mean he'll have limited opportunities for everyday playing time with the Brewers at 1B/2B/OF. Adding the 2019 version of Hiura's right-handed bat to this lineup as a DH would be incredible for the offense.

[ThisIsMyCrew]

Keston needs an offseason and some time to sort out his approach at the plate for sure, but I'm hoping this extra time allows for his personal life situation with his mother battling cancer to hopefully sort itself out for the better, too and allows his mind to shift much more towards improving results from the batter's box.

 

As a Brewers fan, the other thing that I think would benefit both Hiura and the organization greatly this offseason would be for the NL to adopt the DH. As of right now, there's no way the Brewers trade Hiura because he's a talented mess as a hitter, but not having the DH in the NL for 2022 would mean he'll have limited opportunities for everyday playing time with the Brewers at 1B/2B/OF. Adding the 2019 version of Hiura's right-handed bat to this lineup as a DH would be incredible for the offense.

 

Hiura in the OF us cringe worthy. Guy needs DH bad.

[markedman5]

If he doesn’t relearn how to hit the DH won’t matter.

[adambr2]

Yeah I'm not overly worried about Hiura's glove at this point, as amazing as that is to say. Right now it's just about getting him to learn how to hit again.

[Fear The Chorizo]

If he doesn’t relearn how to hit the DH won’t matter.

 

I for one think the amount of time Hiura likely put into defensive work since the day he was drafted, initially at 2nd to try and establish himself there because he wasn't playing defense his last 1.5 collegiate seasons due to throwing arm issues and then during the 2020 offseason to try and learn a different position at 1B, likely impacted his offensive production. IMO, having the DH as an available spot for his bat in the lineup everyday dramatically improves his chances to relearn how to hit.

[Jopal78]

. As of right now, there's no way the Brewers trade Hiura because he's a talented mess as a hitter, but not having the DH in the NL for 2022 would mean he'll have limited opportunities for everyday playing time with the Brewers at 1B/2B/OF. Adding the 2019 version of Hiura's right-handed bat to this lineup as a DH would be incredible for the offense.

 

There is no need to trade Hiura, he has an option remaining and has zero value in a trade right now.

 

More importantly, there is no logical explanation for penciling Hiura in as a potential DH in 2022. He was the 2nd worst hitter in the NL this year, and is two calendar years and 400 at bats removed from having any sort of success in the major leagues.

 

Since he has an option reamining, he belongs in the minor leagues, and I'm sure the front office will make him earn his way back onto the 26 man roster as opposed to counting on him again to fill a specific role in 2022.

[PeaveyFury]

. As of right now, there's no way the Brewers trade Hiura because he's a talented mess as a hitter, but not having the DH in the NL for 2022 would mean he'll have limited opportunities for everyday playing time with the Brewers at 1B/2B/OF. Adding the 2019 version of Hiura's right-handed bat to this lineup as a DH would be incredible for the offense.

 

There is no need to trade Hiura, he has an option remaining and has zero value in a trade right now.

 

Zero is hyperbole, of course, but his value is certainly depressed. The problem is, at the same time, the Brewers may feel that his value may never be higher, sadly. He probably still has more potential value to an AL team because of the DH than to the Brewers who are only hoping the DH returns to the NL.

[pacopete4]

If there is a DH, it makes a lot of sense to think he would be the guy. I get that he really struggled this season but I don't think it is a player that you don't at least go back to after a full offseason of adjustments. The guy has talent, he has hit at every level, including the MLB.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Hiura's 400 terrible MLB ABs from 2020-2021 are roughly the same amount of plate appearances he had across 2019 between AAA and MLB, the year he was essentially a 1.000 OPS hitter (.938 MLB, 1.088 AAA) despite a higher than ideal K rate. If Hiura gets back anywhere near where he was in 2019, he's a bat that will be in the MLB lineup and it shouldn't require him destroying AAA pitching for 3/4 of a season in 2022 before he's given another shot - DH or not.

 

My point about Hiura being the Brewers' best initial option as an everyday DH (if the NL adopts it) is entirely based on what he did at the plate in 2019 and frankly the talent he has that made him a 1st round draft pick. He's struggled mightily at the MLB level the last two years, but there's also been alot going on off and on the field during that time - COVID 2020 that saw a ton of hitters struggle, mother's cancer battle, emphasis on defensive work at 2nd in 2020/position change to 1B in 2021. I also view a potential DH role from the Brewers perspective as a bonus roster spot they could fill internally with either someone from what their 2022 bench will already be, or a guy like Hiura rather than having to spend via free agency to bring someone else in.

[SRB]

Keston needs an offseason and some time to sort out his approach at the plate for sure, but I'm hoping this extra time allows for his personal life situation with his mother battling cancer to hopefully sort itself out for the better, too and allows his mind to shift much more towards improving results from the batter's box.

 

As a Brewers fan, the other thing that I think would benefit both Hiura and the organization greatly this offseason would be for the NL to adopt the DH. As of right now, there's no way the Brewers trade Hiura because he's a talented mess as a hitter, but not having the DH in the NL for 2022 would mean he'll have limited opportunities for everyday playing time with the Brewers at 1B/2B/OF. Adding the 2019 version of Hiura's right-handed bat to this lineup as a DH would be incredible for the offense.

 

Hiura in the OF us cringe worthy. Guy needs DH bad.

 

How exactly is Hiura in the OF "cringeworthy"? Based on the one career putout he has in LF?

 

He was actually a decent defensive 1B and I see nothing in his physical skillset suggesting he can't be a decent corner OF. The only reason he was never tried there in the past is they were still hoping he could stick at 2B, and then this season they had a huge hole at 1B.

 

Given his chaotic 2021 season, I'm not sure if Hiura will need more time in AAA to start 2022. Seems clear to me that the problem is he picked up bad habits starting in 2019 because he realized he could basically hit AAA pitching at will (which then actually carried over into MLB for a time). He just needs to refine his approach to cut down on the K's, which I think he is more than capable of with additional seasoning in the minors.

[PeaveyFury]

Hiura in the OF us cringe worthy. Guy needs DH bad.

 

How exactly is Hiura in the OF "cringeworthy"? Based on the one career putout he has in LF?

 

I can only assume he meant that the idea of it would be concerning, as to your point, he's barely played there.

 

Hiura has serious arm strength concerns, so I'd expect a horrifically bad OF arm, like Khris Davis bad, in left, which would be a significant problem. Hiura would have to hit a ton to overcome terrible defense, and there's no indication that's a reasonable expectation at this point.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Hiura in the OF us cringe worthy. Guy needs DH bad.

 

How exactly is Hiura in the OF "cringeworthy"? Based on the one career putout he has in LF?

 

I can only assume he meant that the idea of it would be concerning, as to your point, he's barely played there.

 

Hiura has serious arm strength concerns, so I'd expect a horrifically bad OF arm, like Khris Davis bad, in left, which would be a significant problem. Hiura would have to hit a ton to overcome terrible defense, and there's no indication that's a reasonable expectation at this point.

 

He'd also be limited to playing LF exclusively ... and that spot is seemingly occupied for a little while, unless they eventually move Yelich to a different spot.

[adambr2]

Hiura needs to start hitting half as good as he was in 2019 and then we'll find a spot for him. Until then, none of this really matters.

 

I would not be at all shocked to see Hiura traded in 2022. In fact, the better he does in AAA may make it all the more likely as they hope for him to reclaim some value. If they don't believe it'll translate again to the bigs, they may as well deal him next year. I know people hate the idea of selling low on him, but he'll burn his last option next year. We can't go into '23 with a guy on the roster who simply can't hit or field. So while he does have a few months to figure it out next season, the clock is ticking faster than many would like to think.

[PeaveyFury]

Hiura needs to start hitting half as good as he was in 2019 and then we'll find a spot for him. Until then, none of this really matters.

 

I would not be at all shocked to see Hiura traded in 2022. In fact, the better he does in AAA may make it all the more likely as they hope for him to reclaim some value. If they don't believe it'll translate again to the bigs, they may as well deal him next year. I know people hate the idea of selling low on him, but he'll burn his last option next year. We can't go into '23 with a guy on the roster who simply can't hit or field. So while he does have a few months to figure it out next season, the clock is ticking faster than many would like to think.

 

Basically where I'm at. In the end, the Brewers have no place to play him in the field, realistically. He'd be of better use to an AL team, unless the DH is in the NL to stay starting next year.

[adambr2]

Hiura needs to start hitting half as good as he was in 2019 and then we'll find a spot for him. Until then, none of this really matters.

 

I would not be at all shocked to see Hiura traded in 2022. In fact, the better he does in AAA may make it all the more likely as they hope for him to reclaim some value. If they don't believe it'll translate again to the bigs, they may as well deal him next year. I know people hate the idea of selling low on him, but he'll burn his last option next year. We can't go into '23 with a guy on the roster who simply can't hit or field. So while he does have a few months to figure it out next season, the clock is ticking faster than many would like to think.

 

Basically where I'm at. In the end, the Brewers have no place to play him in the field, realistically. He'd be of better use to an AL team, unless the DH is in the NL to stay starting next year.

 

Yeah, it sucks, because he was the best hitting prospect we've had in a long time, and when he came up in '19 it looked initially like he was going to be a star.

 

But I was pretty certain in '19 that our near term success was largely dependent on the futures of Hiura and Grisham. I was absolutely certain that any sustained success in '21 was dependent on rebound seasons from Yelich and Hiura.

 

None of those things have really happened and here we are at 76-49 so I have to assume at this point that no matter what happens with Hiura the Brewers are going to figure it out.

[jonescm128]

Yelich 1st Half vs 2nd Half Tracker (games through 8/31)

 

ABs: 187 / 129

AVG: .241 / .281

OBP: .399 / .333

SLG: .369 / .436

OPS: .768 / .769

ISO: .128 / .155

BB%: 19.7 / 7.7

K%: 27.7 / 20.9

2B: 7 / 9

HR: 5 / 3

 

Last 7 games: .346/.419/.500/.919

Last 15 games: .362/.391/.586/.977

 

 

Power is still not quite there but this is great to see. The difference in BB% between the first and second half seems to indicate he is being more aggressive. I will gladly take an aggressive Yelich over a high OBP Yelich. Good things, good things...

[ThisIsMyCrew]

“Christian Yelich since Aug. 8 slashing .324/.366/.461 w/ two HRs & a 58% hard hit rate, which in the span is first in NL.” From Will Sammon