MLB has an issue regarding pitching dominance

[Thurston Fluff]

Shouldn't we wait for a year or so to see if this is a trend or an aberration before making major changes? We're a in the second month of the season after a weird year. Pitching may have the upper hand now but what happens when the pitchers start to wear down a bit and the hitters start to get their timing and mechanics down after limited playing time last season.

[roadcrew3]

Unfortunately, I think MLB should explore moving towards a 7 inning game...Baseball purists will crucify the idea, and honestly I don't like it much myself, but pace of play is a bigger issue than the hitting. Attention spans are too short and there are too many other mental stimulants for fans to invest 3.5 hours watching this product. Pitch clocks and limiting throws over to first aren't going to move the needle with the duration of the game.

[NievesNoNO]

Step 1: Stop #@#@$@$ with the baseball. MLB over the years tries to compensate for what they think the game needs, with the ball. STOP

Step 2: See step 1

 

Yes, the pitchers are throwing the ball harder and spinning it more. Maybe its the ball, maybe it's technology and training, but the hitters have been doing it for a few years now too. Players are evolving. Let it happen.

 

The runs per game really isn't out of line with years past, outside of the late 90s-early 2000s when we can probably agree steroids played a part of. The runs are just being scored differently, with all the emphasis on the HR.

 

I do miss the days of the walk, steal, sac bunt and sac fly to score a run here and there. I say let the pitchers dominate for a bit. It was brought on by silly MLB and their ball adjustment, but also by the hitters selling out for HRs. Let them adjust back. Maybe it will start a shift where teams value guys that can get on base or hit for a higher average.

 

You could probably make a case for lowering the mound, or lengthening the outfield walls, but I'm not sure that will have a super big impact on the bottom line. I would agree, baseball is less watchable with 30 Ks, 4 HRs and three hits in between. It's become such a one dimensional power game. It's on the players to change the sport. In my mind, MLB has always sucked at marketing it's stars and it's game.

 

I would love to see a team just start selling out for contact, bunts to beat shifts and stealing bases. I know people will say, well it's just not that easy to hit the other way or bunt against todays pitchers. Well they had no problem adjusting their launch angle, it wouldn't be much different. Maybe a team like Baltimore; they have nothing to lose. Just start playing differently. If anything, it'd be a novelty and draw attention to your team.

[pacopete4]

I would be for 7-inning games. I think if you asked me 5-years ago, I would've snarled at it. But the direction of pitching has made me think it might be a decent idea. I also would love if they did DH's on Sundays with Mondays off/travel days.

[jonescm128]

I'm guessing the universal DH will be implemented next year. With offense being down across the league this year that is the easiest fix (at least in the NL).

[MrTPlush]

I would be for 7-inning games. I think if you asked me 5-years ago, I would've snarled at it. But the direction of pitching has made me think it might be a decent idea. I also would love if they did DH's on Sundays with Mondays off/travel days.

 

Are you advocating 7-inning games to make pitching even better and make offense worse? You are almost reducing innings needed to cover by 25%. Last years 7-inning games showed how much good pitching can steam roll teams in those DH's.

 

People can't tune in for all 9 innings, why make scheduled DH's that will last 14 innings? Guessing that would have a negative impact on tickets sales for those days too.

[mtrebs]

I'm guessing the universal DH will be implemented next year. With offense being down across the league this year that is the easiest fix (at least in the NL).

 

Except for the Brewers, who never seem to have anyone decent to use as a DH. Would have been perfect for Braun’s final years, but now we might as well have the pitcher bat.

[roadcrew3]

I would be for 7-inning games. I think if you asked me 5-years ago, I would've snarled at it. But the direction of pitching has made me think it might be a decent idea. I also would love if they did DH's on Sundays with Mondays off/travel days.

 

Are you advocating 7-inning games to make pitching even better and make offense worse? You are almost reducing innings needed to cover by 25%. Last years 7-inning games showed how much good pitching can steam roll teams in those DH's.

 

People can't tune in for all 9 innings, why make scheduled DH's that will last 14 innings? Guessing that would have a negative impact on tickets sales for those days too.

 

I don't think its trying to make pitching stronger or weaker, just trying to reduce the total time of the game. Easier and more enjoyable to watch a 2-1 pitching duel if it takes 2 hours instead of 3.5 hours.

[RightFieldCoder]

Getting rid of the shift will just mean a longer game. Shaw will get a hit. But since no batter is changing their approach you'll still see the next two guys strike out. The best way to get rid of the shift is to incentivize hitters to hit against it. It's also really hard to hit the ball where it's pitched when the pitcher throws non-fastballs at 90+. It will be a little easier if you move the mound back and give the hitter more time to identify the pitch and go the other way. I'd jump straight to two feet back.

 

A list of some radical ideas I'd rather see tried then outlawing the shift:

2 strikes and you're out. (batters would be incentivized to swing for contact early in the count)

7 balls to get a walk. (a lot harder to walk so guys aren't "looking" for them)

If you get on base via walk you can't lead off. (removes "a walk is as good as a hit")

Foul ball is always a strike and can cause a strikeout (just like a foul bunt).

Bunting a ball foul with two strikes is no longer an out. (less penalty for trying to bunt)

 

If you like to see a perfect game pitched with all 27 Hitters striking out, That might be a good idea to make it possible.

 

I read his post and was pretty confused since I thought the premise of this thread was lack of offense and just unbearable offense in general to watch. Like you, I thought this was a good way to make offense even worse and even more horrendous to watch. If we were trying to officially kill the game and have zero viewership, those ideas would be fantastic.

 

I am not sure the answer to making baseball better...but I am pretty confident those ideas are not said answer.

I agree that those shouldn't be done (especially not multiple of them). I just think each of those on their own would be a better idea than outlawing shifts. That's how dumb I think it is to make some rule about where the defense plays. It's the same as having a rule about how many offspeed pitches are allowed to be thrown per at bat. We would be trying to stop teams from using smart strategies.

[MrTPlush]

I'm guessing the universal DH will be implemented next year. With offense being down across the league this year that is the easiest fix (at least in the NL).

 

Except for the Brewers, who never seem to have anyone decent to use as a DH. Would have been perfect for Braun’s final years, but now we might as well have the pitcher bat.

 

Christian Yelich will need it soon enough. Hiura should be there if he ever figures out how to hit balls again.

[MrTPlush]

I agree that those shouldn't be done (especially not multiple of them). I just think each of those on their own would be a better idea than outlawing shifts. That's how dumb I think it is to make some rule about where the defense plays. It's the same as having a rule about how many offspeed pitches are allowed to be thrown per at bat. We would be trying to stop teams from using smart strategies.

 

I mean, soccer does it...hockey does it. Though I am not sure where I am going with this as I don't like either of those sports. I guess football has rules regarding the number of guys on kick offs each side of the kicker.

 

I don't think it would be overly ridiculous if they forced the defense to keep two guys on each side. You could still shift around quite a bit. I would not be opposed to forcing infielders to stay, well, in the infield. I don't know about other people, but I am getting kind of tired seeing absolute missiles to RF become routine ground outs.

[owbc]

MLB already had rules about where the defense can be positioned so it’s not an entirely new thing...

 

Rule 4.03 ...When the ball is put in play at the start of, or during a game, all fielders other than the catcher shall be on fair territory.

 

a) The catcher shall station himself directly back of the plate. He may leave his position at any time to catch a pitch or make a play, except that when the batter is being given an intentional base on balls, the catcher must stand with both feet within the lines of the catcher's box until the ball leaves the pitcher's hand.

Penalty: Balk

 

b) The pitcher while in the act of delivering the ball to the batter, shall take the legal position

 

c) Except for pitcher and catcher, any fielder may station himself anywhere in fair territory.

[Thurston Fluff]

Step 1: Stop #@#@$@$ with the baseball. MLB over the years tries to compensate for what they think the game needs, with the ball. STOP

Step 2: See step 1

 

Yes, the pitchers are throwing the ball harder and spinning it more. Maybe its the ball, maybe it's technology and training, but the hitters have been doing it for a few years now too. Players are evolving. Let it happen.

 

The runs per game really isn't out of line with years past, outside of the late 90s-early 2000s when we can probably agree steroids played a part of. The runs are just being scored differently, with all the emphasis on the HR.

 

I do miss the days of the walk, steal, sac bunt and sac fly to score a run here and there. I say let the pitchers dominate for a bit. It was brought on by silly MLB and their ball adjustment, but also by the hitters selling out for HRs. Let them adjust back. Maybe it will start a shift where teams value guys that can get on base or hit for a higher average.

 

You could probably make a case for lowering the mound, or lengthening the outfield walls, but I'm not sure that will have a super big impact on the bottom line. I would agree, baseball is less watchable with 30 Ks, 4 HRs and three hits in between. It's become such a one dimensional power game. It's on the players to change the sport. In my mind, MLB has always sucked at marketing it's stars and it's game.

 

I would love to see a team just start selling out for contact, bunts to beat shifts and stealing bases. I know people will say, well it's just not that easy to hit the other way or bunt against todays pitchers. Well they had no problem adjusting their launch angle, it wouldn't be much different. Maybe a team like Baltimore; they have nothing to lose. Just start playing differently. If anything, it'd be a novelty and draw attention to your team.

 

Those are the two things we need to keep in mind. Those adjustments cannot be made in one season nor can they ever be made if we keep changing the rules, the field or the ball. If we change every year based on the previous year we won't ever get to the point were players can figure out how to succeed for any length of time. Nor will teams be able to assemble a team based on knowable skillsets. Building a team based on the way the ball is made this year won't help if they change the ball next year. Ditto for the mound or any of the other stuff we're talking about. Basically teams would be rolling the dice every year in how to assemble a team. It would be virtually impossible to draft and develop for the future to boot.

[MrTPlush]

MLB already had rules about where the defense can be positioned so it’s not an entirely new thing...

 

Rule 4.03 ...When the ball is put in play at the start of, or during a game, all fielders other than the catcher shall be on fair territory.

 

a) The catcher shall station himself directly back of the plate. He may leave his position at any time to catch a pitch or make a play, except that when the batter is being given an intentional base on balls, the catcher must stand with both feet within the lines of the catcher's box until the ball leaves the pitcher's hand.

Penalty: Balk

 

b) The pitcher while in the act of delivering the ball to the batter, shall take the legal position

 

c) Except for pitcher and catcher, any fielder may station himself anywhere in fair territory.

 

Okay, hear me out. What If a team took all their players and stuck them directly in front of home in a way that the batter has absolutely no way to see the pitch coming. Give each other piggyback rides to get higher than the batters eyes and block the pitcher from view.

 

This by definition is not against the rules, is it not? I would keep this trick play in my back pocket until the biggest moment of the year. 3 outs from the world series win I am deploying this strategy stunning the entire sports world.

[Thurston Fluff]

Okay, hear me out. What If a team took all their players and stuck them directly in front of home in a way that the batter has absolutely no way to see the pitch coming. Give each other piggyback rides to get higher than the batters eyes and block the pitcher from view.

 

This by definition is not against the rules, is it not? I would keep this trick play in my back pocket until the biggest moment of the year. 3 outs from the world series win I am deploying this strategy stunning the entire sports world.

 

My guess would be the umpire would have as hard a time as the hitter seeing the pitch and not call very many strikes. Or the pitcher wouldn't be able to hit his spots because people were in his line of sight. Or the batter does see the occasional pitch and hits a 105 mph ball at someone riding piggy back two feet away from home plate preventing future players from trying it. There really isn't anyway they can position players where the pitcher and the umpire can see the pitch and throw it for a strike without the batter seeing it.

[JET15]

Mattingly says the game is "sometimes unwatchable"

 

[MrTPlush]

Okay, hear me out. What If a team took all their players and stuck them directly in front of home in a way that the batter has absolutely no way to see the pitch coming. Give each other piggyback rides to get higher than the batters eyes and block the pitcher from view.

 

This by definition is not against the rules, is it not? I would keep this trick play in my back pocket until the biggest moment of the year. 3 outs from the world series win I am deploying this strategy stunning the entire sports world.

 

My guess would be the umpire would have as hard a time as the hitter seeing the pitch and not call very many strikes. Or the pitcher wouldn't be able to hit his spots because people were in his line of sight. Or the batter does see the occasional pitch and hits a 105 mph ball at someone riding piggy back two feet away from home plate preventing future players from trying it. There really isn't anyway they can position players where the pitcher and the umpire can see the pitch, throw it for a strike without the batter seeing it.

 

 

Play Ball

 

[jerichoholicninja]

MLB already had rules about where the defense can be positioned so it’s not an entirely new thing...

 

Rule 4.03 ...When the ball is put in play at the start of, or during a game, all fielders other than the catcher shall be on fair territory.

 

a) The catcher shall station himself directly back of the plate. He may leave his position at any time to catch a pitch or make a play, except that when the batter is being given an intentional base on balls, the catcher must stand with both feet within the lines of the catcher's box until the ball leaves the pitcher's hand.

Penalty: Balk

 

b) The pitcher while in the act of delivering the ball to the batter, shall take the legal position

 

c) Except for pitcher and catcher, any fielder may station himself anywhere in fair territory.

 

Okay, hear me out. What If a team took all their players and stuck them directly in front of home in a way that the batter has absolutely no way to see the pitch coming. Give each other piggyback rides to get higher than the batters eyes and block the pitcher from view.

 

This by definition is not against the rules, is it not? I would keep this trick play in my back pocket until the biggest moment of the year. 3 outs from the world series win I am deploying this strategy stunning the entire sports world.

 

Fielders cannot make unusual movements to distract a hitter. That is also a rule and would take care of that. Someone got called for that last year or the year before.

[Hopper]

The #1 thing that should be done is a pitch clock.

Minors have been doing it for years right?

What is the purpose if they were not trying it out for MLB?

Just add the damn pitch clock and shave some time off that way to start.

I have friends who are baseball fans who can't sit through a game live anymore on tv.

The dvr every game (watch it the next day for highlights), or just tune in on the net someplace to see the highlights.

I wish I could be satisfied with that, but I need to see the game.

[Thurston Fluff]

Okay, hear me out. What If a team took all their players and stuck them directly in front of home in a way that the batter has absolutely no way to see the pitch coming. Give each other piggyback rides to get higher than the batters eyes and block the pitcher from view.

 

This by definition is not against the rules, is it not? I would keep this trick play in my back pocket until the biggest moment of the year. 3 outs from the world series win I am deploying this strategy stunning the entire sports world.

 

My guess would be the umpire would have as hard a time as the hitter seeing the pitch and not call very many strikes. Or the pitcher wouldn't be able to hit his spots because people were in his line of sight. Or the batter does see the occasional pitch and hits a 105 mph ball at someone riding piggy back two feet away from home plate preventing future players from trying it. There really isn't anyway they can position players where the pitcher and the umpire can see the pitch, throw it for a strike without the batter seeing it.

 

 

Play Ball

 

 

Well played sir.

[Oxy]

MLB already had rules about where the defense can be positioned so it’s not an entirely new thing...

 

Rule 4.03 ...When the ball is put in play at the start of, or during a game, all fielders other than the catcher shall be on fair territory.

 

a) The catcher shall station himself directly back of the plate. He may leave his position at any time to catch a pitch or make a play, except that when the batter is being given an intentional base on balls, the catcher must stand with both feet within the lines of the catcher's box until the ball leaves the pitcher's hand.

Penalty: Balk

 

b) The pitcher while in the act of delivering the ball to the batter, shall take the legal position

 

c) Except for pitcher and catcher, any fielder may station himself anywhere in fair territory.

 

Okay, hear me out. What If a team took all their players and stuck them directly in front of home in a way that the batter has absolutely no way to see the pitch coming. Give each other piggyback rides to get higher than the batters eyes and block the pitcher from view.

 

This by definition is not against the rules, is it not? I would keep this trick play in my back pocket until the biggest moment of the year. 3 outs from the world series win I am deploying this strategy stunning the entire sports world.

 

I know there are certain provisions in the rulebook against things that "make a mockery of the game." I believe this would fall under that category. Interesting thought though.

[Boomer5]

Launch angle and the 3TO hitter has ruined the game.

 

Get back to playing baseball and focusing only on baseball and the game will rebound.

[nate82]

The umpires are also now worse at calling balls and strikes. The number of bad calls in the strike zone being called balls and pitches completely out of the strike zone being called strikes is alarming. The robot umps at least for calling balls and strikes needs to come immediately and I don't care if the umpires strike over this they can leave if they don't want this.

[SomewhereInTime]

The umpires are also now worse at calling balls and strikes. The number of bad calls in the strike zone being called balls and pitches completely out of the strike zone being called strikes is alarming. The robot umps at least for calling balls and strikes needs to come immediately and I don't care if the umpires strike over this they can leave if they don't want this.

 

There is no way that is true. What we have now is technology that analyzes every pitch so you can clearly see if a ball is an inch outside or not. I can assure you if you watch an old game from 20+ years ago you will see balls 6 inches or more off the plate called strikes but you didn't have strikezone box over homeplate on the telecast so you just kind of eyeballed it and said it is what it is.

[TURBO]

The umpires are also now worse at calling balls and strikes. The number of bad calls in the strike zone being called balls and pitches completely out of the strike zone being called strikes is alarming. The robot umps at least for calling balls and strikes needs to come immediately and I don't care if the umpires strike over this they can leave if they don't want this.

 

There is no way that is true. What we have now is technology that analyzes every pitch so you can clearly see if a ball is an inch outside or not. I can assure you if you watch an old game from 20+ years ago you will see balls 6 inches or more off the plate called strikes but you didn't have strikezone box over homeplate on the telecast so you just kind of eyeballed it and said it is what it is.

 

Just had this arguement with a guy I know from work. He thinks the umps are just worse today, I pointed out exactly what you just said. I don't believe the umps are worse, in fact, if you compared todays umps with umps from 20 years ago, I'd venture to say they are probably a lot better just because they don't want to look bad with today's technology.

 

I think these guys are doing the best they humanly can, but technology continues to show their flaws.