Burnes article

[markedman5]

This is some good stuff here

 

https://www.mlb.com/news/how-corbin-burnes-is-even-more-dominant-in-2021

[wildcat2237]

This is really fascinating. I believe was sent to the Brewers R&D pitching "lab" in Phoenix to work on all of this after the disastrous 2019 season. Would love to hear more about what the Brewers are doing there.

 

If the Brewers can fix Burnes I would hope they may be able to fix some other hard throwers.

 

Maybe that confidence had something to do with the return in the Arcia trade.

[markedman5]

So after watching Burnes dominate again today it got me thinking.

 

Have we ever had a pitcher with better stuff? I mean ever? I’m not saying he’s the best pitcher....at least not yet.....just the best most dominant arsenal of pitches.

 

I know CC was at the top of his game when he pitched that short stint for us but even his stuff wasn’t as quite at the level of what we’ve seen from Burnes in 20-21. IMO

 

Sheets had great stuff but was basically a 2 pitch pitcher.

 

Anyone else that compares?

[nate82]

So after watching Burnes dominate again today it got me thinking.

 

Have we ever had a pitcher with better stuff? I mean ever? I’m not saying he’s the best pitcher....at least not yet.....just the best most dominant arsenal of pitches.

 

I know CC was at the top of his game when he pitched that short stint for us but even his stuff wasn’t as quite at the level of what we’ve seen from Burnes in 20-21. IMO

 

Sheets had great stuff but was basically a 2 pitch pitcher.

 

Anyone else that compares?

 

I think the closest the Brewers have come to what Burnes is doing now is 2004 with Ben Sheets. If Burnes can duplicate that oh my that will be awesome. I don't think he will get the same amount of innings as Sheets did in 2004 and will probably be just short in terms of strikeouts but I think it will be just as dominating as that 2004 year Sheets had.

[FVBrewerFan]

Juan Nieves and/or Teddy Higuera maybe. Sabathia during his short stint here for sure. Ben Hendrickson obviously.

[markedman5]

Can’t believe I forgot Hendrickson......

[CheezWizHed]

Sheets had a great CB, but his FB was pretty straight. Very good when he had both working, but never truly dominant.

 

I would say, Higuera.

[HiAndTight]

Sheets had a great CB, but his FB was pretty straight. Very good when he had both working, but never truly dominant.

 

I would say, Higuera.

 

 

He was pretty dominant in '04. The fastball was straight, but he could put it wherever he wanted when he was right. And then that big 12-6...he was pretty filthy.

 

That was his only truly dominant season, but he was generally pretty underrated in my opinion. The perception that he didn't put in the work and was always injured didn't help.

[wallus]

The Ben Sheets curveball is my favorite pitch thrown by any Brewer. The Williams changeup is a close 2nd.

[CheezWizHed]

Sheets had a great CB, but his FB was pretty straight. Very good when he had both working, but never truly dominant.

 

I would say, Higuera.

 

 

He was pretty dominant in '04. The fastball was straight, but he could put it wherever he wanted when he was right. And then that big 12-6...he was pretty filthy.

 

That was his only truly dominant season, but he was generally pretty underrated in my opinion. The perception that he didn't put in the work and was always injured didn't help.

 

Yeah, I thought about his one season when I was writing that. But he had a lot of good and meh seasons too. By dominant, I was thinking someone sustaining for a while.

 

FYI, in 1987 (i.e. Team Streak), Higuera had a team record 32 consecutive scoreless innings.

 

Edit - I went to compare the two. Sheets did have a better tail than I remembered (4 years of sub-4.00 ERA after his one dominant year. Higuera was handicapped by starting much older (27 for his MLB debut). Higuera did have 2 very dominant years (sub 3 ERA) with another 3 very good years (sub 4.00). So the two are pretty close overall.

[JackNicholson1974]

Can we get excited about Burnes and Woodruff yet?

[jjfanec]

Can we get excited about Burnes and Woodruff yet?

 

And maybe Peralta...

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Can we get excited about Burnes and Woodruff yet?

 

And maybe Peralta...

 

Heck, as far as I'm concerned, you can throw Houser and his 1.80 ERA in as well. Small sample alert obviously, but he's looked good so far as well.

[CheezWizHed]

I remember back in 2019, we were excited to have Woodruff, Burnes, and Peralta in the lineup, but only Woody was able to stick. Now the trio certainly look like they will stick around. Houser's results still seem a bit better than he is pitching, but if he can hold around a 4.0-4.5 ERA, that would make quite a quartet of pitchers for our starting rotation.

[adambr2]

Houser to me just isn't close to the level of the other three. He's closer to Brett Anderson though there's still some upside there. If we got a 4-4.50 ERA from him starting I'd be very happy.

 

Burnes is kind of on a tier of his own to me really. I wonder if they will continue to treat Woodruff as their #1 (opening day, first turn in playoffs, etc) when Burnes is clearly the better pitcher.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I wonder if they will continue to treat Woodruff as their #1 (opening day, first turn in playoffs, etc) when Burnes is clearly the better pitcher.

 

Certainly not a bad problem to have. But as a longtime Brewer fan, this concept is nearly impossible to comprehend. It might as well be in Greek to me.

[Zad Fnark]

Looks good that Burnes and Woodroof are lined up to face San Diego. We'll definitely need them then.

[homer]

There was an article on Fangraphs about Burnes this morning. I don't know if you have to pay to see it. I'm a member so I was able to read.

 

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/cutter-in-hand-corbin-burnes-is-the-hottest-pitcher-on-the-planet/

[Fear The Chorizo]

Something to keep in mind related to consistent angst over farm system rankings in recent years - when the Brewers had a very highly regarded farm system from 2016-2017 and it was gutted of many of the prospects that led to its high regard (Ortiz, Brinson, Diaz, Harrison, Medeiros, Dubon, Yamamoto, etc). Woodruff, Burnes, and Peralta were in that mix but never were thought of as headline prospects for a system rankings service....throw in Devin Williams and others currently on the Milwaukee MLB pitching staff, too. Right this moment despite a low system ranking, the strength of the Brewers' farm appears to be pitching.

 

Under Stearns, one thing the Brewers have done a much, much better job at is identifying and developing their own pitching talent - and seemingly understanding which of those arms was worth retaining and which would be most valuable to the organization to include in trades to bolster the MLB roster.

[Zad Fnark]

There was an article on Fangraphs about Burnes this morning. I don't know if you have to pay to see it. I'm a member so I was able to read.

 

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/cutter-in-hand-corbin-burnes-is-the-hottest-pitcher-on-the-planet/

 

It works. You're good.

[Fear The Chorizo]

The other thing this article got me thinking about was how much Jimmy Nelson improved as a pitcher once Stearns and company showed up after some offseason tinkering...and how insane the rotation would be right now had that 2017 version of Jimmy remained instead of ruining his shoulder sliding into a 1st base.

[adambr2]

Jimmy would have hit free agency by now. I think you could pretty legitimately question if he'd still be here even if his career had continued to follow the 2017 trajectory.

[HiAndTight]

Jimmy would have hit free agency by now. I think you could pretty legitimately question if he'd still be here even if his career had continued to follow the 2017 trajectory.

 

 

No, I'm sure he'd be gone. But the Brewers may have made a World Series...and another playoff series.

 

But unless we'd have signed him to an extension that year, he'd likey be gone. Still fun to think about a rotation with 4 home grown starters in Woody, Nelson, Burnes and Peralta.

[HiAndTight]

Something to keep in mind related to consistent angst over farm system rankings in recent years - when the Brewers had a very highly regarded farm system from 2016-2017 and it was gutted of many of the prospects that led to its high regard (Ortiz, Brinson, Diaz, Harrison, Medeiros, Dubon, Yamamoto, etc). Woodruff, Burnes, and Peralta were in that mix but never were thought of as headline prospects for a system rankings service....throw in Devin Williams and others currently on the Milwaukee MLB pitching staff, too. Right this moment despite a low system ranking, the strength of the Brewers' farm appears to be pitching.

 

Under Stearns, one thing the Brewers have done a much, much better job at is identifying and developing their own pitching talent - and seemingly understanding which of those arms was worth retaining and which would be most valuable to the organization to include in trades to bolster the MLB roster.

 

 

Absolutely. It wouldn't shock me if Ashby and Small develop into really nice starters. Kelly has Chris Sale type upside.

 

It's the position players that are the biggest question mark. Will Mitchell be able to maximize his power with his launch angle, can Turang make the adjustments...but they've earned the benefit of the doubt with their young arms.

 

It's certainly WAY too premature to suggest we've got a Indians type thing going with our young arms, but it's sure as hell trending in the right direction. Now just PLEASE get some minor league games in so that I can overanalyze one start and start making grand declarations based on Ethan Small's velocity in his first AA start!

[StearnsFTW]

So, if you're Stearns, what are you offering Woodruff and Burnes right now to buy out their arby and a couple years of FA?

 

5/50? I really don't know. I feel like I'd be thrilled if they both signed that right now, but would they?