Spring Training Battle: 3B (and SS and UT)

[brewcrewdue80]

Lets hope Arcia continues his trend on bat improvements aside from his 2019. Ezit velocity and launch angle maybe its time for his breakout. Higher EV and launch means more line drives and less grounders to SS/3b. Maybe even crank a few more HRs on a tiny improvement with both. But it'd be telling if after 60days the numbers regressed to part ways. They must be seeing something to want to continue starting him.

What's weird is Shaw would be the better platoon side for 3b.

[jerichoholicninja]

Arcia is going to be the new Hernan Perez. A guy where we all get frustrated because he is playing far more than he should

 

Haven't we felt that way about Arcia for about 3 years already?

[jerichoholicninja]

Arcia is going to be the new Hernan Perez. A guy where we all get frustrated because he is playing far more than he should

 

Haven't we felt that way about Arcia for about 3 years already?

[monty57]

 

Yeah, it's too early in spring for anything conclusive, but it looks to me like they're grooming Arcia to be a super-utility guy who can play almost every position on the field. He's a naturally good defender, so I'd guess that with a little practice he'll be able to play anywhere on the field.

 

But his bat just doesn't play.

Hoping last year was the real Arcia offensively, but I've seen his act before.

Plenty!

If we have to settle for him pinch hitting late in games, that will not be ideal.

If he is a defensive replacement late in games, and somehow gets meaningful at bats, also not ideal.

 

We should have other guys on the bench for late-inning pinch hit appearances, or just to pinch hit for the pitcher. We really shouldn't have a lot of guys who need defensive replacements, so his biggest role would be to get spot starts here and there at SS and maybe 2B. I guess that if Urias is batting 8th then Arcia could also be a double-switch candidate with the pitchers hitting again this year.

 

It's not a bad thing to have a "defense first" guy on the bench who can play every position. It may be the reason we can keep a "bat only" guy on the bench. We should have a five-man bench, and Arcia will probably be choice #3 as a pinch hitter vs lefties and #5 as a pinch hitter vs righties. He will, however, be choice #1 to play SS if Urias gets hurt or needs a break, as he's the only other guy on the roster we should probably trust to play shortstop for more than an emergency inning or two.

 

Bottom line: I'd bet that there are plenty of teams that would trade their utility infielder for Orlando Arcia. He's not that expensive, and he's a pretty good insurance policy.

[monty57]

 

Yeah, it's too early in spring for anything conclusive, but it looks to me like they're grooming Arcia to be a super-utility guy who can play almost every position on the field. He's a naturally good defender, so I'd guess that with a little practice he'll be able to play anywhere on the field.

 

But his bat just doesn't play.

Hoping last year was the real Arcia offensively, but I've seen his act before.

Plenty!

If we have to settle for him pinch hitting late in games, that will not be ideal.

If he is a defensive replacement late in games, and somehow gets meaningful at bats, also not ideal.

 

We should have other guys on the bench for late-inning pinch hit appearances, or just to pinch hit for the pitcher. We really shouldn't have a lot of guys who need defensive replacements, so his biggest role would be to get spot starts here and there at SS and maybe 2B. I guess that if Urias is batting 8th then Arcia could also be a double-switch candidate with the pitchers hitting again this year.

 

It's not a bad thing to have a "defense first" guy on the bench who can play every position. It may be the reason we can keep a "bat only" guy on the bench. We should have a five-man bench, and Arcia will probably be choice #3 as a pinch hitter vs lefties and #5 as a pinch hitter vs righties. He will, however, be choice #1 to play SS if Urias gets hurt or needs a break, as he's the only other guy on the roster we should probably trust to play shortstop for more than an emergency inning or two.

 

Bottom line: I'd bet that there are plenty of teams that would trade their utility infielder for Orlando Arcia. He's not that expensive, and he's a pretty good insurance policy.

[clancyphile]

Arcia is going to be the new Hernan Perez. A guy where we all get frustrated because he is playing far more than he should

 

Haven't we felt that way about Arcia for about 3 years already?

 

Right here...

 

Was even willing to re-sign Moustakas to play short after 2019.

[clancyphile]

Arcia is going to be the new Hernan Perez. A guy where we all get frustrated because he is playing far more than he should

 

Haven't we felt that way about Arcia for about 3 years already?

 

Right here...

 

Was even willing to re-sign Moustakas to play short after 2019.

[Warning Track Power]

Arcia is going to be the new Hernan Perez. A guy where we all get frustrated because he is playing far more than he should

 

Haven't we felt that way about Arcia for about 3 years already?

We absolutely have. Just now he won't just be starting at SS over Urias, but also will be starting over Shaw or Robertson at 3B and Wong at 2B...and god forbid CF over Cain or Taylor

[Warning Track Power]

Arcia is going to be the new Hernan Perez. A guy where we all get frustrated because he is playing far more than he should

 

Haven't we felt that way about Arcia for about 3 years already?

We absolutely have. Just now he won't just be starting at SS over Urias, but also will be starting over Shaw or Robertson at 3B and Wong at 2B...and god forbid CF over Cain or Taylor

[SeaBass]

 

Arcia as everyday 3B... You gotta be kidding me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My favorite part is how so many people on this board are penciling Shaw in as the every day 3B when Arica has outplayed him each of the last 2 seasons.

 

I don't know about everyone else but I'm still a skeptic when it comes to Shaw. A kinda, sorta, squint-your-eyes-real-hard minor bounce back in 50 games last season wasn't enough for me. I don't dislike him and I'm open minded but I need to see him prove that he deserves playing time.

[SeaBass]

 

Arcia as everyday 3B... You gotta be kidding me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My favorite part is how so many people on this board are penciling Shaw in as the every day 3B when Arica has outplayed him each of the last 2 seasons.

 

I don't know about everyone else but I'm still a skeptic when it comes to Shaw. A kinda, sorta, squint-your-eyes-real-hard minor bounce back in 50 games last season wasn't enough for me. I don't dislike him and I'm open minded but I need to see him prove that he deserves playing time.

[Warning Track Power]

 

Arcia as everyday 3B... You gotta be kidding me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My favorite part is how so many people on this board are penciling Shaw in as the every day 3B when Arica has outplayed him each of the last 2 seasons.

 

I don't know about everyone else but I'm still a skeptic when it comes to Shaw. A kinda, sorta, squint-your-eyes-real-hard minor bounce back in 50 games last season wasn't enough for me. I don't dislike him and I'm open minded but I need to see him prove that he deserves playing time.

Three things related to this:

 

1. I think people, myself included, remember the 2017-2018 Shaw and don't think Arcia at his peak could come close to producing a .258/.347/.844 slash with 30+ HR potential. If you took Arcia's peak #s of any year in his career, you get .277(2017)/.324(2017)/.734 (2019) with 15-20 HR potential

 

2. Arcia is not a 3B and is not a guy who you have to find a spot for in the lineup because of his bat. Arcia's career slash is still .244/.295/.660. In arguably his best offensive season of 2020, Arcia was .260/.317/.734. In 2020, Shaw produced .239/.306/.717. Even in a "down" Shaw year in 2020, he almost reached Arcia's career peaks in OBP and SLG and still almost produced the same in OBP & SLG as Arcia did in 2020.

 

3. I think most people are rooting for Shaw as he was quickly becoming a fan favorite at the time of his slump. While not the face of the franchise, the blue-collar type production (e.g. solid not elite offense coupled with solid not elite defense) really resonates to this fanbase.

 

In terms of production, you generally know what Arcia is. A .250/.300/.700 guy. Shaw has a wider range of outcomes but if he approaches something close to his peak, significantly passes Arcia's OBP and SLG and is an actual 3B. I give Shaw every chance to lose the job.

[Warning Track Power]

 

Arcia as everyday 3B... You gotta be kidding me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My favorite part is how so many people on this board are penciling Shaw in as the every day 3B when Arica has outplayed him each of the last 2 seasons.

 

I don't know about everyone else but I'm still a skeptic when it comes to Shaw. A kinda, sorta, squint-your-eyes-real-hard minor bounce back in 50 games last season wasn't enough for me. I don't dislike him and I'm open minded but I need to see him prove that he deserves playing time.

Three things related to this:

 

1. I think people, myself included, remember the 2017-2018 Shaw and don't think Arcia at his peak could come close to producing a .258/.347/.844 slash with 30+ HR potential. If you took Arcia's peak #s of any year in his career, you get .277(2017)/.324(2017)/.734 (2019) with 15-20 HR potential

 

2. Arcia is not a 3B and is not a guy who you have to find a spot for in the lineup because of his bat. Arcia's career slash is still .244/.295/.660. In arguably his best offensive season of 2020, Arcia was .260/.317/.734. In 2020, Shaw produced .239/.306/.717. Even in a "down" Shaw year in 2020, he almost reached Arcia's career peaks in OBP and SLG and still almost produced the same in OBP & SLG as Arcia did in 2020.

 

3. I think most people are rooting for Shaw as he was quickly becoming a fan favorite at the time of his slump. While not the face of the franchise, the blue-collar type production (e.g. solid not elite offense coupled with solid not elite defense) really resonates to this fanbase.

 

In terms of production, you generally know what Arcia is. A .250/.300/.700 guy. Shaw has a wider range of outcomes but if he approaches something close to his peak, significantly passes Arcia's OBP and SLG and is an actual 3B. I give Shaw every chance to lose the job.

[SoCalBrewfan]

While it's fun to argue about who will be where at the start of the season, I think it's unlikely that the opening day lineup (much less the March 2 chatter about said lineup) is the same one taking the field for a hypothetical playoff game. Moreso than in past years, the error bars on projected performance seem huge, and so I imagine that the first month plus of the season is going to be partly about evaluation.

 

And really that's been Stearns' MO from the beginning, particularly for those last few utility and bullpen roles. I fully expect to tune in one weeknight only to find Jacemark McSpangenmilleradino our new starting 3B.

[SoCalBrewfan]

While it's fun to argue about who will be where at the start of the season, I think it's unlikely that the opening day lineup (much less the March 2 chatter about said lineup) is the same one taking the field for a hypothetical playoff game. Moreso than in past years, the error bars on projected performance seem huge, and so I imagine that the first month plus of the season is going to be partly about evaluation.

 

And really that's been Stearns' MO from the beginning, particularly for those last few utility and bullpen roles. I fully expect to tune in one weeknight only to find Jacemark McSpangenmilleradino our new starting 3B.

[JohnBriggs12]

Comment from SD crew when Blake Snell blew a fastball by Urias for strike 3 in opening inning : "I seem to recall Urias having trouble catching up to good hard stuff when he was here"

 

The SS battle is far from over. Arcia was at times the best hitter in the lineup in 2020.

[JohnBriggs12]

Comment from SD crew when Blake Snell blew a fastball by Urias for strike 3 in opening inning : "I seem to recall Urias having trouble catching up to good hard stuff when he was here"

 

The SS battle is far from over. Arcia was at times the best hitter in the lineup in 2020.

[jerichoholicninja]

Comment from SD crew when Blake Snell blew a fastball by Urias for strike 3 in opening inning : "I seem to recall Urias having trouble catching up to good hard stuff when he was here"

 

The SS battle is far from over. Arcia was at times the best hitter in the lineup in 2020.

 

Which certainly shows how crappy the offense was last year more than anything.

 

I'm sorry but all the wishing and hoping and trying to convince ourselves that Arica might maybe possibly someday be an even average hitter is pie in the sky thinking. The guy's had 5 years and almost 2000 PA's in the majors to prove himself and even at his best, he's been mediocre. But most of the time he's been downright putrid and there's nothing in his minor league stats that says we should expect otherwise.

 

There are some bad hitters you watch at the plate and think, with that swing they could put it together some day. Arcia has the same terrible approach and the same horrible swing he had when he first came up. How he has survived as a major league starter without making any changes to those obviously horrible parts of his game is nothing short of amazing or a travesty. As far as I'm concerned, Urias should be the shortstop only because we don't know he's a terrible hitter and he at least has some minor league record of hitting.

[jerichoholicninja]

Comment from SD crew when Blake Snell blew a fastball by Urias for strike 3 in opening inning : "I seem to recall Urias having trouble catching up to good hard stuff when he was here"

 

The SS battle is far from over. Arcia was at times the best hitter in the lineup in 2020.

 

Which certainly shows how crappy the offense was last year more than anything.

 

I'm sorry but all the wishing and hoping and trying to convince ourselves that Arica might maybe possibly someday be an even average hitter is pie in the sky thinking. The guy's had 5 years and almost 2000 PA's in the majors to prove himself and even at his best, he's been mediocre. But most of the time he's been downright putrid and there's nothing in his minor league stats that says we should expect otherwise.

 

There are some bad hitters you watch at the plate and think, with that swing they could put it together some day. Arcia has the same terrible approach and the same horrible swing he had when he first came up. How he has survived as a major league starter without making any changes to those obviously horrible parts of his game is nothing short of amazing or a travesty. As far as I'm concerned, Urias should be the shortstop only because we don't know he's a terrible hitter and he at least has some minor league record of hitting.

[patrickgpe]

Reyes started at 3rd today and homered. I don’t think we can rule it out if Shaw struggles. I would imagine the brewers want Urias to play as everyday and Arcia be a utility guy. We are less than 2 weeks from when Shaw can opt out so the decision will be made soon

[patrickgpe]

Reyes started at 3rd today and homered. I don’t think we can rule it out if Shaw struggles. I would imagine the brewers want Urias to play as everyday and Arcia be a utility guy. We are less than 2 weeks from when Shaw can opt out so the decision will be made soon

[brewmann04]

Has Shaw gotten an AB yet? I thought i read he has a May 15 opt out?

[brewmann04]

Has Shaw gotten an AB yet? I thought i read he has a May 15 opt out?

[patrickgpe]

At this point, I’d be shocked if he doesn’t opt out, unless he starts getting the majority of the at bats soon

[patrickgpe]

At this point, I’d be shocked if he doesn’t opt out, unless he starts getting the majority of the at bats soon