Kolten Wong to Brewers

[monty57]

We added a Gold Glove-caliber second baseman who gets on base, and will get a Gold Glove center fielder who gets on base back in the lineup. "Moneyball" taught me that OBP has a high correlation to scoring runs, and common sense tells me that good defense has a high correlation to preventing runs.

 

We needed to cut back on strikeouts and get on base more. This move helps with that. Hiura was by far the worst defensive second baseman in the league. This move helps with that. I'm sure Stearns has a plan with what he's going to do with Keston.

[MrTPlush]

Always amusing to see how some viral falsehood can take off on these forums. Wong has a "noodle" bat? The last full season he hit .285/.361/.423/.784 with 11 HR and 24 SB (and elite defense).

 

No kidding. Incredible how badly people want to be mad.

 

Maybe the fact he has had two good years with the bat and the rest have been underwhelming to pretty bad. Isn’t a whole lot different than Avisail Garcia who many didn’t like (myself included) and it ended up fully justified last year.

 

I think Wong ends up a better sign than Garcia, but it could easily end up just as bad from an offensive standpoint. His career isn’t consistently great.

 

I can see why some my not like it a ton.

[NievesNoNO]

I like it. Improved. Hiura at 1st with a future at DH is fine by me.

[SRB]

You were talking about swinging a noodle. That would imply power, would it not?

 

I think it implies an inability to hit. If you just want ISO, I bet we could get Jay Bruce for cheap. He hit 26 HR in 2019.. with a .261 OBP.

[StearnsFTW]

Cain

Wong

Hiura

Yelich

Garcia

Narvaez

Arcia

Urias

P

 

I can dig it. Our bench stinks, but I like the lineup. Still would like a better 3b and make Urias the SS/ultra utility man, but it's got potential.

[SeaBass]

Considering the Brewers signed Sogard to a $4.5 million deal before the start of last season I like this signing so much more. He should be solid offensively, great defensively and be an all around good asset. Refreshing.

 

I'm not thrilled with the prospect of Hiura being a potential trade piece, I'm not against trading him but his value is definitely at its lowest point after his struggles in 2020. I supposed his value is only marginally lower though so it might not be quite so bad.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Considering the Brewers signed Sogard to a $4.5 million deal before the start of last season I like this signing so much more. He should be solid offensively, great defensively and be an all around good asset. Refreshing.

 

I'm not thrilled with the prospect of Hiura being a potential trade piece, I'm not against trading him but his value is definitely at its lowest point after his struggles in 2020. I supposed his value is only marginally lower though so it might not be quite so bad.

 

I would hope that any team that is taking Hiura's 2020 numbers into account when determining his value, and significantly lowering it, would not be a legit trade partner.

[Underachiever]

At this point catcher is a black hole offensively as is shortstop and third base. I also expect Garcia to be just as bad as he was last season.

Is your projection system basically limited to players' time with the Brewers?

Well, he watched Yelich in 2018 and 2019 and considers him not "consistently great", so I'd say no.

[monty57]

Isn’t a whole lot different than Avisail Garcia who many didn’t like (myself included) and it ended up fully justified last year.

 

I get what you're saying, but I don't think anything can be considered "fully justified" by only using what happened in 2020.

[RollieTime]

I don't expect much offense from Cain. Yelich better be close to MVP level or we will be bad and I expect Hiura to hit if he is even with us.

 

At this point catcher is a black hole offensively as is shortstop and third base. I also expect Garcia to be just as bad as he was last season.

 

If Hiura does end up playing first base we should be solid offensively at first, and left field and average to below average everywhere else. Sorry but I just don't see this team having nearly enough offense and think that Haines may be the worst hitting coach in baseball.

 

Narvaez is a .270/.350/.750 hitter regardless of the results of his 100 at bats last season. Yelich, Cain, and Hiura should also be above average. Wong will be at least average to slightly above average offensively. Garcia is due to return to the mean of being a solid hitter as well. It’s too early to tell what we have in Urias and Arcia seemed to show some life last season in roughly 200 at bats.

 

Essentially, acquiring Wong gave us a gold glove second baseman as well as an average bat, giving us a first baseman that will hit over 30 homeruns and could be a .280ish hitter. Isn’t improving at first and third what people wanted? Hiura shouldn’t be worse than Vogelbach defensively at first with being a much much better offensive player. The only hole left is third which could easily be filled with someone like Asdrubal Cabrera on a cheap deal.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I feel like the 'overpriced' comments are just outdated. Eric Sogard commands $2-3 million.

[adambr2]

My issue is not so much with the player its need vs money .all we heard all off season was its going to be tight etc etc so we overpay at postion thats loaded already and no I do not belive Hirua can play 1st base In fact I think thats a disaster waiting to happen..so how did we improve? We raised our payroll and even though wong may play everyday I don't belive we gained a starter because now someone's got to sit at a postion with to many players

 

I don't think it's fair to say we overpaid, as it really doesn't appear so. And Wong is the starter at 2B. There's no way he's sitting in 2021.

 

Hiura is either the 1B, the DH if they get that sorted out, or traded.

 

I would also like to point out that the Brewers seem to very much like to try to negotiate an extra club option year into most of their contracts when possible and there is obviously a bit of an expected extra cost to us associated with getting that extra year of control without guaranteeing it.

 

Usually, those costs are figured into the announcement of these deals but not always. It could very well be a 2/16 contract with a 2M buyout on a 10M team option for 2023.

[MrTPlush]

Considering the Brewers signed Sogard to a $4.5 million deal before the start of last season I like this signing so much more. He should be solid offensively, great defensively and be an all around good asset. Refreshing.

 

I'm not thrilled with the prospect of Hiura being a potential trade piece, I'm not against trading him but his value is definitely at its lowest point after his struggles in 2020. I supposed his value is only marginally lower though so it might not be quite so bad.

 

I would hope that any team that is taking Hiura's 2020 numbers into account when determining his value, and significantly lowering it, would not be a legit trade partner.

 

Of course you wouldn’t want to trade with them, but a smart team probably would want to take his 2020 into serious consideration. His 2019 was a good predictor to his poor 2020. Maybe one wasn’t expecting it it too be as bad as it was, but a massive decline was pretty obvious. He had a .402 BABIP and 30.7% K rate in 2019. All that really changed is the results started matching the actual performance, which wasn’t that good. The only strange thing was he went from a doubles machine to not being able to buy one. Still, even if you made that a little more realistic he was probably still a sub .800 hitter.

 

Everyone wants to throw out 2020 results, fine, but there is a reason he wasn’t good and it dates back to his finer 2019 numbers. Same goes for Avisail Garcia. His 2020 was not a big shocker, it was close to his career average and not one of his lone outlier years. Some poor years were shocking and unexpected (Baez/Yelich) and others the writing was on the wall (Garcia/Hiura).

[pacopete4]

Stearns man. Love this guy. Just continues to find value. Wong will help the top half of this lineup score more runs and it will help this pitching staff keep runs off the board. If I remember correctly, the goal is to outscore the opponent and this helps a bunch. Good stuff!

 

Now just get Braun back here as the DH and let's get after it.

[JohnBriggs12]

Kolten Wong has career .855 OPS at American Family Field.

 

That seems good.

 

Has 6 lifetime HR at Miller Park, more than any other road park, and has slugged a healthy .482 there. Sample size is pretty significant too. Am Fam Field favors LH hitters in the alley and he should take advantage of it enough to up his HR totals into the 15 range.

 

Hopefully it frees up Hiura to be able to concentrate on his hitting. I think he'll settle in quickly at 1B but he's going to have to hit better than he did in 2020.

 

Looks like Robertson and Urias will be main competitors at 3B unless they can upgrade somehow.

[monty57]

Considering the Brewers signed Sogard to a $4.5 million deal before the start of last season I like this signing so much more. He should be solid offensively, great defensively and be an all around good asset. Refreshing.

 

I'm not thrilled with the prospect of Hiura being a potential trade piece, I'm not against trading him but his value is definitely at its lowest point after his struggles in 2020. I supposed his value is only marginally lower though so it might not be quite so bad.

 

I would hope that any team that is taking Hiura's 2020 numbers into account when determining his value, and significantly lowering it, would not be a legit trade partner.

 

Of course you wouldn’t want to trade with them, but a smart team probably would want to take his 2020 into serious consideration. His 2019 was a good predictor to his poor 2020. Maybe one wasn’t expecting it it too be as bad as it was, but a massive decline was pretty obvious. He had a .402 BABIP and 30.7% K rate in 2019. All that really changed is the results started matching the actual performance, which wasn’t that good. The only strange thing was he went from a doubles machine to not being able to buy one. Still, even if you made that a little more realistic he was probably still a sub .800 hitter.

 

Everyone wants to throw out 2020 results, fine, but there is a reason he wasn’t good and it dates back to his finer 2019 numbers. Same goes for Avisail Garcia. His 2020 was not a big shocker, it was close to his career average and not one of his lone outlier years. Some poor years were shocking and unexpected (Baez/Yelich) and others the writing was on the wall (Garcia/Hiura).

 

Look at Hiura's minor league stats, and they look a lot more like 2019 than 2020. The biggest concern for me is that he jumped from around a 20% K rate in the minors to over 30% both years in the majors, which is a concern. He's always been able to hit, so I expect him to be better than he was in 2020, but I would like to see the strikeout rate drop.

[Vollbc74]

2018-2020 MLB AVG 2B OPS: 714

18: 714

19: 737

20: 692

 

2018-2020 Wong OPS: 742

18: 720

19: 784

20: 675

 

Elite defensive 2B and over the last 3 years (age 27-30) he has been a better than average bat in 2 of those 3 years. Love the signing

[PeaveyFury]

If someone can verify, hasn't a lot of the concern regarding Hiura's defense been related to his arm? If so, that's obviously lessened considerably as a 1B. Presumably, range ability as a 2B is also boosted by playing first?

[mtrebs]

I like this move... and I don’t like anything. So there’s that.

[DR28]

Cain

Wong

Hiura

Yelich

Garcia

Narvaez

Arcia

Urias

P

 

I can dig it. Our bench stinks, but I like the lineup. Still would like a better 3b and make Urias the SS/ultra utility man, but it's got potential.

 

I would go:

 

Wong

Cain

Yelich

 

Get the two table setters on base before Yelich steps to the plate.

[Roderick]

I don't think it is an overpay for the player, versus what another team would also pay. It just doesn't seem like an efficient move, unless the DH is here for 2021.

 

We are either trading Huira (after a bad season) or moving him to 1B (hurts overall defense). I guess I was hoping 1B would be available at some point for Yelich. But if Huira hits and there is no DH, we could at least trade him for value to the AL. If he doesn't hit, makes the whole issue not applicable anyways.

 

Is age 30 really a players prime, especially if he isn't a power hitter in the first place?

[Simba2020]

I would have expected Wong to command an $8 to $10 million contract so I think this fits right into that expectation. I like him as a table setter and defensive whiz. Hopefully Hiura can pick up first base at least passably. Nobody wanted to go into the season with Vogelbach playing first and I can't see Hiura being any worse than that. If he is you either bide time until the DH likely becomes an option next year or he gets traded.

[SoCalBrewfan]

I think it's funny to complain about a stat being 'made-up'...as though batting average or RBI or fielding percentage or ERA were handed down from the heavens on a crystal tablet. Of course it's made up. So is ERA, and people seem to have no trouble using that in an argument. Just say what you mean: I don't trust stats invented after I was born.

 

Wong deal is sneaky good I think, the defensive bump going from Hiura to Wong is about as big as is possible, and we didn't really have a 1B so Hiura can focus on the part of the game that he's good at. Wong has little power but the issue with the Brewers wasn't with the big swingers, it was too few guys getting on base to extend innings and make the big swings count for more. I like it. Now I would like some clarity on the left hand side of the infield, if that's not too much to ask.

[StearnsFTW]

Cain

Wong

Hiura

Yelich

Garcia

Narvaez

Arcia

Urias

P

 

I can dig it. Our bench stinks, but I like the lineup. Still would like a better 3b and make Urias the SS/ultra utility man, but it's got potential.

 

I would go:

 

Wong

Cain

Yelich

 

Get the two table setters on base before Yelich steps to the plate.

 

You talked me into it.

 

I bet CC goes my way as long as Cain is healthy (and I don't think that makes it right).

[SRB]

We are either trading Huira (after a bad season) or moving him to 1B (hurts overall defense).

 

Hiura would have to be Braun-at-3B-level bad at 1B for this to not be a huge overall upgrade on defense. (If he even plays there at all, I suspect Stearns is confident there will be a DH in 2021.)