Kolten Wong to Brewers

[tmwiese55]

Not much of an opinion either way. Overall glad they did something and I assume Keston is 1B.

 

One thing I'd note is I was surprised by Wong's offensive stats when I saw. Based on what he does vs MKE I expected a year or two in there with around 20 HRs, but just overall more pop. Seems like 1/3 of his HRs must have come vs MKE (note that's hyperbole I did no fact checking on it, just gut haha)

[DR28]

brad miller, ugh.

 

why can't we just let urias have a chance at 3rd?

or if you want to pick someone off the scrap heap get Jake Lamb.

 

Does this help you feel better about Miller?

 

2018-20 vs RHP AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS

Brad Miller .253/.339/.487/.825

 

2018-20 vs LHP AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS

Luis Urias .337/.373/.500/.873

Daniel Robertson .260/.368/.382/.749

[SRB]

I think some of you are greatly exaggerating the defensive and offensive differences between 2B and 3B. I completely get not wanting to mess with something that's already working, but if he is a Gold Glove defender at 2B he would likely be a premier defender at 3B as well.

 

If you think Wong's bat won't play at 3B, then I hate to point out that our current options are Luis Urias and Daniel Robertson. Plus, setting aside the platoon/flexibility issues and the fact that we are probably not going to have a static infield, the overall offense in that scenario for the "normal" starters would be Vogelbach/Hiura/Wong, versus Hiura/Wong/(Urias/Robertson).

 

If we are getting good years from Wong offensively (around a .335 wOBA), then combined with his excellent defense at 3B that is more or less one of Manny Machado's down years. Hardly "unplayable" at 3B.

 

I think it is clearly at least possible that Stearns has this in mind. Maybe unlikely.

[Thurston Fluff]

If Hiura's typical year is .260/.340/.500 with 32 HR (essentially his full year stats so far), he's a mid pack 1B. If he did that every year at 2b and improved his defense there to average, he'd be an All Star in his good years. He'd have a lot more competition to make it at 1B. Not that he's not capable of replicating his rookie numbers which would put him in the mix. The hope is the move to first will allow him to focus more on his hitting and not let a bad play in the field take away from his concentration at the plate.

 

I'm left handed. If I can just improve my velocity and control to league average I'll be rich. You can't just will yourself into something you're not.

[MrTPlush]

Kolton Wong is using a pool noodle to throw compared to Manny Machado. Machado can make rocket throws 10 feet into foul territory, Wong would have to use the pitcher as a cut off man. His arm is fine, but I think it would be quite ‘meh’ at 3B. A big part of Wong’s defense looks to be his range...something not really needed at 3B. Even if he gets to a ball over at 3B I am not sure he has the arm to actually get it to first in time for outs. If he doesn’t get to utilize his range and has an average arm you will waste a lot of his defensive value.

 

As far as offense at the two positions he was 8th at 2B and would have been 14th at 3B (per fangraphs 2019). That is assuming a career year though. If he ends up giving closer to zero offensive value he is still 11th per 2019 second baseman. However a no offense third baseman in 2019 would have been ranked 19th. It’s a big difference offensively.

[monty57]

Putting Kolton Wong at 3B would be a total waste. We could have spent $1mil if all you wanted was a .700 - .750 OPS third baseman.

 

Or we could just keep Urias there and save the million dollars.

 

I would be surprised if Wong is anything but our second baseman. Barring further moves, I think Urias is the guy who will be all over the infield, getting starts almost every day, but that time will be split between 2B, 3B and SS. He makes a great platoon partner with Wong at second, and can play SS or 3B on the days we're facing a righty.

[DR28]

Putting Kolton Wong at 3B would be a total waste. We could have spent $1mil if all you wanted was a .700 - .750 OPS third baseman.

 

Or we could just keep Urias there and save the million dollars.

 

I would be surprised if Wong is anything but our second baseman. Barring further moves, I think Urias is the guy who will be all over the infield, getting starts almost every day, but that time will be split between 2B, 3B and SS. He makes a great platoon partner with Wong at second, and can play SS or 3B on the days we're facing a righty.

 

I would much rather add a lefty bat at 3B, Urias would play 2B against lefties, which he kills.

[monty57]

Putting Kolton Wong at 3B would be a total waste. We could have spent $1mil if all you wanted was a .700 - .750 OPS third baseman.

 

Or we could just keep Urias there and save the million dollars.

 

I would be surprised if Wong is anything but our second baseman. Barring further moves, I think Urias is the guy who will be all over the infield, getting starts almost every day, but that time will be split between 2B, 3B and SS. He makes a great platoon partner with Wong at second, and can play SS or 3B on the days we're facing a righty.

 

I would much rather add a lefty bat at 3B, Urias would play 2B against lefties, which he kills.

 

I'm all for adding a good 3B, but if we do then I hope Urias is our starting SS. If he's relegated to short-side-of-a-platoon third baseman then we should trade him now when he still has some value. He could start at SS vs righties and 3B vs lefties, but we'd still need a platoon at 2B for Wong and Hiura doesn't fit that bill as his backup at first is LH-hitting Vogelbach.

 

Robertson is a possibility, but if we add a LH-hitting 3B, then he could be off the roster. I guess the bottom line is that while I like the Wong signing, there are still a lot of questions.

[DR28]

I'm all for adding a good 3B, but if we do then I hope Urias is our starting SS. If he's relegated to short-side-of-a-platoon third baseman then we should trade him now when he still has some value. He could start at SS vs righties and 3B vs lefties, but we'd still need a platoon at 2B for Wong and Hiura doesn't fit that bill as his backup at first is LH-hitting Vogelbach.

 

Robertson is a possibility, but if we add a LH-hitting 3B, then he could be off the roster. I guess the bottom line is that while I like the Wong signing, there are still a lot of questions.

 

Oh definitely agree, its Urias' time at SS... We know what Arcia is.

[adambr2]

Honestly, for all this discussion about Hiura, I would not be at all surprised if he stays at 2B and Wong moves full-time to 3B.

 

You have literally one of the best if not the best defensive 2B in baseball and you're going to move him to a position he's never played in his career to keep an absolute defensive butcher at his position?

 

I don't think so.

 

And presumably Wong's plus defense would translate to 3B, a position we currently have a vacancy at. I'm not saying it's what I would do, but would you really be shocked if the organization who moved Moustakas to 2B would do this?

 

For the record, moving Wong to 3B would not even affect his "value" given that, unless I'm mistaken, WAR uses the same positional adjustment for 2B and 3B. His defensive value likely could even increase at 3B.

 

Yes. I'd be shocked. Part of the whole benefit of signing Wong was getting Keston off of a position that he simply can't play. 2B got a massive defensive upgrade and 1B got a big upgrade with this move.

 

I don't think they're looking back. It's similar to when Braun was moved off of 3rd. He was a butcher at 3rd and he turned out to be okay in the OF. Hopefully this move will turn out similarly.

[3and2Fastball]

Kolton Wong is using a pool noodle to throw compared to Manny Machado. Machado can make rocket throws 10 feet into foul territory, Wong would have to use the pitcher as a cut off man.

 

Quite possibly the “sentence of the year” so far at Brewerfan! I mean hey, Woodruff etc can throw mid 90’s, maybe the cut off man would work!

 

I like the signing. I don’t like the signing all that much if the Brewers don’t do much else. Thinking the $18 million could be allocated towards a bigger need.

 

Is this Stearns zigging when we expect him to zag? Is Keston going to be traded? Did Stearns’ computer say that a Gold Glove 2B will make the pitching staff much better?

 

I do look forward to Arcia and Wong turning 2 together.

[wntrtxn21]

I think some of you are greatly exaggerating the defensive and offensive differences between 2B and 3B. I completely get not wanting to mess with something that's already working, but if he is a Gold Glove defender at 2B he would likely be a premier defender at 3B as well.

 

If you think Wong's bat won't play at 3B, then I hate to point out that our current options are Luis Urias and Daniel Robertson. Plus, setting aside the platoon/flexibility issues and the fact that we are probably not going to have a static infield, the overall offense in that scenario for the "normal" starters would be Vogelbach/Hiura/Wong, versus Hiura/Wong/(Urias/Robertson).

 

If we are getting good years from Wong offensively (around a .335 wOBA), then combined with his excellent defense at 3B that is more or less one of Manny Machado's down years. Hardly "unplayable" at 3B.

 

I think it is clearly at least possible that Stearns has this in mind. Maybe unlikely.

 

IMO you are wrong about a 2B being similiar at 3B. The two positions aren't that close. Third is much more reaction and a lot less movement. The throw is about twice as long and in many cases has to be made much quicker. Going from 3B to 2B is much easier than going from 2B to 3B. Maybe Wong has the arm and reactions to do it, but that can't be assumed.

[SRB]

IMO you are wrong about a 2B being similiar at 3B. The two positions aren't that close. Third is much more reaction and a lot less movement. The throw is about twice as long and in many cases has to be made much quicker. Going from 3B to 2B is much easier than going from 2B to 3B. Maybe Wong has the arm and reactions to do it, but that can't be assumed.

 

I'm not assuming it. I'm suggesting it is a possibility.

[markedman5]

I don’t think Stearns signed the best defensive 2nd baseman in all of baseball to move him to 3rd base.

 

My guess is there will be another move or 2 and everything will become clear.

[MadScientist]

BF.net - The Brewers defense up the middle is terrible. Huira is an absolute butcher at second.

Brewers - Sign reigning gold glove second baseman.

BF.net - Why did they do this? Huira's bat has such plus potential at second.

 

I'm good with acquiring Wong, but Huira at first has me more that a bit worried. I have visions of him becoming Jaun Francisco 2.0. If there is a DH this year, I could see Huira as DH and Nottingham as 1b.

[markedman5]

I don’t think Nottingham will make the team

[JosephC]

Hiura is playing 1B with Vogelbach likely getting some starts against tough righties. Wong is at 2B pretty much everyday. Arcia at shortstop. Stearns paid a good bit for Urias and I very much doubt that he is just going to toss him aside. I think Urias is the 3B and will be given every opportunity to stick in the starting lineup everyday...Robertson is the fallback plan if Urias fails.

 

I think all the Brewers remaining money will go towards picking up one more starting pitcher.

[tigerbrew]

Wow, really nice to see two Asian Americans in the starting lineup, Hiura in 1B and Wong in 2B, and both guys were 1st round draft picks too.

[Eye Black]

Devin Williams changeup was the final pitch of an at-bat to 67 batters last year. Of those 67 changeup pitches, only two ended in a base hit. Here’s the first player to do it...

 

Baseball Savant Video

[reillymcshane]

Nice article about the deal at Fangraphs: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/brewers-sign-kolten-wong-to-overhaul-infield-defense/

 

The author illustrates the value quite nicely (and includes some sweet video of Wong showing off his glove).

[SeaBass]

I'm good with acquiring Wong, but Huira at first has me more that a bit worried. I have visions of him becoming Jaun Francisco 2.0. If there is a DH this year, I could see Huira as DH and Nottingham as 1b.

I keep seeing this. I guess I need someone to explain this to me like I was 5 years old why a bad defender that plays 2nd base becomes the lynchpin of the coming apocalypse if he shifts to playing 1st base?

 

Is it simply that he'll be involved in more plays? Aren't most of those plays going to be routine "put foot on bag, catch easy throw for out"?

[AKCheesehead]

I’m not banking on it, but I’m also not ruling out the possibility that Hiura could become pretty good at playing 1B.

[Lathund]

I don’t think Nottingham will make the team

 

Likewise. They haven't run 3 catchers for any length of time before (outside of September), and I don't think Nottingham has the bat to play 1st. So I've been expecting him to be part of a trade for some time now. Perhaps they want to see that Manny is fully back from his knee injury before they decide, but them tendering a contract to Piña probably sealed his fate. Like they could trade Manny of course, but I think they value his defense, familiarity with the staff and at least average (for a catcher) hitting. Very hard to find a better backup/platoon catcher than Manny.

[JohnBriggs12]

Hiura is playing 1B with Vogelbach likely getting some starts against tough righties. Wong is at 2B pretty much everyday. Arcia at shortstop. Stearns paid a good bit for Urias and I very much doubt that he is just going to toss him aside. I think Urias is the 3B and will be given every opportunity to stick in the starting lineup everyday...Robertson is the fallback plan if Urias fails.

 

I think all the Brewers remaining money will go towards picking up one more starting pitcher.

 

I think Urias is trade bait myself as part of package for a starting pitcher and they want either Turner or someone like Brad Miller or Jake Lamb to platoon with Robertson. Turang will be Arcia's heir, not Urias.

[Pugger]

We added a Gold Glove-caliber second baseman who gets on base, and will get a Gold Glove center fielder who gets on base back in the lineup. "Moneyball" taught me that OBP has a high correlation to scoring runs, and common sense tells me that good defense has a high correlation to preventing runs.

 

We needed to cut back on strikeouts and get on base more. This move helps with that. Hiura was by far the worst defensive second baseman in the league. This move helps with that. I'm sure Stearns has a plan with what he's going to do with Keston.

 

I like the fact he doesn't strike out a lot and is great on D. Hitting homers isn't the be all end all. I kinda wish Hiura was more like Wong in that regard...