Packer 2021 Team Discussion (Rodgers Out Vs. Chiefs)

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I'm a hard pass on Peterson. Maybe he'd be better not being the best corner on his team, but he's like $9-12 million a year for someone that did not look good this year and has a PED suspension. If they're not going to get someone really good there, just bring King back and draft somebody early.

[PeaveyFury]

I'm a hard pass on Peterson. Maybe he'd be better not being the best corner on his team, but he's like $9-12 million a year for someone that did not look good this year and has a PED suspension. If they're not going to get someone really good there, just bring King back and draft somebody early.

 

Oh, I think it'd have to be entirely dependent on him needing a rebound-type deal. If he's looking to cash in on who he used to be, that's a non-starter for a team like Green Bay, I'd think.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I'm a hard pass on Peterson. Maybe he'd be better not being the best corner on his team, but he's like $9-12 million a year for someone that did not look good this year and has a PED suspension. If they're not going to get someone really good there, just bring King back and draft somebody early.

 

Oh, I think it'd have to be entirely dependent on him needing a rebound-type deal. If he's looking to cash in on who he used to be, that's a non-starter for a team like Green Bay, I'd think.

 

For sure. The only reason the Packers were able to acquire Woodson back in the day is that they were the only team interested that vowed to keep him at CB. A few others, like the Bucs, wanted to sign him and move him to safety.

 

I'm not sure where Peterson's head is at, but his career arch has been eerily similar to Woodson's ... college superstar at a big program who becomes a Top 5 pick, and plays up to that level for several years before injuries and playing on poor teams begin to take their toll. Peterson is roughly about a year older than what Woodson was when he signed with the Packers. The Packers also had a terrific #1 corner at the time they signed Woodson in Al Harris, although Harris was already 32 at the time, unlike the very young Jaire Alexander.

 

Don't know if it could happen. Just saying there are some fun similarities to both players' situations.

[Samurai Bucky]

Regarding King, I thought it was ironic how Breeland (the subject of a comparison with King via the Barry-DC-Washington discussion) completely failed on almost exactly the same play as King (getting burnt at the end of the first half, but getting a PI instead).

 

We tend to forget that both teams have stars that make plays.

We also tend to forget that King was often abused by opposing defenses. He was obviously targeted by the TB offense on multiple occasions and they burnt him.

 

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/by-the-numbers/2020/12/16/22174122/kevin-kings-struggles-have-the-packers-singing-the-boundary-corner-blues

[balsamlaker]

I think it interesting listening to people say the Buccaneers are champions because of who they brought in after Brady. One of the main reasons TB is Super Bowl champions is the job Jason Licht and co. have done the first two days of the draft the last handful of years. If you were wondering "Walter" gave the Licht (GM) extension an "F" grade.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I think everyone knows that defense is the strength of that team, but I never saw Brady throwing 40 TDs this year. He's not physically super impressive in any particular area of QB play but the season he had at 43 was amazing.

 

I thought Tampa was at best a 9-7 team. Had Brady pegged for 25 touchdowns and 3400 yards or something, maybe a loss in the wild card.

[CheezWizHed]

Regarding King, I thought it was ironic how Breeland (the subject of a comparison with King via the Barry-DC-Washington discussion) completely failed on almost exactly the same play as King (getting burnt at the end of the first half, but getting a PI instead).

 

We tend to forget that both teams have stars that make plays.

 

In the Chiefs' defense the circumstances were far different. There was plenty of time left in the half and they still had to defend the entire field whereas the Packers just needed to make a tackle in the field of play to guarantee that the half ended right there.

 

My dad and I were laughing about the similarities of the play, though. Of course Breeland did the right thing and just tackled the guy. King was too slow to even do that.

 

True that time, down, distance were all different. Just so odd that quite nearly the exact same thing happened (get burnt, leads to TD with minimal time left in the first half).

 

We also tend to forget that King was often abused by opposing defenses. He was obviously targeted by the TB offense on multiple occasions and they burnt him.

 

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/by-the-numbers/2020/12/16/22174122/kevin-kings-struggles-have-the-packers-singing-the-boundary-corner-blues

 

If I was a team's OC, I'd certainly be testing King over Alexander. I'm not saying King is all-pro, just that other CBs get burnt too. King just seems to lose focus at the worst times. I'm thinking small improvements can make a big difference for the guy.

[patrickgpe]

It's supposed to be another deep WR draft. I'd be totally fine grabbing one in the first three rounds.

One could argue that cornerback, offensive tackle and center and larger need positions than wr. That being said I hope they get Aaron some help

[HiAndTight]

It's supposed to be another deep WR draft. I'd be totally fine grabbing one in the first three rounds.

One could argue that cornerback, offensive tackle and center and larger need positions than wr. That being said I hope they get Aaron some help

 

 

Tackle is by far the biggest and CB the next. Though I wouldn't put Center on that list. Feels like they drafted next years Center this year. Either by picking Stepaniak, who they knew would miss most of this year to play guard and slide Jenkins back to his position in College, or Patrick or Hanson. Either way, I think C is covered.

 

I love Allen Robinson, but if we're going to spend a lot of money on a Free Agent, I'd rather it be on Taylor Morton. Give Rodgers the next RT in the game...someone who can hold down LT for the first quarter of next year and is just 26 years old, and I think the Packers are real tough to beat.

 

They need to look at HOW they've been losing games. It's almost always when Rodgers gets pressured.

 

Morton almost certainly won't happen, but there this is also supposed to be a very deep class at OT as well. You really can't have too many. If someone can play Tackle, they can pretty much always play inside.

 

OT, CB, DE, then a few positions you could add someone at depending on who's available. Hopefully a big guy like Nasirildeen in the 3rd or 4th. But with at least one of those positions, you have to try and go out and make it happen, add someone who can help out right now instead of hoping someone falls to you. Gute is pretty good at making sure he gets "his guy," having traded up for Alexander, Savage and Love. Maybe he'll do the same with Slater or whoever.

[HiAndTight]

I think it interesting listening to people say the Buccaneers are champions because of who they brought in after Brady. One of the main reasons TB is Super Bowl champions is the job Jason Licht and co. have done the first two days of the draft the last handful of years. If you were wondering "Walter" gave the Licht (GM) extension an "F" grade.

 

 

That's really stupid. They added some nice pieces, but we were saying on this board last year if they just had a game manager at QB, they'd be an 11 win team. Not the SB Champs, but they went .500 with a QB who had 42 or 44 turnovers last year. That's incredible.

 

Two #1 WR'ers, two elite edge rushers, Vea, White....I guess they brought in Wirfs after Brady, but I don't know if that's because of Brady so much as they had the 12th pick in the draft and they just picked the best player available.

 

They had a lot of talent all over the place. Sure, adding Gronk, AB and several other ring chasers is nice, but even at TE, they had Howard and Brate.

 

 

It'd be nice if the Packers treated Rodgers like the Buccs did Brady though. At least pretend to listen to his imput.

[pacopete4]

The Packers don't ever need to listen to a player's input. Why in the world would a QB get say in roster makeup? Now, do I think they could be adding more pieces here and there to help Rodgers? Sure. But it's nuts that a player should ever have any say in the roster. There are people paid handsomely to take care of that.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

The Packers don't ever need to listen to a player's input. Why in the world would a QB get say in roster makeup? Now, do I think they could be adding more pieces here and there to help Rodgers? Sure. But it's nuts that a player should ever have any say in the roster. There are people paid handsomely to take care of that.

 

Seconded. Aaron Rodgers is a great player. He is not bigger or more important than the Green Bay Packers. When he retires in a few years, the Packers will still be a team. Hopefully they are a team that is in good shape to compete. I'd love to see then go all in to get the TEAM a Super Bowl. If Rodgers is the QB, great. But they certainly don't owe him the personnel moves he wants.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

The Packers don't ever need to listen to a player's input. Why in the world would a QB get say in roster makeup? Now, do I think they could be adding more pieces here and there to help Rodgers? Sure. But it's nuts that a player should ever have any say in the roster. There are people paid handsomely to take care of that.

 

Brady never really had leverage to get the kind of deal other QBs did which made the moves he always wanted much more viable than for most teams. I don't know if the Patriots would have ever ceded to that demand, they got very lucky with the timing of him signing new deals, and Brady either didn't care or knew what was best for him. One of his last deals with NE was a perfect example. It was clear that the Jimmy G era was on the horizon, and rather than make a stink about it, he signed a very modest extension that all but forced NE to trade Jimmy.

 

I've always believed that luck plays a much bigger role in these types of things than people like to admit. But his typical cap hits were arguably the single biggest competitive advantage the Pats had. That and a division that was even worse than ours. They were almost never even playing WC weekend. Doing that for 20 years is a major, major leg up.

 

But NE and TB this season were willing to do something Ted Thompson almost never was. Bring in guys like AB, Randy Moss, Dante Stallworth on the cheap because their market value had tanked. The Pats did that a lot and it didn't work, but they were always willing to try it and sometimes it did. That was my biggest gripe with Ted. It's one thing not to sign monster FA deals. It's another to throw high-reward, moderate-risk deals in the garbage.

[PeaveyFury]

The Packers don't ever need to listen to a player's input. Why in the world would a QB get say in roster makeup? Now, do I think they could be adding more pieces here and there to help Rodgers? Sure. But it's nuts that a player should ever have any say in the roster. There are people paid handsomely to take care of that.

 

Seconded. Aaron Rodgers is a great player. He is not bigger or more important than the Green Bay Packers. When he retires in a few years, the Packers will still be a team. Hopefully they are a team that is in good shape to compete. I'd love to see then go all in to get the TEAM a Super Bowl. If Rodgers is the QB, great. But they certainly don't owe him the personnel moves he wants.

 

Thirded. The Packers actually did that with the last HOF QB during the Mike Sherman era, and those teams were LESS successful since they never made it past the 2nd round.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I'm fine with the Packers not listening to Aaron's personnel advice. I'm also fine with him being frustrated about how things have gone and wanting to finish this out some place that does, if he chooses to do so.

[PeaveyFury]

I'm fine with the Packers not listening to Aaron's personnel advice. I'm also fine with him being frustrated about how things have gone and wanting to finish this out some place that does, if he chooses to do so.

 

I don't think any of that is unreasonable either. But in the end, it's not like the FO has indicated in any way that they don't know what they're doing....

[pacopete4]

Yes, I should've stated that I can understand Rodgers frustration to some degree. Although, I do believe that some of the narratives about his rosters not being talented enough are overblown. I think the Packers have had some incredibly bad luck and unfortunate timing with some of their losses that have kept this franchise from winning at least one more SB if not two but hey, that is life. It also shows how incredibly hard it is to win SB's.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

It's pretty crazy that both Brees and Rodgers not only have just one title, but both have just one appearance. And both experienced what feels like a disproportionate number of heartbreaking losses and bad defenses. The Packers in particular rarely seem to be on the same page in the same season. When their defense was decent, which was rare, their offense wasn't good.

 

The year the Packers won the SB, Rodgers played arguably the worst playoff game of his career in the NFCCG, and it was probably his 5th or 6th best overall season.

[JohnBriggs12]

Anyone can second guess, but the GM put a team on the field that was capable of a championship. It didn't happen because of a freak injury to the best left tackle in the game in the last week of the season, a blown defensive call, some questionable work by the zebras, and a fumble by one of your key players perhaps in his last play in a Packer uniform. In short, to win it all takes a little bit of luck too, and the luck was on the Bucs side this year.

[HiAndTight]

The Packers don't ever need to listen to a player's input. Why in the world would a QB get say in roster makeup? Now, do I think they could be adding more pieces here and there to help Rodgers? Sure. But it's nuts that a player should ever have any say in the roster. There are people paid handsomely to take care of that.

 

Seconded. Aaron Rodgers is a great player. He is not bigger or more important than the Green Bay Packers. When he retires in a few years, the Packers will still be a team. Hopefully they are a team that is in good shape to compete. I'd love to see then go all in to get the TEAM a Super Bowl. If Rodgers is the QB, great. But they certainly don't owe him the personnel moves he wants.

 

 

Woah....how did this go from the Packers should at least pretend to listen to his input to he's not bigger or more important than the Packers?

 

The Buccs brought in Gronk and AB almost certainly because Brady wanted them. That seemed to help out in the SB.

 

 

Nobody's saying that they need to run their draft picks by Rodgers to make sure they're up to his standards, but the Packers almost never actually go out and improve their team with veterans. Antonio Brown was available. The Packers needed a WR'er. He's talked publicly about wanting to play with Rodgers. He signed with the team that had Gronk and 2 #1 WR'ers already.

 

Just saying when you've got the best player in your franchises history, you could treat him like most teams treat and all time great QB.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Just saying when you've got the best player in your franchises history, you could treat him like most teams treat and all time great QB.

 

Aaron Rodgers had a cap hit of $37+ million dollars in 2020. How is that not treating him like an all-time-great QB?

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Yeah, but I think the counterargument is, they did. They brought in Peppers and it basically got them to the Super Bowl, then they messed it up. They were in on Allen Robinson, didn't get him, and went for Jimmy Graham who was awful. They tried to get Mack. The narrative too often is that they sat on their hands. They didn't do that, and sadly they were also good enough numerous times to win it all. Luck, circumstances, a key injury, it takes the smallest nudge to derail a championship. You can even make that argument for the seasons Brady lost the Super Bowl. All 3 were winnable games with a different play or two.

[pacopete4]

And I'd argue that they could have brought in better players than both Gronk and AB if they had not listened to Brady. If Rodgers had his way Nelson and Cobb would still be Packers and we would all be ticked at both of those decisions. GM's put the team on the field. This GM, two years in a row, have put together championship-level teams. I'm sure he will attempt to do the same come this fall and he doesn't need a QB telling him how to do that.

[HiAndTight]

Just saying when you've got the best player in your franchises history, you could treat him like most teams treat and all time great QB.

 

Aaron Rodgers had a cap hit of $37+ million dollars in 2020. How is that not treating him like an all-time-great QB?

 

 

It was 21 million, but how does this discussion keeps changing. I'm talking about communicating with Rodgers during the off-season with regard to who they're going to bring in, AGAIN, as the Buccs did with Brady or the Pats did when they brought in AB or Gronk.

 

Never said they didn't pay him enough, I've never said he was more important than the franchise, I've never inferred either. I also didn't say they needed to makes the moves he's wanted. Just communicate with him. That's all. Doesn't seem like that's really asking too much of them.

 

This is kinda the problem when you take one sentence and delete the rest of the quote. It completely changes the context. I'm not arguing that Rodgers hasn't been paid well enough. He's paid right in line with what franchise QB's get paid. I'm saying it might be good if they spoke during the off-season. Not just an exit interview and then nothing again until OTA's or a phone call 15 seconds before they announce they're drafting a QB. Which was fine.

[HiAndTight]

And I'd argue that they could have brought in better players than both Gronk and AB if they had not listened to Brady. If Rodgers had his way Nelson and Cobb would still be Packers and we would all be ticked at both of those decisions. GM's put the team on the field. This GM, two years in a row, have put together championship-level teams. I'm sure he will attempt to do the same come this fall and he doesn't need a QB telling him how to do that.

 

 

I think Nelson's obviously hyperbolic, but Cobb? Yeah, we clearly could have used Cobb either of the last two years.

 

 

And who else could they have brought in that would have been better than Gronk and AB? Obviously Gronk's situation is unique having spent his career with NE and Brady. But AB?

 

 

Who could they have gotten that Brown prevented them from signing?