Bucks 2020-2021 season thread

[nate82]

I'm having doubts about this team winning a playoff series.

 

If Holiday is missing in the playoffs sure they won't win a playoff series. Sometimes I wonder if people even look at the starting lineups when making hot takes.

[adambr2]

I'm having doubts about this team winning a playoff series.

 

If Holiday is missing in the playoffs sure they won't win a playoff series. Sometimes I wonder if people even look at the starting lineups when making hot takes.

 

If Giannis alone in the absence of Holiday isn't enough to win even an opening round playoff series then he is not nearly as valuable as we think.

 

They should win a lot of these games without Holiday. Holiday is not Giannis. Losing this much without Holiday is still pretty alarming. He is not even the second best player on this team.

[nate82]

If Giannis alone in the absence of Holiday isn't enough to win even an opening round playoff series then he is not nearly as valuable as we think.

 

Giannis isn't Jordan and even Jordan needed help to win games in the playoffs. All of the greats from Kobe to Jordan needed at least one or two other players to help them through the playoffs.

 

Giannis is probably more Shaq than Jordan and Shaq needed a solid #2 in Wade and Bryant to win a championship. Jordan though had a solid 1a in Pippen and I don't think Jordan wins all that many games without Pippen at his side. The Bulls didn't really take off until Pippen was playing with Jordan.

 

Actually Giannis is probably more Olajuwon than Shaq and Olajuwon needed more help to win a championship than Shaq or Jordan did.

[HiAndTight]

I'm having doubts about this team winning a playoff series.

 

If Holiday is missing in the playoffs sure they won't win a playoff series. Sometimes I wonder if people even look at the starting lineups when making hot takes.

 

 

I'm hoping this season is just the complete inverse of the last two. Flying high during the regular season just to crash in the post-season.

 

Still...I bet the Bucks pretty big tonight thinking there was no way Giannis and Middleton would let them lose AGAIN.

 

This was pretty troubling, but one thing you could really see was how much we miss any PG who can defend. Auggie is just terrible on that end.

[adambr2]

I know he's on the shelf right now too but in the absence of Holiday we miss George Hill a lot. We don't have a serviceable backup PG.

[SomewhereInTime]

Everything is cyclical with the Bucks. Every two years they need to fire the coach and it usually takes them an extra two years to figure it out.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Bud's done and should have been fired last season but got a Covid mulligan. The league is wise to their routine now and they need a shake up. Holiday hasn't been bad but these kinds of results for what they gave up are going to be bad. Lopez looks like he is finished too.

[patrickgpe]

I'm having doubts about this team winning a playoff series.

yes they just lost 5 in a row, but noone remembers that they won 5 in a row just prior. These 5 games happen to coincide with holiday missing time. Forbes is a nice player, but he isn't a starting PG in the NBA.

[adambr2]

The Holiday trade is likely going to end up being really terrible. Jrue is better than Bledsoe, but the difference is really marginal. It's a massive haul for a marginal upgrade. Not only do you give up a reasonable contract in Bledsoe and your only serviceable backup PG, giving up the three 1st rounders is lost ammunition for a deadline deal to add pieces for future runs. It puts them in a really bad spot. Not only are you losing, but your hands are pretty tied to upgrade anywhere.

 

It's the type of trade I would have expected to net Bradley Beal, not Jrue Holiday.

[patrickgpe]

I think the holiday trade was made because Giannis wanted him here. If thats what it took to get him to resign, then it was worth it. He did give a list of players he wanted..

[OldSchoolSnapper]

The Holiday trade is likely going to end up being really terrible. Jrue is better than Bledsoe, but the difference is really marginal. It's a massive haul for a marginal upgrade. Not only do you give up a reasonable contract in Bledsoe and your only serviceable backup PG, giving up the three 1st rounders is lost ammunition for a deadline deal to add pieces for future runs. It puts them in a really bad spot. Not only are you losing, but your hands are pretty tied to upgrade anywhere.

 

It's the type of trade I would have expected to net Bradley Beal, not Jrue Holiday.

 

This is kind of where I'm at. Statistically he's been better in a lot of advanced stats but it's not translating into a better team on the court. And I know they just won five games, but Holiday sitting out does not explain away how bad this team looks. I thought Holiday would make a much bigger difference than he has. I was giving some room for "gelling" but we are 30 games into the season and we look like the 6th seed in the Western Conference on a good day.

 

And it's great if Giannis wanted Holiday, until it doesn't work if Giannis squirms his way into a trade in 2023 as a result of himself not being a great GM.

[patrickgpe]

 

And it's great if Giannis wanted Holiday, until it doesn't work if Giannis squirms his way into a trade in 2023 as a result of himself not being a great GM.

its a league wide issue. Stars get to play GM. This doesn't really happen elsewhere. Heck Rodgers couldn't even get the Packers to not draft his replacement rather than get him some help. you can get out of the holiday business after this season, but yes loss a lot of draft picks to get him. I don't envy Horst.

[Baldkin]

The Holiday trade is likely going to end up being really terrible. Jrue is better than Bledsoe, but the difference is really marginal. It's a massive haul for a marginal upgrade. Not only do you give up a reasonable contract in Bledsoe and your only serviceable backup PG, giving up the three 1st rounders is lost ammunition for a deadline deal to add pieces for future runs. It puts them in a really bad spot. Not only are you losing, but your hands are pretty tied to upgrade anywhere.

 

It's the type of trade I would have expected to net Bradley Beal, not Jrue Holiday.

 

This is kind of where I'm at. Statistically he's been better in a lot of advanced stats but it's not translating into a better team on the court. And I know they just won five games, but Holiday sitting out does not explain away how bad this team looks. I thought Holiday would make a much bigger difference than he has. I was giving some room for "gelling" but we are 30 games into the season and we look like the 6th seed in the Western Conference on a good day.

 

And it's great if Giannis wanted Holiday, until it doesn't work if Giannis squirms his way into a trade in 2023 as a result of himself not being a great GM.

 

Turns out when you're implementing rather large changes defensively and offensively and change 6 of your top 11 players (Giannis, Pat, Brook, DDV and Midds are the 5 returning) on the roster and then have a condensed schedule, almost no training camp..... it takes time to get the pieces to fit. Do I wish they'd be hitting their stride right now? Absolutely. It really looked like they were turning a corner 10 days ago before Jrue got put into Covid jail.

 

While I'd say something definitely looked wrong with the team the last two games - I don't know if the team has the flu, if they are just bored with the regular season or if they all need 6 hours in Cancun I cannot say.

[sveumrules]

Even after losing five in a row, the Bucks still have the 2nd best SRS in the NBA (behind only the Jazz) & the 3rd best Net Rating (behind the Jazz & Clippers, fraction ahead of the Lakers).

 

538 has their odds of making the Finals at 30% & winning at 12% with Brooklyn the only East team in the same neighborhood at 26% make & 10% win Finals.

 

If Jrue, Giannis & Khris are all healthy for the postseason they will have just as good of a chance as any other East contender to make the Finals.

 

If they don't make it out of the East, Bud probably gets canned.

 

Still looks like a win/win proposition to me.

[patrickgpe]

Agreed on Bud. He needs to get to the finals to save his job. His predecessor was so terrible it can cloud your evaluation of him. Its often hard to judge coaches who have the 2x MVP on their roster because he can sit back and let Giannis do his thing. It seems like when things are going bad, the bucks are slow or not to adjust to figure out a way to fix it. Thats on him.

[homer]

Mamadi Diakite has been burning up the G League. I've been watching his highlights every game and the guy is everywhere doing everything.

[homer]

I think Giannis has figured out free throw shooting

[CheezWizHed]

I had no idea Jabari Parker was still in the league...

[yourout]

I had no idea Jabari Parker was still in the league...

While it doesn't look like there any future Hall of famers in that class Embiid has had the best career so far.

[sveumrules]

I think Giannis has figured out free throw shooting

 

Shooting 70% on just under 200 attempts since the 1 for 10 game.

[Baldkin]

I had no idea Jabari Parker was still in the league...

While it doesn't look like there any future Hall of famers in that class Embiid has had the best career so far.

 

Embiid is on the path to be a hall of famer, as is Jokic.

[HiAndTight]

 

And it's great if Giannis wanted Holiday, until it doesn't work if Giannis squirms his way into a trade in 2023 as a result of himself not being a great GM.

its a league wide issue. Stars get to play GM. This doesn't really happen elsewhere. Heck Rodgers couldn't even get the Packers to not draft his replacement rather than get him some help. you can get out of the holiday business after this season, but yes loss a lot of draft picks to get him. I don't envy Horst.

 

 

Rodgers couldn't even get a heads up when they fired his own position coach.

 

Stars in the NBA have the type of control I don't think NFL stars have in their own homes!

 

Still, I want to see how this all plays out. I don't think they'll be moving on from Jrue Holliday unless Holliday doesn't want to sign.

 

I also think it's a bit unfair to blame Jrue for the teams struggles this year. Lets wait and see how this team develops and how they play in the post-season. Holliday wasn't signed to be an upgrade during the regular season. Bledsoe was terrible in the post-season...for whatever reason. He had all the talent, but he tightened up.

 

I'd rather see them bring in a new coach and try it again with Holliday. Even if they sign him to a max deal, it's not like we wouldn't be able to move him in the future.

[HiAndTight]

Mamadi Diakite has been burning up the G League. I've been watching his highlights every game and the guy is everywhere doing everything.

 

 

What's the guys upside? I can read about the measurables, that he just started playing the game 6 years ago, his defensive ability...but I haven't watched him much and a lot of the draft profiles talk about the limits to his game.

 

Does he have a chance to blow up like a Siakam or a Christian Wood? Not in that he'll be a similar player to Wood, but someone who can be more than just a role player at sit at the end of the bench?

 

We're gonna have to find another contributor or even a star if we're going to contend over the next 4-5 years. Can he develop into one of them?

[HiAndTight]

I had no idea Jabari Parker was still in the league...

While it doesn't look like there any future Hall of famers in that class Embiid has had the best career so far.

 

Embiid is on the path to be a hall of famer, as is Jokic.

 

 

Is the Joker the most underrated athlete in sports? He's putting up nearly 27/11/8.5, shooting over 40 pct from 3.

[homer]

Mamadi Diakite has been burning up the G League. I've been watching his highlights every game and the guy is everywhere doing everything.

 

 

What's the guys upside? I can read about the measurables, that he just started playing the game 6 years ago, his defensive ability...but I haven't watched him much and a lot of the draft profiles talk about the limits to his game.

 

Does he have a chance to blow up like a Siakam or a Christian Wood? Not in that he'll be a similar player to Wood, but someone who can be more than just a role player at sit at the end of the bench?

 

We're gonna have to find another contributor or even a star if we're going to contend over the next 4-5 years. Can he develop into one of them?

 

He's skinny and kind of a tweener so he'll probably never be able to defend the post, he doesn't have great hands so is prone to turnovers, and I guess you could say he fouls too much but to my eye he can do almost everything else. He has like a 7'3" wingspan, can defend in space (and has been covering guards here and there) very well, he is a natural shot-blocker, he's made some great interior passes, he looks good shooting the three, he can make his free throws, etc. etc.

 

I don't think he's starter material and he is doing this against the G League but he makes those guys look silly.