COVID-19 Thread [V2.0]

[homer]

Our media is a complete joke... Every aspect of today's media is corrupt and agenda driven.

 

Two things:

 

1) The media is publishing stories questioning the study

2) If there's fault its from the study, not the media, which is why I linked directly to the study and not a story about the study

[Samurai Bucky]

Our media is a complete joke... Every aspect of today's media is corrupt and agenda driven.

 

Two things:

 

1) The media is publishing stories questioning the study

2) If there's fault its from the study, not the media, which is why I linked directly to the study and not a story about the study

Here is a story that addresses the issues with research, estimates, etc. https://www.inverse.com/mind-body/sturgis-coronavirus-report-explained

 

Now, let's look at how the Washington Post reported on the study (https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/09/08/worst-case-scenerios-sturgis-rally-may-be-linked-266000-coronavirus-cases-study-says/):

 

‘Worst case scenarios’ at Sturgis rally could link event to 266,000 coronavirus cases, study says

 

Yes, the article does a fairly good job of presenting both sides, but in today's "Twitter-like" society, people will draw conclusions based on what the headline says. They ignore the "could" and look at "Worst Case." For those who took the time, they would see that the 266,000 is at the highest end. The Inverse.com article (who?) blows more holes in it by talking about lack of peer reviews, and that the paper is not even a scientific paper, but an economic one.

 

The media is in the business of making money. They make money by sensationalizing headlines and even developing narratives to push an agenda. Unfortunately, people will just look at the sound bite, or headline and make judgments from that.

 

Then... many "journalists" who are really op ed hacks end up being considered experts. People who don't know any better won't care because they need a quick hitter to inform them of what is going on.

 

So, to say the media is publishing stories to question the study is not entirely false. However, the majority of the audience will not take the time to read the story. Is it the audience's fault, the media's fault, or the study's fault? I might suggest a combination of all three.

[LouisEly]

The CEOs of the nine pharma companies involved in developing a COVID-19 vaccine issued a joint pledge that none of them would release a vaccine unless it had been thoroughly vetted for safety and efficacy.

 

This is because the public is deeply skeptical of a vaccine that would be released before the November election.

 

The election couldn't come at a worse time.

[CheezWizHed]

Election aside, any medical procedure that is rushed makes me nervous in general. Pharma doesn't have the greatest track record even when not rushed.

[CheezWizHed]

Election aside, any medical procedure that is rushed makes me nervous in general. Pharma doesn't have the greatest track record even when not rushed.

[CheezWizHed]

Election aside, any medical procedure that is rushed makes me nervous in general. Pharma doesn't have the greatest track record even when not rushed.

[Machu Peach]

Vaccines have a phenomenal safety record. I've been fighting against the antivax movement for my entire adult life. Seeing mainstream politicians and media endorse antivax conspiracies and polls that show over 2/3 of Americans are now distrustful of vaccination is very disheartening.

[Machu Peach]

Vaccines have a phenomenal safety record. I've been fighting against the antivax movement for my entire adult life. Seeing mainstream politicians and media endorse antivax conspiracies and polls that show over 2/3 of Americans are now distrustful of vaccination is very disheartening.

[Machu Peach]

Vaccines have a phenomenal safety record. I've been fighting against the antivax movement for my entire adult life. Seeing mainstream politicians and media endorse antivax conspiracies and polls that show over 2/3 of Americans are now distrustful of vaccination is very disheartening.

[stoutdude04]

Vaccines have a phenomenal safety record. I've been fighting against the antivax movement for my entire adult life. Seeing mainstream politicians and media endorse antivax conspiracies and polls that show over 2/3 of Americans are now distrustful of vaccination is very disheartening.

 

This is so true. I asked a few of my buddies in the health field if they would take a vaccine/give it to their kids. Every single one of them said if they say they have one then they are taking it. They echoed your thoughts on the safety record.

[stoutdude04]

Vaccines have a phenomenal safety record. I've been fighting against the antivax movement for my entire adult life. Seeing mainstream politicians and media endorse antivax conspiracies and polls that show over 2/3 of Americans are now distrustful of vaccination is very disheartening.

 

This is so true. I asked a few of my buddies in the health field if they would take a vaccine/give it to their kids. Every single one of them said if they say they have one then they are taking it. They echoed your thoughts on the safety record.

[stoutdude04]

Vaccines have a phenomenal safety record. I've been fighting against the antivax movement for my entire adult life. Seeing mainstream politicians and media endorse antivax conspiracies and polls that show over 2/3 of Americans are now distrustful of vaccination is very disheartening.

 

This is so true. I asked a few of my buddies in the health field if they would take a vaccine/give it to their kids. Every single one of them said if they say they have one then they are taking it. They echoed your thoughts on the safety record.

[CheezWizHed]

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just cautious about "new" things in general. As an engineer, I never buy the first version of anything (even if I make it). Watch late night television and you'll see what are the latest medicines being sued because of some side-effect that wasn't known at the time of release of some medicine.

 

People rushing makes mistakes; companies like to cut corners to save money and be out there first; Testing doesn't cover long term effects well; There are several common-mode sources of error.

 

I'll probably take the vaccine, but I do think the pharma companies need to be very transparent about the success rate and side-effects of the virus. There will be a huge pressure for people to take it and we deserve to know that it was done well.

[CheezWizHed]

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just cautious about "new" things in general. As an engineer, I never buy the first version of anything (even if I make it). Watch late night television and you'll see what are the latest medicines being sued because of some side-effect that wasn't known at the time of release of some medicine.

 

People rushing makes mistakes; companies like to cut corners to save money and be out there first; Testing doesn't cover long term effects well; There are several common-mode sources of error.

 

I'll probably take the vaccine, but I do think the pharma companies need to be very transparent about the success rate and side-effects of the virus. There will be a huge pressure for people to take it and we deserve to know that it was done well.

[CheezWizHed]

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just cautious about "new" things in general. As an engineer, I never buy the first version of anything (even if I make it). Watch late night television and you'll see what are the latest medicines being sued because of some side-effect that wasn't known at the time of release of some medicine.

 

People rushing makes mistakes; companies like to cut corners to save money and be out there first; Testing doesn't cover long term effects well; There are several common-mode sources of error.

 

I'll probably take the vaccine, but I do think the pharma companies need to be very transparent about the success rate and side-effects of the virus. There will be a huge pressure for people to take it and we deserve to know that it was done well.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just cautious about "new" things in general. As an engineer, I never buy the first version of anything (even if I make it). Watch late night television and you'll see what are the latest medicines being sued because of some side-effect that wasn't known at the time of release of some medicine.

 

People rushing makes mistakes; companies like to cut corners to save money and be out there first; Testing doesn't cover long term effects well; There are several common-mode sources of error.

 

I'll probably take the vaccine, but I do think the pharma companies need to be very transparent about the success rate and side-effects of the virus. There will be a huge pressure for people to take it and we deserve to know that it was done well.

 

Makes me wonder if there were anti-Polio vaxxers back in the day ...

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just cautious about "new" things in general. As an engineer, I never buy the first version of anything (even if I make it). Watch late night television and you'll see what are the latest medicines being sued because of some side-effect that wasn't known at the time of release of some medicine.

 

People rushing makes mistakes; companies like to cut corners to save money and be out there first; Testing doesn't cover long term effects well; There are several common-mode sources of error.

 

I'll probably take the vaccine, but I do think the pharma companies need to be very transparent about the success rate and side-effects of the virus. There will be a huge pressure for people to take it and we deserve to know that it was done well.

 

Makes me wonder if there were anti-Polio vaxxers back in the day ...

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just cautious about "new" things in general. As an engineer, I never buy the first version of anything (even if I make it). Watch late night television and you'll see what are the latest medicines being sued because of some side-effect that wasn't known at the time of release of some medicine.

 

People rushing makes mistakes; companies like to cut corners to save money and be out there first; Testing doesn't cover long term effects well; There are several common-mode sources of error.

 

I'll probably take the vaccine, but I do think the pharma companies need to be very transparent about the success rate and side-effects of the virus. There will be a huge pressure for people to take it and we deserve to know that it was done well.

 

Makes me wonder if there were anti-Polio vaxxers back in the day ...

[nate82]

 

Makes me wonder if there were anti-Polio vaxxers back in the day ...

 

Different generations. The amount of trust towards governments and even companies was different then compared to now. Also information is far more widely available now than any other time in history. This includes misinformation and information that is true but is represented as being false or exaggerated.

 

To answer your main question there were probably people and groups of people who were anti-Polio vaxxers.

[nate82]

 

Makes me wonder if there were anti-Polio vaxxers back in the day ...

 

Different generations. The amount of trust towards governments and even companies was different then compared to now. Also information is far more widely available now than any other time in history. This includes misinformation and information that is true but is represented as being false or exaggerated.

 

To answer your main question there were probably people and groups of people who were anti-Polio vaxxers.

[nate82]

 

Makes me wonder if there were anti-Polio vaxxers back in the day ...

 

Different generations. The amount of trust towards governments and even companies was different then compared to now. Also information is far more widely available now than any other time in history. This includes misinformation and information that is true but is represented as being false or exaggerated.

 

To answer your main question there were probably people and groups of people who were anti-Polio vaxxers.

[igor67]

There have been small anti- vaccine groups pretty much all the way back. Some of the relevant law was even decided out of Amish Communities in Wisconsin. I say that to highlight in some cases how diverse the views on taking them can be not to lump Amish into a category with say Jenny McCarthy. In a post Covid world I think we can better imagine what the polio vaccine truly meant at the time and why rejection of it was relatively a non-issue. Its far from a perfect analogue as a disease, but people recognized how serious a problem it was and it could have quite the range of outcomes. I had an uncle that survived with a paralyzed toe for example.

[LouisEly]

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just cautious about "new" things in general. As an engineer, I never buy the first version of anything (even if I make it). Watch late night television and you'll see what are the latest medicines being sued because of some side-effect that wasn't known at the time of release of some medicine.

 

People rushing makes mistakes; companies like to cut corners to save money and be out there first; Testing doesn't cover long term effects well; There are several common-mode sources of error.

 

I'll probably take the vaccine, but I do think the pharma companies need to be very transparent about the success rate and side-effects of the virus. There will be a huge pressure for people to take it and we deserve to know that it was done well.

Can you share what some of those medications are? Any ones that I'm aware of are products that came out 20+ years ago. And by "late night TV", if you're referring to the class action attorney commercials... well, that's all you need to know. They're just trying to get a settlement so they can pocket a few million.

 

It certainly is possible for things to surface after a drug comes to market. How big the clinical trials are depends on the incidence of the disease. For drugs that I've worked on, the trials are typically 1000-2000 people (and there are usually 3-4 separate trials). For oncology drugs, the numbers are much smaller because of how rare the diseases usually are and how short the life expectancy is.

 

As I've shared before, these clinical trials aren't with 1000-2000 people - they are with 30,000 people. And the reason they are coming to market so quickly is because of the tremendous amounts of resources that have been allocated to this as well as the fact that these companies are all sharing data - that never happens.

 

I'm not afraid of the vaccine, but I won't be first in line to get it so that the health care/essential workers, first responders, and high risk populations can get first cracks at it.

[CheezWizHed]

Can you share what some of those medications are? Any ones that I'm aware of are products that came out 20+ years ago. And by "late night TV", if you're referring to the class action attorney commercials... well, that's all you need to know. They're just trying to get a settlement so they can pocket a few million.

 

Zantacis the most recent one. No, I'm not relying on late night TV commercials for truth, but they highlight where problems that like to be covered up by Pharma companies. I'm also in the camp that the US is far too litigious and one of the main reasons our medical insurance costs so much, so its not like I'm reacting to each commercial with panic and paranoia.

 

There have been other recent ones... I want to say a cholesterol reducer? I don't remember the name. I think some of the early biologics too.

[LouisEly]

Zantac was discovered in 1976 and commercialized in 1981.

 

In November of last year, the FDA determined that the levels of NDMA in ranitidine were similar to that of eating grilled or smoked meat.

 

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/statement-new-testing-results-including-low-levels-impurities-ranitidine-drugs