The Next Numbers To Be Retired...

[clancyphile]

Given the talk about Ted Simmons being in the Hall of Fame, there is one interesting question:

What numbers should be the next ones retired for the Brewers?

 

I can think of two easy calls, and one on the bubble:

#8 - For Ryan Braun. Franchise's all-time leader in homers, and will be in the top three of most offensive categories whether his tenure ends after 2020 or 2021 (depending on the options). Face of the franchise for the 2010s, and has been on more playoff teams than any other Brewer (2008, 2011, 2018, 2019), with two other near-misses (2007, 2017).

 

#15 - For Ben Sheets/Cecil Cooper. The former was arguably the face of the franchise in the 2000s, even as injury shortened seasons. He's 2nd all-time in strikeouts and WAR among pitchers. The latter was the first baseman from 1977-1987, and in those 11 seasons was an offensive force until 1986.

 

On the bubble:

#23 - For Rickie Weeks/Ted Simmons. I consider Weeks, and not Jim Gantner, to be the team's best second baseman of all time. Put some outstanding offense, and was always able to draw walks and was a threat on the basepaths. Ted Simmons is in the Hall of Fame, and was part of the 1982 Brewers, but was clearly on the downside of his career in 1984-1985.

[PeaveyFury]

I think Braun is a lock to NOT be retired. I think his legacy is similar to Paul Hornung's in Green Bay- because of the obvious 'other issues', they won't retire it. Walk of fame, you bet. But not a retired jersey.

 

The Brewers have maintained a high standard with the jerseys, as each of them made the HOF. I think your bubble is more possible than either of the two 'locks' for that reason, but I think that's unlikely as well.

 

I think '22' is the correct answer to the question of which comes next.

[JohnBriggs12]

Given the talk about Ted Simmons being in the Hall of Fame, there is one interesting question:

What numbers should be the next ones retired for the Brewers?

 

I can think of two easy calls, and one on the bubble:

#8 - For Ryan Braun. Franchise's all-time leader in homers, and will be in the top three of most offensive categories whether his tenure ends after 2020 or 2021 (depending on the options). Face of the franchise for the 2010s, and has been on more playoff teams than any other Brewer (2008, 2011, 2018, 2019), with two other near-misses (2007, 2017).

 

#15 - For Ben Sheets/Cecil Cooper. The former was arguably the face of the franchise in the 2000s, even as injury shortened seasons. He's 2nd all-time in strikeouts and WAR among pitchers. The latter was the first baseman from 1977-1987, and in those 11 seasons was an offensive force until 1986.

 

On the bubble:

#23 - For Rickie Weeks/Ted Simmons. I consider Weeks, and not Jim Gantner, to be the team's best second baseman of all time. Put some outstanding offense, and was always able to draw walks and was a threat on the basepaths. Ted Simmons is in the Hall of Fame, and was part of the 1982 Brewers, but was clearly on the downside of his career in 1984-1985.

 

Rickie Weeks? Are you serious? Sheets/Cooper will never happen either and I was a huge Cooper fan. The fact that he got like one HOF vote and then disappeared from the ballot was a joke. I thought he was one of the top 5 hitters in the game from 79 to 83. Had he been able to extend that excellence for a couple more seasons, he would have been HOF worthy and also worthy of number retirement. He kind of got overshadowed by Yount, but Coop was the best hitter on those great teams. Retiring numbers is reserved for the all time greats. Otherwise eventually you'll have no numbers available for current players.

 

The next number to be retired will be #22.

 

As for Simmons, his best years were with the Cardinals.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Retiring numbers is silly. I thought so when I was 7 years old and still think it is now. When you think about it for a while and consider a team might still exist in 200 years it makes even less sense. There are a lot of guys and not that many numbers. I know the NFL has asked teams to stop doing it and they've obliged except for guys like Brett Favre or players that die tragically.

 

If we insist on doing it, I can't think of anyone the Brewers would have fitting the bill if Braun doesn't. Rickie Weeks doesn't reach that level.

[nodakfan17]

You want to talk silly? Look at the Bucks’ rafters.

 

But to answer the original question, either 8 or 22.

[DuWayne Steurer]

Rickie Weeks was a marginally average guy who played on some good teams. There's no way he gets his number retired. Nor should he. As others have said, if Yelich makes the HOF, he'll get his retired. As he's now mostly assured to play the majority of his career as a Brewer, it makes sense. Let's not count that chicken before it hatches. Braun was a HOF lock at one point as well.

[patrickgpe]

you need to be in the HOF to have your number retired. Braun won't get in. Yelich is the most logical person to get his number retired here.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Even Yelich seems like no sure thing. He is already 28 and just over 1k hits and ~140 HRs, I think. Definitely most logical but I think even he is a tough in. Baseball loves its round number milestones for the HOF.

[BrewCrewForever]

#8 and #22 should both be retired at some point.

[djoctagone]

only nine players in franchise history have worn #17. eight of them did it prior to the 1978 season. the only player to wear #17 since 1978 has been jim gantner.

[patrickgpe]

Retiring numbers is silly. I thought so when I was 7 years old and still think it is now.

It makes more sense to put up a statue in the arena or outside, I give you. The bucks list of retired numbers is an embarrassment. That being said I think the brewers and packers have done a good job about being very selective about doing it atleast.

[Underachiever]

You want to talk silly? Look at the Bucks’ rafters.

 

But to answer the original question, either 8 or 22.

 

Swear to god, I read that and went, "22? Charlie Moore?"

[MrTPlush]

My understanding is the Brewers requirement is HOF and obviously a big impact as a Brewer. Therefor Ryan Braun seems really unlikely.

 

Yelich is obvious if he makes the HOF. Not an assured thing though.

 

I’m guessing sports teams will eventually have to do what college teams do and retire name/number, but not actually retire it. I know Kansas Basketball does that and I’m sure many other teams/programs do it similarly.

[AKCheesehead]

[sarcasm]What? No #24 Kevin Mench?[/sarcasm]

 

Seriously, #22 is the answer.

 

I suppose an argument could be made for #71 if he were to continue his dominance for another 10-12 years and somehow stay in Milwaukee all the while, which yes, I realize is a pipe dream.

 

If I'm willing to dream, then #30 if Counsell has a long, successful tenure at the helm and brings a championship to Milwaukee.

[clancyphile]

Given the talk about Ted Simmons being in the Hall of Fame, there is one interesting question:

What numbers should be the next ones retired for the Brewers?

 

I can think of two easy calls, and one on the bubble:

#8 - For Ryan Braun. Franchise's all-time leader in homers, and will be in the top three of most offensive categories whether his tenure ends after 2020 or 2021 (depending on the options). Face of the franchise for the 2010s, and has been on more playoff teams than any other Brewer (2008, 2011, 2018, 2019), with two other near-misses (2007, 2017).

 

#15 - For Ben Sheets/Cecil Cooper. The former was arguably the face of the franchise in the 2000s, even as injury shortened seasons. He's 2nd all-time in strikeouts and WAR among pitchers. The latter was the first baseman from 1977-1987, and in those 11 seasons was an offensive force until 1986.

 

On the bubble:

#23 - For Rickie Weeks/Ted Simmons. I consider Weeks, and not Jim Gantner, to be the team's best second baseman of all time. Put some outstanding offense, and was always able to draw walks and was a threat on the basepaths. Ted Simmons is in the Hall of Fame, and was part of the 1982 Brewers, but was clearly on the downside of his career in 1984-1985.

 

Rickie Weeks? Are you serious? Sheets/Cooper will never happen either and I was a huge Cooper fan. The fact that he got like one HOF vote and then disappeared from the ballot was a joke. I thought he was one of the top 5 hitters in the game from 79 to 83. Had he been able to extend that excellence for a couple more seasons, he would have been HOF worthy and also worthy of number retirement. He kind of got overshadowed by Yount, but Coop was the best hitter on those great teams. Retiring numbers is reserved for the all time greats. Otherwise eventually you'll have no numbers available for current players.

 

The next number to be retired will be #22.

 

As for Simmons, his best years were with the Cardinals.

 

Hank Aaron had two years in Milwaukee, neither of which matched his earlier dominance, and his #44 was retired... and was the only retired number for a long time.

 

In the case of Braun, I'd argue he has had long-term impact. Won't make the HOF, but the retired number for the face of the franchise in the 2010s is easily defensible, IMO.

 

The Cooper/Sheets retirement for #15 is similarly warranted, IMO. The former was dominant from 1977-1983, while the latter arguably was a co-face of the franchise in the 2000s (alongside Geoff Jenkins).

 

If you're retiring #23 for Simmons (given that they retired Aaron's #44 for a shorter, less productive tenure), it also makes sense to honor Weeks, who was arguably the best 2B in franchise history (why the DraftKings Dream Team picked Gantner over Weeks is beyond me), and who was hampered by injuries, but still was a force on the field when healthy.

 

If we want to look to the future, Yelich's #22 and Hiura's #18 could very well be up for discussion ten years from now.

[TURBO]

No to Weeks, just.....NO

 

I was always a Weeks fan, but there is no possible way on earth that his jersey # being retired is justifiable.

[PeaveyFury]

Hank Aaron had two years as a Brewer

 

I fixed this for you above. He was a Brewer for two years, but played in Milwaukee much longer. His number is as much a tip of the cap to his time with the Braves in Milwaukee as it was anything to do with the Brewers.

 

The reason Simmons won't have his number retired is similar to why Sutton's wasn't. Both HOFers, both minor contributors here. Rollie went in rightfully as an A, but he won a Cy Young and MVP here.

[rickh150]

you need to be in the HOF to have your number retired. Braun won't get in. Yelich is the most logical person to get his number retired here.

 

You need to be in the Hall to have your number retired with the team? All people with #'s retired are in the HOF, but does that make it a prerequisite? It's not a hard rule, is it?

Braun is probably getting his number retired, imo. I'll be surprised, but not shocked, if it isn't retired. I mean, if Fingers number is retired.....

[PeaveyFury]

I'll be surprised, but not shocked, if it isn't retired. I mean, if Fingers number is retired.....

 

Was Rollie involved in multiple PED scandals that I'm unaware of? I'll be absolutely shocked if Braun's number is retired.

[clancyphile]

I'll be surprised, but not shocked, if it isn't retired. I mean, if Fingers number is retired.....

 

Was Rollie involved in multiple PED scandals that I'm unaware of? I'll be absolutely shocked if Braun's number is retired.

 

The evidence on Braun was dubious, if you ask me. The arbitrator threw the suspension out prior to 2012 (and then got fired for siding not just with Braun, but at least one other player in similar circumstances, Eliezer Alfonso, IIRC).

 

A mishandled test, and then MLB firing the arbitrator who voided a suspension on the basis of the mishandled test, kinda raises the question in my mind as to whether Braun was guilty.

 

It should be noted after the Braun and Alfonso cases, MLB did change their procedures.

[pacopete4]

Braun was guilty. There’s no questioning that. But he should have the number retired. The Brewers are not some rich history type franchise that should ignore a player of his success. All of which is in a Brewers uniform. When they play a shortened season this year and he gets to the playoffs a 5th time in his Brewers career, that’s like Jeter winning five WS rings to an organization like the Brewers.

[PeaveyFury]

I'll be surprised, but not shocked, if it isn't retired. I mean, if Fingers number is retired.....

 

Was Rollie involved in multiple PED scandals that I'm unaware of? I'll be absolutely shocked if Braun's number is retired.

 

The evidence on Braun was dubious, if you ask me. The arbitrator threw the suspension out prior to 2012 (and then got fired for siding not just with Braun, but at least one other player in similar circumstances, Eliezer Alfonso, IIRC).

 

A mishandled test, and then MLB firing the arbitrator who voided a suspension on the basis of the mishandled test, kinda raises the question in my mind as to whether Braun was guilty.

 

It should be noted after the Braun and Alfonso cases, MLB did change their procedures.

 

Clancy, that's all well and good, but then completely ignores the suspension for PEDs Braun DID serve in 2013.

[DuWayne Steurer]

It doesn't raise any questions as to whether or not Braun was guilty. Braun admitted to using banned substances. Why do people choose to ignore that when they say "it raises questions in my mind as to whether or not he was guilty?"

 

I mean, I don't care at this point. I'm way past moved on, but dude was GUILTY with a capital G.

 

"After my interview with MLB in late June of this year, I came to the realization that it was time to come to grips with the truth," he said. "I was never presented with baseball's evidence against me, but I didn't need to be, because I knew what I had done."

[Outlander]

There is no chance Braun gets in the Hall of Fame but I would say more likely than not that he gets his number retired at some point. It might be a while still though and wouldn't be surprised if Yelich is the next. Actually think if Yelich becomes a Brewer for the rest of his career and become a Hall of Fame player he might be the one encouraging the Brewers to retire Braun's number.

[ClosetBrewerFan]

When I think of retiring a players number, it should be such a beloved player that you could never think of anyone else wearing that number. Typically, it would be players who played for the brewers for a long time. Like Molitor, Yount, and Gantner (who's number is obviously unofficially retired). Aaron as well, not due to his time as a Brewer, but as a Milwaukee Brave. Fingers is the exception as he was such a unique character and really one of the first relief aces and a MVP/Cy young winner in our most memorable season and the brewers first and only world series appearance. It does not hurt that these players are all in the hall of fame as well.

 

I doubt the Brewers have certain rules as to what it takes to retire a number - its probably more of a feel thing. Braun certainly has a shot. It would be hard for me to see anyone else wearing a #8, but he definetely has his worts. You never know, Molitor was really hated when he left the Brewers after 15 years with them, to the extent that they let Listach use his number for one season (1996). Time does heal though and they made the right choice to retire his number.

 

I think Yelich also has a chance. Especially if the Brewers get to the World Series. You never know who it could be though, as Fingers proved that. His number is retired after only 2 short seasons. Maybe Hader ends up dominating in the next World Series and goes on to have a long Brewers career - Here's hoping...

 

Thanks Clancy for starting an interesting thread at a time when we have little Baseball to talk about.

 

If you want to waste some time going down memory lane, here is a list of every brewer to wear a uni for the Brewers during the regular season, by thier uniform number: https://www.baseball-almanac.com/teams/baseball_uniform_numbers.php?t=ML4