COVID-19 Thread

[owbc]

County by county ends up making less sense when you realize your a pretty significant percentage of people regularly cross county boundaries for grocery runs and essential jobs. My in-laws have a 7 minute car trip one way to the grocery store in a different county, and a 15 minute trip the other direction in a 3rd county. As things get more spaced out in MN and WI you'll have all kinds of people wondering why they would have to travel halfway across the county, when this other town is so much closer. How about the Dells, it actually sits in 4 different counties. Marshfield sits in two.

 

As for referring to the modelling as bad science? This is how it actually works all the time. It is not the magical answer producing in a few hours nonsense you see on TV or in the movies. Models are built, tested improved over and over again with cycles of critique and publication. The more potential variables the broader the range of outcomes ends up. So biological sciences (especially humans with all of that free will and changing behavior) tend to have wider confidence intervals then physical sciences. Most organisms take so long to grow you wouldn't be through even 1 experiment yet.

 

Agreed--overall the models have been pretty good. All models have a ton of assumptions built into them, the key is figuring out which assumptions matter and which don't. At the end of the day, exponential growth is exponential growth no matter what coefficients you throw in there, and with very limited information the models correctly predicted the rapid spread of infections.

 

The tricker part was to model deaths and hospitalizations because the percentage of cases leading to hospitalization/death is an important parameter and nobody really knew what that was given the lack of data. At the end of the day you would rather prepare for an overestimation. And things were certainly helped by people being good about social distancing which should be celebrated. At some point I hope as a society we can congratulate ourselves for successfully fending off the worst case scenario.

 

The local and state responses have been great, especially given the complete lack of organization at the federal level and the general lack of a plan for what to do. To me it's quite scary how poor the national response was, if the states hadn't acted to get this under control it could have gotten pretty ugly quickly. The governors are just following the advice of infectious disease experts which is really all they can do.

[nodakfan17]

Brown County is going to reportedly jump from 214 to 297 cases today and the JBS beef plant has been confirmed as the source of the outbreak. Amazingly, they are still open. 10 days ago, we had <50 cases.

[reillymcshane]

To top this off we just found out last night that the hospitals in our areas are furloughing their staff because there is a lack of patients in the hospital! This is truly insane.

I said this before, but the biggest issue is that they can't test everyone like they need to test. Are the hospitals blaming the 'stay at home' order for this? I don't doubt that. But the reason we have to continue this thing is that the hospital systems don't have the testing capacity that they need.

 

I know this because my wife has to hear this - and deal with it - every single day.

 

Everyday, the big question is about how many people can they test. If they can test more, they can start doing more. And the biggest reason they can't test is that they don't have the supplies to do it. Again, I hear this from my wife everyday.

 

All the hospitals and clinics are prepared for an influx of patients with regard to testing, and the immediate professionals who must treat them. But the capacity to test - after those necessities - is limited.

 

Healthcare professionals are being furloughed because it is not safe for them to do their job. Increase the capacity for testing - for the workers and the patients - and that will change.

 

History has shown that in situations like this, hospitals and clinics are one of the most dangerous places to be.

 

Frankly, you would be insane to send your mother or child or whomever to a hospital without knowing all the professionals involved in your loved ones care was free of COVID. Remember, COVID does not have to display any symptoms. Thus a nurse or doctor - if not tested - could have the virus - and go on to treat dozens of people (many who are sick or vulnerable) in a single day. That's exactly how you get outbreaks.

 

I would also like to add that there are nurses and doctors and other healthcare people who refuse to work without testing. It's a crazy situation.

 

We know a doctor who is working. His wife has undergone chemo a couple of times in the last year - making her extremely vulnerable to COVID. He goes home at night and talks to her between a plastic sheet. He has a room in the basement blocked off from the rest of the house, where he has his computer and TV and bed. He can't risk bringing anything home. COVID would kill his wife.

 

No matter what, I wish everyone well.

[FVBrewerFan]

County by county ends up making less sense when you realize your a pretty significant percentage of people regularly cross county boundaries for grocery runs and essential jobs. My in-laws have a 7 minute car trip one way to the grocery store in a different county, and a 15 minute trip the other direction in a 3rd county. As things get more spaced out in MN and WI you'll have all kinds of people wondering why they would have to travel halfway across the county, when this other town is so much closer. How about the Dells, it actually sits in 4 different counties. Marshfield sits in two.

 

As for referring to the modelling as bad science? This is how it actually works all the time. It is not the magical answer producing in a few hours nonsense you see on TV or in the movies. Models are built, tested improved over and over again with cycles of critique and publication. The more potential variables the broader the range of outcomes ends up. So biological sciences (especially humans with all of that free will and changing behavior) tend to have wider confidence intervals then physical sciences. Most organisms take so long to grow you wouldn't be through even 1 experiment yet.

 

Agreed--overall the models have been pretty good. All models have a ton of assumptions built into them, the key is figuring out which assumptions matter and which don't. At the end of the day, exponential growth is exponential growth no matter what coefficients you throw in there, and with very limited information the models correctly predicted the rapid spread of infections.

 

The tricker part was to model deaths and hospitalizations because the percentage of cases leading to hospitalization/death is an important parameter and nobody really knew what that was given the lack of data. At the end of the day you would rather prepare for an overestimation. And things were certainly helped by people being good about social distancing which should be celebrated. At some point I hope as a society we can congratulate ourselves for successfully fending off the worst case scenario.

 

The local and state responses have been great, especially given the complete lack of organization at the federal level and the general lack of a plan for what to do. To me it's quite scary how poor the national response was,if the states hadn't acted to get this under control it could have gotten pretty ugly quickly. The governors are just following the advice of infectious disease experts which is really all they can do.

 

You're now the 2nd moderator today with not so subtle political jabs. Not poster...moderator. Funny thing is, the governors have generally praised the federal government for their response and organization.

[owbc]

County by county ends up making less sense when you realize your a pretty significant percentage of people regularly cross county boundaries for grocery runs and essential jobs. My in-laws have a 7 minute car trip one way to the grocery store in a different county, and a 15 minute trip the other direction in a 3rd county. As things get more spaced out in MN and WI you'll have all kinds of people wondering why they would have to travel halfway across the county, when this other town is so much closer. How about the Dells, it actually sits in 4 different counties. Marshfield sits in two.

 

As for referring to the modelling as bad science? This is how it actually works all the time. It is not the magical answer producing in a few hours nonsense you see on TV or in the movies. Models are built, tested improved over and over again with cycles of critique and publication. The more potential variables the broader the range of outcomes ends up. So biological sciences (especially humans with all of that free will and changing behavior) tend to have wider confidence intervals then physical sciences. Most organisms take so long to grow you wouldn't be through even 1 experiment yet.

 

Agreed--overall the models have been pretty good. All models have a ton of assumptions built into them, the key is figuring out which assumptions matter and which don't. At the end of the day, exponential growth is exponential growth no matter what coefficients you throw in there, and with very limited information the models correctly predicted the rapid spread of infections.

 

The tricker part was to model deaths and hospitalizations because the percentage of cases leading to hospitalization/death is an important parameter and nobody really knew what that was given the lack of data. At the end of the day you would rather prepare for an overestimation. And things were certainly helped by people being good about social distancing which should be celebrated. At some point I hope as a society we can congratulate ourselves for successfully fending off the worst case scenario.

 

The local and state responses have been great, especially given the complete lack of organization at the federal level and the general lack of a plan for what to do. To me it's quite scary how poor the national response was,if the states hadn't acted to get this under control it could have gotten pretty ugly quickly. The governors are just following the advice of infectious disease experts which is really all they can do.

 

You're now the 2nd moderator today with not so subtle political jabs. Not poster...moderator. Funny thing is, the governors have generally praised the federal government for their response and organization.

 

If criticizing the federal government is inherently political then we're in bigger trouble than I thought. The federal government response has been and continues to be terrible and the case counts are higher than they should be because of it. Has nothing to do with preferring one political party to another.

[FVBrewerFan]

To top this off we just found out last night that the hospitals in our areas are furloughing their staff because there is a lack of patients in the hospital! This is truly insane.

I said this before, but the biggest issue is that they can't test everyone like they need to test. Are the hospitals blaming the 'stay at home' order for this? I don't doubt that. But the reason we have to continue this thing is that the hospital systems don't have the testing capacity that they need.

 

I know this because my wife has to hear this - and deal with it - every single day.

 

Everyday, the big question is about how many people can they test. If they can test more, they can start doing more. And the biggest reason they can't test is that they don't have the supplies to do it. Again, I hear this from my wife everyday.

 

All the hospitals and clinics are prepared for an influx of patients with regard to testing, and the immediate professionals who must treat them. But the capacity to test - after those necessities - is limited.

 

Healthcare professionals are being furloughed because it is not safe for them to do their job. Increase the capacity for testing - for the workers and the patients - and that will change.

 

History has shown that in situations like this, hospitals and clinics are one of the most dangerous places to be.

 

Frankly, you would be insane to send your mother or child or whomever to a hospital without knowing all the professionals involved in your loved ones care was free of COVID. Remember, COVID does not have to display any symptoms. Thus a nurse or doctor - if not tested - could have the virus - and go on to treat dozens of people (many who are sick or vulnerable) in a single day. That's exactly how you get outbreaks.

 

I would also like to add that there are nurses and doctors and other healthcare people who refuse to work without testing. It's a crazy situation.

 

We know a doctor who is working. His wife has undergone chemo a couple of times in the last year - making her extremely vulnerable to COVID. He goes home at night and talks to her between a plastic sheet. He has a room in the basement blocked off from the rest of the house, where he has his computer and TV and bed. He can't risk bringing anything home. COVID would kill his wife.

 

No matter what, I wish everyone well.

 

I'm sorry your wife believes this, but it just isn't true. The reason hospitals and clinics are half empty is because routine appts and elective procedures have been put on hold. It has nothing to do with PPE. This was not part of Evers stay at home order, it was guidance by the CDC and various federal agencies. The goal was to create space, beds, and medical staff for the onslaught of corona virus patients that never came.

 

Also, while I'm at it, I'm sick of hearing medical providers whine about lack of PPE. Why didn't they have a supply on hand for a pandemic, or any other type of emergency?

[MrTPlush]

All this talk about having enough testing and we don’t even utilize half the daily tests we say we can do as is.

[homer]

Plan to open things up gradually released (contingent on testing and case count....no dates on this yet):

 

https://content.govdelivery.com/attachments/WIGOV/2020/04/20/file_attachments/1431309/EMO31-BadgerBounceBack.pdf

[ilikewisco]

To top this off we just found out last night that the hospitals in our areas are furloughing their staff because there is a lack of patients in the hospital! This is truly insane.

I said this before, but the biggest issue is that they can't test everyone like they need to test. Are the hospitals blaming the 'stay at home' order for this? I don't doubt that. But the reason we have to continue this thing is that the hospital systems don't have the testing capacity that they need.

 

I know this because my wife has to hear this - and deal with it - every single day.

 

Everyday, the big question is about how many people can they test. If they can test more, they can start doing more. And the biggest reason they can't test is that they don't have the supplies to do it. Again, I hear this from my wife everyday.

 

All the hospitals and clinics are prepared for an influx of patients with regard to testing, and the immediate professionals who must treat them. But the capacity to test - after those necessities - is limited.

 

Healthcare professionals are being furloughed because it is not safe for them to do their job. Increase the capacity for testing - for the workers and the patients - and that will change.

 

History has shown that in situations like this, hospitals and clinics are one of the most dangerous places to be.

 

Frankly, you would be insane to send your mother or child or whomever to a hospital without knowing all the professionals involved in your loved ones care was free of COVID. Remember, COVID does not have to display any symptoms. Thus a nurse or doctor - if not tested - could have the virus - and go on to treat dozens of people (many who are sick or vulnerable) in a single day. That's exactly how you get outbreaks.

 

I would also like to add that there are nurses and doctors and other healthcare people who refuse to work without testing. It's a crazy situation.

 

We know a doctor who is working. His wife has undergone chemo a couple of times in the last year - making her extremely vulnerable to COVID. He goes home at night and talks to her between a plastic sheet. He has a room in the basement blocked off from the rest of the house, where he has his computer and TV and bed. He can't risk bringing anything home. COVID would kill his wife.

 

No matter what, I wish everyone well.

 

I'm sorry your wife believes this, but it just isn't true. The reason hospitals and clinics are half empty is because routine appts and elective procedures have been put on hold. It has nothing to do with PPE. This was not part of Evers stay at home order, it was guidance by the CDC and various federal agencies. The goal was to create space, beds, and medical staff for the onslaught of corona virus patients that never came.

 

Also, while I'm at it, I'm sick of hearing medical providers whine about lack of PPE. Why didn't they have a supply on hand for a pandemic, or any other type of emergency?

 

How do you have more information than a hospital administrator? Can you please elaborate how you know this is not true. It sounds like testing is the main point, and I think you missed it.

[FVBrewerFan]

I honestly assumed this was common knowledge, but this is pretty succinct summary from Politifact:

 

"Canceled elective procedures and admissions are freeing up bed space to prepare for (the) surge," Dr. James Lawler, an infectious diseases expert and internal medicine professor at the University of Nebraska Medical Center, told PolitiFact. "In regions where hospitalization rates from COVID are still relatively low, this is resulting in more empty beds — which is good. The surge is coming to them as well."

 

(Now, that last sentence isn't coming true, thankfully)

 

I did get his point. Hospitals are half empty and people are getting laid off, furloughed, etc. due to lack of testing. But that's not the reason.

[homer]

Is Dr Lawler with the CDC?

https://www.mwe.com/insights/how-to-handle-elective-surgeries-and-procedures-during-the-covid-19-pandemic/

Re: elective surgeries

 

Looks like every major healthcare advisory group recommended this including...

 

On March 1, 2020, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) issued Interim Guidance for Healthcare Facilities: Preparing for Community Transmission of COVID-19 in the United States. The CDC recommended that inpatient facilities reschedule elective surgeries as necessary and shift elective urgent inpatient diagnostic and surgical procedures to outpatient settings, when feasible.

 

On March 13, 2020, the American College of Surgeons (ACS) released COVID-19: Recommendations for Management of Elective Surgical Procedures, and recommended minimizing, postponing or canceling electively scheduled surgeries and invasive procedures

 

On March 14, 2020, US Surgeon General Jerome Adams, MD, retweeted ACS’s guidance, urging hospital and healthcare systems to “please consider stopping elective procedures until we can” flatten the curve.

 

On March 15, 2020, in response to these recommendations, the American Hospital Association, Association of American Medical Colleges, Children’s Hospital Association and Federation of American Hospitals sent a letter to the surgeon general requesting that he clarify his comments by recognizing the gradients of elective surgeries and offering guidance on how to classify the various levels of necessary care. The associations explained that “elective” simply means that “a procedure is scheduled rather than a response to an emergency,” and could therefore include, for example, replacement of a faulty heart valve, removal of a serious cancerous tumor or a pediatric hernia repair. The associations stated that the delay or cancellation of these procedures often rapidly worsens the patient’s condition, potentially turning it into a life-threatening condition and making the patient more vulnerable to COVID-19. The associations recommended that physicians determine what is in the patient’s best interest and make a case-by-case evaluation of many factors, such as the current and projected COVID-19 cases in the facility and in the surrounding area, and the urgency of the procedure.

 

March 17, 2020

"White House COVID-19 response coordinator Dr. Deborah Birx recommended that hospitals and dentists cancel all elective surgeries over the next two weeks in order to free up hospital beds and space. The task force has stated that its recommendations are not mandatory."

[ilikewisco]

They could have all the beds in the world for elective procedures, but if they can't test they're not going to do them.

[FVBrewerFan]

Is Dr Lawler with the CDC?

https://www.mwe.com/insights/how-to-handle-elective-surgeries-and-procedures-during-the-covid-19-pandemic/

Re: elective surgeries

 

Looks like every major healthcare advisory group recommended this including...

 

On March 1, 2020, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) issued Interim Guidance for Healthcare Facilities: Preparing for Community Transmission of COVID-19 in the United States. The CDC recommended that inpatient facilities reschedule elective surgeries as necessary and shift elective urgent inpatient diagnostic and surgical procedures to outpatient settings, when feasible.

 

On March 13, 2020, the American College of Surgeons (ACS) released COVID-19: Recommendations for Management of Elective Surgical Procedures, and recommended minimizing, postponing or canceling electively scheduled surgeries and invasive procedures

 

On March 14, 2020, US Surgeon General Jerome Adams, MD, retweeted ACS’s guidance, urging hospital and healthcare systems to “please consider stopping elective procedures until we can” flatten the curve.

 

On March 15, 2020, in response to these recommendations, the American Hospital Association, Association of American Medical Colleges, Children’s Hospital Association and Federation of American Hospitals sent a letter to the surgeon general requesting that he clarify his comments by recognizing the gradients of elective surgeries and offering guidance on how to classify the various levels of necessary care. The associations explained that “elective” simply means that “a procedure is scheduled rather than a response to an emergency,” and could therefore include, for example, replacement of a faulty heart valve, removal of a serious cancerous tumor or a pediatric hernia repair. The associations stated that the delay or cancellation of these procedures often rapidly worsens the patient’s condition, potentially turning it into a life-threatening condition and making the patient more vulnerable to COVID-19. The associations recommended that physicians determine what is in the patient’s best interest and make a case-by-case evaluation of many factors, such as the current and projected COVID-19 cases in the facility and in the surrounding area, and the urgency of the procedure.

 

March 17, 2020

"White House COVID-19 response coordinator Dr. Deborah Birx recommended that hospitals and dentists cancel all elective surgeries over the next two weeks in order to free up hospital beds and space. The task force has stated that its recommendations are not mandatory."

 

Thank you, you proved my point. I was just going to post something similar from CDC website. So, testing was never mentioned as the reason.

[homer]

Your point was that it all came from the CDC.

 

And from I've read...it's all voluntary. They could switch it up and go back to scheduled surgeries if they wanted to. These are just guidelines.

[ilikewisco]

You don't get the point Reilly is making. The last thing you want to do is introduce Covid-19 to a hospital without being able to identify it. It will spread and some of the most vulnerable happen to be there. If you are saying they have the capability to test but are using resources for a spike that's one thing, though I wouldn't agree. But you are just neglecting the testing part completely.

[igor67]

I'm guessing most folks don't pay close enough attention, but the PPE needs for an infectious disease are very different than most hospital care. How often when you have been in have all of the nurses treating you or the person your visiting had a mask, gloves, face shield, and the disposable gown over the scrubs? It's just not needed most of the time. One of the more common times is when a patient has C.Diff, there are 450,000 cases of that in a year. Because you have to treat anybody with the symptoms that way, you can look at the number of tested individuals and get an idea for the demand. We are just under 4 million tested. Without even adjusting for 2 months versus an entire year that's like 9 times the normal demand. Planning for that level of just in case is quite rare in any walk of life.

[FVBrewerFan]

Your point was that it all came from the CDC.

 

And from I've read...it's all voluntary. They could switch it up and go back to scheduled surgeries if they wanted to. These are just guidelines.

 

That's exactly what I said. That is wasn't a law, mandate, etc. it was GUIDANCE from CDC. This is important, because the story keeps changing in a whole variety of areas related to Covid-19. As you've shown, the reason hospitals are half full and people are being laid off is due to making room for an onslaught of Covid-19 patients- not because of lack of testing.

[FVBrewerFan]

I'm guessing most folks don't pay close enough attention, but the PPE needs for an infectious disease are very different than most hospital care. How often when you have been in have all of the nurses treating you or the person your visiting had a mask, gloves, face shield, and the disposable gown over the scrubs? It's just not needed most of the time. One of the more common times is when a patient has C.Diff, there are 450,000 cases of that in a year. Because you have to treat anybody with the symptoms that way, you can look at the number of tested individuals and get an idea for the demand. We are just under 4 million tested. Without even adjusting for 2 months versus an entire year that's like 9 times the normal demand. Planning for that level of just in case is quite rare in any walk of life.

 

Apparently planning for a pandemic is quite rare. That's a failure on the part of health care providers. We're not talking about having an extra 10,00 cat scan units on hand, gloves and face shields are pretty inexpensive- especially when bought in bulk at the right time.

[homer]

I'm guessing most folks don't pay close enough attention, but the PPE needs for an infectious disease are very different than most hospital care. How often when you have been in have all of the nurses treating you or the person your visiting had a mask, gloves, face shield, and the disposable gown over the scrubs? It's just not needed most of the time. One of the more common times is when a patient has C.Diff, there are 450,000 cases of that in a year. Because you have to treat anybody with the symptoms that way, you can look at the number of tested individuals and get an idea for the demand. We are just under 4 million tested. Without even adjusting for 2 months versus an entire year that's like 9 times the normal demand. Planning for that level of just in case is quite rare in any walk of life.

 

Apparently planning for a pandemic is quite rare. That's a failure on the part of health care providers. We're not talking about having an extra 10,00 cat scan units on hand, gloves and face shields are pretty inexpensive- especially when bought in bulk at the right time.

 

So maybe for profit, decentralized healthcare isn't well suited for pandemics?

[OldSchoolSnapper]

That was not the goal. The goal was to flatten the curve which would buy the hospitals some time to prepare for the onslaught

 

They're re-using surgical masks, making direct deals with suppliers and bidding against other hospitals to acquire the materials they need. Doctors and nurses are working around the clock, and there's no real progression in treatment plans and no vaccine in sight. That doesn't seem like they're managing ok. Some areas are doing better than others, obviously. The goal of extending the order is to make sure the onslaught doesn't come because the social distancing is working.

 

We can do it, if our grandfathers could muster the courage to storm Normandy beach we can handle getting back to life while practicing SAFE precautions and get past this virus.

 

Our grandfathers gave up so much for such a selfless cause, and it's astoundingly remarkable that after what, five weeks of being asked just to stay in our homes, in an era of video games, streaming services, Amazon, and food delivery, people are holding protests and clamoring for their Governors to open Buffalo Wild Wings.

 

 

You don't even have to stay inside. There are hundreds of trails open and nobody is stopping you from chipping golf balls, flying a kite or doing whatever in any of the million acres of green space. People are just sitting inside because their favorite restaurant is closed but there is plenty to do outside.

[Daubs]

To top this off we just found out last night that the hospitals in our areas are furloughing their staff because there is a lack of patients in the hospital! This is truly insane.

I said this before, but the biggest issue is that they can't test everyone like they need to test. Are the hospitals blaming the 'stay at home' order for this? I don't doubt that. But the reason we have to continue this thing is that the hospital systems don't have the testing capacity that they need.

 

I know this because my wife has to hear this - and deal with it - every single day.

 

Everyday, the big question is about how many people can they test. If they can test more, they can start doing more. And the biggest reason they can't test is that they don't have the supplies to do it. Again, I hear this from my wife everyday.

 

All the hospitals and clinics are prepared for an influx of patients with regard to testing, and the immediate professionals who must treat them. But the capacity to test - after those necessities - is limited.

 

Healthcare professionals are being furloughed because it is not safe for them to do their job. Increase the capacity for testing - for the workers and the patients - and that will change.

 

History has shown that in situations like this, hospitals and clinics are one of the most dangerous places to be.

 

Frankly, you would be insane to send your mother or child or whomever to a hospital without knowing all the professionals involved in your loved ones care was free of COVID. Remember, COVID does not have to display any symptoms. Thus a nurse or doctor - if not tested - could have the virus - and go on to treat dozens of people (many who are sick or vulnerable) in a single day. That's exactly how you get outbreaks.

 

I would also like to add that there are nurses and doctors and other healthcare people who refuse to work without testing. It's a crazy situation.

 

We know a doctor who is working. His wife has undergone chemo a couple of times in the last year - making her extremely vulnerable to COVID. He goes home at night and talks to her between a plastic sheet. He has a room in the basement blocked off from the rest of the house, where he has his computer and TV and bed. He can't risk bringing anything home. COVID would kill his wife.

 

No matter what, I wish everyone well.

 

I'm sorry your wife believes this, but it just isn't true. The reason hospitals and clinics are half empty is because routine appts and elective procedures have been put on hold. It has nothing to do with PPE. This was not part of Evers stay at home order, it was guidance by the CDC and various federal agencies. The goal was to create space, beds, and medical staff for the onslaught of corona virus patients that never came.

 

Also, while I'm at it, I'm sick of hearing medical providers whine about lack of PPE. Why didn't they have a supply on hand for a pandemic, or any other type of emergency?

 

My wife works in a Milwaukee area hospital (not on the front lines), but I can confirm this to be the case why that particular hospital was looking into furloughs - their census was down due to the expected flood of COVID cases not occurring, along with the postponement of anything not seen as an emergency.

[FVBrewerFan]

I'm guessing most folks don't pay close enough attention, but the PPE needs for an infectious disease are very different than most hospital care. How often when you have been in have all of the nurses treating you or the person your visiting had a mask, gloves, face shield, and the disposable gown over the scrubs? It's just not needed most of the time. One of the more common times is when a patient has C.Diff, there are 450,000 cases of that in a year. Because you have to treat anybody with the symptoms that way, you can look at the number of tested individuals and get an idea for the demand. We are just under 4 million tested. Without even adjusting for 2 months versus an entire year that's like 9 times the normal demand. Planning for that level of just in case is quite rare in any walk of life.

 

Apparently planning for a pandemic is quite rare. That's a failure on the part of health care providers. We're not talking about having an extra 10,00 cat scan units on hand, gloves and face shields are pretty inexpensive- especially when bought in bulk at the right time.

 

So maybe for profit, decentralized healthcare isn't well suited for pandemics?

 

That would be true if most other countries had plenty of PPE on hand, which isn't the case, of course. Just ask the UK as a quick example.

[FVBrewerFan]

You don't even have to stay inside. There are hundreds of trails open and nobody is stopping you from chipping golf balls, flying a kite or doing whatever in any of the million acres of green space. People are just sitting inside because their favorite restaurant is closed but there is plenty to do outside.

 

Cool, I'll tell my neighbor that is going to decide any day now if he's going to close his restaurant and file bankruptcy that he can fly a kite. My dad has missed 6 appointments so far with his primary care physician, specialists, and lab work. But I'll let him know he can go chip golf balls.

 

These flippant "can't go to Wild Wings" comments are so condescending and miss the point by a country mile.

[FVBrewerFan]

My wife works in a Milwaukee area hospital (not on the front lines), but I can confirm this to be the case why that particular hospital was looking into furloughs - their census was down due to the expected flood of COVID cases not occurring, along with the postponement of anything not seen as an emergency.

 

Thanks. I honestly though this was fairly common knowledge, but I was challenged pretty heavily for suggesting it.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

You don't even have to stay inside. There are hundreds of trails open and nobody is stopping you from chipping golf balls, flying a kite or doing whatever in any of the million acres of green space. People are just sitting inside because their favorite restaurant is closed but there is plenty to do outside.

 

Cool, I'll tell my neighbor that is going to decide any day now if he's going to close his restaurant and file bankruptcy that he can fly a kite. My dad has missed 6 appointments so far with his primary care physician, specialists, and lab work. But I'll let him know he can go chip golf balls.

 

These flippant "can't go to Wild Wings" comments are so condescending and miss the point by a country mile.

 

That wasn't what I was saying at all, I'm on the side of opening things back up. But business owners aren't doing most of the complaining. It's people who want to go do things. I do too, but I don't make the laws, so I try to make the most of the situation.

 

Sorry about your Dad's appointments, but my mother actually died on the 19th of March, the last time I was able to see her was February 29th. I'm anticipating a funeral sometime in August. Those of us impacted by such things don't down have a monopoly on what's best for the state/country.

 

In the meantime, stop smarting off to everyone in your path. My valid point was that nobody is stuck inside unless they're choosing to be stuck inside.