2020 Packers Draft Thread

[homer]

Saw an interesting stat today: AJ Dillon ran into a stacked box 44% of the time. Jonathan Taylor? 20%

 

From this article:

https://sportsinfosolutionsblog.com/2020/04/28/fans-didnt-like-it-but-the-packers-had-a-plan-for-their-offense-in-the-2020-draft/

[PeaveyFury]

May I present to you the 2005 Green Bay Packers draft:

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/nfl-draft/2005/2005-report-card-report

 

Green Bay: The discrepancy here is all about Aaron Rodgers. Bell understands why they took Rodgers but says it "prevented the choice of an immediate impact player." Rang and Borges cannot overlook the value of getting Rodgers with the 24th pick, and the Rodgers selection is the only thing cited by Maske in giving them an A. The other point of contention is which needs that the Packers addressed. Rang loves the pick of receivers Terrance Murphy in the third round and Craig Bragg in the sixth, while Kiper, who likes Murphy, says the Packers did not need a receiver and that "there is just not enough defensive help in this class." Everyone agrees that second round pick Nick Collins, a cornerback from Bethune-Cookman, was a major reach. I think Pierson may sum it up best: "If Rodgers eventually replaces Favre with any degree of success, it will be a great draft. Grade: C-."

 

"Everyone agrees that second round pick Nick Collins... was a major reach."

 

Even without hindsight, after Green Bay made the pick the Ravens GM called TT and congratulated him because they were going to pick Collins two picks later in the 2nd round.

 

Fan reactions:

https://247sports.com/nfl/green-bay-packers/Article/Fans-mixed-on-Packers-draft-104192879/

 

My favorite one:

 

Draft Grade: F-

Here's why: Is Thompson still working for Seattle? When I watched opposing offenses run roughshod over the pathetic GB defense (a line that puts almost no pressure on the QB, backs who can't defend the pass - unless, of course they hold, players who can't tackle) ("Remember the Titans" isn't just a movie title), my first thought wasn't, "what this team really needs is a backup QB."

It doesn't matter who the defensive coordinator is. If your players have no talent (or brains, Draft pick Nick Collins scored a 10 on the Wonderlic test!), you're not going to stop the opposing offense. One of the few players from last years team with talent now wears purple, and the defense gets zero help from the draft?

 

Nobody has any idea what a team's draft board looks like, no matter how many internet yahoo's rankings they look at. There's a reason they are writing on the internet and not employed by a NFL team to do pre-draft evaluations.

 

Thanks for sharing. I do remember how panned that draft was, especially after Rodgers sat and Collins struggled his first season or two.

 

And man, how even better that draft would look if not for two spine injuries. We'll never know what Murphy would have become, but Collins' career was cut short maybe halfway through a career that may have been on a HOF-like trajectory. You pull two HOFers from a draft, that's legendary stuff.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I'm fine with Love, but I don't think it's quite as simple as Rodgers was good so it was the right pick. When you consider the Packers won 13 games in 2007 and Brett Favre still had 5 years of mostly good football left, you can certainly make an argument that had they hit on another player with that Rodgers pick, it could have, possibly, gotten Brett Favre another title. Roddy White went four picks later, Frank Gore was picked a couple rounds later. I'm going from memory but I believe Tatupu went mid 2nd too. Rodgers was other-worldly good, so no one has issues with the pick now, but there's still an argument that a) someone else could have helped Favre win faster/more, and b) the Packers could have found another QB between 2005 and 2010. Probably not one as good though.

 

I am not suggesting Rodgers was a bad pick, just that I think there's more gray area than how Love turns out. He can turn out fine and I think it's still OK to be upset with the pick. Personally I just never cared for getting worked up in the immediate aftermath of a draft.

[pacopete4]

Saw an interesting stat today: AJ Dillon ran into a stacked box 44% of the time. Jonathan Taylor? 20%

 

From this article:

https://sportsinfosolutionsblog.com/2020/04/28/fans-didnt-like-it-but-the-packers-had-a-plan-for-their-offense-in-the-2020-draft/

 

This was a good read. Thanks for sharing that.

[LouisEly]

Saw an interesting stat today: AJ Dillon ran into a stacked box 44% of the time. Jonathan Taylor? 20%

 

From this article:

https://sportsinfosolutionsblog.com/2020/04/28/fans-didnt-like-it-but-the-packers-had-a-plan-for-their-offense-in-the-2020-draft/

Speaking of Jonathan Taylor, Marlon Mack of the Colts rushed for more yards than Aaron Jones did last year, and it didn't stop the Colts from taking Taylor 21 spot ahead of where the Packers picked Dillon. They already had a starter at RB.

[LouisEly]

I'm fine with Love, but I don't think it's quite as simple as Rodgers was good so it was the right pick. When you consider the Packers won 13 games in 2007 and Brett Favre still had 5 years of mostly good football left, you can certainly make an argument that had they hit on another player with that Rodgers pick, it could have, possibly, gotten Brett Favre another title. Roddy White went four picks later, Frank Gore was picked a couple rounds later. I'm going from memory but I believe Tatupu went mid 2nd too. Rodgers was other-worldly good, so no one has issues with the pick now, but there's still an argument that a) someone else could have helped Favre win faster/more, and b) the Packers could have found another QB between 2005 and 2010. Probably not one as good though.

 

I am not suggesting Rodgers was a bad pick, just that I think there's more gray area than how Love turns out. He can turn out fine and I think it's still OK to be upset with the pick. Personally I just never cared for getting worked up in the immediate aftermath of a draft.

Between 2005 and 2010 the Packers could have taken a QB with their first draft pick every year, and the best they would have gotten was...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If the Packers would have taken an immediate impact player, maybe they win a few more games in 2005 and if they draft after #11 in 2006 the best they could have gotten was Ryan Fitzpatrick.

 

People greatly overestimate the number of good QBs who have come into the league in the last 15 years.

[bjkrautk]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/05/01/months-before-drafting-him-packers-used-josiah-deguara-as-a-teaching-tool/

 

"Deguara, a third round tight end/fullback out of Cincinnati, was used by Packers coach Matt LaFleur in a team meeting last year as an example of the way LaFleur wants his players to play the game.

 

Specifically, LaFleur showed the Packers a highlight of Deguara running down a UCLA player after an interception, hustling to make a tackle on what otherwise would have been a pick-six."

 

 

Honestly, I like the guy considerably more after knowing this. Not 100% sure he was worth a 3rd round pick, but that's academic at this point.

[MrTPlush]

Saw an interesting stat today: AJ Dillon ran into a stacked box 44% of the time. Jonathan Taylor? 20%

 

From this article:

https://sportsinfosolutionsblog.com/2020/04/28/fans-didnt-like-it-but-the-packers-had-a-plan-for-their-offense-in-the-2020-draft/

Speaking of Jonathan Taylor, Marlon Mack of the Colts rushed for more yards than Aaron Jones did last year, and it didn't stop the Colts from taking Taylor 21 spot ahead of where the Packers picked Dillon. They already had a starter at RB.

 

Marlon Mack is also a FA after next year much like Jones (I believe). Not like either team has some stud lined up for the next 3+ years.

 

Guessing both teams don’t eye their current RB as a long term solutions, probably because of money.

[trwi7]

I think the Dillon pick says a lot more of what they think about Jamaal Williams than it does about Aaron Jones' contract status.

[brewcrewdue80]

I think the Dillon pick says a lot more of what they think about Jamaal Williams than it does about Aaron Jones' contract status.

 

No doubt a Thunder for Jones' Lightning. It'd be great if they could work a 3 year extension deal with Jones. No doubt Rodgers has a chemistry with him in the passing game.

[HiAndTight]

Saw an interesting stat today: AJ Dillon ran into a stacked box 44% of the time. Jonathan Taylor? 20%

 

From this article:

https://sportsinfosolutionsblog.com/2020/04/28/fans-didnt-like-it-but-the-packers-had-a-plan-for-their-offense-in-the-2020-draft/

 

 

Wow....that is really shocking. It seemed like JT was running into 8 man boxes all the time...and you're telling me Dillion ran into twice as many of them?

 

 

Doesn't mean Dillon's gonna be Henry, but as always, until these guys get a couple years in the NFL, I'm looking at the draft with an optimistic outlook. Doesn't have to be Henry, but if he can be a big bruiser who can get you 750 yards and help Jones stay healthy..great.

 

Jamal Williams is just a guy in my opinion.

 

I'd would have been nice if we could have gotten a WR'er, but two guys seemed to go JUST ahead of us in both the 2nd and the 3rd rounds....so...what can you do.

[HiAndTight]

I think the Dillon pick says a lot more of what they think about Jamaal Williams than it does about Aaron Jones' contract status.

 

 

Agreed. I'd imagine Jones role will change very little this year. Last year however Jamal Williams came in for full drives in relief of Jones.

 

 

And again...they're trying to become a run heavy team. They're running the same(or similar) offense that the Falcons ran when they blew the SB lead, the Rams are running and the 49'ers are running.

 

So you're always going to need a guy who can run that outside stretch and catch the ball out of the backfield. If you lose Jones, you'll still need to replace him. Dillon's merely a supplement.

[LouisEly]

Rewatching the UW-Minnesota game from last year and Kamal Martin came out of the game early with a knee injury. They said that he had been battling a knee injury the last several weeks, and that might have affected some of the tape on him last year.

[nodakfan17]

Here is a neat article from CBS Sports that lists the best player drafted in every draft slot 1-256. The Packers are disproportionately represented, which speaks to the drafting prowess of Ron Wolf and Ted Thompson. The author went with Ed Reed at #24 instead of Aaron Rodgers. Perhaps he felt the need to be contrarian? Good offseason fodder, nonetheless.

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/ultimate-nfl-draft-the-best-pick-for-all-256-slots-over-the-last-50-years-from-peyton-manning-to/

[brewcrewdue80]

I dig the idea on 1&2 for both Colts 2s. Simply because the WR I'm enamored with[Chase Claypool) seems destined for selections around there. I envision he being the kind of Gronk, Kelce, Gonzalez, and going back Eric Moulds defensive, mismatch gamewreckers.

 

The only tidbit is I see more and more where Love is selected before GBs pick. I dont know if that's to mock players who shouldnt be there for the team the writer supports and lo and behold hes there!. Tristen Wirfs regarded as best OL in draft by most lasted to 10 or 11 in a mock or 2.

 

I wonder how quickly or slowly the draft runs when they do it.

 

4TDs today ho hum game 5 of career. Has Love even been active for a game?

 

Patrick Queen with a sack/strip fumble and recovery today.

[PeaveyFury]

Has Love even been active for a game?

 

Has he needed to be?

[nodakfan17]

Patrick Queen was the player I wanted when the Packers traded up, but there’s no point in criticizing BG now. His future is tied to Love.

[HiAndTight]

Patrick Queen was the player I wanted when the Packers traded up, but there’s no point in criticizing BG now. His future is tied to Love.

 

 

Yeah, I thought that as well, but I'm not so sure any longer. He IS the GM that hired Matt LaFleur...and if Love doesn't pan out but the Packers are competing for SB's the next several years, I don't think people are going to care.

 

But really...I wish people would stop with the "Love hasn't even been active." This was never a secret. He was never expected to contribute in year one or even year 3 by most people.

 

 

As for who I was hoping for...I was kinda hoping we'd take Love, but I knew what a issue that'd create(yet it was even worse), but I'd seen Ruggs going in the 20's in multiple mocks and liked him obviously and Shenault Jr. I also really liked that Raekwon Davis as a 2nd rounder, but he was gone anyway.

[adambr2]

I think it's ok to be impressed with the job the Packers have done putting together a competitive 2020 team, while simultaneously noting that the 2020 draft class hasn't improved the 2020 team in any way.

 

I am excited about the 2020 team, and they've certainly changed my mind since the pre-season.

 

I thought our 2020 draft was quite awful, and nothing has happened since then to change my mind on that.

[HiAndTight]

I think it's ok to be impressed with the job the Packers have done putting together a competitive 2020 team, while simultaneously noting that the 2020 draft class hasn't improved the 2020 team in any way.

 

I am excited about the 2020 team, and they've certainly changed my mind since the pre-season.

 

I thought our 2020 draft was quite awful, and nothing has happened since then to change my mind on that.

 

 

What COULD have happened to change your mind though?

 

Is there anything that can until we see what Love does as a starter?

 

Also...people should probably keep in mind how people went nuts when we acquired Rodgers and Favre.

 

Favre, the 33rd pick in the previous draft was traded for the 19th pick(despite being the 3rd string QB and throwing 2 picks in 4 passes). People were calling for Wolfs head right out of the gate.

 

And then Favre, a year younger than Rodgers and the most durable at the position in NFL history is drafted after a year the Packers went 10-6 and didn't have a lot of weapons. And contrary to the narrative, he was not threatening retirement at that time. That came primarily over the next three years.

 

 

So if you were upset about it...you're gonna be upset about it until we see Love play like with Favre and Rodgers before him.

[adambr2]

I think it's ok to be impressed with the job the Packers have done putting together a competitive 2020 team, while simultaneously noting that the 2020 draft class hasn't improved the 2020 team in any way.

 

I am excited about the 2020 team, and they've certainly changed my mind since the pre-season.

 

I thought our 2020 draft was quite awful, and nothing has happened since then to change my mind on that.

 

 

What COULD have happened to change your mind though?

 

Is there anything that can until we see what Love does as a starter?

 

Also...people should probably keep in mind how people went nuts when we acquired Rodgers and Favre.

 

Favre, the 33rd pick in the previous draft was traded for the 19th pick(despite being the 3rd string QB and throwing 2 picks in 4 passes). People were calling for Wolfs head right out of the gate.

 

And then Favre, a year younger than Rodgers and the most durable at the position in NFL history is drafted after a year the Packers went 10-6 and didn't have a lot of weapons. And contrary to the narrative, he was not threatening retirement at that time. That came primarily over the next three years.

 

 

So if you were upset about it...you're gonna be upset about it until we see Love play like with Favre and Rodgers before him.

 

I liked the Rodgers pick. I'm sure not everyone was in the same boat, but he was such a great value at 24. That was a damned if you do, damned if you don't choice for TT.

 

Love was a little different. It felt forced. He's far less of a certain prospect than Rodgers (not that Rodgers was a total slam dunk) There were other options. We'll see.

 

As far as what COULD have happened to change my mind, I thought Dillon would have a lot more than a nonexistent role in the offense. I don't see any real signs that he's got the future that people want to believe. Even next year, if Jones is re-signed, Dillon doesn't do more than take over the Jamaal Williams role. It's disappointing that they don't even consider him a short yardage option this year.

 

DeGuara is who he is. An H-back and special teamer, when he can make it on the field. He'll make some future rosters, but that's not a huge return on a 3rd round pick. There's just not a ton of upside there to dream on.

 

But yes, like 2005, the only thing people will remember about the '20 draft will be whatever happens with Love. I think Favre and Rodgers have given people unrealistic expectations for Love, though.

[HiAndTight]

 

I liked the Rodgers pick. I'm sure not everyone was in the same boat, but he was such a great value at 24. That was a damned if you do, damned if you don't choice for TT.

 

DeGuara is who he is. An H-back and special teamer, when he can make it on the field. He'll make some future rosters, but that's not a huge return on a 3rd round pick. There's just not a ton of upside there to dream on.

 

 

Yeah, I can't find ANYONE who doesn't say they were a fan of the Rodgers pick NOW or the Favre trade back when it happened...but that doesn't change that we got D's and F's for our grades in the 2005 draft and the headlines when we traded for Favre were blistering. I believe you were a fan of it, but VERY few were.

 

I think people also understated the huge questions about Rodgers. His arm strength, he was a "system" QB, a Tedford QB. It was thought to be an extremely weak draft class.

 

As for Dillon...he's a rookie behind two established players who are rookies after this year. No live action...so I can't really see why after 4 games you don't see the same future for him.

 

And again...you're saying we didn't get much of a return from our 3rd round pick...a guy who was starting and playing well before he got injured in his rookie season.

 

 

 

This feels like confirmation bias to me. No pre-season...not surprising that our rookies wouldn't be having a huge impact. And the two guys who were given a chance, Degura and Martin suffered injuries.

[nodakfan17]

The biggest differences between drafting Rodgers at #24 in 2005 and Love at #26 in 2020:

 

1) Favre had contemplated retirement as early as 2002 when he told Peter King that he would prefer to be on his tractor back home in Mississippi. Aaron Rodgers has repeatedly said he wants to play until he’s 40.

 

2) Rodgers was the second QB drafted in his class and could have gone #1 overall. Love was the fourth QB drafted in his class and no one considered him a potential #1 pick.

 

3) Rodgers literally fell to the Packers at #24. He was projected to be picked much higher. The Packers traded up to #26 to get Love and then the GM tried to gaslight fans by saying Love fell to them.

 

I didn’t like the Love pick at the time, but it may have been the right pick. Time will tell. However, it’s not fair to compare the two situations. Fans have a right to be puzzled by the move. But this team is also 17-3 in their last 20 games, so those same fans should also be paitent.

[adambr2]

I think people also understated the huge questions about Rodgers. His arm strength, he was a "system" QB, a Tedford QB. It was thought to be an extremely weak draft class.

 

No doubt there were questions about Rodgers, by no means was he a perfect prospect. But he was also seen as a consensus top 2 pick just weeks before the draft. So there was absolutely a vast gap in how he was seen and Love was seen as a potential franchise QB.

 

As for Dillon...he's a rookie behind two established players who are rookies after this year. No live action...so I can't really see why after 4 games you don't see the same future for him.

 

Well, that's part of my point. We spent a 2nd round pick on a position where we have two established players. 2nd day picks at that position are almost universally early contributors at least to some degree. It's not a position that you spend an early pick on a developmental year. I think Jones is likely to be re-signed. I don't think Gute is going to let him walk. And if they were planning on it, I think Dillon would be seeing a lot more game action than he is. I thought he would at least be a threat to the playing time of Jamaal Williams, who is not a special player. I don't think it's a great sign that he has less touches than Tyler Ervin.

 

And again...you're saying we didn't get much of a return from our 3rd round pick...a guy who was starting and playing well before he got injured in his rookie season.

 

Starting and playing well? He has 31 career snaps. This seems like a stretch. He has 17 less snaps this season than Tonyan had on opening day. Also, you know as well as I do that position matters when you're talking about a player starting and playing well. A 3rd round rookie starting at WR or CB is notable...it's common for rookies to contribute immediately at tertiary positions like H back/fullback.

 

I like DeGuara. I really do. I'm just talking solely about the draft, and about value. He's a guy I would have loved as a Day 3 pick. I hated the pick because I felt it was a reach in Round 3. My mind certainly isn't going to be changed now that he's going to be coming off of a significant knee injury 31 snaps into his career and competing for snaps as the 3rd TE next season. I guess my bigger point on DeGuara is that H-back/blocking TE's aren't at a premium in the NFL and there's no need to pay a premium price for one in the form of a 3rd round pick when you can just go sign a veteran like Marcades Lewis for 2 million.

 

Maybe it's confirmation bias, but I'm just trying to view it impartially and not forcing myself to like the pick because it's a Packer draft. There are Packer drafts that I have loved, and in the absence of certainty I usually defer to our guys (example, I wanted Courtney Upshaw, but when we took Nick Perry, I was sold on it quickly.) Sometimes I love guys that don't really pan out, Joshua Jackson for example).

 

This particular draft I didn't like at all, and I understand that there have been drafts in the past that have been widely panned and turned out well, and I fully acknowledge that IF DeGuara turns out to be a franchise type QB (here), obviously that will change the entire complexion of this draft.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

3) Rodgers literally fell to the Packers at #24. He was projected to be picked much higher. The Packers traded up to #26 to get Love and then the GM tried to gaslight fans by saying Love fell to them.

 

That's a bogus argument. We have absolutely no idea where Love sat on the the Packers' draft value board. That's the only board that counts ... not anything guys like Todd McShay or Mel Kiper put out. If the Packers had Love as a Top 10 talent, and then got him at #26, then he fell to them. It's obvious that the Packers really liked him coming into the draft, and IMO insinuating that Gute is lying to the fanbase about Love's value is flat out wrong.