Packer Offseason Thread: Latest- Packers Sign Kenny Clark- 4 years/$70 Million

[LouisEly]

I was just going to put up an offseason needs by position thread, so perhaps you can change the title of the thread.

 

Number in parenthesis is the need on a 0-10 scale.

 

Quarterback (4): Need for a starter - 0. Need for a backup - 9. Time to start developing a legitimate backup.

Running back (1): Jones has become a legitimate star, Williams a high quality backup, and the addition of Ervin as a gadget player makes this one of the best backfields the Packers have had since the 60's.

Tight end (5): I'm pretty high on Sternberger, hard to tell what they have in him because of the injuries, but Graham is all but certain to get cut and Lewis is on the twilight of his career. They could stand to bring in a developmental guy. They moved James Looney from DL to TE as he looked good at TE on the scout team; maybe he can develop into a good blocking TE to replace Lewis.

Wide receiver (9): The young guys haven't developed, and it's past time to invest here. It's the right time too, as 55(!) wide receivers were invited to the NFL combine. They don't need to invest a 1st, as there will be talented WRs available in the 2nd and 3rd round, maybe later. Good chance they will double-dip at WR in the draft.

Tackle (8): Bulaga is a FA, and Bak will be after next year. They'll need to draft one this year, because even if Bulaga is back, he doesn't have a lot of years left and usually only plays about 80% of the teams snaps because of various injuries.

Guard (5): Taylor likely is a cap casualty, and who knows when Madison will be ready to return, so depth is needed. If Bulaga isn't back and Turner slides out to RT, then this becomes an 8. Linsley is a FA after next season, and Jenkins could slide back to center if Linsley moves on.

Center (4): Linsley had one of the best pass block win rates for centers in the league last year, if not the best, but he is due $10.6M this year and is a FA after next year.

 

Defensive line (7): Clark is a FA after next year, Adams hasn't developed, and we saw what a dominant defensive line can do in the games against San Francisco. I like Keke as a developmental guy, Lowry is underrated, and Lancaster is a decent two-down run stuffer, but another disruptor on the line is needed.

OLB (2): If someone signs away Fackrell they will need another backup, but they are pretty well set here for the next three years.

ILB (10): Martinez is a FA and if he leaves I have no idea what they will do as Burks hasn't developed. Unfortunately, this isn't a good year for ILBs in the draft. Likely a very high priority for a FA signing with what few FA dollars they will have left after (hopefully) extending Clark and Bak.

Corner (4): King finally started to show what he can do when healthy, but he hasn't been healthy. Alexander is a budding star, they found a gem in Sullivan, and they were so deep here they let Tony Brown go. That being said, cornerbacks are like starting pitchers, you can never have too many good ones.

Safety (4): Like QB, the need for starters is zero, but they need to upgrade backups here as Will Redmond wasn't cutting it and Tramon Williams is a free agent. Campbell and Greene are just guys. Maybe it's time to move Josh Jackson to safety.

 

Kicker (9): While Crosby is likely to be back, he is a free agent.

Punter (2): While inconsistent, Scott has a big leg and should be given more time to develop. Need for a better special teams coach - 9.

Long snapper (1): I don't recall hearing Bradley's name being called once in the last two years, and for a long snapper that is a very good thing.

[DHonks]

 

Defensive line (7): Clark is a FA after next year, Adams hasn't developed, and we saw what a dominant defensive line can do in the games against San Francisco. I like Keke as a developmental guy, Lowry is underrated, and Lancaster is a decent two-down run stuffer, but another disruptor on the line is needed.

ILB (10): Martinez is a FA and if he leaves I have no idea what they will do as Burks hasn't developed. Unfortunately, this isn't a good year for ILBs in the draft. Likely a very high priority for a FA signing with what few FA dollars they will have left after (hopefully) extending Clark and Bak.

 

Remember for our DLine, they’re not taught or paid to dominate. They’re taught to occupy blockers and create opportunities for our linebackers. If we want to push towards a 4-3 again, then the DLine can be asked to try to dominate. Then again, we haven’t really used 4-3 or 3-4 in years, as our base defense has been nickel

[CheezWizHed]

I was actually halfway through a similar post. I split this off of the OL post. There is no need to mush all topics in one thread. That is why we have this Other Sports Forum.

[CheezWizHed]

 

Defensive line (7): Clark is a FA after next year, Adams hasn't developed, and we saw what a dominant defensive line can do in the games against San Francisco. I like Keke as a developmental guy, Lowry is underrated, and Lancaster is a decent two-down run stuffer, but another disruptor on the line is needed.

ILB (10): Martinez is a FA and if he leaves I have no idea what they will do as Burks hasn't developed. Unfortunately, this isn't a good year for ILBs in the draft. Likely a very high priority for a FA signing with what few FA dollars they will have left after (hopefully) extending Clark and Bak.

 

Remember for our DLine, they’re not taught or paid to dominate. They’re taught to occupy blockers and create opportunities for our linebackers. If we want to push towards a 4-3 again, then the DLine can be asked to try to dominate. Then again, we haven’t really used 4-3 or 3-4 in years, as our base defense has been nickel

 

Then they did a bad job at occupying blockers. A good portion of our poor run D was on the DL getting pushed around. MLB play and playing a bunch of nickel D would be the other. Lowry did not play well this year; he got pushed around in our worst games. I can see them getting one of several NTs in FA plus another draft pick to upgrade the position. We had no depth.

[PeaveyFury]

I believe both Lowry and Lancaster both graded out poorly this year in general, and there could be upgrades there fairly easily.

[brewcrewdue80]

I just had a thought when it comes to the TE/WR position. Allen Lazard bulking up and becoming a TE breed the ilk that Travis Kelce is. I think about how he goes about on the field he reminds me of a TE. He certainly led the WR core for blocking effectively. Put Sternberger now as #2 TE. I think you can create mismatches. If we're talking the WRs available in this year's draft being good, then just fill up on two within you're first 3 picks. Sign a FA WR to pair with Adams (Amari Cooper if can afford) Emmanuel Sanders or Breshad Perriman would seem the highest upsides. Sanders would be a 1 or 2yr contract I imagine? Perriman was a 1st rd pick that appears to know how to play FA contracts. Become a good looking WR in your last 5games before it, 506yds of 645 total yds on season. Essentially 1/3rd his total in career of 51 games. It's actually looking like a really weak class to do this. They had better find a WR with their 1st pick if the MLB they need most isn't there.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

The Packers WR problem is certainly not due a lack of investing in the position. They have just been absolutely horrible drafting there. Here's the other thing. If they draft one, even early, there is a 90% chance he is not really a needle mover this year. The DK Metcalfs are few and far between and even he came on really late in the year. With Rodgers age I really think this is a position they need to be active in FA and sign a veteran. It doesn't even have to be someone that great, just an OK established player.

 

Austin Hooper is already a big rumor at TE, which makes sense considering the Packers tried to trade for him. Another position where drafting doesn't make much sense to me since Sternberger looks like a nice player and a first-year guy is not likely to make the difference they need.

 

I don't think there is any chance Bulaga is back. I just can't see them wanting to commit more than one year to someone of his history, and some other team will happily do so. They seem to know how to draft OL so I'm not super concerned there. They need some athleticism at MLB to either replace or complement Martinez. Their DL has to be better, and the draft might be the place to do that since they've already invested a lot of money on the defense in FA, and paid Lowry. You can't spend everywhere, and that may be the spot you just have to hope some guys have better seasons.

[MrTPlush]

To be honest I think they need to invest high in the draft and in FA at WR. I think they greatly need someone able to step up and be reliable right away, but Rodgers is 50 years old. Getting the next great WR in the mix for 2021 and beyond is really important too in my opinion.

 

I also don't think they have invested in the WR position all that much. They have been terrible drafting, but what do you expect when you are using 5th round picks or worse? There is a reason those guys are 5th rounders or beyond. Skill positions on offense are usually high draft picks. There are diamonds in the rough etc., but to get a sure fire guy the first few rounds is where they are.

 

Past the 3rd round here are recent Packer WRs that had 1,000+ receiving yards in their CAREER:

 

MVS - 2018 Draft Pick (5th Rounder)

Donald Driver - 1999 Draft Pick (7th Rounder)

 

It is probably about time to just take a trip to the jewelry store for a diamond instead of aimlessly digging a hole in the backyard hoping to find one.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

That is true, they haven't taken early round guys there, which is too bad because I believe Nelson, Jennings, Cobb and Adams were all 2nds and Jones was a 3rd. I wasn't saying they shouldn't draft one, just that I don't think it will be enough, and even if they do, there really needs to be a veteran there. I would love for them to get someone like Marvin Jones, just somebody that can run.

[patrickgpe]

I want an OT and WR in the first 2 rounds of the draft. Just think if the packers got Brown, Mclaurin, or Metcalf in the draft last year how different their offense would have been. I think part of the issue is that the packers have invested so heavily in their defense the last few drafts and last free agency, their offense hasn't really improved. I really hope the packers focus there this draft and free agency.

[homer]

Or Deebo Samuel...

[homer]

Packers have drafted plenty of receivers....none have planned out. Curious how Brown comes back from injury. He seemed decent. Lazard seems like a really nice three or four guy.

[Jenkins5]

Thompson invested a lot in WRs early. It built a get WR core for us that last most of Rodgers career. Jennings 2nd, Jones 3rd, Jordy 2nd, Cobb 2nd, Adams, 2nd. All those guys except Adams & Cobb are retired with only Adams still around. Investing at WRs is using quality high draft picks on them. Because we drafted a guy in 4, 5, 6 one year isn’t the same. Sure you can hit on those guys but to say well we drafted a WR in 5th round and 6th isn’t the same as taking a highly rated stud early. Gute had that mindset and it killed this offense this year. He tried to just let low investments develop and it failed. Don’t see him doing it again this season. He is going draft them high and maybe sign one. Lucky for him, he needs WRs the year that is considered the best WR class in awhile. Not just top heavy but it is deep.

[Jenkins5]

Past 30 drafts

1st round

02 Javon Walker - good

 

2nd Round

14 D. Adams - very good

11 R. Cobb - very good

08 J. Nelson - very good

06 G. Jennings - very good

05 T Murphy - career ended right away

01 R Ferguson - serviceable but bust

96 D. Mayes - straight bust

 

3rd round

15 Ty Montgomery- solid but move to RB

07 J. Jones - very good

95 A. Freeman - very good

92 Robert Brooks - very good

 

As you can see in first 3 rounds we have hit way more than missed. Come 4th round and later, you will see why I don’t count that as investing into a position. For 30 years we have drafted terrible 4-7 at the position. Maybe 4-5 who amounted to anything. Only 2-3 became key players for us.

 

4th 0/3

18’ J. Moore, 06’ C. Rodgers, 00’ A. Lucas.

 

5th 1/10

18’ MVS, 17’ D Yancy, 16’ T Davis, 14’ J Abbreddris, 07’ D Clowney, 00’ J. Jamison, 98’ C Bradford (very serviceable), 94’ T. Mickens, 92’ O. McKay, 90’ C Wilson, 89’ J. Query.

 

6th 1/4

18’ St. Brown, 99’ D. Miller, 95’ Charlie Simmons, Bill Schroeder (great career)

 

7th

17’ M. Dupree, 14’ Jeff Janis, 13’ Charles Johnson and K Dorsey, 08’ B Swain, 03’ C Ford & D Rubin, 00’ C Lee (decent), 99’ D Driver (great career), 97’ C. Miller, 92’ C Holder

 

Personally we draft better in 7th than 4th-6th at WR

[LouisEly]

Good Lord, whatever they do, don't draft a receiver in the 4th round. They drafted better in the 7th than the 4th.

 

Just imagine if they had listened to scout that recommended Thielen instead of Dorsey.

[LouisEly]

Or Deebo Samuel...

He went eight picks before Jenkins in the 2nd round. Tough call, but an OL who only gave up a handful of pressures all season is pretty hard to pass up.

 

It was a loaded 2nd round - 12 guys put up a FB-R.com AV of 6 or more that season, which is pretty darned good for a rookie. For reference, Savage put up an AV of 5.

[Jenkins5]

I always knew he had done really well in first 3 rounds. Many more hits than misses but until I actually did the research, couldn’t believe how ugly 4-6 have been for us. Basically in 30 years and 18 picks we got a great career out of a 6th round pick in Billy & Bradford carved a nice little career while here but that was in the 90s. Nothing to show for those picks past 20+ years.

 

I do like how we have got production from many 7th round guys. Driver is one of the team greats. Charles Lee flashed and had decent career. Guys like Janis & Swain were special team aces. But honestly, MVS May already be our 2nd best 5th round pick.... and that’s not because he has done that much.

 

Moral of story, invest early in WR and don’t do the whole we spent mid to late round picks, we are fine now at WR. Clearly history says otherwise.

[JosephC]

WR

TE

OT

WR (again)

ILB

DE

backup QB

OG

[homer]

Or Deebo Samuel...

He went eight picks before Jenkins in the 2nd round. Tough call, but an OL who only gave up a handful of pressures all season is pretty hard to pass up.

 

It was a loaded 2nd round - 12 guys put up a FB-R.com AV of 6 or more that season, which is pretty darned good for a rookie. For reference, Savage put up an AV of 5.

 

Oh I agree re: Jenkins. Be nice to have Metcalf or Mecole Hardman as both were available but can't complain about what we did get.

[patrickgpe]

Packers have drafted plenty of receivers....none have planned out. Curious how Brown comes back from injury. He seemed decent. Lazard seems like a really nice three or four guy.

Yes they have, and in general the ones they have drafted high have worked and the ones they have drafted mid to low usually don't. Favre and Rodgers both excelled in their careers with not the greatest WR corps in the world. I just wish they would invest in a decent TE and WR for Aaron before his window is completely shut.

[homer]

Packers have drafted plenty of receivers....none have planned out. Curious how Brown comes back from injury. He seemed decent. Lazard seems like a really nice three or four guy.

Yes they have, and in general the ones they have drafted high have worked and the ones they have drafted mid to low usually don't. Favre and Rodgers both excelled in their careers with not the greatest WR corps in the world. I just wish they would invest in a decent TE and WR for Aaron before his window is completely shut.

 

I'm referring to recent history.

 

And I meant St. Brown in that post. My mistake.

[Jenkins5]

Problem is they haven’t invested in a true round 1-3 talent at WR. Hard to expect 4-7 WRs to be big playmakers.... you may hope they can. A few guys in those rounds do make big impact however HUGE percent from 4-7 round WRs become anymore than a backend role player. The Hill’s, Diggs, Marvin Jones are rarities. Great reference below, just scroll through & read down the list of WRs drafted 4-7. Then look where the impact WRs are taken. If Packers don’t invest early in top talent at the position (Top 3 rounds) don’t expect the problem to be addressed by simply continuing to draft late WRs. Sure one could hit big but we can’t expect them to. The numbers just don’t support it.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?type=position&position=WR

[Jenkins5]

Saw a list of players on twitter who could be cap cuts. One name was Sammy Watkins. I have hard time seeing that happen but do you target him if that happens? He is is one of the type of guys we are missing in this offense. He is the burner deep threat. You sign him you can turn attention in draft away from the Ruggs, Reagor, Hamler types and focus more on the big body types like Higgins, Pittman etc, or the possession or slot types who can make things happen with ball in the hand Shenault, Aiyuk, Hill, Jefferson types

[LouisEly]

Saw a list of players on twitter who could be cap cuts. One name was Sammy Watkins. I have hard time seeing that happen but do you target him if that happens? He is is one of the type of guys we are missing in this offense. He is the burner deep threat. You sign him you can turn attention in draft away from the Ruggs, Reagor, Hamler types and focus more on the big body types like Higgins, Pittman etc, or the possession or slot types who can make things happen with ball in the hand Shenault, Aiyuk, Hill, Jefferson types

Watkins has a $21M cap hit in 2020 and hasn't had more than 700 yards receiving in a season since 2015. He's not much more than a name only, Randall Cobb in another uniform. It's a no-brainer that he gets cut, and not someone I'd give a big contract to.

[brewcrewdue80]

Saw a list of players on twitter who could be cap cuts. One name was Sammy Watkins. I have hard time seeing that happen but do you target him if that happens? He is is one of the type of guys we are missing in this offense. He is the burner deep threat. You sign him you can turn attention in draft away from the Ruggs, Reagor, Hamler types and focus more on the big body types like Higgins, Pittman etc, or the possession or slot types who can make things happen with ball in the hand Shenault, Aiyuk, Hill, Jefferson types

Watkins has a $21M cap hit in 2020 and hasn't had more than 700 yards receiving in a season since 2015. He's not much more than a name only, Randall Cobb in another uniform. It's a no-brainer that he gets cut, and not someone I'd give a big contract to.

 

But if hes cut you can sign him to a different money deal? He wouldnt hurt GB for 21mil. Just whatever they signed him to? Or is that not true?