Dodgers sign Jimmy Nelson

[MadScientist]

The Dodgers are giving him 1.25M just to pitch in spring training. It's 2.25 to pitch in the regular season (with 2.5M in possible bonuses).

 

I can see this as more than the Brewers wanted to pay for a flyer on a guy. Especially since other than his last outing, he looked more like a steam train fireman than a fire department fireman.

[Jopal78]

Players the Brewers non-tendered keep signing elsewhere for less than their projected arby numbers and people keep saying the Brewers made a mistake. I don't follow.

 

I love how people keep assuming MKE needed to pay bigger arby number to avoid sour grapes feelings by the players forcing them to sign elsewhere.

 

You're telling me you are going to pass the best offer on the table because they didn't offer you more and you feel disrespected? Please. How petty do you think these little guys are?

 

Playing baseball in the MLB is the same no matter the city. If one city offers you a 5/1 prove it and another offers you a 4/1 prove it, you better have family ties, value venue stability (which works against them leaving MKE) or something pretty legitimate forcing you away from the 5/1 prove it. Players don't just give up 1 mil over hurt feelings that they didn't get 6.5/1.

 

As for Nelson, he went for the best offer. MKE didn't wrong him in any way by keeping him around when he was rehabbing and paying him quite well while recovering. He looks done. MKE could think he's done. It's a terrible injury to rebound from and this deal could be a 1 and done oops for Nelson, and Nelson could still have something left in the tank later on down the road. It's a long long road back from that shoulder he injured.

 

I'd be stunned if this deal is a big win for the Dodgers. It's either a cheap flop or it's likely a push. Does anyone really think he's seeing year 2 at 10 mil? I also wouldn't be surprised if Nelson stays healthy and shows he's got something left in the tank when he's 34-35 before age catches up to him completely. Last year, he didn't seem close to back and he really has to take the long road back to what he was or figure out a new way to use what he has. That injury changed him.

 

Well, you can't simply turn off your common sense either. The Brewers would be a pretty pathetic franchise if they non-tendered a bunch of talent without first informing the player of their intentions with respect to arbitration, and inquiring if they could reach an agreement at a lesser price before the deadline to tender a contract (or even informing the player the organization is going in a different direction all together). In fact, we know that does happen, because it was reported the Brewers did that very thing with Travis Shaw before ultimately non-tendering him.

 

I would surmise that if a player rejects taking a pay cut from the Brewers and is subsequently non-tendered, the ship has probably sailed on a potential reunion regardless if a market for that player subsequently materializes or not. Again, there are exceptions to any rule, but that's what seems logical.

[MrTPlush]

It is reasonable to think that one bad slide cost Jimmy Nelson well over $100,000,000. That is crazy.

 

I would say it definitely cost him $80mil minimum....possibly way more if he repeated 2017 twice. Sometimes life is just not fair.

[TJseven7]

I would surmise that if a player rejects taking a pay cut from the Brewers and is subsequently non-tendered, the ship has probably sailed on a potential reunion regardless if a market for that player subsequently materializes or not. Again, there are exceptions to any rule, but that's what seems logical.

 

It's also logical that the guy rejected taking a pay cut only to realize on the market that all he's going to get is a pay cut. They should take the best offer and opportunity unless other forces are at play. Hurt feelings, ego and pride aren't acceptable forces. There are a number of forces that are quality of life choices that are acceptable monetary offsets but none of them have to do with the negotiation process. Players have over expected plenty of times and the MKE ship sailed, regardless of offer, when Smoak agreed. Thames could have been in the discussion for roughly the same amount and got stuck settling as he held out for more.

 

You obviously want to handle this with tact, especially when you decline contracts on anyone you have any interest in bringing back. But you know all the angles that are likely going on. MKE states they want player x to take a pay cut. Agent says call their bluff. MKE declines option. It's all negotiation and plenty of people suck at it because they don't understand the market or their leverage. You see this everywhere and in my simple little life I have a number of examples of some company thinking it can swing its junk around and stand their ground only for them to lose horribly. Multiple contracts undercut and dismissed with the snap of a finger because some idiot didn't know his worth or leverage. Same deal here.

 

DS seems to understand value better than just about anyone in the league. Players Agents and other teams. I'm sure a few agents thought they could get their players more and whiffed then settled for less or similar elsewhere. I just don't believe it has much to do with bad blood over MKE refusing to overpay guys very often. Reason being, that's a very dumb way to operate. I respect the agents and players too much to think they are that stupid and petty.

 

Frankly if that is their rationale, I don't care. This is business. You want to get your feelings hurt by business you don't understand business. My own stance on it is that no GM in professional sports should operate in the off season with any shred of remorse or loyalty. Tact and decency never come off the table but loyalty and remorse do. It's about a number and only a number. Are you worth said number or not? That's it. Business elsewhere shows little remorse and in those situations you are talking about the livelihood of common folk and communities. If you offer Thames 4.5/1 and he turns his nose up at it, he can go make 4 mil elsewhere and be more than fine. He might even lose out because MKE embraced him and he got outside baseball money for being the character he is. Even then, he'll be just fine.

 

I like the revolving door of value seeking. I appreciate seeing guys who MKE scooped cheap blowing up in MKE only to get monster deals elsewhere. It shows MKE is ahead of the curve. I didn't flinch at the arby declines and no one should have because DS knows his values and holds to them. Every guy signing elsewhere for less is a good sign. It means DS was right to decline and either he low balled them lower than the market did or they over expected and settled. MKE isn't a big payroll team. They can't afford to waste a mil here and a mil there. It adds up to 10 mil and that's a lot of waste in our budget and if MKE wants to contend they have to pile up value in every way possible. It's much harder to do that when you start in a hole. Paying fair market as a low payroll team isn't going to win you anything.

[stalton]

I think too often all of us backseat GMs have a video game mentality of what can be accomplished. So far, the Brewers were accurate that their non tenders weren't worth the assumed arby deals. Just because X player signed with Y team for Z dollars, doesnt mean it was possible for the brewers to meet/want to beat that offer.

 

That being said, I wish Nelson the best and for his sake I hope he does well enough to earn the most that he can.

[BrewCrewForever]

Wish Jimmy all the best, I was hoping the Brewers would give him another chance. But I can understand why they didn't.

[The stache]

Jimmy, over his last 7 appearances, 10 IP, had a 3.60 ERA. 9 H, 4 ER, 2 HR, 13 K. The walks are high, but his last two outings were at Coors Field-3 IP, 5 K, 1 BB, no hits or runs. Anybody saying he'll "never be a Major League pitcher again" obviously don't see what the Dodgers do. It's a very low risk, high upside deal.

 

I'll cheer for him so long as he's not playing against the Brewers. Still one of my favorite Brewers of recent years.

[clancyphile]

Jimmy, over his last 7 appearances, 10 IP, had a 3.60 ERA. 9 H, 4 ER, 2 HR, 13 K. The walks are high, but his last two outings were at Coors Field-3 IP, 5 K, 1 BB, no hits or runs. Anybody saying he'll "never be a Major League pitcher again" obviously don't see what the Dodgers do. It's a very low risk, high upside deal.

 

I'll cheer for him so long as he's not playing against the Brewers. Still one of my favorite Brewers of recent years.

 

Agreed. This was a mess largely of the Brewers' own making. They needed to option him to the minors and keep him there. This was a year for him to rebuild, and to come back in September.

 

Instead, they did what they did, and as such, they had to non-tender over the season.

[82brewcrew82]

Jimmy, over his last 7 appearances, 10 IP, had a 3.60 ERA. 9 H, 4 ER, 2 HR, 13 K. The walks are high, but his last two outings were at Coors Field-3 IP, 5 K, 1 BB, no hits or runs. Anybody saying he'll "never be a Major League pitcher again" obviously don't see what the Dodgers do. It's a very low risk, high upside deal.

 

I'll cheer for him so long as he's not playing against the Brewers. Still one of my favorite Brewers of recent years.

I'm struggling to understand how a 10 game stretch should negate concern over whether Jimmy will be a viable major league pitcher moving forward. I don't think any of us knows what the Dodgers see outside of "eh, lets give him a million bucks and lets see what happens". He was once a promising pitcher and the Dodgers are the kind of team that can throw a million bucks at a gamble like that but I doubt they are expecting much on the return.

[owbc]

Jimmy, over his last 7 appearances, 10 IP, had a 3.60 ERA. 9 H, 4 ER, 2 HR, 13 K. The walks are high, but his last two outings were at Coors Field-3 IP, 5 K, 1 BB, no hits or runs. Anybody saying he'll "never be a Major League pitcher again" obviously don't see what the Dodgers do. It's a very low risk, high upside deal.

 

I'll cheer for him so long as he's not playing against the Brewers. Still one of my favorite Brewers of recent years.

 

Agreed. This was a mess largely of the Brewers' own making. They needed to option him to the minors and keep him there. This was a year for him to rebuild, and to come back in September.

 

Instead, they did what they did, and as such, they had to non-tender over the season.

 

Wait, I thought the Brewers tried to do that and he signaled that he would refuse assignment?

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Jimmy, over his last 7 appearances, 10 IP, had a 3.60 ERA. 9 H, 4 ER, 2 HR, 13 K. The walks are high, but his last two outings were at Coors Field-3 IP, 5 K, 1 BB, no hits or runs. Anybody saying he'll "never be a Major League pitcher again" obviously don't see what the Dodgers do. It's a very low risk, high upside deal.

 

I'll cheer for him so long as he's not playing against the Brewers. Still one of my favorite Brewers of recent years.

 

Agreed. This was a mess largely of the Brewers' own making. They needed to option him to the minors and keep him there. This was a year for him to rebuild, and to come back in September.

 

Instead, they did what they did, and as such, they had to non-tender over the season.

 

Wait, I thought the Brewers tried to do that and he signaled that he would refuse assignment?

 

They missed their window where they could have optioned him without his consent early in the season. They tried to option him a few weeks later, and he refused the assignment, which was his right under the CBA. Probably a blunder on the part of the Brewers, but Nelson refusing the assignment when he clearly needed the work and was harming the big league squad looks bad in hindsight as well.

[Matty V]

Anybody saying he'll "never be a Major League pitcher again" obviously don't see what the Dodgers do. It's a very low risk, high upside deal.

 

And the flip side of that argument is the fact that the Brewers let him go. If they thought it was likely he would return to form they would have worked something out.

 

Ultimately, all we can do is see how this plays out.

[reillymcshane]

Awful lot of handwriting over a guy who pitched 22 not-very-good innings over the last two years. I understand everyone wanted Nelson so he could try and recapture the magic of 2017, but the price tag of arbitration - I believe the estimate was $3.7M - was prohibitive. At that point, Nelson was a free agent. He had the chance to shop his services with all 30 teams - a nice bit of leverage for any player - even a guy coming off two years of injuries.

 

I realize there's a sentimental attachment to Nelson - one of the few good starters we've developed in the past decade or two - but who knows how much the Brewers valued him. And who knows how much Nelson just wanted a change of scenery. It's all speculation. But in the end, Jimmy had the chance to shop himself around, and put himself in what he feels is the best situation for him. I'm not going to fret over that. I hope the guy does well. He had some nice times in Milwaukee, and seemed like a standup dude.

[Matty V]

Maybe he'll end up back in Milwaukee after the Dodgers release him.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Maybe he'll end up back in Milwaukee after the Dodgers release him.

 

If they release him then why would a team like Milwaukee hoping to contend want to waste a 40 man roster spot on a damaged goods pitcher? They stuck with him for two full seasons following his injury and paid him 6 millionish dollars over that span to give them nothing in terms of mlb production. The brewers as an organization have moved on from Nelson after doing everything within reason to stick with him hoping he'd return to anything close to his 2017 form. Who knows, maybe his 2017 would have been his statistical outlier season had he stayed healthy, and he would have been the marginal #5 starter he was his first two years in the mlb rotation.

[FVBrewerFan]

Maybe he'll end up back in Milwaukee after the Dodgers release him.

 

I think it's the opposite. Out of respect to a veteran and everything he went through, Brewers let him go early instead of letting him hang around then likely cut him in April where he may have to scramble for a job. This way he had plenty of time to find the right spot. A prove it year in a pitchers park is a great fit for him.

[clancyphile]

Maybe he'll end up back in Milwaukee after the Dodgers release him.

 

I think it's the opposite. Out of respect to a veteran and everything he went through, Brewers let him go early instead of letting him hang around then likely cut him in April where he may have to scramble for a job. This way he had plenty of time to find the right spot. A prove it year in a pitchers park is a great fit for him.

 

Agreed. And that good will may help the Brewers later.

 

The same probably applied for Travis Shaw and some of the others.

[Matty V]

Maybe he'll end up back in Milwaukee after the Dodgers release him.

 

I think it's the opposite. Out of respect to a veteran and everything he went through, Brewers let him go early instead of letting him hang around then likely cut him in April where he may have to scramble for a job. This way he had plenty of time to find the right spot. A prove it year in a pitchers park is a great fit for him.

 

Jimmy Nelson would have a much better chance to crack the Brewers active roster than the Dodgers. The Dodgers, as usual, have a deep pitching staff. Even if healthy, I don't see Nelson making their active roster out of spring training.

[MrTPlush]

I sense people are way too upset in the Dodgers paying Nelson $1mil to be a spring training invite. Nelson is probably a FA again by May or may not even crack their roster.

[Jopal78]

From the department of “can’t catch a break”, the Dodgers have shut Jimmy Nelson down with some type of injury.

 

Too bad, I’m sure his frustration level is through the roof after turning a corner into a quality MLB starting pitcher in 2017 only to beset constantly by injuries ever since.

[KeithStone53151]

That's really a shame. Feel for the guy. He's always been one of my favorites, I tend to be drawn to guys that put in the work...and nobody works harder than Jimmy.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Feel really bad for Jimmy, as he seems like a pretty great guy. But I can't help but feel a little relieved that the Brewers made the decision to move on from him, after initially hoping and advocating for hanging on to him. It appears that shoulder injury, and basically having to learn to pitch all over again, has just had a domino effect on the rest of his body. It sucks! Who knows what difference a healthy Jimmy Nelson may have made to the last couple playoff runs?

[monty57]

I'm probably not the only Brewer fan whose opinion on the NL adopting the DH changed after the injuries to our pitching staff while hitting/base-running in the 2017 season.

 

Best of luck to Nelson. I would've liked to have seen how good he could have been if not for a freak injury on the base-paths.

[Fear The Chorizo]

I'm probably not the only Brewer fan whose opinion on the NL adopting the DH changed after the injuries to our pitching staff while hitting/base-running in the 2017 season.

 

Best of luck to Nelson. I would've liked to have seen how good he could have been if not for a freak injury on the base-paths.

 

That freak injury could have legitimately cost him generations-changing money

[monty57]

I'm probably not the only Brewer fan whose opinion on the NL adopting the DH changed after the injuries to our pitching staff while hitting/base-running in the 2017 season.

 

Best of luck to Nelson. I would've liked to have seen how good he could have been if not for a freak injury on the base-paths.

 

That freak injury could have legitimately cost him generations-changing money

 

And cost the Brewers a playoff spot in 2017, and who knows, maybe a World Series in 2018. We definitely could have used an "ace" the past couple of years.