Milwaukee Bucks 2019 - 20 Season Thread

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Yeah I think the post above pretty much nails it. I think we know what is meant by NBA culture and as much damage control as the NBA has done, and as accurate as it to say that the top guys have done a lot of good in terms of charitable work (LeBron, Curry, Westbrook, etc.) that image still persists, particularly in rural communities.

 

I think it's accurate to say that younger people tend to think of the NFL having a worse image, but the further you get from city centers the older and more conservative you get. I think it'd be fair to say the NBA is definitely the most city-centric league of the major three.

 

I'm not really sure I buy in to the statement that millennials like the Bucks much more than the Brewers. In Milwaukee that might be true with the younger subsection of that demographic, but I consider the Brewers to have a fairly rabid following. I know in my millennial circle the Brewers are 10x more popular.

 

Edit: Misread that, missed "very few.." I agree.

[FVBrewerFan]

No, I still don't get the "NBA culture" thing. Only examples anyone has shared is bad officiating and superstars dictate the game. Sounds like the NFL to me, not the NBA.

 

As far as millennials go, I'll leave that alone since it's impossible to "prove" one way or another. My kids' circle of friends and millennials at work are my only basis, and they're definitely bigger Bucks fans than Brewers fan in general. Sure, they go to more Brewer games but that's more a social activity.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

When a lot of people hear the words "NBA culture" this is what they think of:

 

 

I'm aware this is 16 years old. It's still what a lot of people, particularly older people less inclined to live in a large city, think of when they think of NBA basketball. You don't really have to go very far online to find people saying the NBA is full of "thugs" or "druggies" and saying that's why they refuse to watch.

[tmwiese55]

No one wants to come out and say it but by culture he simply means the racial implications of the NBA. Everyone is trying to avoid saying and getting into the conversation, no need to discuss it further but that's what they're saying. And IMO, I think they're right as I spend a lot of time in rural areas. Also, almost anyone who comes with the how t hey prefer NCAAB vs NBA are usually really saying that as well. That and they usually just don't actually watch either one. I don't need to comment any further as I'm merely saying I agree with and get what those posters are getting at.

 

Millennials stuff, I think I've said it in here already but I agree. But I'd move that age down to under 30, not the millenial cut off in the upper 30s. Everyone's circles are different, but in my experience around younger people NBA is much bigger than MLB

[DuWayne Steurer]

If you made a Venn Diagram, the overlapping circles of people who wrinkle their nose in disgust when they hear "NBA culture" are the same people that love brushback pitches and beanball wars and can't stand the antics of guys like Yasiel Puig, and love guys like Brian McCann who "play the game the right way".

[FVBrewerFan]

So they base their opinion from an isolated brawl from 16 years ago? I doubt it. I think it's as simple as how you were raised. Packers are #1 by far all over the state for generations. Brewers #2, probably very close to the Packers in the Milw area. I think the Bucks base is there as it always has been, and growing now due to Giannis, winning, and just more interest in general from younger generations.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

So they base their opinion from an isolated brawl from 16 years ago? I doubt it. I think it's as simple as how you were raised. Packers are #1 by far all over the state for generations. Brewers #2, probably very close to the Packers in the Milw area. I think the Bucks base is there as it always has been, and growing now due to Giannis, winning, and just more interest in general from younger generations.

 

It's an example of what some people associate with the brand, it's not meant to be taken literally, but I get the feeling you're intentionally being obtuse.

[owbc]

The difference between NBA and NFL culture is fascinating and the "superstars rule the game and dictate the game" comment gets right to the heart of it.

 

Mark Attanasio should be MLB commissioner. No MLB owner has ever completely turned around every aspect of a franchise the way he has and sustained it for over a decade.

[FVBrewerFan]

So they base their opinion from an isolated brawl from 16 years ago? I doubt it. I think it's as simple as how you were raised. Packers are #1 by far all over the state for generations. Brewers #2, probably very close to the Packers in the Milw area. I think the Bucks base is there as it always has been, and growing now due to Giannis, winning, and just more interest in general from younger generations.

 

It's an example of what some people associate with the brand, it's not meant to be taken literally, but I get the feeling you're intentionally being obtuse.

 

I'm not, but feel how you will. You can have the last word, I don't want to bog down the topic any longer, we really should be talking about the Bucks- not how or why some old people don't like them.

 

Which leads me to this:

 

Point differential this season:

 

12- Bucks

8.9- Bucks with Giannis off the court

7.6- Lakers

7.4 Mavs

6.7 Celtics

 

That is rather amazing.

[DuWayne Steurer]

As Homer previously stated in the thread, even without Giannis, this could be a 50 win team. Super deep team. If they continue to manage Giannis' minutes the way they have, they might not have anyone averaging 30 mpg by the end of the season. He's under 31 minutes right now, and he's the only guy averaging 30 minutes right now.

[adambr2]

No, I still don't get the "NBA culture" thing. Only examples anyone has shared is bad officiating and superstars dictate the game. Sounds like the NFL to me, not the NBA.

 

How? Bad officiating sure, seems to be both, seems to be every sport, but superstars dictating the game? I wish. Aaron Rodgers would have more than one Super Bowl under his belt. Superstars only have as much dictation as their talents will take them in the NFL. Maybe a star QB will occassionally get the benefit of the doubt on a roughing call more than a rookie QB might, but that's about as far as it goes.

 

Star players have very little leverage in the NFL. They can hold out and even that doesn't usually end well for them so very few will dig in their heels like LeVeon Bell did. Even the ones who are free agents are powerless to change their situation if their team decides to slap the franchise tag on them.

 

NBA superstars can, and routinely do force trades, form super teams in locations of their desire, and benefit from superstar calls from officials. That's part of the NBA culture that is referred to, and I can't see how the superstar aspect of that compares to the NFL.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

The NBA embraces individualism and the NFL has always tried to shut it down, right down to the fact that the players' faces are difficult to see during games. None of that is an accident, and makes a lot of sense when you consider the NBA has a far younger audience (45% of viewership is under 35).

 

This isn't the sport itself either, as the NCAA tournament skews REALLY old and rural. The NBA is a superstar-driven league, plain and simple. Much more common to see a LeBron or Giannis jersey anywhere in the country than it is to see Lamar Jackson's in Chicago. The players are the brand in the NBA; in the NFL, the violence is.

[FVBrewerFan]

No, I still don't get the "NBA culture" thing. Only examples anyone has shared is bad officiating and superstars dictate the game. Sounds like the NFL to me, not the NBA.

 

How? Bad officiating sure, seems to be both, seems to be every sport, but superstars dictating the game? I wish. Aaron Rodgers would have more than one Super Bowl under his belt. Superstars only have as much dictation as their talents will take them in the NFL. Maybe a star QB will occassionally get the benefit of the doubt on a roughing call more than a rookie QB might, but that's about as far as it goes.

 

Star players have very little leverage in the NFL. They can hold out and even that doesn't usually end well for them so very few will dig in their heels like LeVeon Bell did. Even the ones who are free agents are powerless to change their situation if their team decides to slap the franchise tag on them.

 

NBA superstars can, and routinely do force trades, form super teams in locations of their desire, and benefit from superstar calls from officials. That's part of the NBA culture that is referred to, and I can't see how the superstar aspect of that compares to the NFL.

 

Ok, thanks, now I know what you mean by "dictate the game." Yea, I agree to that to a degree. But the QBs are the superstars in the NFL, and they protect them with rules, unwritten rules, and every other way. They are the face of the team every bit as NBA superstars. You never see NBA players hold out, NFL players do. And NFL stars get their coaches fired just as NBA players do. NBA players don't get all the calls anymore either, just ask Giannis.

 

But again, I agree with a lot of what you said. NBA teams are simply smaller, so the superstar has a larger impact in every way.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

QBs might be faces of the team but they are not close to being faces of the league the way NBA mega stars are. LeBron is practically his own economy. The NBA would miss Giannis retiring tomorrow a lot more than the NFL would miss Patrick Mahomes.

 

NBA stars transcend the cities they play in, in a way NFL players just don't.

[FVBrewerFan]

QBs might be faces of the team but they are not close to being faces of the league the way NBA mega stars are. LeBron is practically his own economy. The NBA would miss Giannis retiring tomorrow a lot more than the NFL would miss Patrick Mahomes.

 

NBA stars transcend the cities they play in, in a way NFL players just don't.

 

Millions play fantasy football, it's all about individual players. Nobody plays NBA fantasy leagues. Even casual sports fans know a lot of NFL players, they don't know NBA players. Lebron sure. That's one, and arguably the goat. Do they know Doncic, Jokic, Siakam, Kemba, etc.? No.

 

Mahomes would be missed way than say, Harden. NFL has been lacking a bit of star power the way it is.

[brwrsfan]

One aspect that I think gets overlooked when it's NBA vs NFL is the fact that in the NFL, superstar players rarely, if ever, change teams (not including a guy like Brady who could leave after 20 years in NE), but in the prime of their career. Imagine Rodgers up and leaving GB after the SB win 9 years ago. It's virtually unheard of. The NFL actively tries to have a level playing field, tries to keep stars with their teams for their careers.

 

The NBA...while they say they do the right thing (and the Bucks CAN offer Giannis the most money), we've seen that it rarely matters. Guys are going with their buddies to form Super Teams - either by all signing with the same team or pulling an AD and forcing a trade to the Lakers. Lebron might be the greatest of all time, but he's on his fourth team (well 3 I guess, but he was with the Cavs twice). Durant is on his third (and left to form not one, but potentially two super teams). The list goes on on and on. I think that matters.

 

We have the best player in the league...imagine how Bucks fans will feel if he were to leave (hopefully we never find out) but just imagine that. It's hard to get attached to teams/players when in the back of everyone's mind, the question is...will he resign this summer? The media beats it to death. Yet this is NEVER talked about in football.

[bucks2281]

Too much of the media coverage of the NBA is centered around future player movement and dysfunction, but not on the product currently taking place. I was listening to a national show on sports radio a couple weeks ago and the host referred to the current season as a “gap season.” Why? Because Zion Williamson has been hurt, there’s no marquee free agent this summer and the Warriors are missing their best players and are godawful. Are you kidding me? It’s not enough that the best player in the league (Giannis) and the best player of this generation (LeBron) are on track to meet in the Finals - there just has to be prospective drama to keep the NBA media talking. During the 2019 Finals, nobody could focus on the actual basketball taking place - the primary focus seemed to be on where Kawhi and Durant (well, before he tore in Achilles in G5) were signing in a couple weeks.

 

If Giannis does not sign the supermax in July, do not underestimate how insufferable sports media will be next season. His pending free agency will be the top story of the 2020-21 season (and not, you know, the actual basketball).

[superfly]

The NBA is too many games, too much politics, and too many egos. I consider myself to be a pretty big Bucks fan (I suffered through Herb Kohl watching 90% of the games)...haven’t watched a game this year.

 

Why you say? Because in my mind we’re going through the motions from November to April. Every...second...night is just another game. The same stale questions in the locker room. The same broadcasts. The same repetitive stuff for 82 games, just like the NHL. Let me know when April is here and I’ll start watching again....when these teams actually play defense and work night in and night out. Why even pay attention when there’s a monthly BS article about “Warriors wooing Giannis” years before he’s a FA?

 

For some reason MLB has never bothered me with so many games. Maybe it’s because nothing else is going on in the summer IDK. The Brewers mean more to me than the Bucks.

[tmwiese55]

At least you acknowledge that the problem you don't like are more of an issue for MLB. Of course to each their own, but man to suffer through the garbage years and then to not watch once they become one of the best teams and have an all time great doesn't seem like a great move, haha.

 

Also, it's not like they don't try and play D. It's that the league intentionally made the rules advantageous to O and the players have becomes such good shooters that there's nothing you can do

[OldSchoolSnapper]

QBs might be faces of the team but they are not close to being faces of the league the way NBA mega stars are. LeBron is practically his own economy. The NBA would miss Giannis retiring tomorrow a lot more than the NFL would miss Patrick Mahomes.

 

NBA stars transcend the cities they play in, in a way NFL players just don't.

 

Millions play fantasy football, it's all about individual players. Nobody plays NBA fantasy leagues. Even casual sports fans know a lot of NFL players, they don't know NBA players. Lebron sure. That's one, and arguably the goat. Do they know Doncic, Jokic, Siakam, Kemba, etc.? No.

 

Mahomes would be missed way than say, Harden. NFL has been lacking a bit of star power the way it is.

 

Russell Westbrook has more followers on Instagram than Aaron Rodgers, Patrick Mahomes, Tom Brady and Lamar Jackson combined.

 

LeBron James has four times the amount of followers Russell Westbrook does.

 

NBA stars have cult followings in China. I didn't really expect anybody to object to that as I thought it was pretty obvious. NBA players are individual enterprises in a way that NFL players just aren't. It's reflected in the audiences, and the way both leagues are marketed.

 

The NBA players are more like Messis and Ronaldos than NFL players. It's not uncommon for basketball fans to have allegiance to players over teams, much like soccer. It's much less common to find that in football.

[tmwiese55]

Basketball is the 2nd most popular sport in the world after Soccer. Very few people outside of the US care about the NFL.

 

And even in the US with younger people there certainly seems to be vibe moving towards NBA. With the health things in the NFL it will be really interesting to see how the landscape looks in say 30 years once fewer and fewer kids are allowed to play football and how that affects their fandom or interest later in life.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Fantasy football is actually an example of the exact opposite point. The players don't get anything from it, the league does. It's got people watching random games with players they know nothing about. It's totally interchangeable and a way to get people interested in a game regardless of who's playing or if they're any good.

 

Football is America's favorite game, there's no question about it. But people are on the sport like a drug. They don't really care about the players and it doesn't embrace individualism, which is the exact opposite strategy of the NBA.

[tmwiese55]

Another 'flaw' of the NFL that I think Cuban has pointed out over the years is that their popularity is largely based on the fantasy football obsession. What does that say about the sport and game overall if a huge drive of it all has nothing to do with the actual games. But on the other hand, with how gambling is now being embraced overall it's still a good thing and it does help alleviate the type of problem Superfly points for NBA/MLB in that it gives a reason to care about games that don't really matter.

[wallus]

The NBA is too many games, too much politics, and too many egos. I consider myself to be a pretty big Bucks fan (I suffered through Herb Kohl watching 90% of the games)...haven’t watched a game this year.

 

Why you say? Because in my mind we’re going through the motions from November to April. Every...second...night is just another game. The same stale questions in the locker room. The same broadcasts. The same repetitive stuff for 82 games, just like the NHL. Let me know when April is here and I’ll start watching again....when these teams actually play defense and work night in and night out. Why even pay attention when there’s a monthly BS article about “Warriors wooing Giannis” years before he’s a FA?

 

For some reason MLB has never bothered me with so many games. Maybe it’s because nothing else is going on in the summer IDK. The Brewers mean more to me than the Bucks.

 

I realize this is a personal post but it just makes no sense. If, as you say, you are a pretty big Bucks fan and you aren't watching the greatest season in many decades, you aren't a big Bucks fan. The NBA game, especially the Bucks, is so much faster now. With the must faster pace and more emphasis on the 3 point shot, scores have gotten higher. I have no idea why anyone would prefer the ISO years of the NBA over what it is now.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Eh, it's not that simple. I'm a Bucks fan. Going to next Friday's game. But if I haven't planned on going to the arena, I typically don't watch. Don't have cable, don't have any live sports streams, and 5-10pm are the busiest hours of my day. Rarely sit down to watch the Brewers on TV either.

 

The regular season in the NBA does feel largely pointless. You pretty much know the Bucks are a #1 seed and there are months to just sit and wait.

 

I think the MLB's million games just more palatable because baseball is synonymous with summer and it's much more of a "drop in" sport. You can catch innings 2 and 3, go do something, and come back for 8 and 9.