Free Agent Starting Pitchers (not named Gerrit Cole)

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Bettis sounds intriguing...

 

But at the same time, even with Shelby Miller, the Brewers can populate the rest of the AAA rotation with a lot of young starters - Z. Brown, Supak, Burnes, and Jankins.

 

In the AA rotation, there's Zavolas, Francis, Bettinger, Ashby, and File.

 

Go down to Carolina, and it's Sunitsch, Lazar, Victor Castaneda, Webb, and Small.

 

Clancy ... this thread is about major league rotation options in 2020. Why are you mentioning names like Zavolas, Francis, Bettinger and the like? Those guys are all at least a year away at best, and the majority of them likely will never throw a major league pitch.

 

Please keep this thread on point with major league pitching options, instead of naming the guys pitching in High A that you like for the upteenth time.

 

Of the guys you mentioned, Supak and Burnes may make an impact this year. Brown possibly if he rebounds. Jankins might be a fill-in type down the road.

[TURBO]

The Mariners have interest in adding free agent right-hander Taijuan Walker.

 

Walker was non-tendered by the Diamondbacks in December after missing the entire 2019 season while rehabbing from Tommy John surgery on his pitching elbow. Walker was drafted by the Mariners in the supplemental first round of the 2010 draft and spent a few seasons as an elite prospect. He debuted with the Mariners in 2013 and was eventually traded to Arizona along with Ketel Marte for Jean Segura, Mitch Haniger and Zac Curtis prior to the 2017 season. The simple fact that a former elite prospect like Walker is still a free agent nearly two months after being released is a good indication that teams do not believe he is healthy and ready to contribute in 2020. The 27-year-old will likely have to settle for a minor league deal somewhere. He has a career 31-31 record and 3.95 ERA in 94 starts and three relief outings.

 

Source: MLB.com

Feb 1, 2020, 11:47 AM ET

[brewcrewdue80]

The Mariners have interest in adding free agent right-hander Taijuan Walker.

 

Walker was non-tendered by the Diamondbacks in December after missing the entire 2019 season while rehabbing from Tommy John surgery on his pitching elbow. Walker was drafted by the Mariners in the supplemental first round of the 2010 draft and spent a few seasons as an elite prospect. He debuted with the Mariners in 2013 and was eventually traded to Arizona along with Ketel Marte for Jean Segura, Mitch Haniger and Zac Curtis prior to the 2017 season. The simple fact that a former elite prospect like Walker is still a free agent nearly two months after being released is a good indication that teams do not believe he is healthy and ready to contribute in 2020. The 27-year-old will likely have to settle for a minor league deal somewhere. He has a career 31-31 record and 3.95 ERA in 94 starts and three relief outings.

 

Source: MLB.com

Feb 1, 2020, 11:47 AM ET

 

Yep that's the post I was referring to with the one commentor that Walker was done or toast whatever.

[TJseven7]

Right now I'd be content enough with Cashner (but tell Cashner he can go start on a horrible Os team or be in the pen of a playoff contender who just made Pom 9 mil per) and Bettis. DFA Williams or Yardley and Freitas. Bettis gets a 40 man Milb deal. Bettis starts the year in AAA Cashner starts in the pen and starts only if MKE is that far down the well.

 

Both should command under 2 mil.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/12/latest-on-chad-bettis.html Just screams MKE.

[clancyphile]

Right now I'd be content enough with Cashner (but tell Cashner he can go start on a horrible Os team or be in the pen of a playoff contender who just made Pom 9 mil per) and Bettis. DFA Williams or Yardley and Freitas. Bettis gets a 40 man Milb deal. Bettis starts the year in AAA Cashner starts in the pen and starts only if MKE is that far down the well.

 

Both should command under 2 mil.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/12/latest-on-chad-bettis.html Just screams MKE.

 

I'd give Bettis a one-year $2 million deal with a club option at $5 million ($2 million buyout) for 2021 and a mutual option at $6 million ($1.5 million buyout) for 2022. DFA Feritas.

[wntrtxn21]

Right now I'd be content enough with Cashner (but tell Cashner he can go start on a horrible Os team or be in the pen of a playoff contender who just made Pom 9 mil per) and Bettis. DFA Williams or Yardley and Freitas. Bettis gets a 40 man Milb deal. Bettis starts the year in AAA Cashner starts in the pen and starts only if MKE is that far down the well.

 

Both should command under 2 mil.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/12/latest-on-chad-bettis.html Just screams MKE.

 

I'd give Bettis a one-year $2 million deal with a club option at $5 million ($2 million buyout) for 2021 and a mutual option at $6 million ($1.5 million buyout) for 2022. DFA Feritas.

 

What do you see in Bettis that you would want to pay him at all? 2019 was a disaster both home and away. Then hip surgery. He did ok away from home in 2018, but 2017 numbers were terrible again especially away from Colorado. Stearns passed on much better pitchers for less money.

[JosephC]

The only thing that interests me in Bettis is his ground ball rate. There have been 149 pitchers that have thrown at least 180 innings over the last two years and Bettis ranks 6th in ground ball rate. Just looking at the stat sheet, he's pretty similar to Brett Anderson. Low strikeout, ground ball pitchers that come with durability questions. Anderson does do better in avoiding walks (Anderson = 2.18 BB/9, Bettis = 3.33 BB/9 over the last two years). But compensating for park/home runs allowed...Anderson has been a 4.51 xFIP pitcher and Bettis has been a 4.67 xFIP pitcher over the last two years.

[clancyphile]

The only thing that interests me in Bettis is his ground ball rate. There have been 149 pitchers that have thrown at least 180 innings over the last two years and Bettis ranks 6th in ground ball rate. Just looking at the stat sheet, he's pretty similar to Brett Anderson. Low strikeout, ground ball pitchers that come with durability questions. Anderson does do better in avoiding walks (Anderson = 2.18 BB/9, Bettis = 3.33 BB/9 over the last two years). But compensating for park/home runs allowed...Anderson has been a 4.51 xFIP pitcher and Bettis has been a 4.67 xFIP pitcher over the last two years.

 

Not too much difference, and the high ground-ball rate could be a good fit for Miller Park/AmFam Field. Worth a flier.

[TURBO]

Pretty sure it is still Miller Park through the end of the 2020 season. Why am I seeing so many calling it AmFam Field already?

[TJseven7]

 

What do you see in Bettis that you would want to pay him at all? 2019 was a disaster both home and away. Then hip surgery. He did ok away from home in 2018, but 2017 numbers were terrible again especially away from Colorado. Stearns passed on much better pitchers for less money.

 

I don't agree on the price with Clancy. I'd be more along the lines of 1.25 mil 2020 40 man spot MiLB deal. 2021 club option for 4 mil with a 250K buyout. Maybe toss in some MLB boosters.

 

I do agree that he's an interesting option that I want. 1st off I'm going to caution the 2017 2019 road splits being used. 1) Sample size is very very small. 2) He was coming back from having CANCER and going through CHEMO in 2017. One of my years in college we had a CB who went through that following his Senior year football season and fall camp as a freshman in college. He lost a TON of weight and was going to be cut until a few coaches were alerted to the situation. Kid rebounded massively with a healthy off season, his year 2 was night and day. Chemo is brutal. Also in 2019 he was used in the pen and that didn't suit him well, he was also pitching through pain in his hip all last year.

 

He recently stated he hasn't felt this healthy since before he had Cancer.

 

I think 2017 is a throw away. 2019 he was pitching through a lot of pain. 2015 and 2016 this guy was pretty even home and away. Not great but even.

 

Guys 31 and was a 2nd round pick. I don't think he's done yet. I don't think he's going to be much better than 4.0-4.4 range as a starter. But that's Anderson Houser insurance for a very cost effective price. I also don't see him as a durability concern. Guy had cancer and a nerve issue in his hip. The nerve issue is a full recovery in 6 months (for pro athletes) and rehab starts at 8 weeks after the procedure. It's not back, shoulder, elbow and arm stuff. It's not even reoccurring soft tissue issues. These two are pretty fluky and (hopefully) a 1 time fix.

[wntrtxn21]

 

What do you see in Bettis that you would want to pay him at all? 2019 was a disaster both home and away. Then hip surgery. He did ok away from home in 2018, but 2017 numbers were terrible again especially away from Colorado. Stearns passed on much better pitchers for less money.

 

I don't agree on the price with Clancy. I'd be more along the lines of 1.25 mil 2020 40 man spot MiLB deal. 2021 club option for 4 mil with a 250K buyout. Maybe toss in some MLB boosters.

 

I do agree that he's an interesting option that I want. 1st off I'm going to caution the 2017 2019 road splits being used. 1) Sample size is very very small. 2) He was coming back from having CANCER and going through CHEMO in 2017. One of my years in college we had a CB who went through that following his Senior year football season and fall camp as a freshman in college. He lost a TON of weight and was going to be cut until a few coaches were alerted to the situation. Kid rebounded massively with a healthy off season, his year 2 was night and day. Chemo is brutal. Also in 2019 he was used in the pen and that didn't suit him well, he was also pitching through pain in his hip all last year.

 

He recently stated he hasn't felt this healthy since before he had Cancer.

 

I think 2017 is a throw away. 2019 he was pitching through a lot of pain. 2015 and 2016 this guy was pretty even home and away. Not great but even.

 

Guys 31 and was a 2nd round pick. I don't think he's done yet. I don't think he's going to be much better than 4.0-4.4 range as a starter. But that's Anderson Houser insurance for a very cost effective price. I also don't see him as a durability concern. Guy had cancer and a nerve issue in his hip. The nerve issue is a full recovery in 6 months (for pro athletes) and rehab starts at 8 weeks after the procedure. It's not back, shoulder, elbow and arm stuff. It's not even reoccurring soft tissue issues. These two are pretty fluky and (hopefully) a 1 time fix.

 

If I was Stearns I'd be ok with the $1.25 + .25 buy out in 2021. That would be value for an insurance policy type guy. Could start the year in San Antonio of 8th guy in the pen.

[TJseven7]

I'm also very interested to see what Cashner is waiting on. If he's holding out for a chunk of change he can hold his breath as long as he wants. If he's holding out for a "guaranteed" SP role he can go play for a bad team. If no one's stepping to the plate, he seems like the type MKE would pursue if his demands were reasonable.

 

Last year he scrapped his sinker and cutter. They were both horrible pitches for him. Started the year with 17 starts over 5.6 IP per start a 3.83 ERA and a 4.26 fip. His FB CH SL graded very well. The CB which he used a solid amount has never been a good pitch for him. I really think if he scrapped the CB as well he could have some late life in his career.

 

FB 50% up 2% (no sinkers), CH 30% up 2%, SL 20% up 7%, would be a good pitch mix for him by the numbers. 94-85-85 on the 3 pitches velocity. Now do you want him starting with a 3 pitch mix or in the pen is the real question.

 

He could be a very nice traditional long man on a 3 pitch mix. While that's usually seen as a garbage man position I think having a guy who can go 3-4IP and pitch sub 4 ERA ball isn't a bad thing to have.

[clancyphile]

 

What do you see in Bettis that you would want to pay him at all? 2019 was a disaster both home and away. Then hip surgery. He did ok away from home in 2018, but 2017 numbers were terrible again especially away from Colorado. Stearns passed on much better pitchers for less money.

 

I don't agree on the price with Clancy. I'd be more along the lines of 1.25 mil 2020 40 man spot MiLB deal. 2021 club option for 4 mil with a 250K buyout. Maybe toss in some MLB boosters.

 

I do agree that he's an interesting option that I want. 1st off I'm going to caution the 2017 2019 road splits being used. 1) Sample size is very very small. 2) He was coming back from having CANCER and going through CHEMO in 2017. One of my years in college we had a CB who went through that following his Senior year football season and fall camp as a freshman in college. He lost a TON of weight and was going to be cut until a few coaches were alerted to the situation. Kid rebounded massively with a healthy off season, his year 2 was night and day. Chemo is brutal. Also in 2019 he was used in the pen and that didn't suit him well, he was also pitching through pain in his hip all last year.

 

He recently stated he hasn't felt this healthy since before he had Cancer.

 

I think 2017 is a throw away. 2019 he was pitching through a lot of pain. 2015 and 2016 this guy was pretty even home and away. Not great but even.

 

Guys 31 and was a 2nd round pick. I don't think he's done yet. I don't think he's going to be much better than 4.0-4.4 range as a starter. But that's Anderson Houser insurance for a very cost effective price. I also don't see him as a durability concern. Guy had cancer and a nerve issue in his hip. The nerve issue is a full recovery in 6 months (for pro athletes) and rehab starts at 8 weeks after the procedure. It's not back, shoulder, elbow and arm stuff. It's not even reoccurring soft tissue issues. These two are pretty fluky and (hopefully) a 1 time fix.

 

As I said, I think Bettis is worth a look - and I'd take the chance on a deal that could go up to three years, $14 million. Partially because others have gone elsewhere. Partially because I think Bettis does nudge Houser to the bullpen, and that makes the pitching better.

 

2020: $2 million

2021: Team option for $5 million or $2 million buyout

2022: Mutual option for $7 million or $1.5 million buyout

 

You get a rotation of Woodruff, B.Anderson, Lindblom, Bettis, Lauer

Bullpen of Hader, Knebel, Peralta, Houser, Suter, Claudio, Rasmussen, Andrews

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Bob Nightengale

@BNightengale

Taijuan Walker, 27, the former prized pitching prospect who has pitched just 14 innings the last two years, worked out in front of about 20 scouts today in hopes of landing a major-league contract. His fastball was clocked at 85-88 mph as he's coming back from Tommy John surgery.

 

This probably explains why Walker doesn't have a team. I know it's not even spring training yet, but topping out at 88 in a showcase is not ideal.

[TJseven7]

Bob Nightengale

@BNightengale

Taijuan Walker, 27, the former prized pitching prospect who has pitched just 14 innings the last two years, worked out in front of about 20 scouts today in hopes of landing a major-league contract. His fastball was clocked at 85-88 mph as he's coming back from Tommy John surgery.

 

This probably explains why Walker doesn't have a team. I know it's not even spring training yet, but topping out at 88 in a showcase is not ideal.

 

He's toast til 2021 at the earliest. 88 won't increase that much in-season. 88 won't cut it when in 2014-16 he was pitching at his best. Throwing that FB on average at 94. Guy needs to completely reinvent his mix. What a shame.

[Ennder]

Spring velocity is usually down 3 or 4 MPH at this point for everyone. I don't think you can just say he is toast because it is only 88 now. It is certainly someone hard to bet on as depth though. More likely you are signing him to rehab half the season first.

[TJseven7]

He's maxing at 6 MPH under his average in 14-16.

 

That's asking him to improve roughly 8 MPH from now until he's back. People freak out about guys losing 1-2 MPH off their FB.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Spring velocity is usually down 3 or 4 MPH at this point for everyone.

 

I wouldn't imagine this would be the case for a guy in a showcase coming off injury. If there were ever a time to let it fly, it's when you're pitching for a job. I get the feeling too that he's done.

[Ennder]

Oh he probably is done, I mean it is the safe bet coming back from injuries and failing to get better. But to say this is somehow definite proof is just not true. Every year we go into spring and people are worried about a pitchers velocity being down 5+ MPH and most of the time it doesn't mean anything and sometimes it means a lot. People like to just deal in absolutes way too much.

[brewmann04]

I think if any additions to be made it be in the pen. Think the rest of the roster is set depth wise

[RollieTime]

Oh he probably is done, I mean it is the safe bet coming back from injuries and failing to get better. But to say this is somehow definite proof is just not true. Every year we go into spring and people are worried about a pitchers velocity being down 5+ MPH and most of the time it doesn't mean anything and sometimes it means a lot. People like to just deal in absolutes way too much.

 

Jeffress is a perfect example of this. He was throwing what, 85 MPH last year in actual game action? And that wasn’t in early February like it was for Walker. It’s definitely a concern, but he could realistically get back to 90-92 after a couple more months of throwing and building the arm strength back up.

[JosephC]

I think the workout pretty much eliminates Walker from major league contract status, but he still should be a split contract or minor league contract guy. His last full season he threw the fastball <60% of the time, and threw a slider, curveball, change-up all at least 10% of the time. His fastball has been by far his most effective pitch, but it's not like he's been a two-pitch guy. He has been a 4-pitch guy in the past and probably is at the point where he needs to re-make himself, work on pin-point fastball location and change speeds off that with the 3 other pitches. The guy is still only 27 years old and should be an interesting project for one of the MLB franchises.

[clancyphile]

I think the workout pretty much eliminates Walker from major league contract status, but he still should be a split contract or minor league contract guy. His last full season he threw the fastball <60% of the time, and threw a slider, curveball, change-up all at least 10% of the time. His fastball has been by far his most effective pitch, but it's not like he's been a two-pitch guy. He has been a 4-pitch guy in the past and probably is at the point where he needs to re-make himself, work on pin-point fastball location and change speeds off that with the 3 other pitches. The guy is still only 27 years old and should be an interesting project for one of the MLB franchises.

 

I wonder if a two-year minor-league contract would make sense in this case.

 

NRIs both years, opt-out after the first year.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I think the workout pretty much eliminates Walker from major league contract status, but he still should be a split contract or minor league contract guy. His last full season he threw the fastball <60% of the time, and threw a slider, curveball, change-up all at least 10% of the time. His fastball has been by far his most effective pitch, but it's not like he's been a two-pitch guy. He has been a 4-pitch guy in the past and probably is at the point where he needs to re-make himself, work on pin-point fastball location and change speeds off that with the 3 other pitches. The guy is still only 27 years old and should be an interesting project for one of the MLB franchises.

 

I wonder if a two-year minor-league contract would make sense in this case.

 

NRIs both years, opt-out after the first year.

 

Jeff Passan

@JeffPassan

·

2m

Pitcher Taijuan Walker and the Seattle Mariners are in agreement on a one-year, $2 million contract, league sources tell ESPN. Walker can earn up to $3 million total based on incentives.

 

I have the feeling this is going to equate to throwing $2 million in the toilet.