Developing Players without the need for minor leagues

[folly412]

Seems Colorado Springs would be a prime target to be dumped, considering the "paper roster" for stashing players was its primary use, there are already two rookie-league teams in Arizona that presumably would even need to be cut to one, and you have Rookie league players in the Pioneer League traveling long distances that make it further impractical.

 

If MLB is driving this they'll protect the team-owned affiliates, so Carolina would be safest. The league is also travel-friendly.

 

Interesting that pulling in the St. Paul Saints was mentioned - if the goal is to get clubs more affiliates in their backyards it's good for Appleton. Wonder if they'd want to push those teams to higher levels due to all the AAA shuttling.

[ClosetBrewerFan]

The brewers have invested heavily the last couple of years in the minors, including buying the Carolina team and creating playing fields for the two Arizona teams. I presume the Carolina team will be unaffected, but if this goes through, they spent money on playing fields for just spring training. Maybe its not that big a deal, but I wonder if Atanasio has been busy talking to his accountant.

[LincolnDD]

It will be interesting to see if "team" names leak out that make up the 42 teams. From a current Brewers perspective, San Antonio has the population. Do they have the stadium? Do Biloxi, Carolina, and Wisconsin have the population base? Would they take into effect annual attendance at the locations?

 

I do think major cities like San Antonio and Richmond could be affected. I think one of the many goals of MLB here is to force cities like this into upgrading with the threat of losing their team if they don't.

[LincolnDD]

The brewers have invested heavily the last couple of years in the minors, including buying the Carolina team and creating playing fields for the two Arizona teams. I presume the Carolina team will be unaffected, but if this goes through, they spent money on playing fields for just spring training. Maybe its not that big a deal, but I wonder if Atanasio has been busy talking to his accountant.

 

The impression I got (and I could be wrong) is that the complex leagues in Arizona and Florida would be unaffected, and we would possible see expansion there. (Edit: I was wrong; each MLB team would be limited to one complex league team.)

 

I assume Carolina will be safe, but I don't know how interested MLB teams will be in affiliate ownership going forward if this goes through.

[JohnBriggs12]

As far as the stadium issue, there's perfectly fine stadiums currently home to independent league teams. Schaumburg and Rosemont in the Chicago area are two prime examples. Instead of cutting hundreds of jobs in affiliated ball, why not put teams in those places?

[brooks_quichenick]

Getting rid of affordable, fan-friendly baseball options will only hurt MLB in the long run. Terrible development in my opinion.

[balsamlaker]

Five of the top 120 teams in minor league average attendance were in the Brewers system. Colorado Springs could likely be one of the 42 on their way out under the plan, with its run down stadium. Could San Antonio be the team headed to CHS Stadium in St. Paul? San Antonio has the population base, but Wolff Stadium could use some work.

[LincolnDD]

San Antonio would be a possibility. Fresno seems like another. I'm sure MLB has noticed how Fresno has become the spot nobody wants. The article mentioned the possibility of a team being demoted from AAA to A, and they're right there in Cal League territory.

 

Tacoma's , too, given their older stadium and unfortunate geographic location in relation to all the other teams.

 

Would have to think that the Twins would have a say in what happens in St. Paul. Sugar Land was the other indy team mentioned as an org that could be absorbed into professional baseball. I would guess that's Astros territory.

[MrTPlush]

Getting rid of affordable, fan-friendly baseball options will only hurt MLB in the long run. Terrible development in my opinion.

 

Reading the article it sounds like little to no cities would actually lose a baseball team if they want to join the ‘Dream League’. There is loads of baseball being played outside of the MiLB system anyway...independent leagues, semi-pro stuff, college, summer league. All of which are probably way more family friendly and affordable compared to MiLB.

 

I like the MLB plan, but it is a total nightmare when it comes to infrastructure and financials. I can’t even imagine trying to put these MASSIVE changes in places so soon.

 

One big problem, they want to make the lower level team pay millions to be AAA. How are they paying all that money for no real monetary gain? It may attract some more attention having AAA players, but hardly enough to offset the insane valuation increase imposed on them. I doubt they make these smaller stadium teams all build new ones their region may not support. By support I mean financially (AAA stadiums cost a solid $50mil) or literal support via attendance etc.

 

I think most of their concepts are beautiful, but to actually make them a reality understanding it effects many communities, people, and owners just seems wishful. This is an incredibly long overdue process that should have begun a long time ago.

[MrTPlush]

Five of the top 120 teams in minor league average attendance were in the Brewers system. Colorado Springs could likely be one of the 42 on their way out under the plan, with its run down stadium. Could San Antonio be the team headed to CHS Stadium in St. Paul? San Antonio has the population base, but Wolff Stadium could use some work.

 

San Antonio got the team and there were pretty good expectations of a new stadium to be done. With those plans getting more dismal by the day I would expect MLB to move the team if they won't build the stadium. A big part of MLBs wishes is to have better facilities.

[LincolnDD]

List of the 42 is out via the New York Times. They don't say where they got the names. As expected, Colorado Springs/Rocky Mountain is gone, and every team from the Pioneer League is on the list.

 

No other Brewers affiliate is listed. In other Brewers affiliates leagues: Southern League would lose Chattanooga and Jackson. Three teams from the Midwest League are out, Burlington, Clinton and Quad Cities. Frederick from the Carolina League goes. Our former FSL Brevard County team (now the Braves' Florida Fire Frogs) gets the axe, too.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/16/sports/baseball/mlb-minor-league-proposal.html

[clancyphile]

Honestly...

 

I think the Brewers are fools to go along with this sort of cut. If anything, they should expand their minor-league system.

 

Two DSL teams

Two rookie-level teams.

A R+ team

A short-season A team

A full-season A team

A full-season A+ team

A AA team

A AAA team

 

Plus, create baseball academies in Australia, South Korea, Taiwan, and Japan.

 

Build something extremely extensive...

 

I wonder if it would be possible for them to also maybe buy part owner-ship of some independent league teams, like the Milwaukee Milkmen...

[TURBO]

Since the thread I started based on the article I am posting below was locked, I'll post it here.

 

https://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/ny-minor-league-luhnow-madden-20191116-73ssnr7ybvdwzdr5vd44vh4e5m-story.html?fbclid=IwAR1ycUOMAOscAFR-vA9UWusL569EjM-ff52z5Y2gKXFCGhn3L8q_E2E2L-M

[DuWayne Steurer]

I moved your post to this thread but bf timed out and gave me a server error and I couldn't get on for like 15 minutes.

[MadThinker88]

List of the 42 is out via the New York Times. They don't say where they got the names. As expected, Colorado Springs/Rocky Mountain is gone, and every team from the Pioneer League is on the list.

 

No other Brewers affiliate is listed. In other Brewers affiliates leagues: Southern League would lose Chattanooga and Jackson. Three teams from the Midwest League are out, Burlington, Clinton and Quad Cities. Frederick from the Carolina League goes. Our former FSL Brevard County team (now the Braves' Florida Fire Frogs) gets the axe, too.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/16/sports/baseball/mlb-minor-league-proposal.html

 

Kinda surprised that Beloit is NOT on the list. Same goes for Fresno (regularly ranked in bottom 2 with Colorado Springs for AAA sites)

 

After personally seeing games in Beloit (& a half dozen other places including 3 others in the Midwest League), Beloit was in the basement in my opinion.

[ReverendBrewmeister]

List of the 42 is out via the New York Times. They don't say where they got the names. As expected, Colorado Springs/Rocky Mountain is gone, and every team from the Pioneer League is on the list.

 

No other Brewers affiliate is listed. In other Brewers affiliates leagues: Southern League would lose Chattanooga and Jackson. Three teams from the Midwest League are out, Burlington, Clinton and Quad Cities. Frederick from the Carolina League goes. Our former FSL Brevard County team (now the Braves' Florida Fire Frogs) gets the axe, too.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/16/sports/baseball/mlb-minor-league-proposal.html

 

Kinda surprised that Beloit is NOT on the list. Same goes for Fresno (regularly ranked in bottom 2 with Colorado Springs for AAA sites)

 

After personally seeing games in Beloit (& a half dozen other places including 3 others in the Midwest League), Beloit was in the basement in my opinion.

 

Probably some factors for Beloit in their favor is the proposed new stadium that is being considered to be built, as well as proximity to both the population in Rockford and Janesville. I am surprised that the Quad Cities are on that slate for the axe.

[MrTPlush]

Man Quad Cities gets a decent chunk of people to the games and have a nice stadium/location.

 

What a shame for some of these cities and owners if it goes through.

[DuWayne Steurer]

Beloit's stadium is an absolute dump-ola. They've been talking for years about moving the Snappers to a different park or up here to Janesville or something (literally anything) and I too am surprised that they weren't one of the cities that are being considered for elimination. Even though Janesville and Rockford should, in theory, provide an attendance boost for the Snappers, Beloit averages about 1200 a game.

[DHonks]

I'd much rather expand the minors.

[jerichoholicninja]

Beloit's stadium is an absolute dump-ola. They've been talking for years about moving the Snappers to a different park or up here to Janesville or something (literally anything) and I too am surprised that they weren't one of the cities that are being considered for elimination. Even though Janesville and Rockford should, in theory, provide an attendance boost for the Snappers, Beloit averages about 1200 a game.

 

I'm guessing by keeping them they're assuming some "free" government money for a new stadium. Or the under the table deals are already in place and they just need the minor league overhaul to actually happen.

[LincolnDD]

If they're really concerned about proximity () they should focus more on realignment, shifting teams to different leagues/levels, and splitting existing leagues into smaller units. Merge all short season leagues (A and Rookie) into one 30-team level just like AAA, AA, H-A and L-A so that each Major League team has one affiliate at five levels. That would still require contracting ten teams (or twelve, if they're hell-bent on getting St. Paul and Sugar Land into affiliated ball), but that would be a lot less bloodshed. And honestly, there are some teams that probably need to go away (Batavia's been hanging on by a thread for years, and the Florida Firefrogs don't even have a home city right now), but 42 is too many. It would also give teams with "difficult" stadium situations time to fix those issues. If they don't, then MLB can cut the next thirty a few years down the road.

[MadThinker88]

IF (& I mean IF) the majors is looking to expand by 2, there could be as many more 8 spots needed for full season minor league teams (2 each at AAA, AA, High-A & A).

 

That might save some spots (even if there is a shuffling of teams moving up levels)

[LincolnDD]

IF (& I mean IF) the majors is looking to expand by 2, there could be as many more 8 spots needed for full season minor league teams (2 each at AAA, AA, High-A & A).

 

That might save some spots (even if there is a shuffling of teams moving up levels)

 

Really good point. Right now, it's really hard to pinpoint enough cities to handle minor league expansion, even with some prominent cities that have lost or are about to lose teams -- Pawtucket, New Orleans, Mobile -- available to fill some spots. I've tried to play around with this in the past (after coming across a post about it on Reddit), and it's not easy.

[Ueckerforpresident]

I'm a huge fan of small town ball so yeah I'm quite unhappy with the new minor league proposal. Unfortunately the more our society moves towards people staring at screens all the time instead of going out into the real world and actually doing stuff, the more baseball is going to concentrate to the top. In other words people in small towns are now more likely to stay at home and watch major league baseball on their big screen tv than go down to their local ball park and watch the real deal. It kind of sucks seeing all the money raked in by MLB these days, meanwhile the kids in the MiLB are basically working below the poverty level. Thats why I love small town ball, kids play with more heart, and it doesn't cost a fortune to take your family to a game.

[CheeseheadInQC]

Man Quad Cities gets a decent chunk of people to the games and have a nice stadium/location.

 

What a shame for some of these cities and owners if it goes through.

 

It is a beautiful stadium. Thankfully we're now hearing that Q-C is not on the contraction list. Clinton and Burlington are, however.