2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Hill is out 6 weeks, thus no returns.

 

I agree on it mostly being about don't be stupid, and don't fumble. Davis was kind of stupid though, and I had a heart attack when he didn't FC. Or he would FC and then block someone...

 

The actual punter you have is much more important than your PR. It used to be more valuable back in the day, but they've really discouraged returns so it's getting slowly taken out of the game.

[nodakfan17]

TE Evan Baylis gets Davis’ roster spot.

 

They must be concerned about Graham’s injury.

[HiAndTight]

Hill is out 6 weeks, thus no returns.

 

I agree on it mostly being about don't be stupid, and don't fumble. Davis was kind of stupid though, and I had a heart attack when he didn't FC. Or he would FC and then block someone...

 

The actual punter you have is much more important than your PR. It used to be more valuable back in the day, but they've really discouraged returns so it's getting slowly taken out of the game.

 

 

They've discouraged kick returns. They haven't really done anything to my knowledge to discourage punt returns. In fact they eliminated that "halo," that allowed for the returner to have 2 1/2 yards around him to catch the ball cleanly. That's resulted in bigger hits.

 

But I agree, a great punter is more important than a punt returner. The Packers can throw Tramon Williams out there and be fine. Let him wave and just hold on. I can only really remember one time Davis had a significant impact on a Packers game. Scott's had two enormously impactful games already.

[CheezWizHed]

Not to mention they won't have to put Davis on IR in 2 weeks and find a PR/KR replacement anyway. I'm surprised he stayed healthy this long this year.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Punting has changed drastically. If you can't directional punt you don't know play very long. The number of returns per game is much lower than it was even five years ago, a shell of it was 15 years ago. Teams also figured it out it is better to hang the ball an extra .5 second and punt it 5 yards shorter than give Devin Hester and Dante Hall 15 yards of green space. The league hasn't discouraged punt returns but the game has.

[MrTPlush]

They also realized punting out of bounds is idiotic and guys that can actually kick it short enough to induce a fair catch or get a favorable bounce are insanely valuable. Returners rarely risk a ball ending up on the 2 yard line and will fair catch even inside the 10 just to make sure that doesn’t happen.

 

It’s funny to look back and think how big of a deal trying to kick it out of bounds inside the 20 was a religious thing everybody just did...now it is more common to just kick it high to let your guys get down there to catch/stop it or get the fair catch called.

[young guns]

Coincidence that Davis' big preseason game was against the raiders or did that impress them enough to cover him?

[homer]

Are there more fair catches than 20 years ago?

[MrTPlush]

Coincidence that Davis' big preseason game was against the raiders or did that impress them enough to cover him?

 

The ironic part of this is Tremon Smith had a big returning game in preseason too. He had kick returns of 45 and 29 yards...against the Packers.

[MrTPlush]

Are there more fair catches than 20 years ago?

 

2003 - 523

2006 - 489

2008 - 449

2013 - 598

2018 - 624

 

I couldn't go farther back than 2003. The answer seems to be yes. I will also mention the average yards on a punt has dramatically changed. There used to be a ton of guys averaging 10+...that simply isn't the case anymore. The more important question would technically be net return, but at the same time I think there is a sacrifice to make guys not have dangerous returns. There were only 7 returns for TDs last year, no one had multiple. Ten years ago there were 17 TDs and four guys had at least two. In 2003 there were 18 TDs and once again four guys with multiple TDs.

 

This shift of punting smarts seems to be in the last 5 years...which makes sense to me.

[homer]

Guys are punting farther too. Since 2011 the average has been over 45 yards. In 2000 it was 41.9. Some of that is probably because teams are going for it on 4th down more often when they cross the 50.

[tmwiese55]

Are there more fair catches than 20 years ago?

 

2003 - 523

2006 - 489

2008 - 449

2013 - 598

2018 - 624

 

I couldn't go farther back than 2003. The answer seems to be yes. I will also mention the average yards on a punt has dramatically changed. There used to be a ton of guys averaging 10+...that simply isn't the case anymore. The more important question would technically be net return, but at the same time I think there is a sacrifice to make guys not have dangerous returns. There were only 7 returns for TDs last year, no one had multiple. Ten years ago there were 17 TDs and four guys had at least two. In 2003 there were 18 TDs and once again four guys with multiple TDs.

 

This shift of punting smarts seems to be in the last 5 years...which makes sense to me.

 

Yet they continue to not listen to the math on 4 and shorts and goal line situations. Well, I guess it's improved but still it's very slow progress.

[HiAndTight]

Not to mention they won't have to put Davis on IR in 2 weeks and find a PR/KR replacement anyway. I'm surprised he stayed healthy this long this year.

 

 

I really think you guys are just looking at him and assuming he's frail. The only time he's missed games due to injury was last year with the Hammy. Otherwise, he was fine.

 

Punting has changed drastically. If you can't directional punt you don't know play very long. The number of returns per game is much lower than it was even five years ago, a shell of it was 15 years ago. Teams also figured it out it is better to hang the ball an extra .5 second and punt it 5 yards shorter than give Devin Hester and Dante Hall 15 yards of green space. The league hasn't discouraged punt returns but the game has.

 

You're definitely right about that. They've also gotten much-much better at using that rugby style kick to get the ball to bounce up more inside the 10 pinning guys back deep.

 

A couple other things that I don't know for a fact are true, but feel true, they seem to leave the gunners out there with just one blocker on them. It always seemed like there were two guys just beating the living hell out of the gunners every play. I've noticed this in the Packers game, they lineup with 8 guys around the LOS more now.

 

And there also seems to be a lot more penalties. Every time there is a big return, there calling EVERYTHING on that return. And they so often don't even call it right. The blocker gets his head in front and they still call it a block in the back. And every little tug is called a hold. That's why whoever said they'd be fine just fair catching the ball every single time, I agree. I bet when you add up the lost penalty yards vs the yards gained, it's a minimal difference. 2-3 times a game you're losing 5 yards right out of the gate, a particularly harmful penalty when you get a 10 yard return, get it out to the 30, but they called a hold on the other side of the field, so you're not starting on the 15.

[HiAndTight]

I take it nobody's really big on trading for Ramsey?

 

I didn't realize he was still only 24. Obviously knew he was young, but 24. I still don't know if I'm all for trading for him because we'd have to sign him. But just looking around the NFL, if the Packers are playing for a SB...and that would seem to be the goal every year, IF you went out and got Ramsey for lets say a 1st, 5th and throw in Josh Jackson if you have to, then gave him 5/85 in new money, make the SB 55 million, spread it over 6 years. Then you've got your QB, LT and Corners locked up for the near future and you have All Pro's at each position

 

It's sure increase our odds against the Chiefs, Pats, Rams, Saints. Plus, he brigs that attitude to a defense that CAN be helpful. Not a huge fan of it, but that Sherman type attitude that your D feeds off of. Just imagine King and Ramsey on the outside, have Alexander playing the slot and Savage and Amos at safety with Tramon ready to play wherever needed.

 

Plus...we are at the point that we can start just kicking that can down the road on that cap, right? Rodgers is 36...Packers certainly have the cash to make these types of moves.

[GAME05]

Aren't both Tackles free agents after this year? I remember after the Smiths signings someone saying the Packers wouldn't be very active in FA next year because there wouldn't be any cap money for it. If we assume that T is a more important position to sign, it seems more like there wouldn't be money to re-sign Ramsey.

[GAME05]

Aren't both Tackles free agents after this year? I remember after the Smiths signings someone saying the Packers wouldn't be very active in FA next year because there wouldn't be any cap money for it. If we assume that T is a more important position to sign, it seems more like there wouldn't be money to re-sign Ramsey.

[nodakfan17]

Elgton Jenkins to start at LG. Lane Taylor to IR. Adam Pankey back with the Pack after being signed off the Titans’ practice squad. That happened quick.

[HiAndTight]

Aren't both Tackles free agents after this year? I remember after the Smiths signings someone saying the Packers wouldn't be very active in FA next year because there wouldn't be any cap money for it. If we assume that T is a more important position to sign, it seems more like there wouldn't be money to re-sign Ramsey.

 

 

No, just Bulaga. Bahk has another year before he's a FA I believe. But you can almost always create cap space. How much cash you have is just as important as cap room. They can give Rodgers another 10 million and extend his contract 3 more years at 35 million base and his cap hit would go way down. There's always a way to do it, it's just how big of a hole do you want to dig. What I'm saying is at this point, who cares? You have Rodgers for a limited amount of time. You can keep pushing that down the road. Give Ramsey his extension, don't tear up those two years...that keeps his cap hit relatively inexpensive if you use the Cowboys type extensions. They give everyone these giant 7-8 year extensions. There have been a few times it seemed like they should have done that. Bahktiari is an obvious one. Adams is another.

 

I don't really think we're going to trade for and then sign him, but he might be a great enough player that you get him, sign him and then worry about the rest later. The rest being Bulaga next year, Clark coming up, Bakh coming up...among others.

 

It will be interesting to see what they do with Bulaga next year. Maybe you just tag him for a year while you try to develop a QB? I really don't know what to do about him. Maybe just tag him? See if you can get an extension along the lines of what Jimmy Graham signed for? But if he plays 16 games this year or stays healthy for the most part, it'd be tough to let him walk.

[PinaMadness]

Looks like heavy rain for the game today, if not thunderstorms. That would be awesome to see.

[MrTPlush]

Looks like heavy rain for the game today, if not thunderstorms. That would be awesome to see.

 

They won’t play in lightning so hopefully just rain.

 

I love crazy weather games...usually prefer it not be the Packers though. The other day I saw highlights from an older Eagles game where they played in heavy snow to start and then had quite a few inches of snow to deal with on the ground after that. Worst snow game I can ever recall, but man it made for one wacky game.

[nodakfan17]

Poor weather in football makes it more difficult for the better team to demonstrate its superiority in a 60-minute window. Gotta believe the rain only hurts the Packers, all else equal.

[pacopete4]

Benched Rodgers for Dak today. Feels just too weird.

[pacopete4]

Cincy is now 0-3 after losing to the Bills. AJ Green is coming back soon. He would be one to target going forward as a trade candidate. He is an unrestricted free agent at seasons end and shouldn't cost a ton because of that. I would assume he would love to play with one of the games best and a chance to get to the playoffs.

[homer]

Saints look really good without Brees.

[HiAndTight]

Saints look really good without Brees.

 

 

[sarcasm]No they don't. They only look good because they're getting turnovers and then scoring. If it wasn't for the defense and the turnovers, they'd be losing...[/sarcasm]

 

 

Seriously though, they do. Even though that offense hasn't looked great. Even when Brees was in for the most part. Still, people wanted to bury them when they knew Brees was going to be out for a while, but that's a really solid defense and they've got a good, established backup. And Seattle is a hard team to read. 21-20 over Cincy, a close win over the Steelers even after they lost Big Ben.

 

I bet on NO, but I didn't expect them to dominate Seattle.

 

Kamara and Thomas are pretty special though. Clowney just blew up a running play and Kamara just ran through his tackle. That's impressive.

 

 

----That first line should be showing up in Blue.