SS market

[KeithStone53151]

A couple other SS that would be more significant splashes, Nick Ahmed and Trevor Story. Ahmed has 1 more year of arbitration and is getting 3.7 million this year. Trevor Story has 2 more years of arbitration and is getting 5 million this year. Obviously their costs would be significantly different, but I think one or both teams may punt on the season...and may be open to trading for pitching despite the team control. Again, just food for thought. Not really advocating in any direction. For all I know, both teams may win 4 straight and buy.

[ebmackenzie]

What would Trevor Story cost?

 

Surely we are backing the truck up on this deal, but the 40 man roster is coming and players need to be moved or lost.

[wntrtxn21]

What would Trevor Story cost?

 

Surely we are backing the truck up on this deal, but the 40 man roster is coming and players need to be moved or lost.

 

The Brewers don't have enough decent prospects to even think about Story w/o completely emptying the system.

[KeithStone53151]

What would Trevor Story cost?

 

Surely we are backing the truck up on this deal, but the 40 man roster is coming and players need to be moved or lost.

 

The Brewers don't have enough decent prospects to even think about Story w/o completely emptying the system.

 

I think a starting point for story maybe could be peralta or burnes. The Rockies aren't in a tear down, so an mlb arm with a ton of team control is very valuable to them. Peralta specifically has been very good at coors field. I also see Rodgers in place behind story, which is part of why i could see them looking to move him for the right haul.

[ebmackenzie]

"I think a starting point for story maybe could be peralta or burnes. The Rockies aren't in a tear down, so an mlb arm with a ton of team control is very valuable to them. Peralta specifically has been very good at coors field. I also see Rodgers in place behind story, which is part of why i could see them looking to move him for the right haul."

 

 

Everyone here is lucky that I am not GM, I would back the truck up for 2019 +2 years of TStory and JGray. I would want them both. I am tired, tired, tired of weak link SSs and would like to see one hit above the 8 or 9 hole.

 

CBurnes, Supak, Grisham and CRay, DRassmssn, and Dubon...I am all in. I left Turang and Lutz out but it would not take much to get me to start replacing the original six listed. COL, like most teams needs catching help so JNott might be on their menu too.

 

I am not adverse to trading for starters and will not trade parts of MIL that I don't like as no other team would want them either...

 

Roast me but I would love this....

[DuWayne Steurer]

Just to point it out, Trevor Story hits .761 OPS away from Coors for his career. I'm not sure selling the farm for a .750-ish OPS shortstop is the right move.

[Warning Track Power]

I just can't rationalize trading Arcia unless it is for pitching help. I don't want to give up any assets for an upgrade at SS when SP/RP are the obvious pressing needs.

[bill hAll Star]

There is always the weird situation like LeMahieu absolutely crushing the juiced ball while no longer being with the Rockies, but odds are that Story will end up like Tulowitzki (without the long contract and injuries)...he'll be an above-average shortstop, not the superstar he's being shopped as.

 

The only difference with him and Tulowitzki is that he's younger and will have a few extra years of solid productivity...BUT, after 2021 that production will either be very expensive or on another team.

[MrTPlush]

Trevor Story has an OPS+ of 114 for what it is worth. Adjusted for his ballpark.

 

I would say Trevor Story would still be pretty darn valuable at Miller Park, 3 WAR guy or so?

[bill hAll Star]

Trevor Story has an OPS+ of 114 for what it is worth. Adjusted for his ballpark.

 

I would say Trevor Story would still be pretty darn valuable at Miller Park, 3 WAR guy or so?

 

He would but I'm assuming there will be an inflated trade value on him. I get that most GMs understand how Coors Field affects overall stats and can see that he's a good player outside of it, but I'm assuming the Rockies will be asking for a lot.

[ThisIsMyCrew]

Trevor Story has an OPS+ of 114 for what it is worth. Adjusted for his ballpark.

 

I would say Trevor Story would still be pretty darn valuable at Miller Park, 3 WAR guy or so?

 

He would but I'm assuming there will be an inflated trade value on him. I get that most GMs understand how Coors Field affects overall stats and can see that he's a good player outside of it, but I'm assuming the Rockies will be asking for a lot.

 

Just my opinion based off my eye balls. But Trevor Story’s numbers wouldn’t drop that far off having half his games in miller park. He seems to flat our rake vs us there. Not 100% the ball park but I think it’s a bit exagerated how some think players will be horrific away from Coors field. Miller park is very hitter friendly as well. Plus, guy has a .981 career fielding percentage. For as amazing as people think Arcia is, he’s only at .971. Offensive and defensive upgrade. Controlled through 2022 but will get more expensive. Would love seeing him Yelich and Hiura in the middle of our lineup.

[KeithStone53151]

I think Story will do fine, in large part because he's actually a very good breaking ball hitter based on the eye test. I feel like I always see that guy smashing offspeed pitches for HR against us...whether at Coors or Miller Park. And he specifically mashes lefties, which would be good for any playoff matchups.

 

I completely understand that pitching is a much greater need, and agree a Story trade is super unlikely. But it's certainly not a super unreasonable guy to discuss...and he would definitely improve the team. It would be similar to acquiring Machado last year, in that we'd all of a sudden have a lineup that is stacked 1-8.

 

Cain

Yelich

Hiura

Moose

Story

Grandal

Braun

Thames

 

Imagine a world where Thames is hitting 8th and it isn't because he's badly slumping...but because the other 7 hitters are really friggin good.

[pacopete4]

Flip Braun and Hiura and then Grandal and Moose and then you got it.

[KeithStone53151]

Flip Braun and Hiura and then Grandal and Moose and then you got it.

 

I didn't want to get too carried away with specific order, the point is obvious though. There is no hole in that lineup...especially when Woodruff is starting.

 

Would Peralta + Dubon + Ashby for Story + Bryan Shaw be close? Shaw is negative value, so taking him is adding benefit to the Colorado side...but I also think he'd be better than Burch Smith, Jay Jackson, Taylor Williams, etc as the 7th/8th bullpen arm.

 

Also a reminder that this trade would allow us to theoretically trade Arcia for pitching. He has enough team control that a team looking to retool quickly could have interest.

[pacopete4]

Colorado is a team I think should tear it down and tank. They have some really bad contracts and very little talent.

[bill hAll Star]

Colorado is a team I think should tear it down and tank. They have some really bad contracts and very little talent.

 

Do they?

 

They went out and overpaid a bunch of relievers because their assumed good, young pitching staff was making $5 million COMBINED per year last year and pretty much this year.

 

So sure, Wade Davis, Shaw, etc. were overpaid for relievers but I saw their intent.

 

However, next year is the final contract year for Davis, McGee, Shaw, and Murphy. Desmond is on the books in 2021 for $8 million.

 

So I do get the idea that they might not have much upward mobility at this point, it's not like they're cash-strapped forever. If their owner wants to spend up and win next year, he can. The following year they are a blank slate other than Blackmon and Arenado, basically. I don't think contracts will be holding them back.

[ThisIsMyCrew]

You weren’t kidding. They are a mess.

 

Paying $18 mil for a 5 ERA closer. $15 mil for a -1.3 war CF. $10 mil for a -.1 war 2nd baseman. Arenado and Blackmon havebeen pretty solid. I stopped at players making $10 mil. But all these players are signed for atleast next year at a min of $10 mil.

 

3 of there top 7 salaried players are relied pitchers.

[Jopal78]

What about Addison Russell?

 

Yes, he plays for a Division rival, and yes he has some personal baggage. However, the Cubs just optioned him to AAA despite not having a replacement at 2B. I assume they are done with the Russell and if they can't trade him he will be non-tendered after the season.

 

Despite the fact the Brewers are a division rival, perhaps Cubs management would prefer to get something for Russell than drop him for nothing in the off-season. Russell remains a solid defender at shortstop and second base. He hasn't hit much the last two plus seasons, but his .733 OPS this year is better than Arcia, Perez, Saladino, etc., and his career marks top those players as well. Russell is arbitration eligible for two more seasons.

[bill hAll Star]

You weren’t kidding. They are a mess.

 

Paying $18 mil for a 5 ERA closer. $15 mil for a -1.3 war CF. $10 mil for a -.1 war 2nd baseman. Arenado and Blackmon havebeen pretty solid. I stopped at players making $10 mil. But all these players are signed for atleast next year at a min of $10 mil.

 

3 of there top 7 salaried players are relied pitchers.

 

Teams with "bad contracts" are ones like Miguel Cabrera or Chris Davis spanning 3-5 more years. Or Pujols.

 

The Rockies' contracts barely make a dent in their long-term outlook is the point.

 

Some people will say, "lol Wade Davis isn't worth $17 million next year" but the reality is that they probably have room to sign some guys next year and if they really wanted to could sign a 10 year/$300 million player the following year and stay within their usual budget.

 

The sign of a team that needs to rebuild with horrendous contracts is not one that has a pretty blank slate after 2020 is all I was saying. One could still argue that they don't have enough to compete next year and not enough coming up in the minors, that is a fair argument.

 

Arenado and maybe Blackmon are the worst contracts but neither of those are concerns in the 2-3 year outlook.

[Lathund]

What about Addison Russell?

 

Yes, he plays for a Division rival, and yes he has some personal baggage

 

That's a hard no from me. Jeffress (DUI) and Braun (Cheating, and how he handled it) could be said to have "some personal baggage", but Russell is on a whole different level to that. I absolutely do not want him on the Brewers. He's a better player than Arcia, but I'd never want to replace Arcia with Russell.

[KeithStone53151]

What about Addison Russell?

 

Yes, he plays for a Division rival, and yes he has some personal baggage

 

That's a hard no from me. Jeffress (DUI) and Braun (Cheating, and how he handled it) could be said to have "some personal baggage", but Russell is on a whole different level to that. I absolutely do not want him on the Brewers. He's a better player than Arcia, but I'd never want to replace Arcia with Russell.

 

We should never ever make an even remotely substantial trade with the Cubs. I could care less about the whole moral superiority nonsense, we're talking about baseball and trying to help the Brewers win. We agree in the end, but for extremely different reasons.

[Warning Track Power]

What about Addison Russell?

 

Yes, he plays for a Division rival, and yes he has some personal baggage

 

That's a hard no from me. Jeffress (DUI) and Braun (Cheating, and how he handled it) could be said to have "some personal baggage", but Russell is on a whole different level to that. I absolutely do not want him on the Brewers. He's a better player than Arcia, but I'd never want to replace Arcia with Russell.

Amen to this. I would rather lose than root for someone who abuses women. Just my feelings on the subject.

[bill hAll Star]

You weren’t kidding. They are a mess.

 

Paying $18 mil for a 5 ERA closer. $15 mil for a -1.3 war CF. $10 mil for a -.1 war 2nd baseman. Arenado and Blackmon havebeen pretty solid. I stopped at players making $10 mil. But all these players are signed for atleast next year at a min of $10 mil.

 

3 of there top 7 salaried players are relied pitchers.

 

Teams with "bad contracts" are ones like Miguel Cabrera or Chris Davis spanning 3-5 more years. Or Pujols.

 

The Rockies' contracts barely make a dent in their long-term outlook is the point.

 

Some people will say, "lol Wade Davis isn't worth $17 million next year" but the reality is that they probably have room to sign some guys next year and if they really wanted to could sign a 10 year/$300 million player the following year and stay within their usual budget.

 

The sign of a team that needs to rebuild with horrendous contracts is not one that has a pretty blank slate after 2020 is all I was saying. One could still argue that they don't have enough to compete next year and not enough coming up in the minors, that is a fair argument.

 

Arenado and maybe Blackmon are the worst contracts but neither of those are concerns in the 2-3 year outlook.

 

Jumping on my own take here, if the Rockies truly did want to just do an ownership cash grab next year, their relievers would be interesting:

 

Davis' road ERA: 0.96

McGee road ERA: 1.32

Shaw road ERA: 3.42

 

Those are the "bad (read: not that bad anymore)" contracts, all of which are only on the hook for 2020. If the Rockies want to just line their owners' pockets or hit a reset button, I'd be interested in grabbing one of those guys and paying a % of the contract while not giving up much of anything.

[brooks_quichenick]

Not only is Russell a bad human being, he’s not a very good ball player. Hard pass.

[bill hAll Star]

I'd probably just pass on Russell. There may still be something there but I don't think he's a huge upgrade at this point. Throw in the baggage (yes, I, too, will let everyone know that I am boldly against domestic abuse on here) and it probably isn't worth sending anything of value for Russell. I honestly didn't understand why the Cubs jumped through so many hoops to give him more chances. It feels dirty, but if he was a really could player you could somewhat understand it but Russell's offense has fizzled and his defense is good but I can go get his production elsewhere.