Bucks off-season thread (non-draft)

[patrickgpe]

 

 

In theory, the bucks have 3 spots to fill.Ideally i'd love to see a veteran big and guard. Its too bad they had to release Wood to make room for Gasol.

 

 

But I'm with you on Morris. I think I mentioned him earlier, but while Marcus Morris would certainly be preferable(and worth using part of the TPE on if a sign and trade could be worked out), Markieff Morris would at least provide some help for when we have to match up with Philly and Toronto in the playoffs. A versatile 6'10 PF who can shoot, but also defend Horford/Gasol on the perimeter.

 

Markief signed with the Pistons, obviously Marcus is the preferred of the 2, but not sure the bucks could afford him. If the bucks want to bring in Gasol on a vet minimum, fine, but I wouldn't expect much from a 39 year old coming off of an injury but a vet presence in the locker room who has been there before. (which isn't anything)

 

As you mentioned, Burke is probably the best backup PG out there, hasn't done much in the pros, saw that the lakers are in the mix for him.

 

however, as i previously stated, carter makes the more sense to me over gasol.

[patrickgpe]

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/report_bucks_to_sign_brother_of_mvp_giannis_antetokounmpo/s1_12680_29458670

 

2 years / 3MM is a small price to pay if this makes Giannis's decision next summer easier, also helps fill out the roster on the cheap. now give me Vince and lets get to camp!.

[OnTheBlack]

You can't combine players with a TPE. Think of it as completing the trade with the Pacers; they were allowed to take back ~$12m in salary in that trade, but they didn't, so they have a year to take back ~$12m in salary in a single trade to make up the difference. It might help to think of the new trade as basically being completion of the Pacer trade.

 

For example, if you take $12m in salary from Minnesota, it's as if Minnesota was part of the Brogdon trade in a 3-team deal. But you can't change the fundamental terms of the original trade by adding someone like Ersan to the TPE. The privilege is basically a delay in when you take back that matching salary in a one-time deal, but no other modifications of the original trade are allowed.

 

The time to get Korver was 2 years ago. He would have been perfect but it's too late IMO. Would much rather complement veterans with the young wings.

 

 

 

Ahh..I thought it basically just a way to allow a team to add salary. So no way you can use it to add a guy like Beal if by chance Washington wanted to just rid themselves of his salary. You'd be limited just to plays who's salaries are close enough to the TPE? So can you tell me why the TPE is around 12 million? How did they arrive at that number?

[patrickgpe]

It’s just one summer league game, but the bucks may have something in jock Landale and Dalton Hommes, both fill a position of need. May be good choices for 2 way contracts, . Fletcher Magee was the player I was excited to see but he was a DNP..

[OnTheBlack]

 

 

In theory, the bucks have 3 spots to fill.Ideally i'd love to see a veteran big and guard. Its too bad they had to release Wood to make room for Gasol.

 

 

But I'm with you on Morris. I think I mentioned him earlier, but while Marcus Morris would certainly be preferable(and worth using part of the TPE on if a sign and trade could be worked out), Markieff Morris would at least provide some help for when we have to match up with Philly and Toronto in the playoffs. A versatile 6'10 PF who can shoot, but also defend Horford/Gasol on the perimeter.

 

Markief signed with the Pistons, obviously Marcus is the preferred of the 2, but not sure the bucks could afford him. If the bucks want to bring in Gasol on a vet minimum, fine, but I wouldn't expect much from a 39 year old coming off of an injury but a vet presence in the locker room who has been there before. (which isn't anything)

 

As you mentioned, Burke is probably the best backup PG out there, hasn't done much in the pros, saw that the lakers are in the mix for him.

 

however, as i previously stated, carter makes the more sense to me over gasol.

 

I mis-spoke when I said they had to release Wood for Gasol. It was Frazier after Brogdon's injury.

 

 

Anyway, obviously Makieff Morris is the lesser of the two and it's a little disappointing to see him go to the Piston's for so little, but he has more of an opportunity there. We're getting pretty loaded with bigs in Milwaukee. Both Lopez brothers, Wilson, Ersan, all guys worth of minutes. None of these guys should be sitting.

 

So I'm not really a big advocate of Pau Gasol. I think he could still be a marginally effective player for short spurts. And even there mostly offensively. Carter seems to be capable of still playing 20 MPG. And he's a decent shooter. Amazing how long he's been around. I doubt anyone looked at his game coming out and thought, "yeah, he's the guy who's game is going to age the best, he could play 20 years in this league."

 

 

Really, the only thing I'd like to see the Bucks add now is a big who can defend the perimeter and capably defend the post as well. That's the only "hole" I see on this team. Two deep at PG(particularly regular season). Multiple good options at the 2. 3-4 are your franchise players. And a whole host of other bigs.

[OnTheBlack]

It’s just one summer league game, but the bucks may have something in jock Landale and Dalton Hommes, both fill a position of need. May be good choices for 2 way contracts, . Fletcher Magee was the player I was excited to see but he was a DNP..

 

 

I didn't really pick up much of that game other than Zhaire Smith dunking on everyone and then locking down Sterling Brown. He looked like an incredible athlete.

 

Only saw bits and pieces of it though.

[OnTheBlack]

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/report_bucks_to_sign_brother_of_mvp_giannis_antetokounmpo/s1_12680_29458670

 

2 years / 3MM is a small price to pay if this makes Giannis's decision next summer easier, also helps fill out the roster on the cheap. now give me Vince and lets get to camp!.

 

 

Yeah, if it makes Giannis happy, then obviously the roster spot and everything else is secondary. It just seems kinda stupid. Who knows if the couple good games Wood had will ever amount to anything, but this is basically just a wasted roster spot. And again, like you said, if it helps Giannis decide to stay next year, small price to pay. I was just hoping for another solid vet who had yet to sign.

 

I guess I'd sign the whole family if it meant keeping Giannis. I don't even want to think about the Bucks without Giannis. The only excitement would be the draft...again.

[nate82]

Off topic but every time someone writes DDV all I can think of is this:

 

[patrickgpe]

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/report_bucks_to_sign_brother_of_mvp_giannis_antetokounmpo/s1_12680_29458670

 

2 years / 3MM is a small price to pay if this makes Giannis's decision next summer easier, also helps fill out the roster on the cheap. now give me Vince and lets get to camp!.

 

 

Yeah, if it makes Giannis happy, then obviously the roster spot and everything else is secondary. It just seems kinda stupid. Who knows if the couple good games Wood had will ever amount to anything, but this is basically just a wasted roster spot. And again, like you said, if it helps Giannis decide to stay next year, small price to pay. I was just hoping for another solid vet who had yet to sign.

 

Guy is 2 years older than giannis, and averages 4 ppg and 2 rpg in the Greek league. Obviously not an NBA player, but I’m fine with it as long as another vet is signed

[OnTheBlack]

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/report_bucks_to_sign_brother_of_mvp_giannis_antetokounmpo/s1_12680_29458670

 

2 years / 3MM is a small price to pay if this makes Giannis's decision next summer easier, also helps fill out the roster on the cheap. now give me Vince and lets get to camp!.

 

 

Yeah, if it makes Giannis happy, then obviously the roster spot and everything else is secondary. It just seems kinda stupid. Who knows if the couple good games Wood had will ever amount to anything, but this is basically just a wasted roster spot. And again, like you said, if it helps Giannis decide to stay next year, small price to pay. I was just hoping for another solid vet who had yet to sign.

 

Guy is 2 years older than giannis, and averages 4 ppg and 2 rpg in the Greek league. Obviously not an NBA player, but I’m fine with it as long as another vet is signed

 

Yeah, I was hoping we'd sign him when he was entering the draft partially in the hopes that he'd be a better player, but also because I hoped it help Giannis stick around.

 

Now it just seems like roster spots are so much more important, but again, they're really irrelevant if you don't have Giannis. So...

[coolhandluke121]

 

 

 

Ahh..I thought it basically just a way to allow a team to add salary. So no way you can use it to add a guy like Beal if by chance Washington wanted to just rid themselves of his salary. You'd be limited just to plays who's salaries are close enough to the TPE? So can you tell me why the TPE is around 12 million? How did they arrive at that number?

 

You can acquire multiple guys for the TPE, just like you could have acquired multiple players from Indiana in the Brogdon deal - up to the amount of matching salary you're allowed to take in the deal.

 

As far as I know, exact terms of Brogdon's deal aren't out yet, so I'm not 100% sure on all the calculations. But regardless of his exact salary next year, Brogdon is definitely a "BYC" player (huge raise, Bird Rights are salary cap exceptions for keeping your players, the NBA got tired of it being a loophole for signing and trading them) so the Bucks would only allowed to take back half his starting salary in the trade. But there's a margin of error of roughly +/- 25%, so I assume his starting salary is about $19m and 125% of half of that is about $12m.

[HiAndTight]

 

 

 

Ahh..I thought it basically just a way to allow a team to add salary. So no way you can use it to add a guy like Beal if by chance Washington wanted to just rid themselves of his salary. You'd be limited just to plays who's salaries are close enough to the TPE? So can you tell me why the TPE is around 12 million? How did they arrive at that number?

 

You can acquire multiple guys for the TPE, just like you could have acquired multiple players from Indiana in the Brogdon deal - up to the amount of matching salary you're allowed to take in the deal.

 

As far as I know, exact terms of Brogdon's deal aren't out yet, so I'm not 100% sure on all the calculations. But regardless of his exact salary next year, Brogdon is definitely a "BYC" player (huge raise, Bird Rights are salary cap exceptions for keeping your players, the NBA got tired of it being a loophole for signing and trading them) so the Bucks would only allowed to take back half his starting salary in the trade. But there's a margin of error of roughly +/- 25%, so I assume his starting salary is about $19m and 125% of half of that is about $12m.

 

Ok, assuming it's 12 million. We can trade for a guy making ~15 million. We can't do anything else? Include cash or any other players? So basically the only thing we can do is taking a guy another team wants to dump essentially?

[jjfanec]

Kawhi to the clippers is huge for the Bucks. The East is now wide open with the 76ers and bucks as the favorites. Pacers, Celtics are in there as well. Nets probably a year away waiting for durant

[patrickgpe]

Besides Boston, I don’t see much resistance in the east for them. From what I read kwahi had the clippers and raptors trying to get George, which is why he signed and waited so long before doing so. Clipppers gave up a ton, but if that’s what you have to do, you do it.

[jjfanec]

Besides Boston, I don’t see much resistance in the east for them. From what I read kwahi had the clippers and raptors trying to get George, which is why he signed and waited so long before doing so. Clipppers gave up a ton, but if that’s what you have to do, you do it.

 

I think you are seriously underestimating the 76ers. Embiid, Simmons, Horford, Richardson and Harris is a very good starting 5. They just need depth. I could be missing some guys they have

[homer]

It’s just one summer league game, but the bucks may have something in jock Landale and Dalton Hommes, both fill a position of need. May be good choices for 2 way contracts, . Fletcher Magee was the player I was excited to see but he was a DNP..

 

Hommes has a really interesting backstory. Missed his junior and senior years of high school due to injury, walked on at some rinky dink school, transferred to a D2 university and won national player of the year as a junior. He's a longshot, but a 6'8" three point gunner would be great.

 

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/26431194/division-ii-daulton-hommes-declaring-nba-draft

[wallus]

Time to pick up Gallo from OKC.

[nate82]

Not really supporting this but there are some rumors the Bucks are interested in Westbrook.

 

Possible deal would be Bledsoe, Irsan/Leuer, and draft picks to the Thunder for Westbrook.

 

I think this would be a horrible deal as Bledsoe is similar to Westbrook in terms of how they score. Westbrook is a better scorer but Bledsoe is by far a superior defender.

 

I can see why this would be appealing to the Bucks front office but Beal would be a better match.

[rickh150]

Not really supporting this but there are some rumors the Bucks are interested in Westbrook.

 

Possible deal would be Bledsoe, Irsan/Leuer, and draft picks to the Thunder for Westbrook.

 

I think this would be a horrible deal as Bledsoe is similar to Westbrook in terms of how they score. Westbrook is a better scorer but Bledsoe is by far a superior defender.

 

I can see why this would be appealing to the Bucks front office but Beal would be a better match.

 

Sadly, it is all about this.... does Gianni's like Westbrook? If it helps keep 34 around long term, probably do it... even though I don't like Westbrook much.

[Jenkins5]

Westbrook’s contract is also not friendly. Believe it’s like 36 mil this year, 41 mil, 43 mil, & 46 mil... those aren’t exact but ballparks. That is a lot to absorb... even with trading Bledsoe. That’s problem one. Problem 2, we don’t have much for draft capital. We got some back for Brogdon but still not much to work with. Lastly, Westbrook wants the ball at a very high usage rate. Giannis works at a high usage rate. Both are at best when ball is in their hands. KD could play off it better since guy can shot with the best of them but Giannis has to attack to get his points. Westbrook Shot 6 3s a game while hitting only 29% of them. Like Giannis he needs to attack to score.

 

Really Russ isn’t too different from the way Bledsoe scores except Bledsoe doesn’t require the usage Westbrook wants. Bledsoe knows his role on team which means get ball to Giannis & play off him. Not sold on Westbrook & Giannis thriving together. It could work out or it could fail miserably.

 

No doubt though that Bucks instantly end all doubts or debates who is the most elite team in East. If Giannis & Westbrook can coexist with Middleton & Lopez to stretch floor.... feel bad for rest of East.

[nate82]

Westbrook’s contract is also not friendly. Believe it’s like 36 mil this year, 41 mil, 43 mil, & 46 mil... those aren’t exact but ballparks. That is a lot to absorb... even with trading Bledsoe. That’s problem one. Problem 2, we don’t have much for draft capital. We got some back for Brogdon but still not much to work with. Lastly, Westbrook wants the ball at a very high usage rate. Giannis works at a high usage rate. Both are at best when ball is in their hands. KD could play off it better since guy can shot with the best of them but Giannis has to attack to get his points. Westbrook Shot 6 3s a game while hitting only 29% of them. Like Giannis he needs to attack to score.

 

Really Russ isn’t too different from the way Bledsoe scores except Bledsoe doesn’t require the usage Westbrook wants. Bledsoe knows his role on team which means get ball to Giannis & play off him. Not sold on Westbrook & Giannis thriving together. It could work out or it could fail miserably.

 

No doubt though that Bucks instantly end all doubts or debates who is the most elite team in East. If Giannis & Westbrook can coexist with Middleton & Lopez to stretch floor.... feel bad for rest of East.

 

My thoughts exactly except I don't think Westbrook will command all that much more than what is rumored to be a package for Westbrook. If the Thunder want to wait until the trade deadline maybe the Knicks will step in and give them the picks that they would want. The only other team that seems intriguing for the Thunder would be Minnesota who could offer Wiggins and a couple of draft picks for Westbrook.

 

I do agree Bledsoe is a better option with Giannis and Middleton. I would really prefer Beal but I am not sure how the Bucks could get him without trading Bledsoe to another team. Ideally a Hill, Beal, Middleton, Giannis and Lopez would be pretty freaking awesome. Depth wise the Bucks would be hurting but I am not sure there is a team in the East that could stop that starting 5. The Nets come close but Middleton and Lopez become the deciding factor in a 7-game series.

[sveumrules]

Pair Giannis up with the most ball dominant inefficient chucker in the league on a contract that makes Middleton's look like a bargain?

 

Pass.

[patrickgpe]

Besides Boston, I don’t see much resistance in the east for them. From what I read kwahi had the clippers and raptors trying to get George, which is why he signed and waited so long before doing so. Clipppers gave up a ton, but if that’s what you have to do, you do it.

 

I think you are seriously underestimating the 76ers. Embiid, Simmons, Horford, Richardson and Harris is a very good starting 5. They just need depth. I could be missing some guys they have

yes definitely a threat

[nodakfan17]

I’m really excited about the Bucks as presently constructed. I loved the additions of Robin Lopez and Wes Matthews and wouldn’t mind seeing more moves like that. I want to see Giannis win a championship as an alpha. If they were to come up short again next year, I’d be more open to trying something different.

[coolhandluke121]

 

Ok, assuming it's 12 million. We can trade for a guy making ~15 million. We can't do anything else? Include cash or any other players? So basically the only thing we can do is taking a guy another team wants to dump essentially?

 

I believe the $12m already account for the plus or minus 25% of half of Brogdon's salary, so it's a hard cap on the TPE. In other words, I believe ~$9.5m is half of Brogdon's salary and $12m is ~125% of that.

 

In general you can't just trade cash in the NBA, except when buying picks. There may be a few other rare exceptions I'm forgetting, but it's not like baseball.

 

You definitely can't include any other players. But I'm almost certain you can acquire more than one player from another team. For example, you can take a player making $7m and a player making $4m from a team. You have to resolve it all at once though.

 

Yes, it's essentially a dump. And that Pacers pick is not likely to be good, so the return on the Brogdon deal isn't great. And they have to keep a cap hold on Brogdon to keep the TPE, so it's not as much flexibility as you might think. They barely fit their other offers under the cap, and reportedly there's a chance they might not get the TPE at all. I think we're waiting to see if Hill waived his $1m buyout as part of his new contract, and that determines whether they have enough cap space to keep Brogdon's cap hold and get the TPE.

 

Bottom line, as much as I'm not a big Brogdon fan, I think they cheaped out overall. I think they could have kept Brogdon's qualifying offer and matched an offer after the fact. I think it's pretty suspicious that they're still very likely to be under the tax threshold for the next 2 years. I don't believe it was necessary at all.

 

It's neither here nor there anymore, but I also would have rather had Brogdon and Mirotic than Khris. I would take Khris over Brogdon obviously, but not over Brogdon and Mirotic. But they did reasonably well this off season. I'm really relieved they got Hill for the equivalent of the MLE.