The Chris Archer trade revisited

[adambr2]

I can't overstate how much the Pirates and Neil Huntington really did us and everyone else in the division a huge favor by doing the Chris Archer trade for some reason at last year's deadline. If they hadn't, this is likely a 4 horse race in the Central rather than a 3.

 

Glasnow has finally turned the corner and turned into the ace that Archer hasn't been for years. He's out for awhile right now, but he was having a Cy Young caliber season and certainly has the ability to continue that. Oh, the Rays have him for 6 more years.

 

Austin Meadows is really good. His OPS is something absurd in the 1.000+ Christian Yelich range. He's an OBP machine, and he hits for power. It's not a fluke, he was a top 10 pick and top prospect. He's 24.

 

I don't know what Shane Baz is up to. It really doesn't matter, this trade was a complete and total robbery by the Rays, and that says something to be able to judge the trade that definitively only 9 months later.

[sveumrules]

There's also a strong possibility that the main reason Glasnow turned the corner in the first place was because he got out of Pittsburgh (where they have a reputation for trying to fit all their pitchers in the same box) & went to Tampa (one of the most forward thinking organizations that encourages pitchers to pitch to their individual strengths).

 

Definitely glad it was Pittsburgh that finally ponied up for Archer & not us.

[Eye Black]

I will forever believe the Pirates mid-July five game sweep of the Brewers convinced them they were something they simply weren’t. That series moved them to just one game below .500 heading into the All Star Break and seemingly within striking distance for a wild card spot (albeit still 5.5 games out of the wild card). If for instance the Pirates would have instead gone 2-3 in that series I don’t think they would have made the Archer trade. I think they got caught up with moving onto the periphery of the playoff picture.

[torts]

that archer deal is... not going over well in pittsburgh, even though half the town was trying to run glassnow out of town prior to the trade

[Eye Black]

A good recap on the trade by Dan Szymborski of FanGraphs, For the Pirates, Archer Trade Not Looking Sterling

[PeaveyFury]

The really funny thing about the trade (funny as in both oddly interesting, and hilarious if you're not a Pirates fan) is that when they made the move, they were still 3.5 back from the 2nd wildcard, and that was after a predictably unsustainable 15-4 stretch in July that even got them to that point. They then went 5-10 over their next 15 (including 1-4 right after the deadline) to immediately drop from contention.

[coolhandluke121]

I will forever believe the Pirates mid-July five game sweep of the Brewers convinced them they were something they simply weren’t.

 

4-dimensional chess. Lose to the Pirates on purpose so they mortgage their future, leaving one less threat in the Central to contend with for years to come.

[homer]

I will forever believe the Pirates mid-July five game sweep of the Brewers convinced them they were something they simply weren’t.

 

4-dimensional chess. Lose to the Pirates on purpose so they mortgage their future, leaving one less threat in the Central to contend with for years to come.

 

 

Great minds and what not....

 

viewtopic.php?p=1139097#p1139097

[KeithStone53151]

Meadows looks like pre 2nd half 2018 Yelich honestly. So similar, I wouldn't be surprised if he eventually learned how to hit more HR like Yelich and become a top 10 player in the league. This was such a dreadful trade, I'm so glad they won the bidding for Archer.

[TURBO]

There were a LOT of people here that wanted Archer, even at an excessive cost to our farm. A LOT of PEOPLE!

 

SO HAPPY we did not go that route.

[homer]

There were a LOT of people here that wanted Archer, even at an excessive cost to our farm. A LOT of PEOPLE!

 

SO HAPPY we did not go that route.

 

nearly everyone here thought the Pirates gave up way too much. Also, when a thread asked if anyone was willing to give up Hiura to get Archer the first 19 responses ranged from "No" to "Absolutely not".

 

So yes, some people wanted Archer. No, they weren't willing to empty the farm for him.

[Oxy]

I wanted Archer for the right price--No arms nor Hiura going back to TBR. That was also before Chacin and Miley had established themselves and well before we picked up Gio.

 

I do like comparing and contrasting the Yelich deal and the Archer deal. Yelich was younger, controlled for longer, safer, and was trending upward and we still got him for cheaper than Archer.

[jerichoholicninja]

Seems like everyone in Pittsburgh and sports media wanted the Pirates to do something because they were being cheap and not trying to win and all that blah blah. Well, they did. And it is very likely going to fail miserably and set the organization back a few years. I hope all those people are happy now.

[torts]

Seems like everyone in Pittsburgh and sports media wanted the Pirates to do something because they were being cheap and not trying to win and all that blah blah. Well, they did. And it is very likely going to fail miserably and set the organization back a few years. I hope all those people are happy now.

 

they're not

[danzig6767]

A good recap on the trade by Dan Szymborski of FanGraphs, For the Pirates, Archer Trade Not Looking Sterling

Hidden in that article was how good former-Brewer Jordan Lyles has started out the season for the Pirates. Granted, it's only 38 innings, but he did throw hard and Pittsburgh got him for pretty much nothing.

[Roderick]

A good recap on the trade by Dan Szymborski of FanGraphs, For the Pirates, Archer Trade Not Looking Sterling

Hidden in that article was how good former-Brewer Jordan Lyles has started out the season for the Pirates. Granted, it's only 38 innings, but he did throw hard and Pittsburgh got him for pretty much nothing.

 

I guess at the $3.5M option, the Brewers had to pay for him, I wouldn't have done it last fall. But, for the $2M the Pirates paid, I would have done that. Nice insurance.

[TURBO]

There were a LOT of people here that wanted Archer, even at an excessive cost to our farm. A LOT of PEOPLE!

 

SO HAPPY we did not go that route.

 

nearly everyone here thought the Pirates gave up way too much. Also, when a thread asked if anyone was willing to give up Hiura to get Archer the first 19 responses ranged from "No" to "Absolutely not".

 

So yes, some people wanted Archer. No, they weren't willing to empty the farm for him.

 

 

I said nothing about Hiura.

 

I said nothing about emptying the farm, but instead said an "excessive cost to our farm." That is far from "emptying" it.

 

Are you saying that no one here was on board with acquiring Archer? Maybe a visit to the "Archer" general thread would dispel that notion.

[coolhandluke121]

I will forever believe the Pirates mid-July five game sweep of the Brewers convinced them they were something they simply weren’t.

 

4-dimensional chess. Lose to the Pirates on purpose so they mortgage their future, leaving one less threat in the Central to contend with for years to come.

 

 

Great minds and what not....

 

viewtopic.php?p=1139097#p1139097

 

Word. My post right above that aged just fine too. I'm sure one could find similar stuff from the "sustainable success" crowd in the Darvish free agent thread. Unfortunately, the Cubs have a much bigger margin of error.

[homer]

There were a LOT of people here that wanted Archer, even at an excessive cost to our farm. A LOT of PEOPLE!

 

SO HAPPY we did not go that route.

 

nearly everyone here thought the Pirates gave up way too much. Also, when a thread asked if anyone was willing to give up Hiura to get Archer the first 19 responses ranged from "No" to "Absolutely not".

 

So yes, some people wanted Archer. No, they weren't willing to empty the farm for him.

 

 

I said nothing about Hiura.

 

I said nothing about emptying the farm, but instead said an "excessive cost to our farm." That is far from "emptying" it.

 

Are you saying that no one here was on board with acquiring Archer? Maybe a visit to the "Archer" general thread would dispel that notion.

 

As I mentioned, people wanted Archer. Nearly everyone thought the Pirates gave up way too much to get him.

[adambr2]

There were a LOT of people here that wanted Archer, even at an excessive cost to our farm. A LOT of PEOPLE!

 

SO HAPPY we did not go that route.

 

Yes, there were but I don't think anyone was on board with giving up Hiura and as Homer said it was generally agreed the Pirates gave up way too much.

 

The flip side of this is that many people thought we gave up way too much for Yelich. I think there were a lot more red flags with Archer but it still can be worthwhile at times to use your farm for proven cost controlled talent.

[TURBO]

Again, I never mentioned Hiura.

 

I haven't looked at that Archer thread, but I wouldn't be shocked if there were in fact some that said they would have given up Hiura though. It would be interesting to read through that thread.

 

I admit I was unhappy with the Yelich trade. I really wanted to keep Diaz and Harrison, but I was completely wrong.

[NYChez]

The legend continues.