Keston Hiura called up, Shaw optioned

[MrTPlush]

Is there anything that quantifies the salary difference between non-Super 2s and Super-2s in a players 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th seasons?

 

$10-$15mil or about 30% more are numbers I have seen before. Maybe the money figure is a little outdated and needs slight inflation adjustment. It isn't crazy money and that is why I question the Brewers making this move for that. Is a team competing really worried about $7mil more on a payroll nearly 6 years away? I really think that is a load of BS. Because most of the money from Super-Two is the final year of arby.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

This comes down to Stearns and the Brewers simply deciding that Shaw wasn't going to lose his spot on the roster due to injury. And after performing as arguably the team's MVP in 2017, then following it up with another standout season last year, that decision is admirable in my eyes. I truly think this was the plan all along.

 

But ... Shaw has to produce now. No more excuses. He's healthy, and the Brewers did him a solid by not manipulating the system by leaving a healthy player down in AAA on a "rehab assignment". I expect Shaw to play pretty much every day for the next 1 1/2 to 2 weeks. If he doesn't produce, I fully expect to see him officially optioned to AAA, and Hiura handed the keys to 2B on a permanent basis.

[pacopete4]

I'm going to remember this thread if/when Shaw is terrible and we miss the playoffs by 1 or 2 games. He had more time he could have spent in AAA including his option. This move didn't need to happen yet.

 

Let me guess. You’re hoping this happens too? That way you can get on a forum and tell the world I told ya so?!! You are the one exaggerating things. This situation will play itself out. It will be okay, I promise.

[BillScottCanRake]

Thanks TPlush. I think this is largely about making sure Hiura isn't a Super-2 and Shaw is just the excuse so Stearns can plausibly lie about it, and those numbers seem to make the service time theory realistic.

 

EDIT: I think 7 million by itself isn't a big deal by itself, but the addition of 7 million to a future payroll may be. Historically the Brewers have not been good enough often enough to spend to whatever limit their revenue sets, so when they played this game they did so because they were cheap. Now that they are competitive and hoping to stay that way, having an extra 5-10 million to spend could be huge. It may not pay an entire years salary for a player, but it could mean the ability to spend 20 million for a player instead of 10 or 15.

[coolhandluke121]

There's a special place in hell right next to Hitler for whoever made this decision.

 

/Blue-ish font... I think? Go Travis! (You and your fat ass!)

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Thanks TPlush. I think this is largel about making sure Hiura isn't a Super-2 and Shaw is just the excuse so Stearns can plausibly lie about it, and those numbers seem to make the service time theory realistic.

 

I don't know about that. Why not just call up Saladino as Shaw's injury replacement then?

[Bulldogboy]

The way that (most) have responded to this news is why I'm such an avid fan of this forum. Quite a bit of disappointment, but also mostly measured optimism and understanding. This is a group of fans who see the big picture.

 

Counter this with Brewers Twitter, which is an absolute train wreck right now.

Agreed

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

There's a special place in hell right next to Hitler for whoever made this decision.

 

/Blue-ish font... I think? Go Travis! (You and your fat ass!)

 

This made me nearly spit out my coffee. You do you, Luke

[JohnBriggs12]

Why not put Thames on waivers. If someone bites which I'm sure they would you save around 3 million this season. Use the money to try and fish a free agent pitcher. Shaw at first base with Aguillar against lefties is fine with me.

 

Because he has an 850 OPS.

Him and Shaw cancel each other out. The question is if Shaw has to play would you rather have Hirua or the Thames /Aguillar platoon. Sign me up for Hirua every day.

 

Right now, I'd rather Perez be in the platoon at 1B than Aguilar, be it with Thames or Shaw. The big reason Aguilar slumping was hurting the team so much was that other than Braun, what RH punch did they have? Hiura, Arcia, and Perez have all helped balance things out by swinging a good bat. Hence not as much critical need for Aguilar, unless he turns back into his early 2018 version. Now no Hiura for the time being and still a lost Aguilar and Shaw.

[DHonks]

This comes down to Stearns and the Brewers simply deciding that Shaw wasn't going to lose his spot on the roster due to injury. And after performing as arguably the team's MVP in 2017, then following it up with another standout season last year, that decision is admirable in my eyes. I truly think this was the plan all along.

 

But ... Shaw has to produce now. No more excuses. He's healthy, and the Brewers did him a solid by not manipulating the system by leaving a healthy player down in AAA on a "rehab assignment". I expect Shaw to play pretty much every day for the next 1 1/2 to 2 weeks. If he doesn't produce, I fully expect to see him officially optioned to AAA, and Hiura handed the keys to 2B on a permanent basis.

 

I feel like the Brewers felt as though Hiura had things to work on however the Shaw injury necessitated bringing him up to the majors before they felt he was fully ready to be handed the reins. He did very well offensively but he also showed things to work on especially with throwing accuracy and poor foot work. Hopefully the Brewers clearly communicated when he was promoted that this was an opportunity to experience the big leagues and use it as a learning experience for when he returns to the minors.

[Bulldogboy]

Without Hirua this team is much less scary against left handed pitching again. Aguillar has done nothing and Braun still needs days off. Perez probably needs ab against them to make up the slack. Thank God we don't have the Cubs this week.

[BillScottCanRake]

Thanks TPlush. I think this is largel about making sure Hiura isn't a Super-2 and Shaw is just the excuse so Stearns can plausibly lie about it, and those numbers seem to make the service time theory realistic.

 

I don't know about that. Why not just call up Saladino as Shaw's injury replacement then?

 

I think the optics of the move are better if this is indeed about service time if they recall Shaw. I am not saying I would do that, or it's the right move, but if you want to avoid Super 2 and have plausible deniability I think you need to recall Shaw and not Salandino.

[buckybrewer232]

Strongly disagree with this move. First of all, sending Hiura down is NOT the only way to keep Thames, Aguilar, and Shaw. Shaw has options left and has done nothing in AAA to show that he has figured things out. Why rush this move? Why not make Shaw earn his way back or Aguilar completely play himself out? Why penalize the one guy who is performing?

 

If you absolutely have to bring Shaw up right now, why not send a pitcher down and figure it out for the next week? Now when we play at Houston next week and their is an extra spot in the lineup for the DH, Hiura isn't eligible to come back up yet.

 

Moves like this just tick me off.

[tmwiese55]

Thanks TPlush. I think this is largel about making sure Hiura isn't a Super-2 and Shaw is just the excuse so Stearns can plausibly lie about it, and those numbers seem to make the service time theory realistic.

 

I don't know about that. Why not just call up Saladino as Shaw's injury replacement then?

 

I think the optics of the move are better if this is indeed about service time if they recall Shaw. I am not saying I would do that, or it's the right move, but if you want to avoid Super 2 and have plausible deniability I think you need to recall Shaw and not Salandino.

 

He meant originally. Why bring up Keston at all if they were so worried about super 2, they've had just brought up Saladino two weeks ago instead.

 

I generally agree. If they were so worried about Super 2 he wouldn't have come up at all.

[TURBO]

Total eyeroll to this move. Send down one of your few hitters who's been doing well to bring back a guy who has been just about your worst hitter all year.

 

This.

 

People can come up with every excuse in the book to justify this move, but we just sent down a hitter that has helped us win games for a hitter who probably cost us games when he wasn't on the DL.

 

This move stinks.

 

Hiura has made this team better offensively, and it is highly doubtful that his defense is any worse than Shaw/Moose at 2B.

 

This is a backwards move. Just stupid.

[xisxisxis]

If they were so worried about Super 2 he wouldn't have come up at all.

 

It wouldn't matter at all if there intention was only to have Keston in the majors while Shaw was on the DL. This could have been their plan all along no matter what the results were at the MLB level. How do we know that the Brewers weren't clear with Keston from the beginning that this was only a temporary promotion?

 

Edit: I believe the new title of the thread is misleading. Shaw was never optioned so he can't be recalled. He simply was activated from the IL.

[pacopete4]

At least he now has time to get his Tommy John done.

[KeithStone53151]

Total eyeroll to this move. Send down one of your few hitters who's been doing well to bring back a guy who has been just about your worst hitter all year.

 

This.

 

People can come up with every excuse in the book to justify this move, but we just sent down a hitter that has helped us win games for a hitter who probably cost us games when he wasn't on the DL.

 

This move stinks.

 

Hiura has made this team better offensively, and it is highly doubtful that his defense is any worse than Shaw/Moose at 2B.

 

This is a backwards move. Just stupid.

 

+1. And Hiura will only get better with more reps at the MLB level, especially considering he's 22.

[homer]

Question: how many options do you get and when does the clock on those start? So Shaw has "an option" left correct? Or is it two? Did Hiura use an option after this latest move? So how many does he have? I usually only start caring about options when a guy is a few years into his career.

[homer]

 

Edit: I believe the new title of the thread is misleading. Shaw was never optioned so he can't be recalled. He simply was activated from the IL.

 

Good catch. Edited

[tmwiese55]

If they were so worried about Super 2 he wouldn't have come up at all.

 

It wouldn't matter at all if there intention was only to have Keston in the majors while Shaw was on the DL. This could have been their plan all along no matter what the results were at the MLB level. How do we know that the Brewers weren't clear with Keston from the beginning that this was only a temporary promotion?

 

I bet they were clear of that being the plan, but it doesn't mean it was because of a few mil 6 years from now. Reasons its risky would be because Shaw could've got legit injured more. Someone else could get injured that necessitates Keston to stay up (say Moose broke his hand Saturday like almost happened). Huira could've hit .450 with no errors so you just can't send down. It risks the fan reaction they're getting now. Tons of stuff like that could've happened that risked the status if that's what they're so concerned with. And again it's a few mil several years from now, if he's good I'm sure their plan is to sign to an early extension anyway to avoid all that.

 

I generally agree they know the dates and this was the plan and the whole time and they stuck to it, I'm just saying if all they cared about was super 2 here(as some implied) then they wouldn't have even bothered bringing him up until after the date at all. I think it's simply them sticking to the plan and being loyal to Shaw. I disagree with it as I'd have waited another week to see if Shaw actually hit in AAA and re-assessed, but I think it's loyalty and them not being able to option Jesus that lead to this.

[BillScottCanRake]

He meant originally. Why bring up Keston at all if they were so worried about super 2, they've had just brought up Saladino two weeks ago instead.

 

I generally agree. If they were so worried about Super 2 he wouldn't have come up at all.

 

I see what he (and you) meant.

 

I don't have a good counter to your position other than Stearns thought Hiura would probably out perform Saladino. This allowed the Brewers to get Hiura some exposure before recalling him permanently later.

 

I am willing to admit that's highly speculative and could well be wrong, but I also dont think it is X-Files out there.

[TURBO]

Hiura has started to figure out MLB pitching, and he was hitting, period. Now, we send him down, losing all that time he gained by getting a look at MLB pitching.

 

Next time we bring him up, we have taken him out of his groove, and he has to start all over again.

 

I truly believe that every game counts, every single game, and we need to realize that.

 

I'll get over this move, but it is just completely asinine. Take one of, if not our hottest hitter out of our line-up and add a guy who is struggling big time, and has been all season long.

 

It is juts baffling to me.

[BillScottCanRake]

Question: how many options do you get and when does the clock on those start? So Shaw has "an option" left correct? Or is it two? Did Hiura use an option after this latest move? So how many does he have? I usually only start caring about options when a guy is a few years into his career.

 

You get 3 option years and they usually start after your 3rd year in the organization. Occasionally some players will get a 4th option year. Anytime a player is optioned to the minors they use one of their 3 options. Keep in mind once a player is optioned during a year they can bounce back and forth without using an additional options.

 

Hiura should have 2 options left, the same as Shaw, as he was on a rehab assignment and wasn't optioned.

[timpep]

Why not put Thames on waivers. If someone bites which I'm sure they would you save around 3 million this season. Use the money to try and fish a free agent pitcher. Shaw at first base with Aguillar against lefties is fine with me.

 

Thames is actually playing very well. I think that's a decent reason not to put him on waivers....