Eastern Conference Finals: Milwaukee Bucks vs Toronto Raptors

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

 

FWIW, you point out way too often how you can detect body fat in athletes that nobody else can. It's a little weird.

 

Well I think it's weird that people can't see it, and that they argue about it and take exception to my observations. Brogdon and especially Khris both need to trim down a little. Toronto's small ball lineups ran circles around the Bucks, and nobody will ever convince me that's not part of the reason why. Given Brogdon the starting SF job if Khris walks and he's fine, but losing 10 pounds will make a big difference in his defense as a guard.

 

 

Wait a second, now Khris Middleton is overweight?

 

https://cdn-s3.si.com/s3fs-public/2018/09/09/malcolm_brogdon_bucks_embed_.jpg

 

That's Brogdon during the season.

 

 

This is Khris Middleton;

 

https://sixerswire.files.wordpress.com/2018/07/khrismiddleton.jpg?w=1000&h=583

 

I'm not sure what you're looking at if you think Middleton "especially" has to trim down. Brogdon could try to get leaner. As I said, he's pretty thick. Not fat at all, but he's thick. He could try lifting less just try dropping a few pounds. But Middleton is skinny. That one is just strange to me.

 

I know this is the Bucks thread, but apparently Travis Shaw is following the Jesus Aguilar diet.

[HiAndTight]

 

All he said was "I might shed a little weight". That could mean "I don't want as much stress on my flat feet". If he loses 5 or 10 pounds it will not impact his quickness.

 

Trimming down definitely helps quickness. And just as importantly, you don't get tired as quickly if you're carrying less weight. Being able to be quick in short bursts is no more important than being able to maintain top speed for long periods of time chasing a guy like Norman Powell or Fred Van Vleet through screens.

 

And even if he is just doing for his feet, that just proves my point about how his previous injuries are a concern moving forward, another point that got me some excessively incredulous replies despite being supported by known facts and, now, by Brogdon's own words.

 

 

Now you're just completely putting words into Brogdon's mouth. HE didn't say it was to prevent injuries, someone else speculated that MIGHT be a reason why. And you cited a foot injury from 2012 years when you brought this up. He happened to suffer another totally, completely different and unrelated injury after you said that. That doesn't make you saying that the foot injury he suffered while at UVA was a reason why it was becoming so urgent that we trade him any more valid.

 

Here are the facts. He broke a bone in 2012 in his left foot. He suffered a soft muscle injury in 2019 to his right foot. Then when pushed by reporters to ask what he wanted to accomplish in the off-season, he said, "get better at everything, come back in great shape, I MIGHT shed a few pounds."

 

You've now taken that little statement and you're saying that HE has somehow agreed with what you've said.

 

And losing weight does not automatically make you quicker. If you're a fat guy it will. He is not anywhere near fat. He's not even overweight. I never thought I'd have to say this, but he's got muscle definition on his stomach.

 

If there was ANY question about his endurance, it should have been answered when he missed roughly 2 months of game time and came back and defended Kawhi and showed no rust and no signs of fatigue. You talked about Hill(A LOT). He played fewer minutes per game than Brogdon and had a much-much easier defensive assignment. So I'm just failing to see any substance behind this argument that Brogdon was out of shape other than him saying among many other things he "might" shed a "little" weight this off-season.

[coolhandluke121]

 

I know this is the Bucks thread, but apparently Travis Shaw is following the Jesus Aguilar diet.

 

I have no problem with this kind of post as long as you own it if and when Shaw admits he wasn't in the best of shape this year. Unfortunately, nobody ever does own it, even though my suspicions in these things usually prove correct. Just look at this thread as an example, unless you're going to argue that Brogdon literally saying he wants to lose weight doesn't support my mid season assertion that he should lose weight, an assertion that was derided in much the same fashion you are doing with Shaw. Personally I think it is silly to completely dismiss the possibility, but carry on.

[homer]

 

All he said was "I might shed a little weight". That could mean "I don't want as much stress on my flat feet". If he loses 5 or 10 pounds it will not impact his quickness.

 

Trimming down definitely helps quickness. And just as importantly, you don't get tired as quickly if you're carrying less weight. Being able to be quick in short bursts is no more important than being able to maintain top speed for long periods of time chasing a guy like Norman Powell or Fred Van Vleet through screens.

 

And even if he is just doing for his feet, that just proves my point about how his previous injuries are a concern moving forward, another point that got me some excessively incredulous replies despite being supported by known facts and, now, by Brogdon's own words.

 

Losing 5 -10 pounds will not improve an NBA guard's quickness to the point where anyone would notice or it would improve his game one iota. He might be .001 seconds better on a three cone drill but I'm guessing it wouldn't even help that much. Losing pounds? Maybe but even then you better hope you aren't losing quick twitch muscle in the process.

 

Again, his exact words were "I might shed a little weight" which was part of a list of things he was going to do in the off season. He didn't say "I have to lose weight" or "I am going to lose weight" he said "I might shed a little weight". But you make it sound like he's joining Jenny Craig.

[tmwiese55]

The last time this was argued I posted articles after LBJ, Melo and others lost weight and their comments on it after and how much it helped with speed, stamina, wear and tear on their knees, etc. And it's not like anyone would've called them overweight before either.

[homer]

The last time this was argued I posted articles after LBJ, Melo and others lost weight and their comments on it after and how much it helped with speed, stamina, wear and tear on their knees, etc.

 

Losing a small amount of your total mass won't in and of itself make you quicker. It could be the workout they do to lose the weight but simply going vegan and losing 10 pounds on a 220 lbs body won't result in more quickness. Or if it does it's such a small amount as to not be noticeable.

 

I am not saying losing weight is a bad thing. Having less mass obviously puts less stress on your joints. But usually the weight loss is due to the workouts which are what is bringing the additional stamina. My guess is guys that say they are "quicker" and just able to be at peak or near peak quickness for longer stretches of time than other guys.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

Honestly it just sounds like you think every pro athlete is a fast-twitch guy who will look like Corey Maggette with a better diet. It doesn't work like that. Lots of great athletes have pretty blah bodies. There was probably no more blah athletic back than Marshall Faulk.

[coolhandluke121]

Honestly it just sounds like you think every pro athlete is a fast-twitch guy who will look like Corey Maggette with a better diet. It doesn't work like that. Lots of great athletes have pretty blah bodies. There was probably no more blah athletic back than Marshall Faulk.

 

I'm not saying it about every guy who doesn't look like Corey Maggette. Not even close. I am saying it about Khris and Malcolm, and I said I was worried about how it would affect Malcolm before he had a pretty serious 2 month lower body injury yet again this year. Does the fact that he got hurt again and then said himself he is gonna try to lose some weight this offseason not support my hypothesis at all? Really??

[coolhandluke121]

 

Van Vleet is carrying more excess pounds than Brogdon, so why is he quicker? It's so obvious, can't believe nobody can see this.

 

Because he is quicker by nature. Doesn't mean losing some of that extra weight wouldn't make FVV a quicker version of himself too. And god help us if FVV's physique and defensive ability become the standard we hold Brogdon to on the salary he's about the get.

 

I give up though. Obviously Brogdon just wants to fit into some skinny jeans and score with some hipster chicks in North Brooklyn. Couldn't possibly be that I had a valid point about his size.

[coolhandluke121]

 

 

Wait a second, now Khris Middleton is overweight?

 

https://cdn-s3.si.com/s3fs-public/2018/09/09/malcolm_brogdon_bucks_embed_.jpg

 

That's Brogdon during the season.

 

 

This is Khris Middleton;

 

https://sixerswire.files.wordpress.com/2018/07/khrismiddleton.jpg?w=1000&h=583

 

LOL. I remember someone showing me this picture of Michael Redd, as proof of the error of my ways, when I said he had bulked up too much:

 

http://www3.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Michael+Redd+USA+Basketball+Challenge+_N1aLrDCzy0l.jpg

 

Then a year later, after his first ACL tear and rehab, he finally admitted that he had often played at over 20% body fat for a few seasons. So yeah, there is about 20 pounds of extra flab there, and yeah, it is really hard for some people to see it. It's going to appear as a very thin layer of fat on any part of a basketball player that is exposed, but one good place to look is where the shoulder muscles end and the biceps begin. That gap will be noticeably less pronounced in a basketball player with 12-15% body fat or more when compared to the most fit players because of a thin layer of fat under the skin - even if the player otherwise looks like a phenomenally fit individual by normal standards.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

 

I know this is the Bucks thread, but apparently Travis Shaw is following the Jesus Aguilar diet.

 

I have no problem with this kind of post as long as you own it if and when Shaw admits he wasn't in the best of shape this year. Unfortunately, nobody ever does own it, even though my suspicions in these things usually prove correct. Just look at this thread as an example, unless you're going to argue that Brogdon literally saying he wants to lose weight doesn't support my mid season assertion that he should lose weight, an assertion that was derided in much the same fashion you are doing with Shaw. Personally I think it is silly to completely dismiss the possibility, but carry on.

 

If you think I personally don't own it when I'm wrong on something, you aren't paying attention.

[tmwiese55]

FVV is quicker than Brogdon because he's like 5 inches shorter, if not more.

[HiAndTight]

 

 

Wait a second, now Khris Middleton is overweight?

 

https://cdn-s3.si.com/s3fs-public/2018/09/09/malcolm_brogdon_bucks_embed_.jpg

 

That's Brogdon during the season.

 

 

This is Khris Middleton;

 

https://sixerswire.files.wordpress.com/2018/07/khrismiddleton.jpg?w=1000&h=583

 

LOL. I remember someone showing me this picture of Michael Redd, as proof of the error of my ways, when I said he had bulked up too much:

 

http://www3.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Michael+Redd+USA+Basketball+Challenge+_N1aLrDCzy0l.jpg

 

Then a year later, after his first ACL tear and rehab, he finally admitted that he had often played at over 20% body fat for a few seasons. So yeah, there is about 20 pounds of extra flab there, and yeah, it is really hard for some people to see it. It's going to appear as a very thin layer of fat on any part of a basketball player that is exposed, but one good place to look is where the shoulder muscles end and the biceps begin. That gap will be noticeably less pronounced in a basketball player with 12-15% body fat or more when compared to the most fit players because of a thin layer of fat under the skin - even if the player otherwise looks like a phenomenally fit individual by normal standards.

 

 

Are you honestly trying to argue that because you said something about Michael Redd...what,10 or 15 years ago before he tore his acl somehow makes you right about this?

 

There just isn't a way to seriously respond to that.

 

I also don't know who you're saying there's 20 pounds of "flab" in? There sure isn't 20 pounds in Middleton or Brogdon. Nor was there in Redd for that matter, but I'm not going back to argue about a picture of Michael Redd.

 

I mean...seriously, we're talking about Michael Redd here?

[HiAndTight]

Honestly it just sounds like you think every pro athlete is a fast-twitch guy who will look like Corey Maggette with a better diet. It doesn't work like that. Lots of great athletes have pretty blah bodies. There was probably no more blah athletic back than Marshall Faulk.

 

I'm not saying it about every guy who doesn't look like Corey Maggette. Not even close. I am saying it about Khris and Malcolm, and I said I was worried about how it would affect Malcolm before he had a pretty serious 2 month lower body injury yet again this year. Does the fact that he got hurt again and then said himself he is gonna try to lose some weight this offseason not support my hypothesis at all? Really??

 

 

It would if you were honestly representing what he actually said. But you're not. He said he was going to "get in the gym." When asked what he was going to work on specifically, he said literally everything at one point. Get in great shape, I MIGHT try to shed a little weight.

 

And to the other point, that he suffered a lower-body injury, no, that doesn't mean anything with regard to his weight. I could come up with a list about a mile long of rail-thin players like KD who suffered lower body injuries.

 

If you were talking about Embid, I'd agree with you. But you're two MAIN examples are an injury from his Freshmen year at Virgina to one foot, a broken bone, and then a TOTALLY different injury to his other foot, a soft muscleinjury.

 

But then, to make this discussion even more bizarre, you're talking about how Khris Middleton has to lose?

 

I don't know if you've actually gone to the games and looked at these guys up close, but I'm sorry, the idea that Middleton "needs" to lose weight is just not accurate in my opinion and that's the most respectful way I can put that.

 

It's almost like you think basketball players are built ONE way and when you have a guy like Brogdon who has more broad shoulders and is thicker(one of the main reasons he's capable of defending a guy like Kawhi) you just label him fat.

 

Also, 12 pct body fat, a TRUE 12 pct body fat(not like how they claim someone like Driver is 1.5 pct Body fat as that's just ridiculous) is an almost ideal pct for an athlete.

[TJseven7]

Off a blurb on Horst for what its worth.

 

“If you asked me what would be a fair deal for him (Horst), I’d say around $3 million (a year),’’ an NBA executive said. “That’s about the average salary for a GM and I think he’s regarded as an average GM.

 

Nothing to see here.

 

While Horst was elated with becoming the Bucks GM, he rankled many front office executives and their agents. Horst agreed to a paltry annual salary of $500,000, according to several NBA officials. One person who knows Horst claimed he wasn’t even paid that much. “That was insulting to every GM in our league,’’ an NBA executive said earlier this week. “It was the lowest salary for a GM in our league – by far. The next lowest (GM) was paid $1 million.’’

 

[coolhandluke121]

Me: "Brogdon would benefit from losing a few pounds."

bf.net: "You're wrong! What are you even talking about?"

Reporter: "What are you planning to do to improve this summer?"

Brogdon: "(other stuff) I'm going to try to shed some weight. (other stuff)"

bf.net: "Whatever, you're still wrong!"

 

Can't make this stuff up.

 

Claiming Redd wasn't overweight just proves that you aren't discerning enough to tell when basketball player should lose a few pounds of excess fat. Here's Redd's account of his weight problem, straight from the horse's mouth. He even admits that he never had six-pack abs in his life. Isn't it reasonable to expect a professional athlete in his prime to get there?

 

http://www.espn.com/espnmag/story?id=3593587

 

I will grant that I had the year wrong and showed the wrong picture as a result. It was a long time ago. The point stands though.

 

Nobody ever said weight is the only factor in quickness or injury risk. Saying that Fred Van Vleet has more body fat than Brogdon but is still quicker, or saying that Shaun Livingston tore up his knee even though he was extremely light and skinny, is like saying smoking is not a risk factor for lung cancer because some non-smokers get it too. It's either a profound failure of elementary logic or an attempt to be deliberately obtuse for the sake of being difficult.

 

There are countless testimonials from players about how losing a few pounds helped them get quicker and play with more energy. It should go without saying that the human body is subject to the laws of physics, even when playing basketball, but I'm saying it anyway. More mass means more force is needed to change momentum. If the mass is extra muscle, that often more than makes up for it, but even a thin layer of excess fat makes a difference. More mass also applies more force to bones and connective tissue, making it a risk factor for injuries - even though there are many other factors, including just bad luck. Brogdon's plantar fasciitis is a textbook example of a chronic overuse injury that can often be mitigated by losing a few pounds, which can make all the difference. Which is not to say that skinny people don't ever get it, or that fat people always do, but I've already corrected two similar logical fallacies and I gotta stop teaching logic for free since it's part of my livelihood.

 

Someone said Khris is an ectomorph. Exactly - that's why it's so hard to see the extra fat. You have to look for the absence of definition. Look at Richard Hamilton and Reggie Miller as examples of ectomorphs who maximized their limited physical gifts by staying extremely fit and trim. And don't just look at their physiques, but also their energy levels and how hard they worked to run guys through screens and get open off the ball. Khris would help the team a lot by doing that. Look at Durant as an example about halfway between Khris and Hamilton, who was the gold standard of fitness and conditioning for players in that mold.

 

Lastly, I just can't understand why anyone insists on having such a strong opinion about something they obviously know nothing about. It's like you don't care about the truth at all, you just want to argue for the sake of arguing. Or you don't want someone you don't like to be right about something. I hate when people get like that on message boards. It just destroys the culture. Getting the facts and the truth should be what matters and the evidence is all there.

 

"I really couldn't tell Brogdon had some weight to lose. I guess I learned something." Would that really be so hard to say? He said it himself. What more could you possibly want?

[stoutdude04]

"I really couldn't tell Brogdon had some weight to lose. I guess I learned something." Would that really be so hard to say? He said it himself. What more could you possibly want?

 

I could be wrong, but I would guess it's because people are growing tired of the, 'I can tell by looking' thats been going on a lot on these boards lately.

[coolhandluke121]

"I really couldn't tell Brogdon had some weight to lose. I guess I learned something." Would that really be so hard to say? He said it himself. What more could you possibly want?

 

I could be wrong, but I would guess it's because people are growing tired of the, 'I can tell by looking' thats been going on a lot on these boards lately.

 

What do they expect if I make an observation and they disagree with it and challenge me? Am I supposed to explain why I think it's the case - which by the way has now been confirmed by the player - or just say "oh, never mind, I guess I was hallucinating, thanks for correcting me guys!" And if I can tell by looking at him, what else am I supposed to say? It's pretty much gas-lighting to keep challenging my observation now that the player said it himself. Like I said, you really can't make this stuff up.

[coolhandluke121]

Just watched Khris's exit interview. About free agency, he acknowledged that the first time he was a free agent, he fell into the trap of not training enough because he didn't want to risk any kind of freak injury before getting a contract. I noticed that he came to camp a little out of shape in the first year of his $70m contract. Did you? If not, why do you find it so hard to stop arguing about conditioning when you obviously can't discern the difference anyway? I hold basketball players to a very high standard of fitness and conditioning. You should too.

[homer]

Me: "Brogdon would benefit from losing a few pounds."

bf.net: "You're wrong! What are you even talking about?"

Reporter: "What are you planning to do to improve this summer?"

Brogdon: "(other stuff) I'm going to try to shed some weight. (other stuff)"

bf.net: "Whatever, you're still wrong!"

 

 

At least use accurate quotes:

 

"I might shed a little weight"

 

But to put an end to this, you have vision akin to a bird of prey and can tell when a guy is a mere five pounds above his optimal weight. There, you have been validated on an anonymous sports message board. Congrats.

[HiAndTight]

Me: "Brogdon would benefit from losing a few pounds."

bf.net: "You're wrong! What are you even talking about?"

Reporter: "What are you planning to do to improve this summer?"

Brogdon: "(other stuff) I'm going to try to shed some weight. (other stuff)"

bf.net: "Whatever, you're still wrong!"

 

Can't make this stuff up.

 

Claiming Redd wasn't overweight just proves that you aren't discerning enough to tell when basketball player should lose a few pounds of excess fat. Here's Redd's account of his weight problem, straight from the horse's mouth. He even admits that he never had six-pack abs in his life. Isn't it reasonable to expect a professional athlete in his prime to get there?

 

http://www.espn.com/espnmag/story?id=3593587

 

I will grant that I had the year wrong and showed the wrong picture as a result. It was a long time ago. The point stands though.

 

Nobody ever said weight is the only factor in quickness or injury risk. Saying that Fred Van Vleet has more body fat than Brogdon but is still quicker, or saying that Shaun Livingston tore up his knee even though he was extremely light and skinny, is like saying smoking is not a risk factor for lung cancer because some non-smokers get it too. It's either a profound failure of elementary logic or an attempt to be deliberately obtuse for the sake of being difficult.

 

There are countless testimonials from players about how losing a few pounds helped them get quicker and play with more energy. It should go without saying that the human body is subject to the laws of physics, even when playing basketball, but I'm saying it anyway. More mass means more force is needed to change momentum. If the mass is extra muscle, that often more than makes up for it, but even a thin layer of excess fat makes a difference. More mass also applies more force to bones and connective tissue, making it a risk factor for injuries - even though there are many other factors, including just bad luck. Brogdon's plantar fasciitis is a textbook example of a chronic overuse injury that can often be mitigated by losing a few pounds, which can make all the difference. Which is not to say that skinny people don't ever get it, or that fat people always do, but I've already corrected two similar logical fallacies and I gotta stop teaching logic for free since it's part of my livelihood.

 

Someone said Khris is an ectomorph. Exactly - that's why it's so hard to see the extra fat. You have to look for the absence of definition. Look at Richard Hamilton and Reggie Miller as examples of ectomorphs who maximized their limited physical gifts by staying extremely fit and trim. And don't just look at their physiques, but also their energy levels and how hard they worked to run guys through screens and get open off the ball. Khris would help the team a lot by doing that. Look at Durant as an example about halfway between Khris and Hamilton, who was the gold standard of fitness and conditioning for players in that mold.

 

Lastly, I just can't understand why anyone insists on having such a strong opinion about something they obviously know nothing about. It's like you don't care about the truth at all, you just want to argue for the sake of arguing. Or you don't want someone you don't like to be right about something. I hate when people get like that on message boards. It just destroys the culture. Getting the facts and the truth should be what matters and the evidence is all there.

 

"I really couldn't tell Brogdon had some weight to lose. I guess I learned something." Would that really be so hard to say? He said it himself. What more could you possibly want?

 

 

Posting this tells me you're really only reading and hearing what you want to. I said he didn't have an extra 20 pounds of flab in the picture you posted(the one that was from the wrong year) and then said I'm not even going to argue about Michael Redd as he has nothing to do with this thread.

[coolhandluke121]

 

But to put an end to this, you have vision akin to a bird of prey and can tell when a guy is a mere five pounds above his optimal weight. There, you have been validated on an anonymous sports message board. Congrats.

 

Classy. Again, why is it so hard to just say you learned something from it?

[HiAndTight]

"I really couldn't tell Brogdon had some weight to lose. I guess I learned something." Would that really be so hard to say? He said it himself. What more could you possibly want?

 

I could be wrong, but I would guess it's because people are growing tired of the, 'I can tell by looking' thats been going on a lot on these boards lately.

 

 

That, and just the non-stop endless "I told you so" posts. Some of them so ridiculous we end up hearing someone bragging about being right about Michael Redd.

 

This is just comical to me. I can't help it, but being able to tell because of a "gap" in the muscle of the shoulder and bicep or whatever he said it was?

 

And then just taking the slightest turn of phrase to say, -see, see everyone, ignore that I told you that we had to get rid of Malcolm Brogdon immediately-but after he said he was going to get back in the gym and asked what he was going to work on, after saying LITERALLY "just everything," he said he MIGHT shed a few pounds. So that means I was right and he's out of shape! That's the reason he was able to come back after missing two months in and play 30 MPG in the playoffs while spending most of his time guarding Kawhi Leonard.

 

And now, see, Khris Middleton just said after the last time he was a FA, he fell into the trap of not training enough because he was going to be an FA and the bean pole, 23-year-old Khris Middleton really was out of shape and I totally said that as well.

 

This is such a stupid topic. I've actually done thousands of body fat tests as a coach and have had to have them done for 20 for years before that myself, you cannot tell what someone's body fat is by looking at their arms, you cannot tell by looking at the gaps of muscle(or lack thereof) in the shoulder.

 

What's not being understood here is that Brogdon COULD lose 5 pounds and also NOT be out of shape right now. Khris Middleton, that one is beyond ridiculous, so I'm not even going to touch that same as Redd. Going back 15 years to claim victory in some argument that nobody on here had with you(as far as I know) or even going back to Middleton and translating, "I was worried about getting hurt so I didn't train," as somehow furthering your argument that he's out of shape NOW, which you can tell by looking at him, or again, using the "I knew it back then," I'm not sure what the point of either of these are.

 

You are just WAY too obsessed with these guys physiques and don't seem to understand being in shape for athletes isn't about how you look. It's a fundamental lack of understanding of fitness. It's your diet, it's your workout, stretching, pretty much everything BUT how defined your arms are. There are plenty of guys who work out and who have the definition you're looking for who are in terrible shape to play a sport.

 

 

Here is what is clear. First of all, Malcom Brogdon was not demonstrably out of shape this year. 2nd, him saying he is going to work on everything and that he MIGHT shed some weight, that's up to him. If he feels better paying at a at 215 as opposed to 220, or if he just loses more weight from working on his legs more, great. It almost certainly will have zero impact on the potential he may have for further injuries. That'll be determined by the type of condition he's in, NOT something you can tell by looking at him. Hell, he was quite a bit skinnier when he hurt his other foot his freshmen year at UVA(basically thesis statement for your argument).

 

Finally, and I'd bet on this one, when everyone on the team comes back next year and says they're in "the best shape of their life," you'll use that as an example to prove that you were right this year and that Khris Middleton, Jack Sikma and Malcom Brodgon were overweight this year.

[coolhandluke121]

"I really couldn't tell Brogdon had some weight to lose. I guess I learned something." Would that really be so hard to say? He said it himself. What more could you possibly want?

 

I could be wrong, but I would guess it's because people are growing tired of the, 'I can tell by looking' thats been going on a lot on these boards lately.

 

 

That, and just the non-stop endless "I told you so" posts. Some of them so ridiculous we end up hearing someone bragging about being right about Michael Redd.

 

 

And what about the endless "I told you not so" posts in reply? Takes two to tango bro. If a comment from the player himself supporting my assertion is not evidence for you, it's hopeless to have a conversation with you.

[HiAndTight]

Off a blurb on Horst for what its worth.

 

“If you asked me what would be a fair deal for him (Horst), I’d say around $3 million (a year),’’ an NBA executive said. “That’s about the average salary for a GM and I think he’s regarded as an average GM.

 

Nothing to see here.

 

While Horst was elated with becoming the Bucks GM, he rankled many front office executives and their agents. Horst agreed to a paltry annual salary of $500,000, according to several NBA officials. One person who knows Horst claimed he wasn’t even paid that much. “That was insulting to every GM in our league,’’ an NBA executive said earlier this week. “It was the lowest salary for a GM in our league – by far. The next lowest (GM) was paid $1 million.’’

 

 

 

Ahh...instantly regret hitting the "display this post," link. The first time I've done so.

Man, you really need to move on. Some un-named source said at some un-named point in time that Hors should get paid 3 million dollars.

 

So what? You think that "anyone" could have made the Mirotic trade, and what did you say about the Henson+Delladova for Hill trade? I believe you argued that wasn't a good one either.

 

Great. This isn't the topic at hand and I'm not quite sure why you're following me around on here now to argue that Horst isn't a good GM.

 

What's more, how much time and energy are working into finding something that's NOT positive about Horst over a disagreement we had on him from weeks ago? I think he did a great job this year. I think he did an awesome job building the team, I think he made two trades that most people thought were unlikely in being able to dump Henson and Delly's contracts while not only picking up a non-guaranteed deal, thereby clearing ~20 million in cap space, but then also picking up someone who had played as well as Mirotic for next to nothing.

 

You disagree and think any GM could have done either. Ok. I get it. There's nowhere for this to go.