All-Time Brewers Team

[RollieTime]

I thought it would be fun to make an All-Time Brewers team/lineup and have discussions about some of the all-time greats to wear a Brewers uniform.

 

I filled out a lineup with guys that played at least a handful of seasons with the Brewers and played multiple seasons at the position listed for them. I did include a starting pitcher and relief pitcher for my all-time Brewers lineup.

 

3B Paul Molitor

SS Robin Yount

LF Ryan Braun

1B Prince Fielder

C Jonathan Lucroy

RF Jeromy Burnitz

CF Gorman Thomas

2B Jim Gantner

SP Ben Sheets

 

RP Rollie Fingers

[OldHeidelberg]

I would take Higuera over Sheets. Maybe Cooper over Prince?

[cesser000]

I would also take Higuera.

 

Cecil Cooper at 1B for me.

 

Additionally, I'd slot Braun over to RF and put Geoff Jenkins in LF.

 

Hopefully in 5 years or so, we can insert Keston Hiura at second.

[clancyphile]

2B: Paul Molitor

SS: Robin Yount

RF: Geoff Jenkins

LF: Ryan Braun

1B: Prince Fielder

C: Jonathan Lucroy

DH: Cecil Cooper

CF: Jeromy Burnitz

3B: Don Money

 

Bench: Ted Simmons, Carlos Gomez, Fernando Vina, Jeff Cirillo, Rob Deer

 

SP: Ted Higuera, Ben Sheets, Yovanni Gallardo, Chris Bosio, Mike Caldwell

RP: Dan Plesac, Josh Hader, Doug Jones, Jeremy Jeffress, Rollie Fingers, Jim Slaton, Chuck Crim

 

Sorry, just don't see where Jim Gantner was better than either Money, Molitor, Vina, or Cirillo at second or third. All I remember is a bunch of empty .260-..270 batting averages, and no real contributions in the box scores I read...

[Ennder]

2B Paul Molitor

SS Robin Yount

LF Ryan Braun

1B Cecil Cooper

C Jonathan Lucroy

RF Ben Oglive

CF Carlos Gomez

3B Jeff Cirillo

SP Teddy Higuera

 

RP Rollie Fingers

 

Maybe Monitor at 2B is cheating but Gantner was so mediocre I couldn't do it, the only positive I can say for him is he played a long time for one team.

[clancyphile]

2B Paul Molitor

SS Robin Yount

LF Ryan Braun

1B Cecil Cooper

C Jonathan Lucroy

RF Ben Oglive

CF Carlos Gomez

3B Jeff Cirillo

SP Teddy Higuera

 

RP Rollie Fingers

 

Maybe Monitor at 2B is cheating but Gantner was so mediocre I couldn't do it, the only positive I can say for him is he played a long time for one team.

 

Molitor twice started in the All-Star game as a second baseman... as far as I am concern, it's legit.

 

I didn't get the appeal of Lil' Sebastian in Parks and Recreation, but let me say this, the appeal of Jim Gantner makes LESS sense than the appeal of that pony.

[RollieTime]

2B: Paul Molitor

SS: Robin Yount

RF: Geoff Jenkins

LF: Ryan Braun

1B: Prince Fielder

C: Jonathan Lucroy

DH: Cecil Cooper

CF: Jeromy Burnitz

3B: Don Money

 

Bench: Ted Simmons, Carlos Gomez, Fernando Vina, Jeff Cirillo, Rob Deer

 

SP: Ted Higuera, Ben Sheets, Yovanni Gallardo, Chris Bosio, Mike Caldwell

RP: Dan Plesac, Josh Hader, Doug Jones, Jeremy Jeffress, Rollie Fingers, Jim Slaton, Chuck Crim

 

Sorry, just don't see where Jim Gantner was better than either Money, Molitor, Vina, or Cirillo at second or third. All I remember is a bunch of empty .260-..270 batting averages, and no real contributions in the box scores I read...

 

Cirillo and Money didn’t spend much time at 2nd at all and the way I picked guys for my lineup was based on if they played multiple years at a position. Viña is a solid option for second. Molitor didn’t play much second after his first few years and that’s why I didn’t put him at second. It’s all in how you want to make your own lineup though. I like how you put Jenkins into your lineup. I was always a big fan of his.

[owbc]

All-Brewers bWAR team (with some subjective position shuffling):

 

C: Lucroy (18)

1B: Cooper (31)

2B: Ganter (22)

SS: Yount (77)

3B: Money (28)

LF: Braun (46)

CF: Gomez (19)

RF: Jenkins (22)

DH: Molitor (60)

Bench: Cirillo (26), Scott (23), Oglivie (22), Lezcano (19), Surhoff (16--backup catcher)

SP: Higuera (31), Sheets (26), Bosio (19), Wegman (18), Caldwell (18)

RP: Plesac (10), Sanders (9), Fingers (8), Crim (8), Jeffress (8)

[RollieTime]

I think we can all agree that second base has been pretty barren for the Crew in their history. Good thing our top prospect is a second baseman so he can take over the top spot a few years from now.

[jerichoholicninja]

CF is the only spot where I don't think you have at least 1 or 2 guys who are obvious options. I see a lot of people have CarGo who I wouldn't even consider. I suppose Yount would be obvious but there's no other obvious candidate for SS then. My CF would be Mike Cameron. I know he was only here two years but he was all around solid. My other thought was Podsednik. Then I looked him up and he too was only here two years. And his second year was flat out awful. I thought he was here longer and did not remember him being that bad at the end.

[owbc]

Sorry, just don't see where Jim Gantner was better than either Money, Molitor, Vina, or Cirillo at second or third. All I remember is a bunch of empty .260-..270 batting averages, and no real contributions in the box scores I read...

 

Vina had 6.0 bWAR with the Brewers...similar to Jose Hernandez (6.2) and Ronnie Belliard (5.8). Vina had one nice year in 1998 but was otherwise unremarkable.

 

If I was going to pick a 1990s 2B/SS, Jose Valentin (11.4) is the clear winner.

[Outlander]

Yelich has only played one season as a Brewer but no way I would leave him off the list. The Brewers have not been good enough to exclude an MVP. With Yount at SS I would also strongly consider Cain in CF, another MVP caliber player.

[MrTPlush]

CF is the only spot where I don't think you have at least 1 or 2 guys who are obvious options. I see a lot of people have CarGo who I wouldn't even consider. I suppose Yount would be obvious but there's no other obvious candidate for SS then. My CF would be Mike Cameron. I know he was only here two years but he was all around solid. My other thought was Podsednik. Then I looked him up and he too was only here two years. And his second year was flat out awful. I thought he was here longer and did not remember him being that bad at the end.

 

You must have a strong dislike of Gomez for some reason. I mean Mike Cameron? Carlos Gomez was one of the most electric players for his short stint of greatness. To be quite frank it isn’t close.

[Mays Hayes]

2B Molitor

SS Yount

LF Braun

1B Fielder

RF Yelich

3B Cirillo

C Nilsson

CF Cain

P Sabathia

RP Hader

 

No tenure requirements.

[clancyphile]

CF is the only spot where I don't think you have at least 1 or 2 guys who are obvious options. I see a lot of people have CarGo who I wouldn't even consider. I suppose Yount would be obvious but there's no other obvious candidate for SS then. My CF would be Mike Cameron. I know he was only here two years but he was all around solid. My other thought was Podsednik. Then I looked him up and he too was only here two years. And his second year was flat out awful. I thought he was here longer and did not remember him being that bad at the end.

 

You must have a strong dislike of Gomez for some reason. I mean Mike Cameron? Carlos Gomez was one of the most electric players for his short stint of greatness. To be quite frank it isn’t close.

 

Gorman Thomas mostly played center, and prior to Yount, was the team's all-time HR leader.

[wntrtxn21]

Molitor 2B

Yount SS

Braun LF

Fielder 1B

Ramirez 3B

Burnitz RF

Thomas CF

Simmons C

Pitcher

 

Starters -- Higuera - Sheets - Bosio - Vuckovich - Sutton

Pen -- Fingers - Knebel - Plesac - Hader - Jeffress - Gorzolany - Wickman

 

Bench -- Gomez (OF) - Vina (2B. SS) - Lucroy © - Cirillo (3B, 2B, 1B) - Listach (OF, SS, 2B)

[owbc]

CF is the only spot where I don't think you have at least 1 or 2 guys who are obvious options. I see a lot of people have CarGo who I wouldn't even consider. I suppose Yount would be obvious but there's no other obvious candidate for SS then. My CF would be Mike Cameron. I know he was only here two years but he was all around solid. My other thought was Podsednik. Then I looked him up and he too was only here two years. And his second year was flat out awful. I thought he was here longer and did not remember him being that bad at the end.

 

You must have a strong dislike of Gomez for some reason. I mean Mike Cameron? Carlos Gomez was one of the most electric players for his short stint of greatness. To be quite frank it isn’t close.

 

Gorman Thomas mostly played center, and prior to Yount, was the team's all-time HR leader.

 

That's a good point. If you go by offense only, Gorman Thomas is the clear-cut #1 CF in franchise history. With defense included Gomez sneaks slightly ahead. If you throw out Gorman's -0.9 WAR year in 1986 when he returned to Milwaukee it's basically a tie.

[DuWayne Steurer]

1B Cooper

2B Weeks

SS Yount

3B Molitor

LF Braun

CF Thomas

RF Jenkins

DH Money

 

SP Higuera

 

RP Plesac

[splitterpfj]

Cooper over Prince for me - easily, with a mention to George Scott, who would also be a worthy choice at 1B

Molitor at second - debate Money or Cirillo at 3B

Teddy Higuera is still the best starting pitcher this team has had - it's a real shame they didn't get him out of the Mexican League a little sooner.

[MNBrew]

Sorry, just don't see where Jim Gantner was better than either Money, Molitor, Vina, or Cirillo at second or third. All I remember is a bunch of empty .260-..270 batting averages, and no real contributions in the box scores I read...

 

Vina had 6.0 bWAR with the Brewers...similar to Jose Hernandez (6.2) and Ronnie Belliard (5.8). Vina had one nice year in 1998 but was otherwise unremarkable.

 

If I was going to pick a 1990s 2B/SS, Jose Valentin (11.4) is the clear winner.

It seems the main point in Clancy's post was about 2B. Jose Hernandez was a SS, not a 2B. Valentin was a SS, too (phenomenal range with a routinely very high error count -- he could get to tons of balls but often would make errors once he did).

 

Gumby was a great dude & solid player but highly unspectacular. Longevity helps him out in this discussion but his production undercuts any real argument in his favor.

[sveumrules]

All Time Milwaukee Team

 

2B Molitor

SS Yount

CF Yelich

RF Aaron

3B Mathews

LF Braun

DH Fielder

1B Cooper

C Torre

 

Bench: Crandall, Gomez, Money

 

Rotation: Spahn, Burdette, Higuera, Sheets, Sabathia

 

Bullpen: Fingers, Plesac, Hader, Jeffress, Knebel, Fetters, Wickman

 

25th Man: Kieschnick

[MNBrew]

1B - Cooper

2B - Molitor

SS - Yount

3B - Cirillo

LF - Braun

CF - Thomas

RF - Burnitz

C - Lucroy

SP - Higuera

RP - Tough call between Fingers & Plesac

 

Cirillo: 26.2 bWAR in 8 seasons; Money: 28.4 bWAR in 11 seasons -- Check out Cirillo's Brewers years vs. Money's and it's not close (.307/.383/.449/.831 vs. .270/.338/.421/.760, and Cirillo was Gold-Glove caliber consistently at 3B and kept losing out to Scott Rolen & others just by their reputations & repeater status (where guys seemed to have to disprove their worthiness to not get Gold Glove votes again)).

 

Best-ever individual years would involve another whole list of players (Hader, Cain, & Yelich all in '18 to start with; Knebel in '17, too; Vaughn (for a year or two of his); Simmons' '82 & '83; Sexson from 2001-03; Eldred's rookie year; Greinke's '11 or Caldwell's '78; Sabathia's other-worldly 3 months of '08; Gomez in 2013-14; etc.).

 

Somewhere above Oglivie got listed for RF, which he hardly played (50x in 1149 career MIL games, all in his first 2 years), and Cooper for DH, which he also pretty rarely played until his last couple years (avg. 9x/yr in his 1st 7 MIL years; 162x total over his last 4 yrs). Those make very little sense.

 

Mark Loretta gets special mention because he was nothing but super solid and pretty darn good for his 8 Brewers seasons. He'll never supplant Yount on an all-time Brewers team, but he may be the 2nd-best SS we've ever had (to date) and he was one of my all-time favorites. Those non-winning mid-/late-'90s teams had some really good position players (beyond Loretta, there were also Vina, Cirillo, Hamilton, Nilsson & even at times John Jaha & Greg Vaughn; plus a couple good years of Kevin Seitzer before Cirillo) who spent the majority of their careers in MIL (except Seitzer).

[clancyphile]

Sorry, just don't see where Jim Gantner was better than either Money, Molitor, Vina, or Cirillo at second or third. All I remember is a bunch of empty .260-..270 batting averages, and no real contributions in the box scores I read...

 

Vina had 6.0 bWAR with the Brewers...similar to Jose Hernandez (6.2) and Ronnie Belliard (5.8). Vina had one nice year in 1998 but was otherwise unremarkable.

 

If I was going to pick a 1990s 2B/SS, Jose Valentin (11.4) is the clear winner.

It seems the main point in Clancy's post was about 2B. Jose Hernandez was a SS, not a 2B. Valentin was a SS, too (phenomenal range with a routinely very high error count -- he could get to tons of balls but often would make errors once he did).

 

Gumby was a great dude & solid player but highly unspectacular. Longevity helps him out in this discussion but his production undercuts any real argument in his favor.

 

You cannot win games if you can't put runs on the board... and Gantner, at least when I was starting to follow the Crew, was not very helpful in that regard. Yet he played too darn much.

[MNBrew]

Clancy, I'm with you re: Gantner. He was generally durable and quietly solid, but still very unspectacular. His offense was usually very ordinary at most.

[KeithStone53151]

I don't know the older Brewers as well, but I'm a bit surprised that Yelich is in so few outfields. Being the MVP isn't good enough? Burnitz and Jenkins were very good and for longer than Yelich at the moment...but neither ever had a season like Yelich's 2018. Burnitz made one all-star game and his highest was 19th in MVP voting. Jenkins also made only one all-star game and was never ranked in MVP voting. I also don't know why Cain isn't in more outfields. I can understand the argument for Thomas a bit better, but I still think Cain is the better player.