2019 Brewers' pitching staff

[pacopete4]

Not to double post but we are getting to the point of the season that it is either one of two things. Either Derek Johnson mattered that much to this staff or our pitchers drastically overachieved a season ago. I suppose it could be a combination of the two but this pitching staff so far just isn't that good.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Not to double post but we are getting to the point of the season that it is either one of two things. Either Derek Johnson mattered that much to this staff or our pitchers drastically overachieved a season ago. I suppose it could be a combination of the two but this pitching staff so far just isn't that good.

 

The optics certainly aren't great coming off a game where they gave up 16 runs, but I think the pitching has been fine for the most part. There were plenty of times early in the season last year where both the starting rotation and pen scuffled. The rotation didn't really jell until Miley came back (the second time) and pitched like an ace.

[MrTPlush]

I know people hate Anderson...but one bad start out of six and we want to dump him back to the bullpen for...Wilkerson? I mean jeez, the dude has an ERA south of 4 and has had never had a season with us that it was over 4. That sounds pretty good in the rotation, certainly not someone deserving of being replaced by AAAA fodder after a bad start.

[xisxisxis]

I am getting frustrated with the pitching decisions this team is making.

In that case, proceed Brewers, you are on the right path...

 

I know people hate Anderson...but one bad start out of six and we want to dump him back to the bullpen for...Wilkerson? I mean jeez, the dude has an ERA south of 4 and has had never had a season with us that it was over 4. That sounds pretty good in the rotation, certainly not someone deserving of being replaced by AAAA fodder after a bad start.

But why can't the Brewers win EVERY game... /whine

 

The Brewers are now 15-7 against sub .500 teams. That's in the top 5 for MLB. The other teams with better winning % all have at least 5 losses so I guess that's pretty good evidence that good teams lose sometimes to bad teams...

 

the over-reaction to one loss is really getting pathological around here...

[KeithStone53151]

I'm not sure you can really blame Anderson for yesterday. The Marlins were seemingly all on fire and hit every reliever we threw at them...except Hernan of course. I also think Anderson has more success if the home plate umpire isn't squeezing him so badly. If he had gotten calls that Lopez was getting, maybe we only lose by a dozen instead of 16. But either way, Anderson really didn't pitch THAT badly yesterday considering the circumstances.

[MrTPlush]

I'm not sure you can really blame Anderson for yesterday. The Marlins were seemingly all on fire and hit every reliever we threw at them...except Hernan of course. I also think Anderson has more success if the home plate umpire isn't squeezing him so badly. If he had gotten calls that Lopez was getting, maybe we only lose by a dozen instead of 16. But either way, Anderson really didn't pitch THAT badly yesterday considering the circumstances.

 

Even if he was bad, so what. It was one game and still sports an ERA of about 3.75 on the year while starting. He had actually only given up one homer prior to yesterday starting in five games...not too shabby. People then say, "Oh there is the Anderson we all know and love, get him out of the rotation" What? The one that had a 3.93 ERA last year starting despite nightmare HR totals?

 

Starters don't grow on trees, especially ones that can give sub 4 ERA baseball for 150+ innings. Anderson may not be a TOR arm or even mid rotation, but he puts up good numbers for a #4 or #5. You are going to be hard pressed to find five guys that will actually outperform him over the long haul of a full season.

 

Now I don't really have a problem if they replace him with Chacin when he return in hopes he can rebound closer to his 2018 self, but sending him to the pen in favor of Wilkerson seems confusing at best. Why would you not give the guy with a successful track record the rotation spot and have the AAAA guy go be long man?

[KeithStone53151]

Yeah I agree. The IGT was a bit insane. I wouldn't be surprised if they were making similar calls for Woodruff to get booted from the rotation after his bad start over the weekend. If Anderson puts up 3 or 4 clunker outings in a row, then maybe you consider moving him to the bullpen pending other options. But he's done well enough so far this season that one bad outing shouldn't change much of anything. Especially considering the umpiring last night and that the Marlins simply seemed to be on fire.

 

That said, Taylor Williams has been mediocre at best up until last night. That one outing is probably enough to get him banished to AAA until they find a trade partner at the deadline. But again, Williams hasn't been nearly as good as Anderson and doesn't have the same pedigree.

[wntrtxn21]

I know people hate Anderson...but one bad start out of six and we want to dump him back to the bullpen for...Wilkerson? I mean jeez, the dude has an ERA south of 4 and has had never had a season with us that it was over 4. That sounds pretty good in the rotation, certainly not someone deserving of being replaced by AAAA fodder after a bad start.

 

Anderson has had only one GOOD outing as a starter. In his 6 starts he has gone only 4 innings three times. Another time 4.2 IPs. In only two of his starts did he go even 5 innings. I'm not saying Wilkerson is the answer, but Anderson is a #5 at best and maybe not that good. He was a disaster in the pen to start the year, so I don't know what CC has planned for him.

[timpep]

I know people hate Anderson...but one bad start out of six and we want to dump him back to the bullpen for...Wilkerson? I mean jeez, the dude has an ERA south of 4 and has had never had a season with us that it was over 4. That sounds pretty good in the rotation, certainly not someone deserving of being replaced by AAAA fodder after a bad start.

 

Anderson has had only one GOOD outing as a starter. In his 6 starts he has gone only 4 innings three times. Another time 4.2 IPs. In only two of his starts did he go even 5 innings. I'm not saying Wilkerson is the answer, but Anderson is a #5 at best and maybe not that good. He was a disaster in the pen to start the year, so I don't know what CC has planned for him.

 

I remember several years where a sub 4 era guy with short outings would have been a heck of a lot better than the 5th best starter for the Brewers. This includes every year Anderson has been with the team. And includes the year where he was Chase the ACE just 2 years ago. It also includes this year.

[pacopete4]

Is it Anderson's fault he's only going 4 innings or so? Feels like he could be asked to go deeper in games and they've refused to let it happen.

[Brew crew 92]

I know people hate Anderson...but one bad start out of six and we want to dump him back to the bullpen for...Wilkerson? I mean jeez, the dude has an ERA south of 4 and has had never had a season with us that it was over 4. That sounds pretty good in the rotation, certainly not someone deserving of being replaced by AAAA fodder after a bad start.

 

The problem is pitch count. His can’t get past 5 innings, plus his stuff, especially his fastball plays better out of the pen.

[KeithStone53151]

I don't think the talk about Anderson being permanently a pen pitcher is insane, it is a bit insane to think Wilkerson is a better option though. I think they are comparable, but I can't see Wilkerson coming up and being a sub 3 era pitcher.

[tmwiese55]

Anderson has clearly been better than what was out there to start the year. He's helped stabilize things. Is he some rockstar, of course not, but frankly they don't really have any better options right now. Consistent mediocrity isn't the worst thing. And 4 runs in 4 innings isn't something ridiculously awful, the bullpen implosion after is what made this game embarrassing.

[Brew crew 92]

Just a guess on my part obviously, but perhaps the Brewers see Wilkerson as many posters here do ... as a AAA-type depth piece who is nice to have around as an emergency guy, but that's about it. That fact that he's on the 40-man roster indicates that he'll likely see more big league time at some point this year, but it appears that he's somewhat down the starting pitching pecking order, despite his great AAA numbers.

 

As for the new 40-man arms, I get it ... but this team is all about conserving depth. They wouldn't be adding guys like Sanchez and Perdomo unless they planned to call them up. With your prospective 12-man staff, there simply isn't room for them.

 

Please don't take this as me disagreeing with you for the sake of disagreeing, or picking on you as you've implied lately to me and others. It's simply providing an alternative viewpoint.

 

Yes, I’m sure they do see him as just a depth piece, otherwise he’d be starting this eeek instead of Peratla, but it’s the wrong move. Why start a failed starter when you can start statistically speaking the best starter in the minor-league system, any minor-league system. Wilkerson has NEVER had anything more than a spot start. With Chacín and Gio down it’s the perfect time for a 2-3 start trial.

 

Do we remember his first start with us on the last game of the year vs the cards > no hitter into the eighth. His last 2 were emergency spot starts one of which he flew that night and lost his luggage so he had to borrow someone’s shoes, not exactly what I’d call a real shot. Although he did homer in that game.Peralta again?

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Just a guess on my part obviously, but perhaps the Brewers see Wilkerson as many posters here do ... as a AAA-type depth piece who is nice to have around as an emergency guy, but that's about it. That fact that he's on the 40-man roster indicates that he'll likely see more big league time at some point this year, but it appears that he's somewhat down the starting pitching pecking order, despite his great AAA numbers.

 

As for the new 40-man arms, I get it ... but this team is all about conserving depth. They wouldn't be adding guys like Sanchez and Perdomo unless they planned to call them up. With your prospective 12-man staff, there simply isn't room for them.

 

Please don't take this as me disagreeing with you for the sake of disagreeing, or picking on you as you've implied lately to me and others. It's simply providing an alternative viewpoint.

 

Yes, I’m sure they do see him as just a depth piece, otherwise he’d be starting this eeek instead of Peratla, but it’s the wrong move. Why start a failed starter when you can start statistically speaking the best starter in the minor-league system, any minor-league system. Wilkerson has NEVER had anything more than a spot start. With Chacín and Gio down it’s the perfect time for a 2-3 start trial.

 

Do we remember his first start with us on the last game of the year vs the cards > no hitter into the eighth. His last 2 were emergency spot starts one of which he flew that night and lost his luggage so he had to borrow someone’s shoes, not exactly what I’d call a real shot. Although he did homer in that game.Peralta again?

 

I won't deny that Wilkerson's AAA numbers look great this year. He's always had solid numbers in the minors. But he's a middling talent that profiles at best as a long reliever/spot starter. Sometimes those types can catch lightning in a bottle and have some success, but it's often brief, and comes crashing down with a pretty big thud.

 

Oh, and that game against the Cards in 2017? It was actually Wilkerson's 2nd big league start (in his first start he went 2 1/3 innings in Pittsburgh on Sept. 20, giving up 3 runs). Against the Cards, he took a no-hitter into the 6th (not the 8th), and ended up giving up 2 hits and an earned run over 7 innings. Definitely a very solid outing, but consider the lineup he was facing. The Cardinals weren't playing for anything, and basically threw their AAA lineup out there. Wilkerson is solid against those type of hitters ... hence the label as a AAAA pitcher.

[True Blue Brew Crew]

Peralta --- "wrong move" instead of Wilkerson and "failed starter" makes for a good laugh

[Brew crew 92]

Peralta --- "wrong move" instead of Wilkerson and "failed starter" makes for a good laugh

 

peralta is a failed starter, at this time, he is, sorry. Now maybe this time next year different ballgame.

 

How do you all KNOW what kind of a starter Wilkerson would be?

 

Again, when has he been given an opportunity for anything more than a SPOT start? NEVER. It’s time.

 

We all talk around here like we know he’s just AAAA “fodder” when in reality he could be a real pitcher. Albeit one that maxes out at 91, but has a curve, slider, and changes speeds effectively with plus command, leading to potentially LOWER pitch counts.

[KeithStone53151]

Peralta --- "wrong move" instead of Wilkerson and "failed starter" makes for a good laugh

 

peralta is a failed starter, at this time, he is, sorry. Now maybe this time next year different ballgame.

 

How do you all KNOW what kind of a starter Wilkerson would be?

 

Again, when has he been given an opportunity for anything more than a SPOT start? NEVER. It’s time.

 

We all talk around here like we know he’s just AAAA “fodder” when in reality he could be a real pitcher. Albeit one that maxes out at 91, but has a curve, slider, and changes speeds effectively with plus command, leading to potentially LOWER pitch counts.

 

He started for a month, that's not a failed starter. Especially at age 22. He probably needs more development, but not yet a failed starter. That would be like saying Hiura was a failed hitter after his first few games in the big leagues.

[wntrtxn21]

Peralta --- "wrong move" instead of Wilkerson and "failed starter" makes for a good laugh

 

peralta is a failed starter, at this time, he is, sorry. Now maybe this time next year different ballgame.

 

How do you all KNOW what kind of a starter Wilkerson would be?

 

Again, when has he been given an opportunity for anything more than a SPOT start? NEVER. It’s time.

 

We all talk around here like we know he’s just AAAA “fodder” when in reality he could be a real pitcher. Albeit one that maxes out at 91, but has a curve, slider, and changes speeds effectively with plus command, leading to potentially LOWER pitch counts.

 

Maybe it's time to see what Wilkerson can do. He can't do much worse than what Chacin has been doing, or Anderson's last start, or Peralta, or Burnes. Right now Davies, Woodruff, Nelson and who? With Gio and Chacin down, is there a better option? If nothing else he bridges the gap until Gio can come back.

[tmwiese55]

Well it is a fair statement to say he failed as a starter so far this year. But that for sure doesn't mean he's failed forever or that he shouldn't get another crack, especially at his age. That's what I think is going on here. He went to the pen to take a breath and generally he's been ok since then. So they're giving him another shot, hoping to get what they expected to start the year, which is totally fair. Since his demotion he's done 16 1/3 innings for 4 runs, I think one of those games he technically did start though.

 

I see the logic too of Wilkerson talk but I think they're just viewing it there is a reason they brought Peralta up last year so young, when he did fairly well. Trusted him to pitch late season games last year and trusted him to open as a starter this year. And they're sticking to it, especially since he has rebounded well over his last 16 innings.

[Brew crew 92]

Just a guess on my part obviously, but perhaps the Brewers see Wilkerson as many posters here do ... as a AAA-type depth piece who is nice to have around as an emergency guy, but that's about it. That fact that he's on the 40-man roster indicates that he'll likely see more big league time at some point this year, but it appears that he's somewhat down the starting pitching pecking order, despite his great AAA numbers.

 

As for the new 40-man arms, I get it ... but this team is all about conserving depth. They wouldn't be adding guys like Sanchez and Perdomo unless they planned to call them up. With your prospective 12-man staff, there simply isn't room for them.

 

Please don't take this as me disagreeing with you for the sake of disagreeing, or picking on you as you've implied lately to me and others. It's simply providing an alternative viewpoint.

 

With Barnes Williams trades/DFA’d and Sanchez and Perdomo on the 40 they would be the last resort depth pieces, get some new blood, at least have the potential to discover another gem, as opposed to the retread gas can Barnes Williams.

 

The disagreement I have with SOME of this so called depth is:

 

It’s bad depth. Bad pitchers. Their keeping a pitcher that actually can help the pen from being given an opportunity.

 

Last night if Barnes Williams we’re gone, they could have brought up Sanchez Perdomo, at least it wouldn’t have been as predictable with the batting practice served up by Williams Barnes.

[Brew crew 92]

Well it is a fair statement to say he failed as a starter so far this year. But that for sure doesn't mean he's failed forever or that he shouldn't get another crack, especially at his age. That's what I think is going on here. He went to the pen to take a breath and generally he's been ok since then. So they're giving him another shot, hoping to get what they expected to start the year, which is totally fair. Since his demotion he's done 16 1/3 innings for 4 runs, I think one of those games he technically did start though.

 

I see the logic too of Wilkerson talk but I think they're just viewing it there is a reason they brought Peralta up last year so young, when he did fairly well. Trusted him to pitch late season games last year and trusted him to open as a starter this year. And they're sticking to it, especially since he has rebounded well over his last 16 innings.

 

Agree, he’s only 22, he’s going to get better with innings and time, but, why spot start and then back to the pen?

 

Why start when can only throw 60 pitches? Why do this to the pen AGAIN?

 

We have good options for 2-3 innings pitchers with Houser Anderson Chacín if they’d pitch them out of the pen, then Peralta Burnes can go below to stretch and mix their pitches until we need them for later in the year.

 

I know this is the pitching thread but that gives us a 12 man staff with Hiura back up in 2 weeks.

[MrTPlush]

Chase Anderson has been taken out with a pitch count of 83 or less 3 times and with a pitch count of about 95 twice. The dude hasn't even hit 100 pitches in a game, but pitch count is the reason he is getting taken out early? Yah, not sure I am buying that argument. Yes, throwing 20 pitches every inning is going to tire you, but I think Anderson can manage 100 pitches either way. Regardless I would rather have him throw 4-5 innings of good baseball vs. Chacin throwing a grand ole 4.75 innings on average of trash baseball...just for example. Which is probably similar to what Wilkerson could manage.

 

I mean honestly, you guys think Wilkerson is going to fair better? The same guy who was already sent away once for sucking on the MLB roster? You think Counsell, who won't give Anderson a leash, will let Wilkerson go 6 innings all the time? I think not.

[Brew crew 92]

I am getting frustrated with the pitching decisions this team is making.

In that case, proceed Brewers, you are on the right path...

 

I know people hate Anderson...but one bad start out of six and we want to dump him back to the bullpen for...Wilkerson? I mean jeez, the dude has an ERA south of 4 and has had never had a season with us that it was over 4. That sounds pretty good in the rotation, certainly not someone deserving of being replaced by AAAA fodder after a bad start.

But why can't the Brewers win EVERY game... /whine

 

The Brewers are now 15-7 against sub .500 teams. That's in the top 5 for MLB. The other teams with better winning % all have at least 5 losses so I guess that's pretty good evidence that good teams lose sometimes to bad teams...

 

the over-reaction to one loss is really getting pathological around here...

 

I guess it’s easier to be a comedian around here than it is to put some thought into an argument against my post if you disagree.

 

My post had absolutely nothing to do with last nights loss. I think we all know it’s just one game amongst the 162.

[Brew crew 92]

Chase Anderson has been taken out with a pitch count of 83 or less 3 times and with a pitch count of about 95 twice. The dude hasn't even hit 100 pitches in a game, but pitch count is the reason he is getting taken out early? Yah, not sure I am buying that argument. Yes, throwing 20 pitches every inning is going to tire you, but I think Anderson can manage 100 pitches either way. Regardless I would rather have him throw 4-5 innings of good baseball vs. Chacin throwing a grand ole 4.75 innings on average of trash baseball...just for example. Which is probably similar to what Wilkerson could manage.

 

I mean honestly, you guys think Wilkerson is going to fair better? The same guy who was already sent away once for sucking on the MLB roster? You think Counsell, who won't give Anderson a leash, will let Wilkerson go 6 innings all the time? I think not.

 

AGAIN > Wilkerson has NEVER started 2 games in a row, so how do we know what he’d do IF FINALLY given 2-3 starts?

 

6-7 innings is what’s needed OCCASIONALLY from starters other than Davies, and we’re not getting that.